AZ and the Southwest Faces an Existential Water Crisis

[kairos12]

Guv Doozey of AZ responds by recommending everyone read "Like Water for Chocolate" as a solution.

Then he countermands that order by remembering that book is banned, somewhere.

[former9thward]

5. CA has been talking about desalination for decades.

And still nothing gets done. Even if some plant is "approved" at some point there will be permitting battles and environmental impact battles which will go on forever.

[grantcart]

43. The desalinization plant in Carlsbad started production in 2015 and does 50 million gallons/day

[former9thward]

44. Yes, and that one plant in the state took how many years?

It supplies a grand total of 10% of San Diego water.

[grantcart]

45. Not the point, you incorrectly said, "nothing" has been done.

The Carlsbad plant was relatively fast in getting approved and implemented. Before implementing a larger plan a proof of concept plant is needed to study the environmental impact of the discharge back into the Pacific.

That plant was made possible because of the vision of one man;

,Bud Lewis and his exemplary role as Mayor over 30 years.

[former9thward]

46. It is the point.

The poster I was replying to was talking about a specific proposed plant. That post has since been deleted. Nothing has been done and they have been talking about it for decades. For some reason you ignored that original post and jumped on mine.

[JCMach1]

13. Not as expensive as you think. State governments?

Just as cheap a$$ and not forward thinking as you would think... Even in poorer countries the MENA region has been installing desalinization for decades.

USA? Crickets

[JCMach1]

18. There is no alternative to desalinization and we have known it for decades

Even erase climate change for a moment. We have known for almost 50 years the West can experience extreme long-term droughts that can last for decades even.

[Wounded Bear]

24. And don't forget the over-population...

[JCMach1]

29. Just population it's ok. It's pop on top of big AG

[Wounded Bear]

30. They've over-populated areas that should not have big cities in them...nt

[ProudMNDemocrat]

2. Gotta have those GREEN lawns though!!!

When the water runs out, people will scream at their local and state governments to high heaven.

I recall on many trips to California over the years...5 minute showers. Up to 4 loads of laundry a week for a family of 4. No watering of lawns, just important plants in the later evenings. No excessive flushing of toilets. Washing of the hair separate of showers using a pitcher for wetting and rinsing.

Arizona, New Mexico, Nevada, California will surely dry out. While we here in the Upper Midwest where there is enough fresh water in Lake Superior and Lake Michigan to provide water and then some for the Western half of the US, and still have plenty left over. It rains in my part of the world. Happy for that.

Still, we need to conserve what we can when we can so it will be there when the hard time comes.

It has also been said that the next great War will NOT be over territory, but over Fresh Water sources and arable land for growing food crops.

[StarryNite]

10. And probably 2/3 of the houses have swimming pools.

Water has to be added to pools frequently whether they are used or not.

[Mr.Bill]

27. Swimming pools use less water than lawns do.

People seem to think everyone in California has a swimming pool. There are more of them in the southern part of the state, but they are rare in the north. Arizona has lots of them.

[sarcasmo]

39. Those pools are skateboard ramps.

[JCMach1]

14. You can have green lawns, just needs to be grey water

Moving forward.

The US is so far behind on this stuff it isn't even funny

[asiliveandbreathe]

3. Never mind all the new home construction from Apache Junction in

the East..thousands of acres bought by RE companies, to Goodyear and beyond in the West..each community of more than a thousand homes..

Golf courses needing to rethink water usage..need to create brown areas from fairways..less watering..already in the works where I live..

One question, where they gettin' the water???

[Igel]

4. Depends.

Most of the new houses will come from the usual dam system.

A lot of golf courses use recycled--take sewage and quickly clean it up--not potable, but not black water any more--and use that.

In most US jurisdictions people don't like recycled sewage coming out of their tap.

Most houses I've seen in the Phx area have brown front yards and small green backyards. Mostly because you don't want small kids running on the gravel. My parents house had a small green patch maybe 10 x 8, the rest of the back, even, was gravel. Last I heard, my brother was tired of watering his backyard and was thinking of putting down stone. My ex-MIL has no lawn, but does have a vegetable garden with drip lines (and a well).

[hunter]

6. This recycled water is becoming too valuable for use on golf courses.

There's already several "toilet-to-tap water" projects in California.

The water I flush down the toilet gets turned into near-potable water for agriculture or tap water.

The tap water is made from the near-potable water by reverse osmosis.

[JCMach1]

15. You can even have golf courses, BUT there needs to be grey water infrastructure

In place

[asiliveandbreathe]

17. Several years ago..our course tapped into ground water via drilling..

A new well..was ho hum..now..there will be turf conversion starting 2025..

On January 1, 2025 the Arizona Department of Water Resources (ADWR) will implement the Fifth Management Plan which reflects the state of Arizona’s Groundwater Management Code, moving Arizona towards its long-term water management goals for safe yield. The 5th Management Plan does not just effect the golf community but also agriculture and industrial users.

Then this..

https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-environment/2021/06/14/arizona-golf-courses-fight-water-conservation-efforts/5032190001/

The watershed is trending, he said, and Lake Mead’s levels could continue to drop toward lower thresholds that would bring bigger cuts for Arizona, Nevada and Mexico — and potentially for California if the reservoir keeps declining.

Other slides detailed the cutbacks that would be required if the reservoir falls toward critically low levels, something a 2019 deal among the states aimed to avert. Buschatzke also described a worst-case scenario.

“At dead pool, 890 feet elevation, no water moves past Hoover Dam. No water. The river will be dry and Arizona will not have any Colorado River water,” Buschatzke said. These larger challenges with the river, he said, relate to the conservation that’s needed under the new management plans in all sectors, including golf.

I wonder if the AZ golf courses will have a 500 golf cart convoy to protest..

[JCMach1]

19. Ground water? That's insane in the desert for starters...

With xeriscaping, turf and grey water it is at least marginally sustainable

[asiliveandbreathe]

21. I wrote letters to City of Mesa..to the AZ Water District..

When CC Managers came to my door..I was diplomatic but assertive in my concern..the reason they came to me..becz they had to run piping, running next to prop. line..yes, their property, for a couple weeks..for whatever reason..the new pump house is across street on other side of 1st green..we are not 25ft from the 2nd tee box ut the front door..

AND..that was b4 they decided they needed extra funds to cement the 3 ponds on the course..losing water ya'know..

[JCMach1]

22. Aaanddd water features... WTH

[newdayneeded]

7. Reality

A couple of dry years is a drought, 20 dry years is your new climate!

Lake Mead is now around 7 ft from losing 12 of its turbines.

[newdayneeded]

8. One more point

Can imagine if 44 billion was spent on desalination instead a free App.

[kairos12]

9. Musk you say that?

[Kid Berwyn]

11. Yup.

Doesn’t need to be nukyular, neither.

[hunter]

12. These desalinization plants need to be run continuously.

In California we burn natural gas when the sun isn't shining and the wind isn't blowing.

Natural gas is a far greater danger to our earth's natural environment, and our civilization, than "nukyular."

It's best we leave natural gas in the ground.

[JCMach1]

20. In the MENA region they are built in tandem.with power plants. The desalinization is actually a

Byproduct of making electricity.

[JCMach1]

23. The whole country needs Right to Xeriscape laws that supercede

HOA and Property Covenants

[panader0]

25. I live in So Az and have my own well. At least the water I use goes back into the ground water,

except for my small garden. The water table has dropped about 10-12 feet in the last twenty years.
The info is on the USGS web site--it lists registered wells in my area. If it gets real bad, I may
need a new well.
eta: I don't have a lawn, I just try to make my many mesquite trees look well-trimmed, although
I have a lot of acres and only trim the area around the house.

[CrackityJones75]

26. Almost like large amounts of people

Almost like large amounts of people shouldn’t live there.

[Mr.Bill]

28. It would be fine with me if half the population

Last edited Sun May 1, 2022, 07:57 PM - Edit history (1)

left California, like every RWNJ claims is happening. (but it isn't)

I lived here when the population was half what it is now, and it was wonderful.

[roamer65]

31. Not likely now with the overturn of Roe v Wade.

Blue states are going to gain population.

[Mr.Bill]

33. Maybe,

but if the republicans get control of the House and Senate and the White Housen again, they will immediately pass a federal law against abortion, likely carrying the death sentence.

[roamer65]

34. States like CA will nullify it.

Just like many states have with MJ legalization.

[Mr.Bill]

35. States can not nullify federal laws.

Federal marijuana laws still exist. We just currently have a Justice Dept who is not vigorously enforcing them.

[roamer65]

38. The same will happen.

That’s nullification in action.

Even Dumps DOJ didn’t touch the MJ legalization.

[Mr.Bill]

40. A republican President will appoint an AG

who will make it the #1 priority. This isn't smoking weed, to these people (their base) it's murdering babies.

[roamer65]

41. ...and then it will be 1860 again.

I’d put us in 1858 or so right now, by comparison.

[Mr.Bill]

42. Maybe so.

Of course, I hope not.

[roamer65]

32. Just remember one thing.

There will be NO water diversion from the Great Lakes.

If we have to start a war over it, we will.

[misanthrope]

36. Anyone who read any Edward Abbey, or "Cadillac Desert" knew this all along

The growing climate crisis made it obvious to anyone who could gather news.

We're on the verge of the burgeoning climate refugee era.

[lunatica]

37. I live in New Mexico

They just started a water conservation order here. No watering lawns during the day.

I lived in California for decades and went through this drought routine before. No flushing toilets, washing cars, watering lawns or long showers. I’ll just dive in and do my part right away. Minimum flushing and showering. It’s second nature for me now. I’ve been doing it for a couple of years so I’m used to it.

[canetoad]

47. Future water supplies

Are a huge responsibility. He's an idiot.