General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsGlad to see someone who wasn't a coward actually stopped a shooting
Unlike those worthless bastards in Uvalde.
Raine
(30,540 posts)Skittles
(153,111 posts)Frasier Balzov
(2,639 posts)So has justice been done?
Skittles
(153,111 posts)it is, however, sickening how many guns saturate America
Frasier Balzov
(2,639 posts)I'm questioning whether the people who were killed and injured by the shooter deserved better.
Skittles
(153,111 posts)you know what? never freaking mind
Nevilledog
(50,986 posts)Shootouts are going to become common, and these good citizens are going to accidentally kill bystanders. It's inevitable.
Straw Man
(6,622 posts)... from the idea that your life might depend on police like those in Uvalde, or the esteemed NYPD, who hit nine bystanders in taking down one shooter, who, incidentally, wasn't an active shooter but had committed a revenge killing and was escaping?
https://www.google.com/search?q=nypd+empire+state+building+shooting
Raine
(30,540 posts)I will never depend on the police, not even for directions.
Kaleva
(36,240 posts)Some of these guys put in a lot of time and money into training.
I just looked at the NRA site for applicable courses and it'd cost a few hundred to attend them all.
NRA Defensive Pistol
NRA Basic Pistol Shooting Course - Instructor Led Only
NRA Basics of Personal Protection Outside The Home Course
NRA Basic Personal Protection In The Home Course
Gun Safety Seminar
NRA Home Firearm Safety Course
Then you add the cost and time going to the range tp practice.
Nevilledog
(50,986 posts)In 2022, Indiana repealed its longstanding law that required a person carrying a concealed firearm in public to obtain a license and background check.1 As of July 1, 2022, anyone 18 years-of-age or older who is not prohibited from firearm possession by state or federal law may generally carry a concealed handgun in public.2
Went into effect July 1st.
I see nothing that requires any training.
Kaleva
(36,240 posts)And quite a number get training on their own violation even if not required to do so.
Maybe later I'll look at what NRA training is offered in Indiana. If courses are available, I imagine there is a demand for such even if the state doesn't require it.
I took a course here in Michigan even though I don't conceal carry in public because I wanted the training.
Nevilledog
(50,986 posts)Kaleva
(36,240 posts)The fact that Indiana doesn't require trying doesn't mean no one has training.
Nevilledog
(50,986 posts)Regardless, we've seen how highly trained officers handle active shooter situations.
The reason the gun laws were loosened was so people didn't have to get training.
I'm not sure you're making the point you think you're making.
Kaleva
(36,240 posts)Last edited Mon Jul 18, 2022, 03:38 PM - Edit history (1)
Gun ranges couldn't survive if they only had customers that had to be there. The NRA offers a number of courses because of demand. .. They wouldn't offer them for a fee if people took only the one course that many states mandate.
Like I said earlier, I'll look at what is offered in Indiana and I'll let you know what I find.
Nevilledog
(50,986 posts)The guy who killed the shooter was carrying his weapon in a mall where it was prohibited. We're in a situation where people are just doing whatever they want with guns. The training opportunities for people who, by law, are not required to avail themselves of, is just not relevant.
What we're going to start seeing is shootouts amongst civilians where one thinks they're a "good guy with a gun". And bystanders will be killed or injured by the good guy. Heck, this weekend cops shot & injured 5 bystanders by shooting into crowded downtown Denver and witnesses say they didn't even see the police's target have a gun. And those are highly trained individuals.
More guns means more shootings and more deaths and injuries. Training won't be the deciding factor. Cops will become even more deadly because they are going to assume everyone is armed and they are so highly focused on "officer safety" over the safety of others.
I think I'm done with this. We just see things from very different perspectives.
Richard D
(8,740 posts)... A public mass shooting between two good guys with guns.
dcweed
(16 posts)...along the path laid out for us
The "good guy" justification for more guns
The path is well marked
By bullet casings and bodies
rockfordfile
(8,695 posts)Ban AR-15s no reason to own one unless you're a nutjob.
MarineCombatEngineer
(12,249 posts)are you saying that only nutjobs should be able to own one?
I'm just kidding, I know what you meant, but the way you worded it could be interpreted differently.
Have a great week.
pnwmom
(108,955 posts)So it happened once. But 376 "good guys" with guns couldn't go after another AR-15 shooter, so I don't think arming civilian "good guys" is the answer.
Kaleva
(36,240 posts)markie
(22,756 posts)nobody had guns...
Earth-shine
(3,938 posts)mainer
(12,017 posts)Theyve passed a lot of hurdles to get that permit. They are most likely trained and responsible gun owners. I wonder if this good guy was one.
If we could just restrict gun ownership to them, we could protect 2nd amendment rights while cutting down on gun violence.
rgbecker
(4,817 posts)[link:https://everytownresearch.org/report/permitless-carry-carrying-a-concealed-gun-in-public-with-no-permit-and-no-training/|
"For over a century, states have recognized the public safety benefits of requiring a permit to carry concealed guns. Yet over the last decade, the gun lobby has been promoting legislation to allow people to carry concealed guns in public places without a permit, background check, or safety training, dismantling the system of responsible gun ownership. Indeed, twenty states have completely eliminated their concealed carry permit requirement since 2015. These permitless carry bills lower the bar for who may carry hidden handguns in public and allow untrained and unvetted people to carry concealed guns in parks, shopping malls, crowded town centers, and on city streets."
ok_cpu
(2,045 posts)While it's good that someone was able to stop this shooting, three people who just wanted to shop on a Sunday are dead as a result of our national obsession with guns.
I don't know how anyone feels safe. Your gun isn't going to protect you if you draw second or are overwhelmed with military hardware.
Demsrule86
(68,455 posts)mainer
(12,017 posts)Before the NRA screwed things up, NY state and MA kept those standards high. Now its a free for all, and its much less safe.
Walleye
(30,935 posts)The more hatred that is fomented the more shootings we will have.
MarineCombatEngineer
(12,249 posts)Walleye
(30,935 posts)AngryOldDem
(14,061 posts)Emile
(22,460 posts)hitting his target? Did he accidentally shoot anyone?
More guns is not the answer!
Mosby
(16,252 posts)He said he almost shot the wrong person.
Then there was the time in a Walmart where an armed customer confronted a shooter, he was shot and killed by the shooters wife, who he hadn't identified.
More guns are not a solution.
sarisataka
(18,472 posts)I wonder, sometimes, what is the real priority.