Isn't prayer in schools grooming?

[malaise]

Asking for my fellow atheist friends.

[Claustrum]

1. You know it's always projections with them.

They want to groom the next generation with their religious beliefs. So they have to accuse democrats for what they are doing.

[Wounded Bear]

7. Every accusation is a confession...nt

[Bayard]

2. Yes

[doc03]

3. Not if you want them to grow up good

Last edited Wed Jun 29, 2022, 05:55 PM - Edit history (1)

little fascists.

[lapucelle]

4. I'm careful with the expansion of the meaning the word "grooming".

I work in education, and there are a lot of RW parents claiming that teachers are "grooming" their students to be (what most of us would call) compassionate, tolerant, decent human beings who know how to think for themselves.

That said, public prayer in schools is cohesive and invites the toxic exclusion of children who don't participate.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

12. It really bothers me

Grooming has a VERY SPECIFIC meaning - and it refers to sexual exploitation and pedophilia. The right is accusing every random person of grooming their kids, but they do at least mean it sexually. Our side seems to take any conservative idea being taught to children as "grooming" - and it isn't. Indoctrination, yes. Grooming, no.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

31. I agree entirely.

"Grooming" is a term that has a specific meaning that ought not be diluted or be thrown around loosely.

Things like the coach-led football prayer are clear examples of religious coercion. No student athlete should feel pressured or compelled to participate due to reasonable fears that failing to join in the prayer session would get them benched.

The Court's actions clearly run counter to the spirit of the First Amendment.

[Skittles]

5. YES

absolutely YES

so is prayer in church

[sakabatou]

6. It can be.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

8. Grooming has a very specific meaning that is ignored here

Grooming is a sex thing, not a religion, guns or political ideology thing.
Professors groom students for sex. Pedophiles groom kids for sex. Priests groom altar boys for sex. Spoken by someone whose former best friend groomed a teen he was raising as his son.

Prayer in schools may be indoctrination, but its not grooming.

[malaise]

9. Thanks

but don't more than a few religions groom kids for sex?

[AZSkiffyGeek]

11. There is certainly a problem with pedophile priests at the very least

But that is different.
Students aren't being "encouraged" to pray in order to make them more pliable to molestation.
Edit: At least not in recent situations involving the Supreme Court.

[mopinko]

17. they most certainly do. most i would venture.

many muslim communities have a tradition of boys for sex. mormons, catholics, baptists. boy scouts used to require religious oath.
most of them also have a seal of secrecy in place, like in the confessional, which is just askin for it.

[malaise]

18. I almost used

most

[mopinko]

20. the only religion i know that does not

abuse their young is mainstream judaism, as far as i know. all the ones i know, and i live in a hood that is about 20% jewish, have the kind of family centered lives that makes it almost impossible to isolate and harm a child. i exempt the more radical branches, who i know more at a distance, but they certainly are sexist, which is another hallmark. i've known some where women arent even allowed to speak to men besides family.

and the stone age ones, the amish, etc, yeah, you cant tell me that's all wholesome.

[malaise]

10. Thanks

but don't more than a few religions groom kids for sex?

[TwilightZone]

13. Agreed.

Indoctrination would indeed be a better word.

[Politicub]

26. Perhaps the definition should be expanded to include forced religious indoctrination. N/t

[AZSkiffyGeek]

28. Why not just use indoctrination?

[Mr.Bill]

29. Five syllable words

are out of reach for most republicans.

[GoCubsGo]

14. It depsnds.

Kids praying on their own, no. Compulsory prayers, such as what already one sees in the Catholic and other religious gulags...errr...schools is absolutely grooming. It has no place in public schools.

And, by "grooming," I mean grooming to comply to a particular religious faith. The term is not applicable only to sex.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

19. That's indoctrination, not grooming

You can say its about religion, but that doesn't mean the definition changes to suit your needs.
Grooming refers to sexual molestation, and trafficking.

[Gore1FL]

25. It depends on the dictionary, I guess.

Sexual molestation, and trafficking are nowhere to be seen in Webster's definition:

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/groom

groom verb
groomed; grooming; grooms
Definition of groom (Entry 2 of 2)
transitive verb

1: to clean and maintain the appearance of (an animal)
especially : to maintain the health and condition of the coat of (a horse, dog, etc.) by brushing, combing, currying, or similar attention
2: to make neat or attractive
an impeccably groomed woman
3: to get into readiness for a specific objective : PREPARE
was being groomed as a presidential candidate

In Oxford's, however, it's as you describe:

https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/us/definition/english/grooming?q=grooming

grooming noun
/ˈɡruːmɪŋ/
/ˈɡruːmɪŋ/
[uncountable]
1> ​the things that you do to keep your clothes and hair clean and neat, or to keep an animal’s fur or hair clean
You should always pay attention to personal grooming.
a range of hair grooming products
Grooming is a vital part of caring for your dog.

​2> the process in which an adult develops a friendship with a child, particularly through the internet, with the intention of having an illegal sexual relationship

[Poiuyt]

15. Sunday school is grooming

[budkin]

16. No because Jesus

Jesus saves

[PufPuf23]

21. Prayer in school is at the least seeding mental illness and delusion

in vulnerable young people.

Spent the first 40 years of life self-identifying as a cultural Christian but never a Believer in the magic stuff.

The last 30 years through observation and direct experience believe Christianity (and most religions) are evil.

There are individuals I know that are practicing Christians and hold in regard but not many.

Christianity has grown toxic in the USA to the degree that the Union is threatened.

[malaise]

23. I started challenging my very Catholic mother

before I was twelve. Like you the faith part missed me.
Having a paternal aunt who was agnostic was a good thing.

[Torchlight]

22. It's grooming them to be good little christians, so yeah. Grooming. nt

verb
gerund or present participle: grooming
1. brush and clean the coat of (a horse, dog, or other animal).
"you must be prepared to spend time grooming your dog"

2. prepare or train (someone) for a particular purpose or activity.
"star pupils who are groomed for higher things"

[sarisataka]

24. Which definition?

grooming /ˈɡro͞omiNG/

noun

1.

the practice of brushing and cleaning the coat of a horse, dog, or other animal.
"regular grooming is essential to the well-being of your dog"

2.

the action by a pedophile of preparing a child for a meeting, especially via an internet chat room, with the intention of committing a sexual offense.
"online grooming has become a growing cause for concern"

[Gore1FL]

32. Definition 3 of the verb at Webster

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/groom

[sarisataka]

33. Begs the question

What is the objective

[Gore1FL]

34. The objective, ultimately, is control. nt

[Tree Lady]

27. I wouldn't use the word grooming

But I would say brainwashing because kids at a young age are very easily influenced by adults and people they consider in charge.

Anyone supervising children should not be teaching them things except what is in the textbooks.

It has to be no religion no politics in school or it will cause clashes on both sides.

But if the supreme court says its ok then I would tell the kids before any prayer you don't have to participate or listen.

[Mr.Bill]

30. I went to Catholic school for six years

and it groomed me to become an Atheist. In fact, a large percentage of the Atheists I've met went to Catholic school.

[Voltaire2]

35. Yes. As is using any gender pronouns or any

depiction or implication of intimate relations between people.

But they don’t care about logic or consistency. It is only grooming if the ‘wrong’ pronouns or the ‘wrong’ sort of relationship or the ‘wrong’ religious beliefs are involved.