Next stop $7/gallon... I paid 6.99 tonight.

[WarGamer]

Holy hell... SoCal gas prices up like $1/gal in the last 10 days...

Just a coincidence that election is 40 days away and gas prices are racing, right?

[Demovictory9]

1. I paid almost that much today to.. hurricane Ian???

[onenote]

2. Hmm...gas prices going up in California where most races aren't competitive

Gas prices going down on the east coast, where there are many competitive races.

I'm gonna guess that what is happening with gas prices isn't about the election.


https://www.kptv.com/2022/09/27/west-coast-gas-prices-skyrocketing-due-refinery-issues-aaa-says/

[WarGamer]

3. We actually have 4-5 REALLY important House races...

[Celerity]

25. +1

[Amishman]

28. California mandates its own special gas blend, which exacerbates any supply issues

Since CA mandates a particular blend (for emissions) that no one else requires, only a few refineries are set up to make it.

So when a problem occurs at one of those refineries, supply tightens and additional gas cannot be brought in from elsewhere. This causes a CA centered price shock like we are seeing.

[Emile]

30. After all these years of having special mandates, you

would think these refineries would stop using that excuse to jack up prices. It's either piss poor management or price gouging.

[Amishman]

31. uh, no. Why would they tool up additional facilities that won't get used regularly?

CA blend costs more to make, so they aren't going to produce excess as they would be selling it elsewhere at a loss.

If they kept standby capacity to produce it, that also would be inefficient.

They aren't directly jacking up the prices either - it is a market commodity. The price they get is what buyers are willing to pay. When supply crashes, only those willing to pay a the highest price get their orders filled, and they pass that cost along to the consumer.

Gasoline blends with ethanol have a poor storage life as ethanol is hydrophilic, so keeping a long term reserve of refined gas also isn't viable.

This is basic economics.

[Emile]

32. Okay, but I still think it's a case of GOUGING!

If it's not, it's piss poor management!

[Amishman]

33. Please explain in detail, I am not sure what you think is their misdeed

They don't directly control the price, only supply.

Their ability to control supply is limited as excess production capacity or excess inventory is not practical for the reasons I mentioned.

What is left?

This is simply the economic ramifications of CA emissions causing them to be a niche market for a critical commodity. It causes supply to that market to be highly inelastic, which has ramifications when supply is disrupted.

[Emile]

34. What is left is

Piss Poor Management!

[Amishman]

36. piss poor management would be the constant waste required to meet your expectations

What you are expecting is not reasonable given the constraints involved.

They would either be producing excess and selling it elsewhere at a loss or continually wasting resources to be capable to add production elsewhere at short notice. Either of those practices would be piss poor management, and if the losses were bad enough, could even open them to shareholder action due to the waste and added expense.

An option would be a CA state program to fund additional stand-by refinery capacity, but I doubt that would be politically viable given the negative public view of giving money to oil companies.

[elleng]

4. $3.39 in southern MD

[WarGamer]

5. amazing...

[TheBlackAdder]

6. Just past WaWa in So. NJ and they were $3.35

[Tanuki]

7. Still well under $3.00 throughout Tennessee

https://www.gasbuddy.com/gasprices/tennessee

[niyad]

8. gas is 3.54 here today.

[Jeebo]

9. I filled up three hours ago.

I paid $3.569 for mid-grade here in central Missouri. If the pump had said $6.999, I would have gone to another fillin' station.

-- Ron

[leftyladyfrommo]

20. I just saw $3.13 in KCMO. It may have gone up

Again yesterday. I didn't ck yesterday

[IbogaProject]

10. $3.09 in Brooklyn, NY

Maybe even a little less there tonite.

[Dorian Gray]

22. What gas station are you going to?

I just filled up at $3.89! (In Gowanus.)

[IbogaProject]

41. McGuiness by the BQE. Greenpoint

Some areas in the outer boroughs totally surprise me with prices that rival NJ.

Credit price for 87 was $3.25 there last night.

[Dorian Gray]

44. I'm gonna make a road trip next time i fill up! Thanks!

[IbogaProject]

45. I recall some cheap places on Atlantic near Bedford in BK too.

[padfun]

11. Oh you people in LA and SD have all the money anyways.

What's a few extra bucks anyway.

[Yavin4]

12. I will never understand Americans who demand complete, car-dependent infrastructure

and then complain about gas prices.

[radicalleft]

17. I'll never understand the obtuse attitude of those who

fail to grasp that the reality of this nation is one of personal automobile ownership and our reliance on that in order to survive in this economy!

[Celerity]

26. the poster did not deny that reality, you are way out over your skis calling them obtuse

personal automobile ownership and our reliance on that in order to survive

those are post-WWII manipulated constructs

[Yavin4]

58. Thank you for the support. n/t

[newdayneeded]

29. Plus the huge % of people

who can't swing 40 grand plus for an electric car.

[Celerity]

60. You anti EV'ers need to get a new talking point, there are multiple EV's under 40K, under 30K, 2

under 20K, and one for just 7000K, when rebates are added in.

Also, the average price of an ICE car in the US is almost 50 thousand USD.


https://www.hotcars.com/cheapest-electric-cars-to-buy-now/


10/10
Kia Niro: $39,990

9/10
Hyundai Ioniq 5: $39,950

8/10
Hyundai Kona: $34,000

7/10
Mazda MX-30: $33,470

6/10
Ford F-150 Lightning: $32,474

5/10
Mini Cooper SE: $29,900

4/10
Chevrolet Bolt EUV: $26,000

3/10
Chevrolet Bolt: $24,000

2/10
Nissan Leaf: $19,900

1/10
Chang Li: $7,000

[newdayneeded]

61. I have a Silverado

and an Outlander sport. I'm happy with both, thank you.

[Celerity]

62. The cars you personally choose to own are not germane to my reply.

[Yavin4]

59. The "reality of this nation" is that building walkable, dense housing is literally illegal.

And funding of reliable, safe, and clean public transportation is a very low priority. The entire nation is built around car ownership bc that's how the majority of Americans want it.

So, please stop complaining about gas prices.

[KPN]

13. Almost $6/gal here south coast Oregon. Up over a $

in the past week to 10 days. What’s up with the big variations across the country? I can understand a $ or so difference because that’s what I’m used to, but $3-4 difference?


The oil industry needs taxed at 100%.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

14. $2.72 here in Houston

[calguy]

15. 3.05 in my Arkansas town. Others towns have it at 2.99

[DFW]

16. Looks like the USA is finally challenging Europe

Do to the strong dollar and a tax reduction for gas at the pump, the price is down from about $9 per US gallon to about $7.25 here in Germany.

[modrepub]

18. West Coast Refineries

Different oil source and different refinery infrastructure from the rest of the country. Something must be up. If we had a real (curious) media then you'd probably know why this is happening.

Most economic teams in the M$M are pretty clueless these days. Not an ounce of curiosity in them. Just want to shove the mic in some talking heads face and print/record what the say. Digging into a topic and really investing more than 15 minutes in a story is apparently too much for them.

[brush]

19. It's pretty obvious to me that fossil fuel companies are doing this to...

damage Joe Biden and Democratic mid-term chances.

[onenote]

37. Really. So how do you explain the lower prices in most of the country?

[brush]

42. You have a point, but how do you explain the higher prices in some of the nation?

Somebody is raising the prices.

[onenote]

46. The reasons for the west coast price spike are explained in several posts

[brush]

48. West coast is blue, could be an attempt to pick up some repub seats.

Nearly 7 bucks in California v 3 bucks plus in other states seems excessive even with California special refinery requirements.

[onenote]

50. Most of those seats are safe. And there are plenty of seats up for grabs on the east coast

So why aren't gas prices going up in all of those states.

And Cook's analysis suggests that there are tight Senate races in Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, Colorado, Georgia, yet gas prices have been declining or are essentially flat over the past several weeks in those states.

[brush]

51. Nothing to argue about in the eastern states. What you say is true.

I'm just suggesting that the House majority race is going to be so close that repugs could be trying to pick off some blue seats whereever they can, and raising prices in California where there are a lot of seats is as good a place as any to try.

A few calls to fellow republican fossil fuel executivex doesn't cost McCarthy anything. The price differential of nearly 7 bucks a gallon v 3 bucks and change sure seems out of line, don't you think?

[onenote]

52. There are way more toss up seats outside of California than in California.

And the reasons for the price increases in California have been documented and explained.

But people are going to believe what they want to believe.

[brush]

53. You think the huge price difference has been adequately explained?

Last edited Fri Sep 30, 2022, 05:45 PM - Edit history (1)

That doesn't make complete sense to me since there hasn't been such a huge price differential before the uptick. And then there was the sharp drop in prices across nation for 80-some days in a row, only for the California prices to suddenly shoot backup again.

Sure seems there's some manipulation going on.

[Dorian Gray]

21. WHAT?

I filled up two days ago in NYC. I paid $3.89 a gallon.

How is it so much more in CALIFORNIA?

[sir pball]

40. As mentioned above, CA mandates a special blend, plus CA is far more car-centric.

In NYC if it gets too expensive to drive, there's a fairly pervasive public transit network, it might not be great but you can grab a bus or train. In LA? You're driving and you're gonna pay whatever it costs. Is there anywhere besides the Bay that has any meaningful transit systems?

[Emile]

23. Predatory Capitalism alive and well.

[mnhtnbb]

24. $3.32 in Durham, NC

I see lots of California license plates when driving around the Triangle area (Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill). There are also plenty of jobs, says this former CA resident who left in 1988 and never looked back.

[Jose Garcia]

27. Yes. Oil companies become more greedy before elections

[onenote]

38. The actual data tells a different story.

Year after year after year, with rare exceptions, gas prices peak sometime in the spring (occasionally summer) and then drop through the summer and fall -- typically they are lower in September/October than they were earlier in the year. That is true for election years and non-election years. And, with the exception of the West Coast, where refinery issues are a major problem this year, it is true for most the country this year.

[NowISeetheLight]

35. California Gas Prices

I watched a YouTube video a couple weeks ago about our CA gas prices. While we have high taxes the other reason it said was infrastructure. The video explained there aren’t really any pipelines to the west coast due to the terrain. As a result most of our oil is brought in by ship, which is more expensive. It kind of makes sense. I read another article that said half of the US imports of Russian oil went to west coast refineries. That’s all gone too.

The California Energy Commission website lists multiple reasons our gas prices are high:

“Many factors affect gasoline prices, including crude oil cost, refinery cost and profits, distribution cost, marketing costs, and profits. In California, there are five reasons why retail gasoline prices are higher than the average price in the United States:

Higher Taxes on Gasoline
State and local sales taxes, combined with the state excise tax, account for the difference between California and the U.S. average.

Higher Gasoline Production Costs
California's unique, cleaner-burning gasoline blend specification costs more to produce than other types of gasoline, typically amounting to a 10-to-15 cents per gallon price difference between California and the U.S. average.

Environmental Program Costs
California is a world leader in its efforts to fight climate change. The state’s higher air quality standards than elsewhere in the U.S. are designed to protect the health and environment from the harmful effects of air pollution.

California’s Shorter Winter Season
Summer-blend gasoline evaporates at a higher temperature than winter-blend gasoline, meaning it is less likely to contribute to unhealthy ozone and smog levels. Summer-blend gasoline is also more expensive to produce. As a result of California’s warmer climate, the state uses summer-blend gasoline for a longer period during the year than elsewhere in the nation.

Isolated Nature of the California Fuels Market
Under normal conditions, California refiners produce enough gasoline to meet demand inside the state. California refineries also export gasoline. When needed, the state typically imports gasoline via marine shipments, which usually take three to four weeks to deliver. The state’s prices must rise to secure these international imports via marine vessel to cover the additional delivery costs.

As a result of the state’s isolated fuels market, unplanned refinery outages requiring maintenance can significantly impact the state’s gasoline supply, usually resulting in temporary price spikes.”

[moonshinegnomie]

39. i just checked has buddy

under $5 in la,san diego and san fran
https://www.gasbuddy.com/gasprices/california

[WarGamer]

54. * in small parts of...

And those are 1-2 hours from me

[Sympthsical]

57. Yeah, gas stations in the boonies

Funnily enough, my partner is in Stockton for work today. After I saw that link, I texted him, "Fill up you haven't!"

Work pays for his little field trips anyway, but hey, maybe he can save the company some bucks.

[Sympthsical]

56. The average price in S.F. is currently $6.22

Your link is showing the lowest ten prices in the entire state of California (and boy howdy are those going to change).

My Costco near Napa just hit $6. And if that's Costco in an outer burb, good luck to everyone else.

[Tommy Carcetti]

43. Huh? $3.43 here. nt

[Initech]

49. More like $2 or $3.

Not even two weeks ago gas was like $4.89 a gallon at most stations. I filled up last night and it was $5.79 at Costco. Some stations where I live had it at $6.59 or higher.

And then I checked the news as to why gas prices were rising, oil companies said that it was due to "refinery problems" which I immediately interpreted as "grade A bullshit".

[herding cats]

55. Wow! That's steep. Regular just outside of Austin was $2.92 today.

It's $3.10 further in so I filled up when I could at the cheaper one.