Young Voters Are Fed Up With Their (Much) Older Leaders

[Coventina]

Alexandra Chadwick went to the polls in 2020 with the single goal of ousting Donald J. Trump. A 22-year-old first-time voter, she saw Joseph R. Biden Jr. as more of a safeguard than an inspiring political figure, someone who could stave off threats to abortion access, gun control and climate policy.

Two years later, as the Supreme Court has eroded federal protections on all three, Ms. Chadwick now sees President Biden and other Democratic leaders as lacking both the imagination and willpower to fight back. She points to a generational gap — one she once overlooked but now seems cavernous.

“How are you going to accurately lead your country if your mind is still stuck 50, 60 or 70 years ago?” Ms. Chadwick, a customer service representative in Rialto, Calif., said of the many septuagenarian leaders at the helm of her party. “It’s not the same, and people aren’t the same, and your old ideas aren’t going to work as well anymore.”

While voters across the spectrum express rising doubts about the country’s political leadership, few groups are as united in their discontent as the young.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/14/us/politics/youth-voters-midterms-polling.html

***********************************************************************

I post this NOT to be divisive!! I fully support anyone with a D by their name.
Having said that, I can understand the frustration and anger of young people. They have a worse future than their parents. Possibly much, much worse.
I am actually glad I am not young, and that most of my life is behind me.

[mzmolly]

1. 'Young voters'

need a lesson in civics it seems.

[Haggard Celine]

13. God knows they didn't get it in school.

[Mariana]

113. Their elders really dropped the ball, doing away with civics classes in schools. nt.

[Haggard Celine]

120. Yes they did.

A lot of older people say things about Generation Z, or whatever they're called. A common refrain is that the younger ones are ignorant of history. Well who is responsible for educating kids and setting examples? I guess a lot of people are putting their kids in front of a computer and letting them educate themselves. It is a crisis that there's so much ignorance out there among the young, but we shouldn't talk about it as if it's some moral failing of theirs that prevents them from learning. The fault lies with us.

[treestar]

160. well there, I'm afraid, is where we Democrats tend to drop the ball

All about thinking if only so and so were President, and if only the President did this or that.

The more local the election, the more boring, apparently, less grand and historical. The Republicans realized that was not so, and ran for school boards.

I admire Republicans for one thing and one thing only - they vote, never abandoning that because they don't get all they want, they stay the long road, not giving up because it will take 50 years (just worked for them) and they know that the local issues matter and that every local election matters, thus they own state legislatures and gerrymander (we act like victims of that, but we could pay more attention to state legislatures).

We could have run against them for school boards and avoided all of this. But we were too busy arguing about what the President could do about it . The answer is Nothing. The school board was in charge.

[2naSalit]

48. +1

[captain queeg]

2. The young have the numbers, they need to use them

The oldsters have the money, they WILL use it

[Retrograde]

8. The old also get out and vote

and they vote in every election they can, not just the big one every four years.

[2naSalit]

50. +1

[captain queeg]

52. Very true

M

[Mariana]

114. The old also get out and vote, and most of them vote for Republicans. nt.

[treestar]

162. and that's exactly what Americans get to do

it's a right and not a burden. Not something we have to be cajoled and catered to in order to do. We realize that's our say right there. And don't expect detailed results from it.

And now it is a fight against evil. We see what the Republicans are up to. No demands to be inspired, just get out there and fight the evil.

[DFW]

3. That's what I said at the Pentagon in 1967 at age 15

Did we do such a great job in the meantime?

[Coventina]

11. Nope.

*sigh*

It's not that we (as in the folks here on this website) haven't tried. We're a pretty activist bunch, and I'm sure we're way more than just keyboard warriors.

Sadly, I think that we (DUers) have generally lacked the money, power, and influence to make effective change.

The forces of reactionary politics have been at the reigns since 1980. (The year I was 11).

[Haggard Celine]

24. I agree. And I'm the same age as you.

It's certainly never seemed like I was in control. Politics to me is a lot like the weather. Living on the Gulf Coast, the weather is generally mild and you know what to expect most of the time. But sometimes we have a freeze or a hurricane that sets us back a while until we can catch back up. Well, I've never felt caught up in my life. And I don't have control over most of it.

The people who are in charge now have been in charge all along. You'd think that out of respect for sheer gaucheness that they would have handed the reins over to the next generation and let them learn to handle things. But the ruler class of that age bracket are just so goddamned narcissistic that they can't imagine a world that they aren't in control of. I think of those Futurama cartoons with Nixon's head in a jar, serving as President. That cartoon was fucking prescient.

But we have to let this sad tableau play itself out for a few more years, so just keep your head down and wait a little longer. It's all we can do.

[Greybnk48]

77. No shit. Isn't that what all young, people say about older,

experienced workers?

[Retrograde]

4. I have a choice this fall between 2 Democrats

(I'm in California: the jungle primary sometimes results in two candidates from the same party on the November ballot) One is the 70-something incumbent, who isn't dynamic but is responsive to their constituents: I always get a reply when I contact their office. The other is a Bernie Bro, whose main running point is that his opponent is old. I agree that we need new blood in the House, but I don't want someone as naive as the challenger seems from his campaign literature.

We need to start grooming the next couple of generations of Democratic leadership, getting them elected to local offices and then statewide and federal ones. And we need to remember that age and competence (and wisdom) don't always go together - look at Boebert or Cawford (and what's up with him these days? He's been rather quiet since he lost his primary)

[Elessar Zappa]

5. Then they need to vote!

C’mon youngsters, save us please! Seriously, they’re our only hope.

[Demsrule86]

9. Then we are fucking doomed as they don't vote hardly at all...if they object to whoever then

should get involved in the process and help nominate candidates...I am sick of their incessant whining...I wonder how many of them bothered to vote in 2016 or voted for fucking Stein... It is not Biden's fault.

[Demsrule86]

6. Well it is divisive and should not be posted...this is agism pure and simple...and since the

young barely vote, I don't give two fucks.

[PortTack]

14. ☝️☝️☝️☝️☝️

Besides, I can name 2-3 organizations of young ppl fired up and ready to vote.

Aaron Parnus leading one of them. You can find him on twitter

[AZSkiffyGeek]

19. That 22-year-old first time voter apparently didn't care enough in 2016 either

[Coventina]

26. Um....if she's 22 now, she would have been too young to vote in 2016. n/t

[SickOfTheOnePct]

29. I read it as she was 22 in 2020

Which would have made her 18 in 2016.

[Coventina]

31. I agree it's a bit vaguely written, but even if that is so

she might have turned 18 too late to be eligible.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

35. Nice try, but no

If she was 22 by Nov 3 2020, then she would had to have been 18 by Nov 8 2016.

It’s not vague at all to me - it says she was a 22 year old first time voter in 2020, and then talks about two years later, or now.

I’m with the previous poster - in 2016, she was didn’t bother to vote, for whatever reason. And now she’s upset that that the President she voted for can’t instantly fix the shitshow caused by the election that she and so many of her age cohort couldn’t be bothered to vote in.

[Coventina]

39. OK, got it. She missed her first election so her opinion does not matter for the rest of her life.

I'm sure getting that message will encourage her to keep voting for Democrats!

[SickOfTheOnePct]

43. No one said her opinion doesn't matter

But anyone who sat on their ass and chose not to vote for Hillary in 2016 needs to acknowledge that they contributed to Trump’s victory, and they don’t get to blame President Biden for not being able to wave a magic wand and instantly fix the mess that Trump left him.

[treestar]

95. If she doesn't vote at all her opinion does not matter

No one who doesn't vote will have an opinion that matters.

[The Revolution]

132. No, but the Supreme Court decisions

That she is complaining about were already baked in before the 2020 election. Trump had already appointed the justices and there wasn't really anything Biden could do about it. The time to do something was 2016. If you didn't bother to vote, you can't complain about the outcome.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

33. I read that as she was a 22-year-old first time voter in 2020

Which would make her 18 in 2016.

[Coventina]

34. If she turned 18 in 2016 she might not have reached 18 in time to vote. n/t

[AZSkiffyGeek]

36. If she was 22 on Nov 3 2020

She had to be 18 in 2016, as election day was Nov 8.

[Coventina]

40. Please see my response #39 n/t

[SickOfTheOnePct]

38. That's not possible

If she was 22 when she voted in 2020.

[ProfessorGAC]

41. That Couldn't Be It

If she was 22 in Nov 2020, she'd have been 18 in 2020, unless election day was her birthday.
That said, i think it was inelegantly written & I'm interpreting it as you did. She's 22 NOW, voted nearly 2 years ago at 19 or 20 & in '16 was too young to vote.
The author of the piece wrote this in a confusing way.

[treestar]

85. +1

I've heard enough on DU about them. Now I'm like the parent. "Enough!"

[Autumn]

214. Ageism isn't just against elders. You are wrong when you say the young barely vote

Last edited Sun Jul 17, 2022, 12:22 PM - Edit history (1)

They do vote, not in the numbers that older people vote but then, they are the ones struggling to survive.

Ageism refers to the stereotypes (how we think), prejudice (how we feel) and discrimination (how we act) towards others or oneself based on age. Who does ageism affect? Ageism affects everyone. Children as young as 4 years old become aware of their culture's age stereotypes

https://circle.tufts.edu/latest-research/half-youth-voted-2020-11-point-increase-2016


https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2021/2020-presidential-election-voting-and-registration-tables-now-available.html

[yardwork]

7. WTF?! The Supreme Court decisions are NOT Biden's fault!!

This is outrageous.

[Demsrule86]

10. Yes it is and should not even be posted here...I suppose some Democrat hating entity

wrote the article.

[SergeStorms]

96. Hence the "lesson in civics" post #1.

These kids don't know who does what and for how long. If they're laying this at Biden's feet, they're sorely mistaken.

We may be old, but we know how our government is run and who's obstructing progress.

[Mariana]

148. They don't know because their elders failed to educate them. nt.

[ripcord]

122. I would have more respect for their opinions

If they didn't desert us on election days.

[JI7]

12. Sorry but these people are just stupid.

Real politics is boring, government is boring. None of this is about imagination. It's about numbers .

We had someone young with Obama and he faced the same bs from similar stupid people.

Also these people are not going to vote in local and state elections.

In California we are able to do many things becsuse we have the numbers to do it.

[betsuni]

58. +1

[JI7]

15. It was a bunch of new young justices that helped overturn Roe

[Boomerproud]

217. Excellent point.

[moonshinegnomie]

16. im 60 and i agree with the younger generation

i too think we need a new generation of leaders. the old way of doing thing isnt workign when you have 1 side willing to break any rule and win at all costs.

[Skittles]

32. THANK YOU

PASS THE FUCKING BATON ALREADY

[thucythucy]

53. You can't "pass the baton" if there's no one there to pick it up.

If every elder progressive in America were to stop their work in order to "pass the baton" all that would happen is conservatives would win every election hands-down.

Fortunately there are quite a few young activists in the disability rights movement, which happens to be my wheelhouse, along with whole legions of young artists, writers, thinkers. They aren't waiting for anyone to pass them fucking anything. They're taking action for themselves. And most older activists I know are thrilled to be mentors to younger activists and quite willing to rest after a lifetime of demonstrations, registration drives, litigation, citizen lobbying, civil disobedience and arrests.

Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. didn't wait for an older generation of civil rights leaders to "hand him the fucking baton." He went out himself, did the work, took the risks. As did young antiwar activists in the 1960s, and young feminists and gay activists and disability rights activists in the 1970s.

So I share the skepticism of others in this thread, hearing a complaint from someone who evidently didn't even bother to vote in 2016, and is now pissed that President Biden isn't some great savior, able to undo the installation of three Supreme Court justices and hundreds of federal district and circuit court judges.

By and large there's nothing stopping younger people--or most anyone for that matter--from picking up or making their own fucking baton. First step: register to fucking vote. Then vote. Every single fucking time.

[betsuni]

59. +1

[Skittles]

80. I'm talking in general

when the two contenders to be the next prez are two white men aged 80 and 78, it's not hard to see why young folk can feel disillusioned

[thucythucy]

99. And yet when offered a relatively young woman as a candidate

very many of them shrugged and said,"Meh," giving us among other monstrosities three hideous lifetime appointments to the Supreme Court.

Not to mention we now have our first black woman vice president. Not good enough, I guess.

You can't be "disillusioned" unless you were living under some illusions to begin with. Our political system has never favored change, has always been stacked in favor of the status quo or worse. Anyone with any grounding in American history would know that, and seek to work around it.

Frankly I would love to see another Obama: a young, charismatic black man or woman who could carry the day, though as I recall there were quite a few complaints about him as well. And JFK, for all the gushing done about him now, was seen as hopelessly middle of the road by many young progressives in 1960. They preferred the more liberal--and yet older--Adlai Stevenson.

The time to have come forward with all this would have been when Elizabeth Warren was running in the primaries. And yet turnout for her as I recall was rather anemic. Why was that, do you think? Where were all these people then, when they might have made a difference?

[betsuni]

105. People swore they would've voted for Warren had she run in 2016, always praised as a progressive

leader with great progressive policies. Then when she did run, not too much interest. Suddenly she wasn't good enough, too capitalist and used to be a Republican and so on. Policies not so important after all. I wonder if Warren was surprised.

[thucythucy]

108. I was an early and ardent supporter of Senator Warren.

Thinking about the response in 2016 still has me mumbling obscenities under my breath.

[Mariana]

141. Is it Hillary Clinton you are calling "relatively young"?

Hillary Clinton was 69 years old on election day 2016. She would have been an amazing president, but she wasn't "relatively young".

[thucythucy]

215. Well, compared to Trump and Biden.

Everything is relative.

Besides which, I've heard it said that sixty is the new forty.

But I get the point.

[Sympthsical]

176. "Relatively young"

69 is not young.

Obama was young. Bush was relatively young.

No one who is past retirement age is relatively young in this or any other universe. Reagan was 69 when he was elected, and he was the oldest person elected to the office at the time.

I think that characterization is probably far more telling of how the perspectives in this space are formed.

That was weirdly eye opening to read. "Oh. It really is that skewed. Sort of explains things." It really explains things.

[JI7]

102. There were many young candidates running in 2020

[Skittles]

133. yeah but who got the prize

because so many people were made to believe only he could win

[inthewind21]

161. NO ONE

Is MADE to believe anything. People believe what they choose to believe. The US hasn't gone full blown mind control. Yet. And if you say social media is to blame, nope, people choose that as well.

[inthewind21]

159. Pass the baton?

The opportunity to change all of government, or "pass the baton" happens every 2, 4 and 6 years. Yet somehow, it never changes. Now, who's fault is that? The politicians or the voters? And don't come back with every excuse under the sun on why it's someone or something else's fault. Think about what this 22 year old nitwit said, then ask, gee, how'd we get here. If she had a single clue, she would have been well aware ROE was lost on election night 2016. Yet here she is in 2022, whining and complaining because POTUS didn't save her.

Disclaimer, yes, I called her a nitwit. And she is. For the mere fact she thought POTUS could "safeguard" a whole bunch of shit that was lost 5 years ago. She wants what she wants when she wants it but she can't be bothered to get even the slightest clue how her own government works. And that doesn't just apply to young voters. There are plenty of older votes who are just as ignorant.

[Maeve]

136. 66, here, and Hubby and I have been saying the same thing

We need the fresh view of a newer generation in the halls of power--too many Boomers--and OLDER--clinging to out-dated ideas.

Of course, some younger are just as stupid, but that's human nature.

[moonshinegnomie]

139. and yet here the younger generation gets called stupid

[Maeve]

145. Not by everyone; and the denigration of the young goes back to the start of time

Even the Greeks and Romans complained of kids who don't know nothin'!

[inthewind21]

164. Well

In order to get a "fresh view" there has to be candidates to step into government AND voters to put them there. It just amazes me all the excuses tossed out on why we have the government we have. We have it because that is what voters, US citizens, have chosen! And by not choosing, AKA not voting, yes, you did in fact make a choice, don't whine when it doesn't work how you want. US citizens have the power to send ALL of government packing. But instead, everyone seems more interested in making sure it's "not my fault." It IS OUR fault! Not the media. Not FB, Twitter, Tic Toc or any other social media. Which ironically gets tons of blame but is used right here on a regular basis as sources. It's not the electoral college, it's been here all along, Yes, government has run amok. ONLY because US citizens have allowed it. It's not because any office with an R in was stolen. It's because that is what the voters have made happen! Either by action or inaction.

[thucythucy]

216. Leadership is about leading.

It's not about waiting for others "to make room" or whatever.

Were you around on DU back during the days of "Nancy Pelosi should step aside because she's too old to be effective"? In the years since she's done amazing work--shepherding the creation of the January 6th committee through the process being just the latest example.

You can't replace something with nothing, or someone with no one. Before kicking out Speaker Pelosi, or President Biden, or Senator Sanders or Senator Warren, I'd like to see who it is would be replacing them.

[Maeve]

226. Don't misunderstand me...no one else could be Pelosi

But we need younger people to step up...and there are some doing so. I think it's "Run for Something" that has helped train new people; there are others out there doing the heavy lifting---power to them!!! And we do have folk in the pipeline that are Gen X, Millennials and such. But my generation needs to stop hogging the stage, too. We tend to be divas.
And yeah...been here since 2001. Thought the idiots should chill re: Madame Speaker. And was right. So are you.

[thucythucy]

232. I agree--I also know young activists

doing amazing work. My focus is on the disability rights movement--it's where I've spent the most of my time and done the most of my advocacy. I see all kinds of exciting and important work being done by twenty and thirty-somethings. I've even run into activism at the high school level.

What's interesting to me is that none of these activists I know personally are wasting time or effort lambasting their elders or telling them to get out of the way. They're doing the work. And it's work that they are uniquely qualified to do. Their use of social media for instance is just amazing. From the Autism Self-Advocacy Network to SinsInvalid to all the activists involved in Disability Justice, whole new networks of young activists are producing their own leaders and focusing on the issues important to their communities.

Which is why I find all this talk about "making space" and "handing down the baton" or whatever simply baffling. The young activists I know aren't waiting for anyone or anything. They're organizing, claiming their own space and forging their own batons.

So then to read an article featuring someone who didn't even bother to vote in 2016 but is now frustrated at the supposed inaction of Democrats, and then all these posts about how Boomers, to quote one poster, "are standing in the way" or words to that effect, is rather off-putting, to say the least.

I've also been mulling over the discussion of how younger people today face obstacles so much worse than previous generations. Perhaps I'm wrong--forever and always possible--but such a viewpoint seems to me reflective of a white, male and Cis perspective. For instance, I don't see how the organizers of SNCC had it so much easier--as young black activists in the early 1960s--than activists today. The young people brutalized by Bull Connor's police dogs and fire hoses were mostly Black high school students, confronting the day to day realities of Jim Crow. And women in the 1960s--young and old--weren't even permitted access to credit cards or mortgages without permission from a male in authority. Not to mention: pre-Roe v. Wade, and how there weren't even rape crisis centers until the 1970s. Not to mention--all those courageous folk who confronted the police at Stonewall in 1969. I generally don't like to indulge in this sort of "whataboutism," but really... To some extent it's apples and oranges. It has for instance been pointed out the economics--for young white men at any rate--are more daunting than in the past. So I can sympathize. But my sympathy doesn't extend to scapegoating entire generations of activists for the crime of being born between 1945 and 1965.

One of the most exciting--to me anyway--aspects of the newest generations of disability rights activists is their understanding of the dynamics of race, class and gender as they impact disabled people. The young folks I run into are so much more sophisticated and knowledgeable than I was at their age. It always does me good to interact with them.

Well, now I'm just rambling. Too wordy, I know, but I felt the need to put this down on the--virtual--page.

Best wishes--

Thucy

[treestar]

155. That argument is meaningless when the polls showed

the young people preferred Bernie.

How old is Bernie again?

It does not matter how old the leaders are - it is where they stand on things. The rest is ageism.

the older people should be the leaders. There are only so many JFKs and Obamas.

[brush]

17. It's nothing new. It's what the '60s was all about. What the election...

of 40-something Bill Clinton in the '90s was all about, and Barrack Obama too to a lesser extent.

The youngest voters are the ones who vote the least though.

[Sympthsical]

22. In the 60s, young people weren't getting economically wrecked by their parents

It's a much, much different A to B journey from Greatest to Boomer and Boomer to Millennial.

Dismissing it as just, "Young people being young people," is pretty blithe. Mix in that these "young people" are now in their early 40s.

[brush]

27. Ok. It's still what happens. And newsflash: if you're in your early 40s...

Last edited Thu Jul 14, 2022, 08:11 PM - Edit history (1)

you're no longer "young people."

[Sympthsical]

30. I'm definitely not young people

But I am a Millennial, and the way they're talked down to around here is never not funny to me. "Oh those . . . middle aged people, so unwise in the ways of the world, worried about their avocado toasts and student loans."

It's hilarious. I have friends with kids in college. But those Millennials who don't know what the world is really like, lemme tell ya!

I think that really just speaks to how much older the demographic here is against the rest of the party. I think the poll laid out a few months ago had me in like the bottom 10%.

I think the latter half of the decade is going to be very turbulent for our party. This current top-heavy orientation cannot last much longer. I mean, biology alone will do for it.

[brush]

47. What are you proposing exactly? Voting against Democrats?

Voting for republicans? Voting third party? What?

You do know we're in danger of slipping into fascism, right? If we lose the mid-terms and our Congressional majorities the rest of Biden's term is lost and republicans will be emboldened and the rest of Biden's term will be nothing but a parade of impeachments and congressional hearings run by McCarthy, Taylor Green, Boebert and Gym Jordan and all the rest. And even more rights-snatching by the christo-fascist SCOTUS 6 will come so fast heads will spin. Ya think there were a lot of Benghazi hearing against Hillary, well we haven't seen anything yet.

These are not normal times. Democracy is on the brink so I advise if you have complaints against the aged, dinosaur Dem leader ship, make it against AG Garland. Get organized and yell as loud as you can because if he doesn't indict trump, trump will run again and sneer his way to victory and the nation will be toast FOR REAL.

That's a looming danger. Complain if you must but remember the republican wingers are the real enemy, not other Dems. Generational change happens. It's the way of history. Millennials will be running things soon and getting this same pushback from younger GenZers and the ones after them sooner than you think.

[thucythucy]

65. I take your point.

But this system didn't happen overnight.

It's the result of election after election--particularly midterms and off years--when too many people either couldn't be bothered or didn't understand what was at stake.

And the latest outrages are a direct result of many of those same people deciding Hillary Clinton wasn't "exciting" enough, or progressive enough, or whatever. Being "economically wrecked" isn't an insurmountable obstacle when it comes to registering to vote, and then voting. Although that too may change, thanks to the outcome of 2016.

Many of the civil rights activists in the 1950s and 1960s were working class or poor people, often women, often with little formal education. I doubt the obstacles they faced were any less daunting than what young people--especially young white people--are facing today.

But it is a different world, which no doubt requires different strategies, tactics, thinking. Then again, setting one generation of activists against another, which is what this article seems to be doing, doesn't seem to me to be in any way productive.

[Sympthsical]

73. 2016 isn't what broke Millennials

It hasn't helped (see: Roe), but there are certain bills that were passed so very bi-partisanly that have profoundly altered the course of my generation. From Glass-Steagall repeal setting up 2008, to the bankruptcy bill that chained people to student debt, and on and on (there are others, but I'm being careful).

Republicans suck, and I will never vote for them. They are far and away a destructive party at this point in our history.

But if we refuse to be honest about how we got where we are even before 2016, then how can we possibly repair what has gone so wrong? I saw a post get removed just for bringing up the bankruptcy bill. Just mentioning it. Not even an attack on anyone.

How can we fix what we cannot bring ourselves to talk about?

That is at the heart of a lot of our problems, and I see that mistake being made again. "Don't talk about inflation!"

Whut.

Economically, Boomers and Millennials have been vastly different. Look at this article and tell me you can honestly say, "They've both had it just as hard."

https://minnesotareformer.com/2021/08/11/millennials-are-the-largest-workforce-and-the-least-wealthy-why-politics/

[thucythucy]

86. I agree with the details you mention.

Yes, these were bone crushing mistakes that need to be undone.

So wouldn't it be more productive to advocate for the repeal or amendment of the bankruptcy bill, or passage of a replacement for Glass-Seagall? Which means finding and supporting candidates--who will no doubt be Democrats--and then working to get them elected?

Student debt in particular is a long standing issue that started in the 1960s when Reagan began gutting state colleges and universities in California. It's not like this snuck up on us. Conservatives in the 1960s identified colleges and universities as hotbeds of progressive, even radical politics, and worked systematically to return us to the status quo of the 1920s and 30s, when only the very rich could afford a college education. This wasn't the work of some great mass of malevolent boomers, but rather a clique of right wingers, with deep pockets and in it for the long haul, who were able to step by step bring us to where we are today.

And yes, the economics are quite different now, though my own experience is in the disability community, where people tend to be perennially economically stressed in ways most "mainstream" folk can hardly imagine. People on SSI or SSDI can hardly be said to be raking it in. And yet, somehow, that movement continues to cook, so that now the focus is shifting from "disability rights" to "disability justice." And it's younger people--particularly those in their twenties and thirties--leading the way.

Political activism has always been hard. Often it's been dangerous. I'm thinking for instance of the 1913 Ludlow Massacre, or the Birmingham bombings. Shit, look at what black abolitionists faced in the 1850s. I'm right now reading the memoir of a black woman who worked as a nurse for all black regiments in South Carolina during the civil war. She was born a fucking slave, and risked her life just to learn to read and write. She couldn't leave her tent at night for fear of being lynched. Somehow I don't think she would have seen student debt as an insurmountable obstacle to being an activist.

We all come at this from places of hardship and stress. And objectively speaking that may be more difficult today than it was in say 1950 or 1970, depending on who you are and what you've experienced. I certainly sympathize with anyone struggling for whatever reason. I just tend to lose patience with people who can't even get off their asses to vote, especially when I've seen what so many others have struggled against, and yet somehow managed to do their bit.

I wish I had some better answers. Anyway, best of luck to you and yours--we're all going to need it.

[Sympthsical]

18. The gerontocracy idea generates a lot of discussion

My generation and younger discusses it at great (and exhausting) length.

What people are saying, what they're discussing, how they think and feel about politics at the moment . . . I wouldn't post it here. I'm not even sure I could post it here. But it wouldn't be very productive.

Suffice to say, we do not feel heard. They turned out in 2020, but they feel leadership hasn't turned out for them in kind. Our economic issues get dismissed out of hand. Look at the reaction to inflation or student loans. Older voters in the party either don't care or don't want to talk about it. That's why I'm getting increasingly exercised about it. How can some Democrats dismiss people hurting so blithely out of political calculus and Twitter preoccupation? It doesn't make sense to me.

I was real nervous about turn out in November on account of this. However, I think Roe has changed things. How much it has changed things remains to be seen. We've 3.5 months left to go. Complacency will set in a bit. Humans get inured to things quickly when our attention spans are constantly being altered on a daily basis. Things that you'd hope would have an impact are forgotten quickly.

If people remain feeling unheard, unheeded, and unhelped, it's not going to go well. And no amount of screaming at them or sending fundraising e-mails is going to alter it.

It's like someone is standing on the road on fire, and people are walking past, "Well, vote!" Ok, not very helpful in the heat of the moment. And what if that person was promised a fire extinguisher two years ago? "Vote!" Yes, of course. But right now, could you maybe try to smother the fire . . . "No, we can't do anything. Vote!"

I mean. It's not great messaging, and I still have no idea how people think it works. People need to at least feel like they're being heard, particularly on abortion and an inflationary economy eating wages. When I am seeing, "Get fucked, whiners!" on a daily basis in spaces that are supposed to be concerned with the poor and working classes, who are supposed to be about doing everything within their power and influence to protect the rights of women, I'm flabbergasted.

Like, what is going on right now? Is this how the next three months are really going to be?

If people are constantly made to feel that their issues don't matter and their input is not needed, they will begin to feel like maybe you don't need them. And when the inevitable consequences arrive, somehow they'll still get yelled at. Heads I win, tails get fucked.

I mean, it's not exactly a JFK speech is it?

[Coventina]

25. I sadly agree with you. I think that young people are not "seen" or "heard."

Part of it is that most young people are having to work harder and longer hours, which leaves them less time to organize and be active. That was definitely true of me in my early adulthood.

[JI7]

55. If Student Loans were that important they would have voted for Elizabeth Warren

The fact is voting and actual actions taken do not for what many claim young people want all the time on places like this site.

Also most young white males vote Republican .

[Sympthsical]

69. It's an issue, not the only issue

And remember, in the 2020 primaries, Democrats under 44 years old voted overwhelmingly for Bernie. It wasn't close. However, once we got into the general, they did their duty and turned out to elect President Biden.

If they're not feeling like their voices are respected, and they don't feel like they're getting a return for that support, how do you think that will be reflected in November?

I get that people don't give a shit. I think I'm more awed by how forcefully they've communicated they don't give a shit. It's open hostility. And after all that open hostility, "Now vote the way I want you to!"

I just don't understand how people can sit there and fail to know how living breathing human beings work.

We have three months to sew up our coalition and become a cohesive unit. Instead, I'm seeing shades of 2016 where it was communicated early and often that some segments of the party didn't matter and weren't really worth the thought. People don't even want to discuss inflation for crying out loud.

How'd that go again?

And by the way. The cohort that turns out the most during elections? No, not older voters. College educated voters. Still think dismissing the student loan issue is a good idea?

(The noting about male Republicans has nothing to do with anything. Voters under 50 voted overwhelmingly for Biden. Voters over 50 . . . did not).

[JI7]

71. I'm not the one dismissing student loans. Voters did that by not supporting Warren who was the only

one with a plan to get rid of it.

[moonshinegnomie]

72. 2020 election by age group

18-29. biden 62-35
30-44 biden 52-45
45-64 biden 50-49
65 and up trump 51-48

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1184426/presidential-election-exit-polls-share-votes-age-us/

[Sympthsical]

78. That is consonant with what I said.

We're looking at two different break downs. You're using exit polls, and I'm using research during the six months after the election.

Mine is:

18-29: 59% vs 35%
30-49: 55% vs 43%

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2021/06/30/behind-bidens-2020-victory/

But both say the same thing. Under 50 goes Biden. Over 50 does not.

[thucythucy]

110. Good to know.

Unfortunately it's not just who people vote for by age, but how many of that cohort actually vote:

CHARACTERISTIC NATIONAL AVERAGE 18-24** 25-44 65+
2020 61.3 % 48 % 55 % 71.9 %
2016 56 % 39.4 % 49 % 68.4 %
2012 56.5 % 38 % 49.5 % 69.7 %
2008 58.2 % 44.3 % 51.9 % 68.1 %

So as I read it, in 2020 less than half of eligible voters 18 to 24 voted at all, as opposed to more than two thirds of voters age 65 and older.

2016 was especially disheartening. Less than forty percent of voters 18 to 24 voted.

Ironically, much of the mess we're in now, for instance the repeal of Roe, wouldn't be an issue if more younger people had voted in 2016. Doubly ironic, since they had the most to lose with Trump appointing three Supreme Court justices, something younger voters will be living with for decades to come.

It's not as if Hillary and others didn't warn us.

[thucythucy]

76. What do you suggest?

What additional steps do older activists need to take that they're not taking now?

What you seem to be saying is people aren't even willing to take the relatively easy but vitallly necessary step of registering and voting. And yet they're expecting others to do, what? Undo three Supreme Court appointments? Rein in big oil and the billionaires who are trashing the economy now and the climate forever?

I have spent much of my life in the disability rights movement. I know spinal cord injured quadriplegics who risked arrest demonstrating for their rights. I know one quadriplegic, thrown into jail, denied critical medication, who is still suffering years later as a result. I know people who spent most of their lives in horrific institutions, suffering incredible abuse, who joined the movement and have done amazing work. They didn't discuss their problems with older activists or politicians "at great and exhausting length." They went out and actually did shit.

And as I posted elsewhere in this thread, many of the "foot soldiers" in the civil rights movement of the 1950s and '60s were working class and poor people, often with little education, often women and girls. Many of the people facing down police dogs and fire hoses in Birmingham were high school and junior high school students. Just as many of the most active BLM activists today are also quite young.
In fact, I see quite a few younger activists out there, doing the work. Young environmentalists, young disablity activists, and certainly young anti-gun violence activists. If I wanted to I could spent eighty hours a week on Zoom attending events organized by people in their twenties. So this malaise you sense among your peers doesn't seem at all universal.

But I return to me original question. What else should older activists be doing now, for instance on abortion? Or on inflation? What is possible in the next three months that will sway people who didn't vote in 2016 or 2018 to vote this November?

[Sympthsical]

82. Stop sneering at their issues would be a huge start.

I'm sure you're familiar with how debates about student loan debt go. Dismissive, you made your choices, boot straps, etc. Forget the loan aspect for a moment. How about reining in these universities and banks? Even a little bit?

And I don't know what to do about how people are treating inflation. We can't talk about it now? Pointing it out is a right-wing talking point?

What the . . .

Treating the issues of Millennials and below as issues worthy of consideration and discussion is like the absolute barest minimum. Forget acting on them. I have no illusion that what could be done will be done any time soon. But this constant, "The people we elected are powerless. Powerless I tell you! Stop criticizing!" And that's supposed to generate enthusiasm apparently. I think? It doesn't make sense to me, but perfect sense to many for some reason.

I have no idea why I'm bothering. I honestly don't. Because I've seen and experienced how older voters treat Millennials and younger with pure disdain for the issues that are affecting them. I know my words are just pissing into the wind.

But, ya know, sometimes someone just has to let people know that what they're doing and how they're treating people sucks.

What happened for Civil Rights during the 1960s was great. Amazing even. And I came up during the LGBT rights struggle in the wreckage of AIDS when people were still shell-shocked and recovering.

But there has been a good five decades that have unfolded since the 60s. How long is everyone planning on resting on those laurels?

Because a lot of crazy shit has happened since, and what happened 50 years ago shouldn't be a trump card thrown down to evade contemporary responsibilities. It too often is. I got a 4.0 in high school and college. Go me! Do you think dropping that knowledge on my boss is going to help me at work tomorrow? Or is she going to tell me to get my ass in gear and get the work in front of me done.

[summer_in_TX]

104. Thank you for persisting.

Dismissive is how some of it felt to me as well, and I'm firmly in the Boomer demographic.

Yours is the generation with kids still at home. Your generation and below are starting their households, trying to find a place to call home, furnishing the houses, buying clothes and shoes for constantly growing kids and their many needs. Now inflation is taking a bigger bite while that generation has more purchases required because of those factors.

My generation generally has no financial stressors that compare to what yours does. We are more likely to have homes that we furnished when younger but now we have relatively few purchases. Inflation hits, but if we are retired or working from home we don't have anywhere near the same financial pressures as parents of growing kids who have to get the kids to school and commute to work and so forth.

As we move into older age that's likely to change, with medical expenses being a significant part of our budget.

America is short at least 3.4 million homes. I've heard estimates as much as 10 million. Those trying to buy their first homes are up against that shortage and escalating home prices fueled by scarcity.

The least we can do is to try to listen and put ourselves in each others' shoes.

[thucythucy]

106. I wasn't "resting on laurels."

I was trying to point out that young activists back then faced obstacles, hardships and dangers every bit as daunting, and perhaps even more so, as what young activists are facing today. I gather that history isn't much studied these days, which is a shame, because it can sometimes provide some needed perspective.

I haven't seen very many people here dismissing student debt as an issue, but if they have that's wrong. The whole "bootstraps" argument is something I associate with right wingers, and would hope people here aren't that thick headed. What I have seen are people saying there isn't an easy way to instantly correct the problem, though President Biden has taken some steps and, from what I recollect, has already provided several billion dollars of debt relief. Of course this isn't enough, but unless I'm missing something further steps will require legislation, which means working majorities in both houses of Congress. So again we return to voting. Boring, I know, tedious, and worst of all not an instantaneous fix-it, but sad to say it's what we have--assuming we can keep it through the next several elections.

And I'm not trying to "evade contemporary responsibilities." I'm pointing out that the hardships that folks keep citing are hardly unprecedented. Then too, and by the same token, citing today's economic morass shouldn't be the all purpose excuse for apathy, willful ignorance of basic civics, and the sheer laziness of not getting your ass in gear to vote once every two years. And then, to top it off, threatening to withdraw from the process all together if solutions aren't forthcoming within eighteen months of the most recent election. The other day someone told me he didn't vote in 2016 because Obama didn't issue an executive order abolishing the entire medical insurance industry and giving us single payer health care for all. Talk about "pissing in the wind"--that kind of abysmal ignorance of how politics works makes me want to scream.

And funny thing, I can remember in 2016 younger progressives telling older women they were "tired of our agenda being held hostage by abortion." That Roe v. Wade would never be repealed. That Hillary just wasn't exciting enough to "earn" their vote. How's that for treating someone's issue as "below consideration?"

I'm sorry you've seen so much abuse of younger voters by older people. It's certainly not helpful to be dismissive of anyone's issues. But as I see it, not voting is also a form of dismissal. It's saying that unless my issue is treated forthwith, I will not bother to help anyone else with theirs, indeed I'll see to it that their rights are trampled and their lives are made at least as miserable as mine.

We need to get out the vote, pure and simple. As far as I can see there is no alternative, no other option or hope for our democracy. Anyone who stands aside out of pique or frustration, however understandable, is shirking their moment in history.

[SunImp]

125. Thank you for being patient & for actually trying to understand younger & dissatisfied voters

Many Duers on here are really dismissive & often times abusive if you are not 100% in line with our Democratic Leadership. They seem to dislike any form of criticism even constructive criticism. Some of them even constantly post obviously bitter copypasted rants filled with biased presumptions that paint dissatisfied voters negatively. Attacking potential voters like this isn't a winning strategy. We have a lot of upset people that vote or could potential vote blue Women upset about losing their rights, Parents upset about gun laws not working, Black Americans still feeling like their lives don't matter, students and people barely getting by. I think their beliefs & ideals matter just as much as anyone who enthusiastically votes 100% of the time. It's frustrating when people dismiss any of these people's issues as whiny or idiotic. Thanks again for being a good Democrat.

[SunImp]

116. +1

[treestar]

87. You get heard by voting

You don't have more personal control than that. The elected are there for all of us, not just you, not just the young.

[TransitJohn]

181. Vote harder and shut up!

It's totally all you hear; agree. Don't expect anything else on this website. DU has been purging progressive voices, disappearing posts, etc. for a couple decades.

[demmiblue]

20. Slightly OT, but I wish there were more younger folks on DU.

Sadly, though, they would be driven off quite quickly. I wonder what ever happened to that young DUer named Ava.

[Coventina]

21. I was a young person.....when I joined DU 20 years ago.

I think the age of the website itself works against having young people join.

But I agree with you.
I'm not young, but there are times when I really feel "young" compared with most of DU.

[kentuck]

97. To be honest...

...I think most younger people believe the leadership in both Parties has failed us miserably during these difficult times and that the country would be better served if the Party leaders, from both Parties, were to retire or resign, en masse, and put new people into their positions. It would give the country a better chance to recover and heal.

[Sky Jewels]

126. I agree.

We're in dire need fresh blood, new approaches, fire in the belly. Dump the bipartisan b.s. -- it hasn't worked for decades. Take the gloves off, like Gavin Newsom does. Bring the fight to the GOP, again, like Newsom (i.e., his anti-DeSantis ad that's running in Florida). Clearly call out what is happening -- an attempted Fascist takeover of our country. Loudly proclaim support for expanding SCOTUS, jettisoning student debt, fighting climate change, legalizing pot nationwide ... and then ACT on it. Stop making deals with GOP criminals like McConnell. Don't coddle fucking Saudi Arabian journalist murderers. I could go on. Oh, and Diane Feinstein needs to go. I'm sure I'll be considered "ageist" but it is ridiculous that she and other people in their late 80s & 90s are still in Congress. Ridiculous!

[inthewind21]

168. So

The hope is to wait for someone else to do for you? The ability to change it all is there. It's called voting. If "they", no matter the age, choose to not vote, well they get what they get.

[Celerity]

81. good luck with that

I am so, so sick of the never-ending youth bashing on here. It manifests itself in so many ways, and is so disheartening. A good place to start is one of the more active student loans threads, going back as long as I have been on the board (4 years now).

Is it any wonder whatsoever that every single person I have tried to get to join and post here for the past 4 years has told me 'hell no' after checking it out?

These have been mostly US citizens (but also many non US folk who are politically inclined, especially my friends/acquaintances/fellow students/co-workers from the UK and Sweden) in my age cohort (roughly 18-34, I am 25yo, fairly late 1996 born, so almost Gen Z, and I self-identify as a Zillennial, the micro gen born 1992/93 to 1998 or so).

So often I have been ready to pack it in, but I have invested far too much time and labour to just walk away atm.

If not for us younger voters (and my age cohort in 2020 voted more than 2 to 1 for Biden, see below) Trump would still be the President. Flip just 21,461 total votes from Blue to Red, split between just 3 states (WI, AZ, and GA) and Trump would still be POTUS.

Furthermore, just Millennials and Gen Z (not including Gen X) will equal the Boomers and up vote (actual votes not just eligible) in 2024 and pass them if you add in Xennials (the 1977-1980 born micro gen sometimes called the Carter Babies in the US). By 2028 we will utterly dominate.

We voted (often overwhelmingly depending on the exact age cohort and election) for Democrats by large majorities in all the elections we have voted in, including 2016, 2018 and 2020.

Boomers plus older voters combined voted majority Rethug in those same elections, even in 2008 (the only recent election where Boomers, when taken alone, went Dem, but just barely, and the older gens washed out that very slight Dem lean).

2008




2020





Gen Z, Millennials and Gen X outvoted older generations in 2018 midterms

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/05/29/gen-z-millennials-and-gen-x-outvoted-older-generations-in-2018-midterms/







The 2020 election shows Gen Z’s voting power for years to come

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/18/the-2020-election-shows-gen-zs-voting-power-for-years-to-come.html

snip

Generation Z, who are currently between the ages of 8 and 23, played a significant role in both of these records. NBC exit polls suggest that 65% of those between the ages of 18 and 24 voted for Biden — 11% more than any other age group. And in states like Georgia and Pennsylvania, young voters proved to be key to Biden’s success.

“I’ve been doing demographic analysis about the changing American electorate for two decades,” says Simon Rosenberg, president of NDN (previously known as the New Democrat Network) and the New Policy Institute. “53% to 55% of registered 18 to 29-year-olds appear to have voted. That may be the highest ever recorded in the modern era of politics.”

“Both Generation Z and millennials are voting generations,” says Brent Cohen, executive director of Generation Progress. “The preliminary data says, in fact, this was the election with the highest turnout rate of young people that we’ve ever seen.”

“Gen Z voters were very enthusiastic about this election,” says Karlyn Bowman, senior fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. “A number of things appeared to be driving young people’s level of participation and level of excitement about the campaign and it wasn’t Joe Biden, though they certainly like Joe Biden overall. They were voting more against Donald Trump than they were for Joe Biden.”

snip

[SunImp]

130. +1

[treestar]

91. We don't know that

actual young people might not be as stupid as these nonvoting complainers who expect to have their loans forgiven and are entitled to who knows what else and think giving up and letting Republicans win is better. That's dumb. And then when they are called out it's like "oh you won't win them over that way." Well damn, there is NO WAY to win them over! Not in the reality we live in.

[Sky Jewels]

23. My kids and the majority of their friends (early 20s) feel the same way.

They are very progressive and concerned with climate change, guns, abortion rights, gay rights, and the destructiveness of end-stage capitalism. They can’t understand why the party hasn’t pushed for legal mj at the federal level and why Biden hasn’t kept his campaign promise on student loans. They’re disgusted by the old school party leader Dems, who they view as namby-pamby corporate lackeys. (And it goes without saying they’ve always been appalled by the Republican-Christofascists.) They’d love nothing more than a party full of AOCs. I understand their anger and frustration because their generation has been royally screwed over in so many ways.

[inthewind21]

169. Well

They need to get out there and make it happen. Expecting it to just happen isn't an option that should be obvious to them by now. I might also suggest they all take the time to learn how their government actually works. That might help with some of their "they just don't understand why..."

[maxsolomon]

28. Having been young once, I understand their frustration.

I can tell them that, unfortunately, American Govt is designed to stop or blunt radical change. The Senate exists to do just that, and the SCOTUS battle was lost before she even got to vote. It sucks when olds make shit choices that impact your life.

I felt the same when Reagan was elected 13 months before I turned 18.

[treestar]

92. When I was young, I kept voting

Last edited Fri Jul 15, 2022, 11:24 AM - Edit history (1)

I was in college when Reagan was elected. I did not give up! I voted every 2 years in every election on the ballet. My entire youth was Reagan and Pappy Bush as President and R governors in the state I lived in. Never dreamed of not voting for the Democrats.

And a lot of us were like that.

[maxsolomon]

111. Yes, I've never not voted.

I kept the faith and
I kept voting
Not for the iron fist
But for the helping hand

For theirs is a land
With a wall around it;
And mine is a faith
In my fellow man

-Billy Bragg, A New England

[onetexan]

37. Then they need to get their butts to register to vote & show up at the polls

Or send it in if thats the norm in their state.

[moonshinegnomie]

44. why should they?

at least from their point of view.
so far under a democratic president house and senate (i realize its barely a senate) they have seen RvW overturned. an attempted coup go basically unpunished. an endless stream of talk and no action by an entrenched democratic leadership

in the words of a few of my friends in that age group all the dems do is talk and ask for money. You may disagree but that doesnt change how they think. they are fed up

[JI7]

54. ROE was overturned by Supreme Court Justices Appointed br Republicans

If they can't understand this simple thing they are just as stupid as right wing MAGA and Q Trash .

[moonshinegnomie]

61. thats a sure way to bring them to your side.call them stupid.......

it was overturned by the court but for the most part the dems havent done anything in response on a federal level.

if your a mid 20's youth you've seen the dems pretty much ignore their concerns.
they are overwhelmingly in favor of pot legalization. and it hasnt happened the feds still call it a schedule 1 drug
they are concerned with crushing student loan debt and the dems have taken no more than limited steps
they qre concerned with global warming.


the old way of doing things wont cut it anymore. just look at the numbers of young people saying teh heall with things like regular jobs.
if you want to really get a feel of how they think go hangout of reddit. theres a subreddit with millions of subscribers called antiwork filled with people that are done with teh old way of doing things.
its time to pull the heads out of the sand and realize that the old ways are done and gone. its a whole new world.

[JI7]

63. This is bs. There were many young people running for President in 2020

and young people didn't vote for them.

Also most young white males voted for Trump .

[treestar]

90. well I'm not going to say they are smart

why should anyone have to flatter them? That's not what it's about, which I knew when I was their age.

[Sky Jewels]

103. Totally agree

And the young people I know have the same views you described.

I really hope the younger generations have the numbers to take the reins of power very soon.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

150. What response do they expect on the federal level?

And I ask that sincerely.

POTUS, House, & Senate can't just issue an edict that abortion is legal in all 50 states. I feel like President Biden is doing all he can via executive action, but his options are limited.

[Kaleva]

66. Their futures are very dark because of climate change

Keeping Roe v. Wade, reducing student debt and punishing coup plotters won't make their future brighter. They are pretty much fucked.

[tazkcmo]

83. Because that's the reality.

The ONLY path to change is participation in the only system America has. As is with the lottery, you cannot win in politics if you don't " buy a ticket", i.e. vote. That is the reality. Nobody is saying it's easy, convenient, fun, exciting or financially enriching but it's only through participating in our messy democracy through getting out the young vote, canvassing, registration drives, fund raising and all the things successful change in our system requires.

So I ask, what are young people going to do about it?

[onetexan]

166. Couldn't agree more!!

and why we need to teach our kids from an early age the importance of history and a liberal arts education, and their duty as American citizens to exercise their right to VOTE so good leaders are elected, not treasonous ones.

[treestar]

89. lol we are fed up with them

being stupid and expecting things that are more than they can expect AND THE ROE V WADE overturn was due to their not fucking voting for HILLARY!!!!!!! It's their own damn fault!

[AZProgressive]

222. If it was up to young voters

Hillary Clinton would be President but the brilliant older voters voted for Trump.

[treestar]

230. If you are going to generalize by the majority of an age group

the main feature is that younger voters failed to vote. The ones that voted for Hillary were only a subset of the group..

[inthewind21]

170. And here in lies the problem

if what you say is the cause then clearly thinking isn't really their strong suit. If they are shocked about Roe and are blaming it on the current government, then ignorant is an understatement. I suggest a crash course in Civics and US history. IMMEDIATELY!

[iemanja]

67. The story literally beings with a girl who voted for Biden in 2020

So she got her butt to the polls.

[Progressive dog]

42. With age comes experience and usually more knowledge.

Which specific ideas does she have a problem with? What does accurately lead mean? The last i knew we weren't sheep following a leader to a specific known place.

[Mariana]

115. In the US, with age comes a tendency to vote for Republicans. nt.

[Progressive dog]

137. And?

We don't get to vote on the voters. The candidates are all we have to choose from and they are going to be older because voters want to see a record, not just propaganda.

[GoodRaisin]

45. An old idea that would work fine is a 70%+ tax rate.

If she thinks she doesn’t like the “old” democrats wait until she sees the christofascists take her back into the 1600s.

[Irish_Dem]

46. In the 60s and 70s young people were fed up with the older generation too.

And a lot of change for the better occurred.

[Novara]

49. What does anybody expect?

The president is old enough to be their great grandpa. The Speaker of the House could be their great grandma. When you were 18 did you think your great grandparents could run the country? Young people don't as a rule look to people in their 70s for inspiration.

In addition, they've been primed by the Bernie or Bust people, and the progressives who won't accept that getting shit done in Washington is accomplished in increments, not giant leaps. And they don't have enough world experience to fully understand the whole messy process of partisan politics yet. Plus, politics is so brutal and tribal now. It must look pretty distasteful from their perspective.

They're impatient. Weren't you impatient when you were that age?

Maybe we should try talking to them rather than ridiculing them.

[JI7]

60. Sanders is old also. There were many young candidates running in 2020

but they didn't get support.

[moonshinegnomie]

70. and yet in this very thread they are being called stupid.

great way to attract people to your side....

[Willto]

128. No One Was Flat Called Stupid

That is an exaggeration. There was an "IF" in that statement about stupidity. And I agree with it. "IF" anyone thinks that issues like climate change, student loan debt, or now abortion rights will be better solved by jettisoning the Democratic party and not voting in the upcoming midterm elections then yes they are indeed stupid. Whether they are 18 or 88. Stupid! If I'm wrong then please explain how that course of action leads to a better future on those issues. Because I'm all ears.

Politics isn't a game you win by turning out to vote one time. It's a lifelong struggle. I'm 56 now and I have voted in every election I could since I was 18. I have on many occasions not gotten everything I wanted from an election or the people elected in it. But that has never FOR ONE SECOND caused me to start threatening to not vote like some do now at the drop of a hat. Waaaa, I got off my ass and voted one time and the whole world didn't get perfect. Well no shit. Nothing worth doing is ever that easy. It often takes a long time, lots of hard work and constant vigilance. Even when a goal is reached there is always forces out there looking to roll it back as we just saw with Roe vs Wade. You do what can be done at the moment. Sometimes that may be a big happy leap forward but a lot of the time it may just be hanging on to what you got until you can do more.

But if these kids think the Democrats suck wait until they get a dose of a House of Representatives majority led by the likes of Lauren Boebert and Marjorie Taylor Greene. Or a Senate with Ran Paul and Josh Hawley running the show. Cap that off with an emboldened Trump back in the White House. Boy I bet the problems the youth of this country care about will be solved then.

[betsuni]

129. +1

[Celerity]

131. Really?

One Was Flat Called Stupid

You must not have looked very hard.

No 'ifs' to be seen here:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=16926679

[Novara]

135. While I agree with the gist of your post ...

... young people don't yet have the maturity and life experience you and I do. And that is to actually see over time that this really is a life-long struggle and that one election cannot solve all issues. They haven't lived long enough to see it in action.

There is an impatient faction of progressives - young and old - who want their rainbow-farting unicorn NOW and incremental progress that takes time is ridiculed. A lot of young people follow this line of thinking.

But a lot of us who've been through several presidential cycles told the impatient people that a president can't get things done by himself. Bernie Sanders has fantastic ideas that I support but he never presented any sort of concrete plan to get his platform through Congress. That's why I cautioned against voting for him. Great ideas go nowhere without a workable plan of implementation.

I didn't support Biden until it was clear he was the front-runner. Yes, I wanted a younger president. I wanted Kamala Harris, who was a smart AG in California, something I thought we needed as we worked our way out of the most criminal administration in modern history. But when he became the nominee I was all in, because I have seen enough presidential elections to see the big picture. It isn't about what I want, but what is good for the country.

Young people don't have that perspective yet because they haven't lived through the ups and downs of politics.

We'd benefit the entire country by helping them see the big picture rather than tearing them down because they are impatient.

[treestar]

158. aren't you adding to the "snowflake" theme?

These people can't do such a thing as is good for them, because their feelings are so hurt that some person on the internet, whose vote is no stronger than theirs, said they were stupid for shooting themselves in the foot?

That's not American. Or anything. We don't let people calling us anything make us hurt ourselves. When the Republicans are in, because they were too stupid to get how things work, and that they are not entitled to be catered to, they will then realize that they have to vote. Hopefully that will smarten them up. And a lot of them may not be like this, as this post if probably to stir things up and features the words of one person who cannot speak for all of her age group.

But of course it is stupid to refuse to vote because the party best suited to you is not all about you. Older people have a vote too, and a right to a say, and are maybe due to maturity not likely to sit home next time because of something affecting us personally.

[treestar]

88. Well maybe if they don't vote for Biden, TFG could get back in!

Because he's so much younger!

I did actually think my grandfather's age group would run the country when I was young; the president was my grandfather's age or so. I can't imagine expecting it to be different!

[womanofthehills]

51. I remember when I was in college and thought people in their 40's were old

Biden must appear ancient to them.

[TransitJohn]

193. I'm 50 and Biden appears ancient to me. n/t

n/t

[Mariana]

196. Biden is ancient. That's just a fact.

Perception of age is extremely skewed here. Elsewhere in this thread someone described Hillary Clinton as being a "relatively young" candidate in 2016. Hillary Clinton was 69 years old at that time.

[peggysue2]

210. Yes, indeed

Never trust anyone over thirty as the saying went. I met my future father-in-law when he was in his early 40s and thought he was an old man.

[Wingus Dingus]

57. I'm in my 50's, watching my parents (who are Biden's and Pelosi's age, Silent Generation), trying

to understand and navigate the current world: shifting values and beliefs and culture, the ever-changing technology and new ways of doing practically everything--and it's getting away from them. They're both fairly healthy, keep up on news, and have lots of engagement with gen Z grandkids, but my mother confesses that she doesn't understand what young people are all about anymore. The world has changed radically in their lifetimes and they are struggling to keep up. Heck, I'M struggling to keep up sometimes, and I'm only GenX.

If you're pushing 80, it has to be a little bewildering. I was reluctantly OK with the late-70's candidates running in 2020 to defeat Trump, because he's no spring chicken either and has brains of mush on top of that. But let's not pretend it's ideal. The Presidential sweet spot is 40's-60's, and we deny that at our peril.

[JI7]

62. But why didn't young people vote for one of many young Democrats running

in 2020 ?

Also Jon Ossoff got more support from old black people than from young white people.

[Wingus Dingus]

68. Do you mean the Presidential primaries? Probably because they

didn't actively care who was chosen to be the nominee. I wasn't engaged in politics when I was in my teens and early 20's either. I showed up to vote D for President every four years in November and thought I was doing pretty great in my civic duties just by doing that much.

[moonshinegnomie]

64. some people still subsccribe to the idea that "they have paid their dues"

but in the modern fast changing world thats not going to cut it.
for instance just look at this site.
im willing to bet the vast majority are in their 50's 60' and 70's. meanwhile the younger generation uses reddit,tiktok,discord,snapchat and a host of new sites that our generation is only vaguely aware of.

[Wingus Dingus]

74. Yep. Our late-millennial sons laugh at our old ways of doing practically everything, which

boils down to: NOT using phone/apps for everything under the sun the way they do, and not being social-media savvy beyond Facebook/Instagram/Pinterest/Youtube (us geezers thoroughly infiltrated those already--lame!).

[moonshinegnomie]

75. ive been spending a lot of time on reddit

tik tok not so much i wont download it to my phone.
im also on a couple of discord servers with friends

[treestar]

93. people in those age groups know those apps

I have accounts on 3 of them.

And mostly those are frivolous fun type things.

[treestar]

94. Depends on the person

and people will live longer and longer, so there will have to be some way for the young people to deal with their existence. They can't prevent older people from voting or running for office and if they win, that's too bad.

[mcar]

79. So what's her alternative? Not voting? 3rd party?

How is that going to improve things?

This is so much BS. I've voted in every election since I turned 21 and will continue to vote till I die. Even when I was 21, I was aware enough to know that I wasn't going to get everything I wanted. I also understood how government works.

[treestar]

84. This looks like an interview with one person

And I'm getting sick of it.

She's old enough to vote, so she should grow up.

[867-5309.]

98. It's not age, in itself, it's traits associated with age

For example, Joe is an institutioanlist. He's reluctant on things like expanding SCOTUS, adding states, ending the filibuster, etc.

Younger voters associate those attitudes with older leaders.

[Sky Jewels]

127. Right. They like Bernie, even though he's old,

because Bernie fights the good fight for issues they care about. That's what they're looking for--authenticity and a passion for standing up to fascism, billionaires, end-stage capitalism, climate change, etc.

[Tarheel_Dem]

211. Other than naming post offices, can you name one piece of groundbreaking legislation...

authored by BS, that made it through the congress, and onto the POTUS' desk? I'm sorry, but young people are confused. They seem to think that smack talking the GOP is the same as doing the hard work that's required to get an actual bill to the president's desk.

[AZProgressive]

220. There is the Sanders-McCain VA bill that was signed by Obama

It is rare for any sponsored legislation to become law.

The bill was so good Trump often took credit for it even though it was signed by Obama.

[Tarheel_Dem]

223. "Authored" by BS? So, he merged a bill with a Republican? Fancy that. Will wonders never cease.

[AZProgressive]

224. Republicans wanted to privatize the VA

In the wake of the overblown Phoenix VA scandal. Sanders wanted more facilities, doctors, nurses, and staff. He got into screaming matches with McCain behind closed doors but they came up with a compromise.

[Tarheel_Dem]

225. So, it wasn't really BS' bill. He merged his with JM's. Wasn't really my question though. n/t

[AZProgressive]

227. They were on the same committee addressing the issue

It was an example of Sanders getting something done aside from naming post offices. The bill would have been a lot worse without Sanders involvement.

[Tarheel_Dem]

228. But we're never supposed to give an inch, remember? Merging with a Republican? Isn't that...

the very essence of "caving"? I didn't think true populists went for that sort of thing? Let's be honest, it wasn't really BS' bill, it was a hybrid.

[betsuni]

231. +1

[Iggo]

100. Well gosh, kids, I guess we'll just keep trying until we find one you like.

Or…you know…you could like…step up and…I dunno…pitch in?

I know, I know, I know. Sorry. That’s asking a lot.

We’ll keep trying!

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

101. So someone younger needs to step up then.

[oioioi]

112. like this...

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

117. AOC?

She's not running for any higher office than what she currently occupies.

But in the first picture she's campaigning for Bernie Sanders for President. Sanders is even older than Joe Biden. This is why I can't take "the politicians are too old" trope very seriously.

[betsuni]

119. +1

[oioioi]

123. She's Bernie's obvious successor.

if New Zealand, Finland and Iceland can do it...

[shrike3]

153. I don't think AOC could win.

[oioioi]

165. Fears grow that Obama can't win....(2008)

With senator Barack Obama poised this week to clinch his party's nomination for President, there are growing fears in some quarters that the Democratic party may not be choosing its strongest candidate to beat Republican John McCain.

Senator Hillary Clinton has been making that argument for weeks. Now some recent polls and analysis, looking particularly at vital battleground states and support among white voters, have bolstered her case - even as Obama looks certain to become the nominee.

Obama supporters reject this argument and point to his record of boosting Democratic voter turnout, especially among the young. But sceptics in the party, already nervous about nominating Obama after the furore over outspoken pastor Jeremiah Wright, are growing increasingly concerned. 'There is an element of buyer's remorse in some areas. The question is whether it gets really strong now or in September - or even after the election is over, if he loses,' said Steve Mitchell, head of political consultancy Mitchell Research.

Republican analysts, meanwhile, are surprised about how healthy their party's prospects look in a year when almost all indicators suggested they should lose. McCain remains competitive against Obama. He even leads in some key states. Indeed, some research predicts he could romp home against Obama.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2008/jun/01/barackobama.uselections2008

[shrike3]

174. AOC would have to win the support of a broad range of voters .

I don't know if she can do it. She can't just rely on young voters. Bernie tried that and look what happened. In a lot of circles, she's a joke. (Sorry.) She would have to win over older AAs, who are a very important voting block, and also older Hispanics, who lean conservative.

Does she even want to run? I have seen nothing that indicates she would.

[oioioi]

179. Well...

[shrike3]

182. A non-answer on No. 3. She's gotten very good at politics.

I saw these clips when they were aired, btw. I.E., I know this already.

I live in a red area that went for Obama in 2008. AOC is HATED here. No way would she win. Part of it is misogyny. I threw my support behind Obama because I believed Americans would vote for a black man over a white woman. Not only is AOC a woman, she's young and Latina.

The situation is not going to be any different in other red areas. So, if she's not going to get crossover votes from the other side, she's going to have to appeal to constituencies that traditionally vote Democratic: Older black voters and Hispanic voters. She's going to have to throw away Bernie's playbook. Bernie lost twice, don't forget. And I'm a person who voted for him. She's going to have to do things Bernie didn't, like go to Selma on its big anniversary. Even Joy Reid, who seemed sympathetic to Bernie, said that was a mistake.

Do NOT underestimate how frightened people are of socialism. Not young people, people my age. It's irrational, but it's there. And people my age vote.

Maybe enough young people would turn out this time. I wouldn't count on it. All those young people at Bernie's rallies: where were they? Not at the polls, apparently.

[Emile]

190. I'm in my 70s and I would vote for AOC

in a New York minute.

[shrike3]

207. That's good.

But there'd have to be a lot more of you.

[Emile]

208. There are. If she was the nominee wouldn't you vote

for her too?

[shrike3]

209. Of course. But a lot has to happen before she is the nominee.

She'd have to make it through the primaries and I'm not so sure she would. Bernie didn't. Twice. How would black voters feel about her? Hispanic? I'm not so sure she'd have the support of Hispanics, given they have become increasingly more conservative.

Does she have support outside the Democratic base? A poll taken in April found that 33 percent of Americans have a very unfavorable view of her. Sixteen percent have a very favorable view of her. I'm not surprised.

[Iggo]

171. Yes. Like that.

[nini]

107. This reminds me of a new Marketing college grad I had to work with for a while

She knew EVERYTHING!!! Had no experience in the industry etc. but came in rolling her eyes at how things were done. Well, Princess learned quickly that her ideas were not new and made sense until we tried them before. She refused to dig in and really learn how her education would fit in with the industry but no - we were all idiots.

I got her but good eventually though. She signed a deal without talking to the person who did the work first - that would be me. She had no clue how much time it would take etc. and just announced it had to be done. That was a big NOPE when she found out the amount of work would take at least a week. Of course, I was an idiot because I could not do 40 hours of work in one day and on demand. It was fun telling her to piss off and to redo the deal. She didn't last much longer than that.

I think of some of these young voters the same way. LEARN what the climate is and dig in to change things but don't throw the baby out with the bath water so to speak - these are frustrating times for us all. Whining won't change them -hard work will.

[betsuni]

109. Unrealistic expectations, believes "Democrats don't fight" "Why didn't Democrats stop __ ?"

"Democrats don't do anything" and that if just the right leaders took over everything would be fine, it's all leadership's fault. Something about inspiring and bully pulpit.

What old ideas is she talking about? Universal health care, Medicare for All, very old ideas. Equality and civil rights? Old. Regulating corporations, raising taxes on the wealthy, higher wages, affordable education, unions, environmentalism. Old.

Liked Chelsea Clinton on "The View" in response to blaming Biden for inflation: he and his administration obviously care deeply about the American people and he HAS been doing things to stop inflation, hasn't been passive, then lists some things his admin. has done.

[Polybius]

118. I was a teenage voter in the 90's

I was the only one of my friends that voted, in fact I was mocked for it. If a cool dude like Bill Clinton couldn't motivate the youth to vote, no one can.

[Midwestern Democrat]

134. You can't compare the state of the party in the '90s to today - the leadership of the party in the

'90s was about what you'd expect it to be - mostly middle-aged men. In 1999, here was a basic rundown of the leadership of the Democratic Party: President Bill Clinton (53); Vice President Al Gore (51); Senate Minority Leader Tom Daschle (52); Senate Minority Whip Harry Reid (60); House Minority Leader Dick Gephardt (58); House Minority Whip David Bonior (54). The men generally thought to be the leading possibilities for a future presidential nomination were of similar ages: Gore (51); Bill Bradley (56); John Kerry (56); Joe Biden (57); Gephardt (58); Chris Dodd (55), etc.

No one in the '90s thought the party had an "age problem" - the situation is A LOT different today. Here's a rundown of the leadership of the Democratic Party right NOW: President Joe Biden (79); Vice President Kamala Harris (57 and very often described as YOUNG); Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer (71); Senate Majority Whip Dick Durbin (77); House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (82); House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer (83); House Majority Whip Jim Clyburn (81). And as far as "electable" leading possibilities for a future presidential nomination - well, the list is quite a bit shorter than it was in 1999.

[Polybius]

172. I'm not comparing the state of the party, I'm just saying that young people don't vote

They voted in very low numbers then, and will vote in equally low numbers in 2022. Nothing we say can make the 18-24 crowd vote. They have to want to do it on their own.

But as to what you are saying, you are 100% spot on. I remember 1996 quite well. The age question came from our side. Dole's age (73) was a constant issue.

[Raine]

121. I felt like that when I was their age and later too

it's nice to see a person of your generation leading. As Kennedy said "passing the torch to a new generation" is appealing since the future belongs more to them.

[betsuni]

124. "But he's too old" is the new "But her emails."

[moonshinegnomie]

138. this whole thread is prime example of why most polls show the dems in a lot of trouble in 2022

rather than taking action to attract younger voters why not just call them stupid. IM sure that will encourage them to vote for our guy. there are a lot of actions biden could take that would attract younger voters. even if they get challenged and overturned in court the dems could then say we did do something and the GOP had it tossed out.

for example reschedule pot
student loan reform
and a host of others.

as far as young people are concerned the dems just talk a good game but dont actually DO anything. and the younger generation is tired of it. they are tired of voting for the same people that have been in office their whole lives as they have seen their hopes for the future deteriorate.

[betsuni]

140. So you think Democrats have huge legislative majorities and don't do anything?

They totally could DO something because they have the votes but don't? The younger generation are tired of voting once? They don't care about their future enough to vote more than once and become active in politics?

[Voltaire2]

142. The post you are replying explicitly noted

actions Biden could take. We all know that Congress is blocked by Mancinema.

Here’s an idea, first read the post you are replying to.

[betsuni]

143. What actions? "a host of others" What?

[Voltaire2]

144. Again, read the post you replied to.

It wasn’t my post.

[betsuni]

146. I didn't say it was. What are you talking about?

[treestar]

157. +1

voting is what we can do to be heard!

it is not something one is coddled and cajoled into doing - it's a great thing, not a burden! It is not something people have to be convinced to do -

The Constitution gives them this. Refusing to do it is is like refusing a million dollar lottery win.

There are people born in other countries who would do a lot to get here and have that!

[treestar]

156. why do we have to be their servants?

Our votes are no more powerful than theirs.

God, you make them sound SO entitled! Why are they the little monarchs?

They have to get involved. Period. End. This is the way things are. They are not there to be coddled, they are adults old enough to vote. The Democratic party is not a business trying to sell them something. It's an organization for the purpose of electing candidates. For getting where we can AS A WHOLE country.

They will let the Republicans make this country into a theocracy because they don't get that? Because we are not catering to them enough? They sound more selfish than Republicans the way you describe them. Spoiled brats whose issues matter more than everyone else's.

That said, I do not believe your assessment of most of them.

[Tommymac]

167. Um, a lot of polls show the Democratic Party Expanding in the Senate and House.

The reports of the demise of the Democratic Party are premature.

Unless you listen to the corporate controlled spin on the 1% owned M$M.

Hell, I get at least one text a week from Leader Pelosi expressing wonderment that the Dems are predicted to win 6 Senate seats and expand the House Majority...and of coarse asking for $$ to maintain that lead.

[Sympthsical]

186. I was reading an article the other day about the Queen

There was some figure, like 85% of her subjects have only ever had her as their sovereign.

I was like, tch. That's not news. I've had the same party leaders my entire adult voting life.

And then it was, "Oh . . . oh."

[Emile]

189. +1 spot on!

[Kaleva]

147. Doesn't matter much. Climate change is going to make survival for them really tough

Some won't survive.

[Generic Brad]

149. Then it's their turn to run - have at it!

I would like nothing more than to see young Americans do something more than complain and find new justification for not participating. Want things to change? Be the change. I would support a youth movement if they would make a move enmasse.

[hatrack]

151. It's not so much old politicians as old attitudes . . . .

What seems to be the case is that the President and a number of senior Democrats continue to believe that the world of bipartisanship and good faith negotiations and "reaching across the aisle" and "My good friend Rep. Bumblefuck" still exists.

It doesn't.

The GQP wants it all, and they will do anything to get it - packing the Supreme Court, endlessly amplifying lies and supporting an attempted coup d'etat.

On anything big-picture (taxes, spending, climate and energy policy, Social Security, healthcare) they will never work with Democrats.

Never.

The most that President Biden and congressional leadership are ever going to get from their "friends across the aisle" are press releases that no one reads and the occasional post office name change.

Why? Because they hate anyone who isn't them, and they want it all, forever.

[Coventina]

152. Thank you!! n/t

[inthewind21]

173. No worries

That "old attitude" is leaving and the Taliban is moving in. That new enough?

[hatrack]

180. Very new, but strangely enough, reeking of straight-up Bronze Age bullshit

.

[inthewind21]

154. Well

If this 22 year old first time voter went to the polls in 2020 oblivious to the cluster fuck of 2016 and what was coming because of said cluster and now blames the president, SHE is the problem.

[Jspur]

163. As a middle age millennial now at the age of 39

I feel my generation has been fed up with the older leaders for a while now starting from the start of our adulthood. For Gen Z I say welcome to club of having shitty old leaders that don't care and want to keep everything the same.

[inthewind21]

175. Well

You've, and your generation have been able to vote in at least 5 presidential elections. Your generation has had plenty of time. What's the deal? Why haven't you change it all by now?

[shrike3]

184. The son of a friend of mine and his friends don't vote because they feel the Ds don't offer them

anything. I told my friend that I don't have much sympathy. That's what we do in this country, we vote.

[Jspur]

188. I"m middle aged so I don't need your

lectures. I have voted in every election since I was 18. At the end of day nothing has changed, and nothing will. I have accepted that and moved on like most Millennials.

Simple answers I can tell you is the rich control both parties and neither one will do anything to change the status quo. That's what millennials have figured out.

The myth that Millennials don't turn out for elections isn't true which it seems like you were trying to imply with your snarky message. They are the generation that put Obama in office twice and was sorely disappointed in him not doing anything beneficial for them. Which resulted in them becoming cynical. Millennials had high turnout both in '08 and '12 and didn't get the results they wanted. They had lower turn out in '16 but still had higher turnout than any other generation group for the '16 elections including Boomers. In '20 they turned out for Biden in large numbers. The democrats would not have won any presidential elections after '04 without Millennial turn out.

Blaming Millennials for not causing change is the typical thing Boomers or other older generations do. The question to ask is why every time Millennials put a democrat in office nothing changes? The answer to that is rich controlling both parties, corporate money, and gerrymandering making sure that no change can possibly occur.

The other question to ask is why is the older generations always standing in the Millennials way when they do try to change things? The answer to that is they don't want the status quo to change and will do everything to prevent that from happening since they benefit greatly from the way the system is set up.

[moonshinegnomie]

192. THIS!!!!!

[thucythucy]

218. "Nothing has changed?"

The legalization of same sex marriage is nothing? Try telling that to the hundreds of thousands of couples now able to share their lives without facing arrest.

Passage of the Americans with Disabilities Act and its enforcement is nothing? Tell that to the millions of disabled people--many of them millennials--who are able to live in the community, instead of being consigned to horrific institutions like Pennhurst and Willowbrook.

Passage of Obamacare, nothing? Tell that to the millions who are now able to see a doctor when they need to.

Lifting millions of children out of poverty through child tax credits is nothing?

Passage of a trillion dollar infrastructure bill--thus providing high paying jobs for hundreds of thousands, is nothing?

Ending the policy that put immigrant children in cages is nothing?

You must live a pretty sheltered life if you think "nothing has changed" in the last several decades. Maybe nothing has changed for you, but I personally know very many people who would disagree.

It's just plain sad to see someone on DemocraticUnderground posting that tired old refrain that "both parties are the same." That's the sort of bullshit that's brought us to this point in the first place.

[Bettie]

177. Oh, so much hatred of young people

while talking about ageism if someone even suggests that maybe, just maybe, we could listen to anyone younger than 70.

[Mariana]

178. It seems to be a reflex to blame the young people for everything that's wrong.

A few weeks ago, some poster was in a rage over a couple of 21 year old students who were protesting. This person actually posted, "What do you want to bet those 2 women didn't vote in 2016 or 2018?" Hello, genius, they were 15 years old in 2016, and 17 in 2018. Of course they didn't vote! Imagine being that hateful and that desperate to blame young people for the current state of affairs.

Meanwhile, the majority of old people gleefully fuck over their children and grandchilden by voting Republican.

[Sympthsical]

183. The fact Trump won the over 50 demographic

Gets very elided over in these never-ending rants.

"Millennials and Zoomers suck!" Ok, but when we do vote, we don't vote for that. So . . . what's your group's excuse?

And here's some knowledge these people never bring up either:

According to new data from the Democratic data firm Catalist, Millennials and members of Gen Z—which together make up the American adults born since 1981— now represent 31% of the electorate, up from 23% in 2016 and just 14% in 2008. Meanwhile, the voting blocs that have long maintained an iron grip on American political power are receding. In 2008, Baby Boomers and older generations (American adults born before 1964) made up 61% of the electorate; by 2020, they were only 44%. “That’s a permanent change,” says Yair Ghitza, chief scientist at Catalist. “And it’s only going to grow from there.”

Millennials and Zoomers are 31% of the electorate. There's only so much we can do. But as the paragraph notes, that is changing. Not fast enough for me, IMO, but by the end of the decade there should be a shift.

One idle thought that crosses my mind from time to time is if we're not living in a kind of Last Hurrah phase, where power has been gripped tightly and possessively by older generations for longer, because they know the avocado-eaters are coming.

And we're not in a great mood.

[SunImp]

198. Hopefully that 31% increases to 50% or more in the next few years

[Bettie]

185. Yep. It's just how things go here

there is a sizable minority (I hope it's a minority) of people here who hate young people with a passion....and especially despise Millennials, who are no longer particularly young.

And the anger, the rage should anyone suggest electing a few younger people or, even worse, give some priority to issues like climate change which will impact the younger generations far more than the older ones (yes, ageism, right there).

[Sympthsical]

199. "No longer seriously young"

Surrously.

"The problem with young voters like Millennials . . ."

Hey! I'm not standing in the aisle at CVS staring at Just For Men products for the hell of it, ya know.

And here's the thing about this very vocal and hostile blaming I often see. "If you're being mistreated, it's your fault for not resisting hard enough!"

That is the toxic language of the abuser.

Which is apparently very mainstream in some quarters. Concerning.

[shrike3]

187. Problem is, those old people do not think they are fucking over their children and grandchildren

They sincerely believe they are making a better world for them. I live in a very red state. Absolutely what they believe. Blame decades of propaganda. I don't blame the Dems as much as others because they weren't the ones who put a gallows in front of the Capitol.
But I do blame them for not recognizing hate radio and Fox News for what they were.

[Jspur]

191. A lot of them are dummies and are

selfish by nature. They hate for Millennials has always been ridiculous. Without them we would have had nothing but Republican presidents for this whole entire century so far. They are now attacking Gen Z for what's wrong in society. I think the real problem is these older people can't accept America has become a very cruel and difficult place to succeed in. They want to be in constant denial of how things have gotten harder because looking at the truth would give them a lot of pain and make it hard for them to sleep at night.

[Mariana]

195. There is much denial of reality going on.

Lots of dishonesty and misrepresentation of the positions and desires of young people, too.

[SunImp]

197. They do it every chance they can get

[Sympthsical]

200. I always appreciate people living with government subsidy

Telling me that desire for economic restructuring means I just want things from "Daddy".

I see it almost daily now, and every time my head tilts so far I end up practically ear to the floor.

How many government benefits are you receiving? And you're telling me about Daddy?

The lack of self-awareness is always what gets me. I'm telling you, "Got Mine!" attitude is an infection that feels like it's increasingly incurable.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

201. Living with government subsidy?

You mean the Social Security they paid into their whole life?

[Sympthsical]

203. Oh, there are other things

Just little notes I picked up here and there from the quarters most preoccupied with those Millennials and their desire for free stuff.

Or we could just discuss how subsidized Boomers' educations were. Since we're all so interested in things given straight from Daddy.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

204. Oh there are other things?

Please spell them out if you're going to make that accusation.

And unless you went to a private school your education was subsidized also.

Should we subsidize public college at a higher rate? Absolutely.

But the cutbacks started under Ronald Reagan because he was pissed off at students protesting the Vietnam War. I remember my tuition doubled back then.

[Sympthsical]

205. Not an accusation, just a general observation

The fun is in the mystery.

I'm tired of hearing about Reagan. I realize what the man did and his contributions to the decimation of our economic system

But there comes a point where it is hideously absurd for older people - particularly politicians - to stand there and say with a straight face, "Nothing that has happened in the last forty years is our fault, and you're mean for complaining about it."

More than an absurdity, it's obscenity. It's a falsity of all human nature and offensive to all reason and judgement.

It's funny how all that, "I need to listen and learn and understand issues that affect people's lived experiences," goes right out the Liberal window the instant anyone under 40 is involved.

When people begin asking for something more than the performative, oh what rank offense. It is a pickle for the haves, no doubt about it. There comes a point where people need to decide if they are what they say or if they just like wearing the t-shirt.

[Jspur]

206. I love your t-shirt quote because

I feel they are a lot of older Democrats that love wearing the t-shirt when it comes to social issues but don't give a shit about fixing the economic problems of this country since they already got there's and don't want anybody else to benefit. A lot of these democrats would be republicans if it wasn't for social issues. That's the only reason why they are team democrat.

I agree with you on the Reagan stuff. I'm nearly 40 just turned 39 years old last week. I'm tired of hearing about this man and the destruction he did to the country with his insidious policies. After a while it just gets old hearing about how he destroyed the country. I haven't seen any democrats make a dent into his horrible policies or reverse them. Hell, I haven't seen a democrat reverse any of GW Bush's horrible policies. It seems like whenever a Republican president passes a shitty policy it never gets overturned by the Democrats once they get power back. In my lifetime Dems have been all talk and no action.

[SunImp]

194. +1

[demmiblue]

202. Can I get an amen?!

[Sky Jewels]

212. Yep.

I'm sick of it. I've got kids in their early 20s and they and their friends are fantastic. The younger generations are wonderful. I like them a lot better than my own age cohort (old Gen X -- currently mid-50s).

[Bettie]

213. I'm about that age too

and have a 20 and 21 year old...also a 13 year old, what was I thinking?

They are good kids. Funny, kind, accepting of people being who they are.

Better than people my age were at that age. I think that's what we all hope for, that our kids will do better than we do.

[thucythucy]

219. I'm sorry, but

who here has been saying we shouldn't listen to anyone younger than seventy?

The position is absurd on its face, so I'd like to know where specifically on DU you've seen that stated.

Thank you.

[betsuni]

221. Nobody.

Ridiculous.

[Hotler]

229. Hell, some of our older voters are fed up with our older leaders.