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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsNext stop $7/gallon... I paid 6.99 tonight.
Holy hell... SoCal gas prices up like $1/gal in the last 10 days...
Just a coincidence that election is 40 days away and gas prices are racing, right?
Demovictory9
(32,456 posts)onenote
(42,702 posts)Gas prices going down on the east coast, where there are many competitive races.
I'm gonna guess that what is happening with gas prices isn't about the election.
https://www.kptv.com/2022/09/27/west-coast-gas-prices-skyrocketing-due-refinery-issues-aaa-says/
WarGamer
(12,444 posts)Amishman
(5,557 posts)Since CA mandates a particular blend (for emissions) that no one else requires, only a few refineries are set up to make it.
So when a problem occurs at one of those refineries, supply tightens and additional gas cannot be brought in from elsewhere. This causes a CA centered price shock like we are seeing.
Emile
(22,740 posts)would think these refineries would stop using that excuse to jack up prices. It's either piss poor management or price gouging.
Amishman
(5,557 posts)CA blend costs more to make, so they aren't going to produce excess as they would be selling it elsewhere at a loss.
If they kept standby capacity to produce it, that also would be inefficient.
They aren't directly jacking up the prices either - it is a market commodity. The price they get is what buyers are willing to pay. When supply crashes, only those willing to pay a the highest price get their orders filled, and they pass that cost along to the consumer.
Gasoline blends with ethanol have a poor storage life as ethanol is hydrophilic, so keeping a long term reserve of refined gas also isn't viable.
This is basic economics.
Emile
(22,740 posts)If it's not, it's piss poor management!
Amishman
(5,557 posts)They don't directly control the price, only supply.
Their ability to control supply is limited as excess production capacity or excess inventory is not practical for the reasons I mentioned.
What is left?
This is simply the economic ramifications of CA emissions causing them to be a niche market for a critical commodity. It causes supply to that market to be highly inelastic, which has ramifications when supply is disrupted.
Emile
(22,740 posts)Piss Poor Management!
Amishman
(5,557 posts)What you are expecting is not reasonable given the constraints involved.
They would either be producing excess and selling it elsewhere at a loss or continually wasting resources to be capable to add production elsewhere at short notice. Either of those practices would be piss poor management, and if the losses were bad enough, could even open them to shareholder action due to the waste and added expense.
An option would be a CA state program to fund additional stand-by refinery capacity, but I doubt that would be politically viable given the negative public view of giving money to oil companies.
elleng
(130,903 posts)WarGamer
(12,444 posts)TheBlackAdder
(28,194 posts)Tanuki
(14,918 posts)niyad
(113,303 posts)Jeebo
(2,023 posts)I paid $3.569 for mid-grade here in central Missouri. If the pump had said $6.999, I would have gone to another fillin' station.
-- Ron
leftyladyfrommo
(18,868 posts)Again yesterday. I didn't ck yesterday
IbogaProject
(2,815 posts)Maybe even a little less there tonite.
Dorian Gray
(13,493 posts)I just filled up at $3.89! (In Gowanus.)
IbogaProject
(2,815 posts)Some areas in the outer boroughs totally surprise me with prices that rival NJ.
Credit price for 87 was $3.25 there last night.
Dorian Gray
(13,493 posts)IbogaProject
(2,815 posts)padfun
(1,786 posts)What's a few extra bucks anyway.
Yavin4
(35,438 posts)and then complain about gas prices.
radicalleft
(478 posts)fail to grasp that the reality of this nation is one of personal automobile ownership and our reliance on that in order to survive in this economy!
Celerity
(43,357 posts)those are post-WWII manipulated constructs
Yavin4
(35,438 posts)newdayneeded
(1,955 posts)who can't swing 40 grand plus for an electric car.
Celerity
(43,357 posts)under 20K, and one for just 7000K, when rebates are added in.
Also, the average price of an ICE car in the US is almost 50 thousand USD.
https://www.hotcars.com/cheapest-electric-cars-to-buy-now/
10/10
Kia Niro: $39,990
9/10
Hyundai Ioniq 5: $39,950
8/10
Hyundai Kona: $34,000
7/10
Mazda MX-30: $33,470
6/10
Ford F-150 Lightning: $32,474
5/10
Mini Cooper SE: $29,900
4/10
Chevrolet Bolt EUV: $26,000
3/10
Chevrolet Bolt: $24,000
2/10
Nissan Leaf: $19,900
1/10
Chang Li: $7,000
newdayneeded
(1,955 posts)and an Outlander sport. I'm happy with both, thank you.
Celerity
(43,357 posts)Yavin4
(35,438 posts)And funding of reliable, safe, and clean public transportation is a very low priority. The entire nation is built around car ownership bc that's how the majority of Americans want it.
So, please stop complaining about gas prices.
KPN
(15,645 posts)in the past week to 10 days. Whats up with the big variations across the country? I can understand a $ or so difference because thats what Im used to, but $3-4 difference?
The oil industry needs taxed at 100%.
LetMyPeopleVote
(145,231 posts)calguy
(5,309 posts)DFW
(54,378 posts)Do to the strong dollar and a tax reduction for gas at the pump, the price is down from about $9 per US gallon to about $7.25 here in Germany.
modrepub
(3,495 posts)Different oil source and different refinery infrastructure from the rest of the country. Something must be up. If we had a real (curious) media then you'd probably know why this is happening.
Most economic teams in the M$M are pretty clueless these days. Not an ounce of curiosity in them. Just want to shove the mic in some talking heads face and print/record what the say. Digging into a topic and really investing more than 15 minutes in a story is apparently too much for them.
brush
(53,778 posts)damage Joe Biden and Democratic mid-term chances.
onenote
(42,702 posts)brush
(53,778 posts)Somebody is raising the prices.
onenote
(42,702 posts)brush
(53,778 posts)Nearly 7 bucks in California v 3 bucks plus in other states seems excessive even with California special refinery requirements.
onenote
(42,702 posts)So why aren't gas prices going up in all of those states.
And Cook's analysis suggests that there are tight Senate races in Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, Colorado, Georgia, yet gas prices have been declining or are essentially flat over the past several weeks in those states.
brush
(53,778 posts)I'm just suggesting that the House majority race is going to be so close that repugs could be trying to pick off some blue seats whereever they can, and raising prices in California where there are a lot of seats is as good a place as any to try.
A few calls to fellow republican fossil fuel executivex doesn't cost McCarthy anything. The price differential of nearly 7 bucks a gallon v 3 bucks and change sure seems out of line, don't you think?
onenote
(42,702 posts)And the reasons for the price increases in California have been documented and explained.
But people are going to believe what they want to believe.
brush
(53,778 posts)Last edited Fri Sep 30, 2022, 06:45 PM - Edit history (1)
That doesn't make complete sense to me since there hasn't been such a huge price differential before the uptick. And then there was the sharp drop in prices across nation for 80-some days in a row, only for the California prices to suddenly shoot backup again.
Sure seems there's some manipulation going on.
Response to brush (Reply #42)
onenote This message was self-deleted by its author.
Dorian Gray
(13,493 posts)I filled up two days ago in NYC. I paid $3.89 a gallon.
How is it so much more in CALIFORNIA?
sir pball
(4,742 posts)In NYC if it gets too expensive to drive, there's a fairly pervasive public transit network, it might not be great but you can grab a bus or train. In LA? You're driving and you're gonna pay whatever it costs. Is there anywhere besides the Bay that has any meaningful transit systems?
Emile
(22,740 posts)mnhtnbb
(31,388 posts)I see lots of California license plates when driving around the Triangle area (Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill). There are also plenty of jobs, says this former CA resident who left in 1988 and never looked back.
Jose Garcia
(2,598 posts)onenote
(42,702 posts)Year after year after year, with rare exceptions, gas prices peak sometime in the spring (occasionally summer) and then drop through the summer and fall -- typically they are lower in September/October than they were earlier in the year. That is true for election years and non-election years. And, with the exception of the West Coast, where refinery issues are a major problem this year, it is true for most the country this year.
NowISeetheLight
(3,943 posts)I watched a YouTube video a couple weeks ago about our CA gas prices. While we have high taxes the other reason it said was infrastructure. The video explained there arent really any pipelines to the west coast due to the terrain. As a result most of our oil is brought in by ship, which is more expensive. It kind of makes sense. I read another article that said half of the US imports of Russian oil went to west coast refineries. Thats all gone too.
The California Energy Commission website lists multiple reasons our gas prices are high:
Many factors affect gasoline prices, including crude oil cost, refinery cost and profits, distribution cost, marketing costs, and profits. In California, there are five reasons why retail gasoline prices are higher than the average price in the United States:
Higher Taxes on Gasoline
State and local sales taxes, combined with the state excise tax, account for the difference between California and the U.S. average.
Higher Gasoline Production Costs
California's unique, cleaner-burning gasoline blend specification costs more to produce than other types of gasoline, typically amounting to a 10-to-15 cents per gallon price difference between California and the U.S. average.
Environmental Program Costs
California is a world leader in its efforts to fight climate change. The states higher air quality standards than elsewhere in the U.S. are designed to protect the health and environment from the harmful effects of air pollution.
Californias Shorter Winter Season
Summer-blend gasoline evaporates at a higher temperature than winter-blend gasoline, meaning it is less likely to contribute to unhealthy ozone and smog levels. Summer-blend gasoline is also more expensive to produce. As a result of Californias warmer climate, the state uses summer-blend gasoline for a longer period during the year than elsewhere in the nation.
Isolated Nature of the California Fuels Market
Under normal conditions, California refiners produce enough gasoline to meet demand inside the state. California refineries also export gasoline. When needed, the state typically imports gasoline via marine shipments, which usually take three to four weeks to deliver. The states prices must rise to secure these international imports via marine vessel to cover the additional delivery costs.
As a result of the states isolated fuels market, unplanned refinery outages requiring maintenance can significantly impact the states gasoline supply, usually resulting in temporary price spikes.
moonshinegnomie
(2,451 posts)under $5 in la,san diego and san fran
https://www.gasbuddy.com/gasprices/california
WarGamer
(12,444 posts)And those are 1-2 hours from me
Sympthsical
(9,073 posts)Funnily enough, my partner is in Stockton for work today. After I saw that link, I texted him, "Fill up you haven't!"
Work pays for his little field trips anyway, but hey, maybe he can save the company some bucks.
Sympthsical
(9,073 posts)Your link is showing the lowest ten prices in the entire state of California (and boy howdy are those going to change).
My Costco near Napa just hit $6. And if that's Costco in an outer burb, good luck to everyone else.
Tommy Carcetti
(43,182 posts)Initech
(100,075 posts)Not even two weeks ago gas was like $4.89 a gallon at most stations. I filled up last night and it was $5.79 at Costco. Some stations where I live had it at $6.59 or higher.
And then I checked the news as to why gas prices were rising, oil companies said that it was due to "refinery problems" which I immediately interpreted as "grade A bullshit".
herding cats
(19,564 posts)It's $3.10 further in so I filled up when I could at the cheaper one.