Kirschner is on MSNBC saying this.

[fightforfreedom]

Trump is on the hook for treason.

[gab13by13]

1. I would be extremely pleased if

Donald Trump were indicted for impeding and obstructing an official act of Congress, a much easier case to prove.

I would also be pleased if Fanni Willis indicts Trump for election law violations, a much easier case to bring.

I remember Trump being on the hook in NY for financial and tax fraud until Alvin Bragg unhooked him.

Being on the hook all depends if the fisherman is fishing catch and release.

[tavernier]

2. Perfect metaphor

[2naSalit]

8. +1

Once upon a time one of our leaders said, "You want to see him impeached, I want to see him in prison."

All legal means possible will likely be employed whether we see it in action or not, IMHO.

[mopinko]

13. i'm fine w tax evasion.

anything to get him behind bars.

[malaise]

3. Heard him

Lock him up!

[no_hypocrisy]

4. If a President is Commander in Chief of the Military,

could Trump be prosecuted for treason by a military tribunal?

I'm ignorant and just asking.

[FarPoint]

5. That is a very reasonable question....

Worth discussion!


Treason Defined: brief version....



treason n. the crime of betraying one's country, defined in Article III, section 3 of the U. S. Constitution: "Treason against the United States shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort."

[Calista241]

11. The answer is no.

Treason is specifically defined in the Constitution, and we basically have to be at war with someone, and Trump would have to provide them “aid and comfort”.

Also, Trump may be Commander in Chief, but he is a civilian and subject to civilian courts.

[getagrip_already]

24. The case is being made that we are at war... with ourselves

I think it was the judge who testified this week. He made the case that trump waged a literal act of war against the us.

First thing I thought of when I heard that is that the basis of treason.

[dem4decades]

6. Kirschner says what we all want but I doubt any of it will become reality.

[getagrip_already]

25. kirschner is being paid a lot of money to give opinions....

The more pointed those opinions, the more money he makes.

Nobody is going to want to hear a balanced opinion, with no real end-point.

Kirscner is selling an end-point view. He isn't giving a thoughtful analysis.

[dem4decades]

27. I wonder how those guys get paid? Contract? Per appearance? And how much?

[getagrip_already]

28. Msnbc intros him as an analyst....

So he is paid under the terms of a contract. Could be per appearance, or cover x appearances. How much he makes is up to his agent and msnbc.

Guests don't get paid, but they do get pampered with first class t&e.

Contributors are full time or frequent show talent. They would be treated as employees.

I think that's how it works anyway.

[Vinca]

7. I heard another lawyer on CNN say he didn't think Trump would be charged because he

always manages to shift the blame to others. In this case, he would claim he was relying on legal advice (no pardon for you, Eastman). In a just world, Trump would have been in prison for other crimes prior to the 2016 election, but he's always managed to skate by with the worst consequence for anything being a civil penalty. He might be on the hook, but he's going to slide right off. Again.

[fightforfreedom]

9. I hear you, however, there is a chance people in Trumps inner circle could turn.

Will Eastman, Meadows, others go to prison for Trump? Or will they attempt to get a plea deal. Will they tell all in an attempt to save themselves?

The case against Trump in Georgia is a slam dunk. He can't say someone else made that phone call. Trump is very good at protecting himself, he sacrifices those around him in order to protect himself. This time Trump made some really big mistakes.

[Vinca]

14. IMO, Georgia is our best hope. It will be interesting to see what happens with Eastman, Meadows and

the rest of the merry band of criminals. Meadows appears to have accepted a bribe to keep quiet according to the J6 hearings with the million dollar donation to his charity (thanks Trump donors, LOL). Eastman seems almost more like the pillow guy who seems willing to take his miserable business down the drain for Trump. I guess it will depend on who has truly been brainwashed and who is just playing a game to enrich themselves. And, of course, Rudy always has the insanity defense.

[dem4decades]

29. Georgia is our best hope? Some poor local prosecutor? Forget about it.

DOJ is the one with the hammer and they're not bringing it.

Trump is above the law, and possibly the law in the very near future.

Thanks DOJ. For nothing.

[onenote]

33. DOJ is actively pursuing a case of seditious conspiracy against the Proud Boys.

That case is a necessary predicate to bringing a similar charge against Trump.

[gab13by13]

21. I understand that time doesn't matter

with the wait and see crowd, but when would Eastman, Meadows turn on Trump when I don't expect either one of those trials to happen before 2024, possibly not until 2025, if they are indicted.

[hydrolastic]

10. There seems to be something building up

But doesn't it bother anyone that through the first impeachment to this point, Nothing of consequence has happened to stop him? There is something wrong with the political/justice system if the only time it works is at the very end and only if the right things happen. It looks like Nixon laid down the blueprint on how to subvert the government from the inside and now it will be repeated until succesfull.

[fightforfreedom]

20. Most of the things Trump has gotten away with happened when he controlled the DOJ.

Mueller, impeachment, etc. He has no control over of these investigations. Times have changed.

[dem4decades]

30. DOJ wasn't under Trump's control when the statute of limitations ran out for individual one.

I didn't see DOJ justice then, Michael Cohen paid the price for Trump's criminality, not Trump.

He's above the law, too big to indict.

America is a bunch of bullshit, it's all about protecting the powerful.

[Emile]

12. Traitorous asshole needs to be put in front of a firing squad,

instead he's playing golf at Mar-a-Lago. Judgement Day is coming asshole!

[durablend]

15. There's a gallows not being used, just sayin.....

[we can do it]

16. Is there video?

[Lovie777]

17. Did I hear shithole threaten Pres. B? . ....

by video showing him hitting Pres. B with a golf ball in the head.

[Mr. Ected]

18. As the photo develops before our eyes, it is becoming abundantly clear that Trump coordinated a coup

Against the United States of America. He engaged militia groups to strike against our standing government.

Too many people concentrate on the giving of aid and comfort to an enemy element of the Constitutional definition of treason and not enough on the "levying war" against the United States part.

What would waging war against the USA look like? Watch the J6 videos.

Glenn Kirschner is a genius, a patriot and a true seeker of justice. He's also a formidable former federal prosecutor. He's not much on crazy legal theories. When he suggests that Trump's crimes would include a charge of treason, he didn't just conjure the idea up to get our juices flowing. It's legally plausible.

[Novara]

26. Seditious conspiracy is more likely

Treason is an extremely high bar and it will be most likely interpreted in the strictest sense: that of giving aid and comfort to a foreign enemy during wartime. You know that would go all the way to the SCOTUS. You think this SCOTUS would be open-minded and generous with its meaning?

Seditious conspiracy is a lower bar and indeed, seems pretty proveable to me:

"Just say we won and the republicans in congress will do the rest."

"I just need you to find 11,800 votes."

"If you don't do this, I won't be your friend anymore." (Jeebus, sounds like a 5 year old.)

We have physical proof for all of these comments, and there are more. These are orders from the president, are they not? These comments illustrate intent and are part of the whole. Look again at the statute (18 U.S. Code § 2384 - Seditious conspiracy):

If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.

The word "force" is in there. I would argue that the tweet about Pence while the mob had already breached the capitol was when he conspired to use force. He knew they were there and they were rioting. Testimony during the hearings showed that when he sent that tweet, the mob became enraged and they went looking to hang Pence. I would also argue his riling up the mob before they went to the capitol was "by force to prevent...."

[They_Live]

19. RICO and wire fraud

still seem very solid to me.

[Fiendish Thingy]

22. Trump will never be charged with treason

But I think it’s likely he will be charged with crimes that, if/when convicted, will result in a virtual Life sentence.

[Patton French]

23. Lucy and the football, and all that. NT

[Seeking Serenity]

31. Put him before a military tribunal

Find him guilty of treason, and have him hanged immediately after.

And then start moving down the list.

[onenote]

32. If Kirshner thinks that, he needs to go back to law school.

Seditious conspiracy? Good chance.

Treason? No chance.