'I'm not going to help you:' Man drowned in Tempe Town Lake as police watched, transcripts reveal

[WhiskeyGrinder]

https://www.fox10phoenix.com/news/man-dead-after-jumping-into-tempe-town-lake-police-say

TEMPE, Ariz. - Three police officers have been placed on administrative leave after they reportedly watched as a man drowned in Tempe Town Lake, transcripts revealed.

The incident began as a reported domestic violence situation at Tempe Beach Park between the man, identified as Sean Bickings, and his wife. Both denied that any fight had taken place.

When officers were called, Bickings reportedly tried to run away from them by fleeing into the lake. He was unable to get out of the water, and eventually drowned.

(snip)

"I'm drowning," Bickings, noted as ‘victim’ in the transcript, said.

"Come back over to the pylon," an officer, noted as ‘Officer 2' in the transcript, said.

"I can't. I can't (inaudible)," said Bickings.

"OK, I'm not jumping in after you," said Officer 1.

[ret5hd]

1. I know a town in Texas that would be PROUD...

to hire them.

[Iggo]

21. The Valiant Guardians Of The Parking Lot?

[Escurumbele]

29. You must send that title to Mike Lukovich, its a great description of the cops in Texas

I am sure Lukovich will come up with something that will do justice to it.

[Iggo]

39. I lifted that from another thread.

[PTWB]

2. Police are not legally obligated to render aid or save someone.

It’s possible (likely?) that these officers violated departmental policy and may face disciplinary action up to and including termination.

[SpankMe]

28. If cops have no obligation - legal or otherwise - to put themselves in danger for another's life...

Then why do we have cops? What's the point? Why don't we just get rid of them all and staff "police" departments solely with detectives to investigate crimes after the fact?

Granted, cops should not go on suicide missions for every sap that puts themselves in danger. But, each situation merits a real time trade-off as to whether the risk to the officer is worth the benefit to the public. Cops are supposed to be trained, case hardened and able to make such judgements more in favor if the distressed person than the average citizen would. It seems to me that bar is getting lower and lower to the point where a cop won't get involved if doing so would so much as muff his hair.

The inaction of the cops in this case will be found to be "justified" I'm sure. The bar will be lowered yet again to the point where society accepts that cops lives are worth more than everybody else's.

[A HERETIC I AM]

33. The point is to protect the property of the wealthy from being destroyed or taken by the poor.

It has always been so.

If that guy was drowning in a lake on the property of a multi millionaire, do you think the cops would have left him in there to drown?


And for what it’s worth, that “property” back in the old days was often times black people.

[Escurumbele]

30. Hmm, logic would dictate that if you watch someone die without helping when your help can

make the difference between life or death, that you would be guilty of murder, if not the law is very screwed up.

The 19 cops in Texas should be judged by their inactivity as conspirators of the murders. They helped the killer by their decision of not helping, and that should be the way these three cops are judged as well.

[Wingus Dingus]

3. I wouldn't have gone in to save him, even if I was an officer and a strong swimmer.

That's how the rescuer dies unless he's a trained lifeguard for a panicked drowner. But they should have tried to acquire a flotation device or something to throw him, or called for a water rescue more quickly.

[Wingus Dingus]

5. Well... bye.

[Abnredleg]

8. Would-be rescuers drowning is very common

They should have thrown a flotation device or a rope, but I’m withholding judgement about them refusing to go into the water until I learn more.

[Wingus Dingus]

12. I think they thought he could swim and was just evading them. They weren't proactive enough

on getting him rescued. They wasted time waiting for him to swim, and dealing with his companion.

[Abnredleg]

18. No denying they should have done more /NT

[Rebl2]

25. True

[cab67]

44. I was trained as a lifeguard.

I was taught that under some circumstances, you have to stay back. If the victim is acting belligerently and fighting with those trying to rescue them, for example - under those circumstances, the rescuers could just as easily become victims as well.

I'm not saying such circumstances pertain to this incident, but lifeguards are, indeed, trained to avoid some rescue attempts.

[Jake97]

55. Reach, throw, row, go with the equipment, go

[peacebuzzard]

57. Your last four words sounds like time to hustle

Expediency or race for time. I don’t think those officers were in a hurry to get wet.

[highplainsdem]

7. I would have, at least when younger. I could swim well enough to handle the distance easily,

though diving if necessary would have been more difficult, and I would almost certainly have been outweighed.

I would have tried to get any others on shore who could swim to go with me, though, and I'd've wanted more help to be called.

And yes, I know it would be risky.

I wouldn't leave a pet in a burning building, either, even if firefighters told me I had to, if I thought there was even a small chance of rescuing them.

[Wingus Dingus]

11. That looked like a big dude who was trying to run away from police because

of outstanding warrants. Combine that with the fact that he didn't appear to be thinking rationally or in his right mind, and that he was panicked in the water. Very dangerous.

[highplainsdem]

13. I know. I still don't think I'd've been able to stand there and watch him drown.

[Wingus Dingus]

14. Yeah, that would be tough.

[highplainsdem]

15. I know my decision wouldn't be rational. I just know it's what I would have done.

[Wingus Dingus]

17. You do have to think then of TWO of you needing rescued.

I'm a small woman who is not a very good swimmer, I think I'd go in after a small kid, but that's about it.

[Thtwudbeme]

23. I was an EMT-Paramedic when I was younger- and you are absolutely correct. EXCEPT for one thing:

The officers should have called for help- and tried to get any flotation device to the guy- anything, even a kid's toy.

I wouldn't jump in water to save someone either- anyone here that is not trained that claims they would is asking to drown with the victim. I don't care how strong of a swimmer they are.

And yes- I was trained in water rescue. I was a paramedic on a fire department.

[shrike3]

34. Yes, that's my take.

You don't stand there and watch someone drown.

I hate to say this, but "unsheltered" means homeless, I think. Would they tried harder for someone else?

[Thtwudbeme]

38. That I don't know. I was only responding to the guy who said, "I wouldn't have jumped in either."

The officers did the wrong thing- apparently they just stood there and watched. They should have been calling for help while looking for any practical way to help the guy without endangering and possibly drowning themselves.

[Jack the Greater]

27. Some people have an aversion to reason and common sense, it seems.

[Escurumbele]

32. Wow...that is all I can say.

[madville]

54. A cop would also sink like a rock

With all their duty gear, body armor, etc. In the military we had to train stripping our gear off in the water, weapons, ammo, body armor, etc. You’re doing good just to save yourself wearing all that crap.

[Retrograde]

6. Going into the water after a drowning person

or one who thinks they're drowning - can be fatal for the would-be rescuer. A better question to ask, I think, is, "were there life-saving aids (flotation devices, long poles, etc) that the police could throw or hold out to a drowning person and get them to shore without risking more lives?" It's a popular town park: I would think they have some sort of safety equipment. I think the investigation should cover this aspect - was there a way the person could be rescued without endangering others, and if so, why wasn't this done.

[Demsrule86]

9. Hopefully they are fired.

"TEMPE, Ariz. - Three police officers have been placed on administrative leave after they reportedly watched as a man drowned in Tempe Town Lake, transcripts revealed."

[Solly Mack]

10. K&R

[peacebuzzard]

16. The correct action to take in a drowning victim case

is to attempt to save with aids: rope, float, stick reaching out or a people chain. This is in case no one is trained enough to survive a struggling, drowning victim. The larger the victim, the less chance likely of a smaller/strong swimmer to survive. The large victim will be trying to survive by clutching the swimmer, even holding them down under water while trying to stay afloat. I am a mediocre swimmer, out of shape, and barely over a hundred lbs. As a lone, out-of-shape swimmer, I could save a baby, but not a large, terrified and struggling drowning person.

[LisaM]

35. Throw, row, tow.....

They probably didn't have a boat, but it's very risky to try and save someone unless you're a trained lifeguard.

[peacebuzzard]

56. I don't think water rescue is taught in police academy

Or is it.?

[Iggo]

19. Goddam motherfucking heroes, ain't they.

Deep down we all knew they were murderers and murder-apologists.

But the sheer amount of straight up cowardice from our boys in blue has got to come as a shock to some.

The sad part is, I can’t tell from the excerpt above which one it is: Malice or Cowardice.

[AllaN01Bear]

42. love your screen nick. herculoids reference ?

[ripcord]

20. I had a drowning man latch onto me with a death grip while doing a rescue

I'm a big guy and had been a lifeguard for 6 years when I got sloppy and approached a struggling victim too closely. People have no idea the strength people can generate in a life or death situation, I was very lucky to get away safely so I could approach him from behind.

[XanaDUer2]

22. My cousin was a trained lifeguard in ny

And was almost killed by a drowning person. Fortunately, they made it out.

[bringthePaine]

24. who fucking brings a gun to a water rescue? more here than meets the eye

[Jack the Greater]

26. Police were not dispatched to a "water rescue"

They were dispatched to a domestic dispute, a situation in which violence commonly erupts. The suspect ran into the lake to escape police and drowned. Not the fault of the police.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

46. what suspect

[Jack the Greater]

48. Sean Bickings

Look it up

[WhiskeyGrinder]

50. what was the crime?

[Cracklin Charlie]

31. Reach, throw, row...then go

They had three other ways to save that man, without going in the water to get him.

Sounds like murder.

[keithbvadu2]

36. Not enough info. Were they qualified and able to do a drowning rescue? Did they have the eqt for a

Not enough info. Were they qualified and able to do a drowning rescue?

Did they have the eqt for a drowning rescue?

[Iggo]

47. They're cops, so no, they're not qualified to save anyone.

Yeah, I’m pissed at cops.

Sue me.

[lpbk2713]

37. All that protecting and serving.

I'm underwhelmed.

[AllaN01Bear]

40. wed probably get them. tuolumne county ca. what are we paying these so and sos 4?

[Retrograde]

52. Huh? Did Tempe move while I wasn't looking?

It was in a different state last I was there - what does this have to do with Tuolumne county?

[dalton99a]

41. Transcript:

[Joinfortmill]

43. Pay more and train better.Cops s/be charged.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

45. Paying them more and training them isn't going to give them a duty to help.

[Joinfortmill]

49. You get better quality candidates.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

51. Who still have no duty to assist, and are working within an oppressive system.

STG cops are the only institution that can fail and get its budget increased, over and over again.

[Gore1FL]

53. I wouldn't have gone in. There is a reason I never earned "Lifesaving" merit Badge in BSA.

There would be two drownings. At some point you have to make good decisions even if there are no good options.