We The People OWN 65% of The Government's Revenue. doesn't that ummmm...

[Heather MC]

give us Majority ownership?

Why do people think our money no longer belongs to us when we pay it to the government?

In a corporation that's an investment, not a payment

We invest our money into the government, We The People Have a right to see a return on our investment.

We are the MAJORITY OWNERS 65%

How come the media and schools never explain it that Way?
We would exist just find without the government, but the government cannot exist without our 65% investment. We Have the invested right to demand our will be done, over the will of any other group that doesn't listen to the Majority!

Instead we are being Robbed, and Enslaved by their greed and lies.💭💭💭

https://ibb.co/DgzWz26
link Edited
https://www.cbpp.org/research/federal-tax/where-do-federal-tax-revenues-come-from

https://ibb.co/4jf6QqS

[mahatmakanejeeves]

1. You're linking to the Mercatus Center in support of your claim? Are you sure?

{edited to add the link}

https://www.mercatus.org/publications/government-spending/where-does-government-get-money-it-spends

Pro tip: you might want to look at and evaluate some of these links ahead of time.

[Heather MC]

2. I didn't realize that wasn't a good source to use please give me one moment

[mahatmakanejeeves]

4. The Mercatus Center gave us Enron.

Last edited Sat Oct 29, 2022, 06:32 AM - Edit history (1)

Wendy Lee Gramm

{snip}

Wendy Lee Gramm (nee Wendy Lee on January 10, 1945 in Hawaii) is an American economist and former head of the Commodity Futures Trading Commission for the Reagan administration. She is also the wife of former United States Senator Phil Gramm. Gramm has gained notoriety for her role in the Enron scandal.

{snip}

Early life

Wendy Lee Gramm was born in Hawaii and is of Korean and Native Hawaiian ancestry. She received a B.A. degree in economics from Wellesley College in 1966 and a Ph.D. in economics from Northwestern University in 1971. In her role at the Mercatus Center, Gramm generally called for deregulation of the energy industry. For eight years, Gramm taught inthe Department of Economics at Texas A&M University and later served on the Texas A&M University System Board of Regents.

{snip}

[Heather MC]

5. I provided you with the more reputable link, It States that we pay 50% to the government revenue

Not 65% either way if you look at this chart that I've given you a link to
We still are the majority owners of the government because we invest more money than anyone else into the government even if it's 50%. And by the way the payroll tax that's at 36% a lot of that also comes from individual taxpayers. So really we're closer to paying 86%.

My point is that we are treated as if we are paying, Instead of being treated like investors, who are investing in our country and investing in schools and bridges being built and therefore as investors we should have the most say on how that money gets spent. Would you agree with that?

https://ibb.co/4jf6QqS

[mahatmakanejeeves]

6. No, I do not agree with that.

Would you agree with that?

[Heather MC]

7. May I ask why not?

How do you view our forced tax payments?

[mahatmakanejeeves]

8. As a necessity to support the things that all citizens rely on,

including those who do not pay taxes, who apparently count for nothing in your weird "logic."

Thank you for asking.

[Heather MC]

10. Even people who don't pay taxes contribute

I'm sure they purchase things they pay a sales tax correct?
I don't mean to exclude them they also vote don't they
I apologize for leaving that out I did make a post to you where I hopefully cleared that up

[Heather MC]

9. I'm not speaking from the standpoint of the Republican view of we pay our tax money

I'm speaking from the majority of people what is the majority of the country vote for
When they do polls for abortion what do the majority of the countries say they want?
When they do polls for healthcare what do the majority always say they want they want?


If the polling data is so important how come it's always ignored by one particular party?

What I am saying is as we the people the primary investors, and the majority voters, The government should be bending more to our will. Instead of treating us as if we are welfare recipients when we need some of our money back


Because if we are considered as investors, An investor can go to a corporation and ask for its investment back. And that's all that happens when someone needs welfare, or healthcare, or whatever the case may be. It's having our investment work better for us and having our money work better for us than we do for it.


I hope that separates me from the Republican thought process on individual taxpayers I'm not talking about yes just the individual I'm also speaking about how that relate to the majority of the country.

Does that clarify anything for you or you or at least relieve you Of other concerns you may have had

[mahatmakanejeeves]

11. Huh? Do you have any idea what are you talking about?

An investor can go to a corporation and ask for its investment back.

You need to give this some more thought, because that's not how this works.

I've had enough. The A-Team is coming on.

[Heather MC]

13. In some cases yes

if one partner doesn't full fill their end of the bargain claim can be made.

We are living in a country that is failing a huge majority of people because unfettered capitalism is allowing the wealthy to gain more and more control over the world's wealth.

And when thry screw up, They come running to the government for a handout of OUR INDIVIDUAL contributions.

But when we the people ask for
free education
affordable housing
affordable Healthcare the Right calls that an entitlement

Even tho WE ALL PAY A TAX somewhere
local state federal we all contribute in someone. Even those who don't pay taxes now they still contributed something in their life times. and If they didn't because of some type of issue, we the people should have the compassion to demand those people receive the most care. not the least.

[Heather MC]

3. Ok I fixed it

https://www.cbpp.org/research/federal-tax/where-do-federal-tax-revenues-come-from

[Jack the Greater]

12. The top 25% of earners pay 86.7% of federal income tax.

The top 5% of earners pay 59.5% of federal income tax.

Your argument that "we the people" are majority owners of the govt falls kinda flat when you look at real numbers. But of course this depends on how you define "we the people". If by "we the people" you mean the top 5% of earners then you are correct.

https://taxfoundation.org/publications/latest-federal-income-tax-data/

[Heather MC]

14. Please look at this graph

Even if it's not 65% even if it's only 50%
We individual tax payers pay the most
corporation pay on 7% a d who do they run to when they crash the markets with their greed.

they come for the 50% WE PAID IN. And they only paid in 7%

Why?
And Why is it if someone needs financial help like food, housing, education
one party named that entitlements.
As if it's a bad word.

BUT aren't we entitled as investors to expect a return on our investment in this country. in the form of roads, Bridges education health care transportation etc...

https://ibb.co/4jf6QqS

[Jack the Greater]

15. I looked at your graph before I replied.

It does not show a break down of which income brackets pay which percentage of the total federal income tax revenue. The link I posted does show this information. so unless you can come up with something that shows my figures to be in error, I think I am done here.

[Heather MC]

17. Why are you upset?

Why does income brackets matter


Shouldn't it matter more that even though corporations only pay in 7%
They get way more back.

Why are thry allowed to take more than they give. But when it comes to things that benefit all Americans like health care and education.

We are yold those things are burdens or they call it socialism

[Jack the Greater]

16. And just to drive the point home in no uncertain terms

[Heather MC]

19. We are all Tax payers

And WE should have a Government that works more for the people than we work for the government.

Our tax Investor contributions should have more say than a paid off politician writing policy that only benefits the wealthy

[Mr.Bill]

18. Sometimes I think if I stood on a street corner

and asked the first ten people who walked by who owned the United States, about nine of them would say China. Forty years ago they would have said Japan.

[Heather MC]

20. I would say People

Who pay the bills Are the owners

so sure China might be part owners
but we also pay the bills around here lol

[Mr.Bill]

22. Of out 31 trillion of debt,

only 7.5 trillion is held by foreign countrires. Japan is number one with 1.3 trillion, China is second with 970 billion. The people own 24.29 trillion of the debt.

People are very ill-informed about how much foreign countries "own" us.

[Heather MC]

23. True, But that's part of the choas

they create
Make China a boogie man

keep us distracted from reality

[keithbvadu2]

21. Ownership can also depend on whether you have voting shares or non-voting shares of the stock.

Ownership can also depend on whether you have voting shares or non-voting shares of the stock.

(It's not purely that simple)

How much control do we really have?

[brooklynite]

24. So...if we go to more progressive taxation, rich people should have MORE of a voice than they do now

I think you should reconsider this entire argument.

If you're unhappy with HOW the Government spends tax revenue, perhaps take it up with President Biden, Speaker Pelosi and Leader Schumer?

[Heather MC]

25. I apologize You misunderstood my point, may I clarify?

We have 2 ways we contribute to the government
Our taxes,
Our vote
And a 3rd way that doesn't count anymore but it should and that's polling data

When you factor in all 3 of those assessments
You can come up with what the majority of the country wants and the direction the majority of the country wants to go in.

Even when they pull republicans on an issues without telling them which side it's on
Even republicans tend to want a more fair approach to issues
Example Republican politicians want to end abortion, However the polling data, and the voting in States like Kansas and Mississippi suggest that is not what the majority of us want.

If you just talk to people about affordable health care, Without calling it Obama care the polling data demonstrates that most people want universal health care of some type in this country

And then you factor in the vote that is the main way we speak to the government
And the last time we had a national election more of us voted than voted in any other election in American history 155 million people voted
81 million voted for the winner.


The vote that should always matter more than the electoral college is the majority vote.
But we live in a country that treats us as if we owe the government something for existing.
Actually it's reverse the government owes us for its existence. Because we the people are paying most of the bills.

I'm not talking about the individualistic selfish Republican views about taxpayers.

I'm talking about how the money should be spent that it should benefit those of us who are contributing the individual taxpayers and I'm not slighting people who don't pay taxes because everybody contributes in some way,

For example everybody has to pay sales tax if they live in a state that has the sales tax correct.
Anr even those that are down-and-out they still contribute to society their shelters created for homeless people those shelters provide jobs, Those shelters are a construction contract,
And those shelters provide a useful service to all the people who fall through the capitalistic cracks in this country.


Have I clarified my position a little better.

[AZSkiffyGeek]

26. No, not at all nt

[Heather MC]

27. Then we continue to disagree, and that's OK

Have a lovely day
💜

[muriel_volestrangler]

28. Here's why that does not clarify things

"And a 3rd way that doesn't count anymore but it should and that's polling data"
Wow - that's come out of nowhere. Suddenly, you think polls should help control the public purse? That's radical - and hasn't been the case anywhere in the world, so why you say "anymore", I can't think.

You say "the majority vote" should matter more than the Electoral College. So I assume you're only talking about the election of the president. So I agree that should matter more, but it's the USA, and getting round the Constitution is hard.

After that, you show you have to basically back away from your OP that tries to tie government revenue with the right to direct it, by saying "it doesn't actually matter how much tax you pay, everyone should have a voice". Which is right, but that's what everyone else has been saying to you in this thread.

[Heather MC]

29. However, The way The Republican party Our tax investment into this country

They call us socialist when we demand that money be used in part for programs that benefit, The least of those among us they call that socialism.
Or they act as if they have a greater right to the money that we invest in to this country, Than we do.

They try to tell us oh we can't afford universal health care, no we can't afford to send people to college without making them pay for it.

And then of course they go off about the free market system and let it do what it does.

But when the free market system blows up where do they run to for safety.
They come back to the government and they take our money to keep themselves propped up.

We are being robbed.