A quick word or two about Antifa

[Deuxcents]

You know, the boogeyman the r’s dont understand n swear it’s after them...

There is no organization called “Antifa”
Antifa stands for anti-fascism
WWII veterans were Antifa b/c they fought fascism
Anyone who is against fascism is Antifa
There is no membership card
Anyone can be Antifa
Everyone should be Antifa

Hope that clears it up for em. Wouldn’t want them to be uninformed

[OAITW r.2.0]

1. The Greatest AntiFa 5 Star General who became President.

Dwight D. Eisenhower.

[Deuxcents]

2. True. Thanks for bringing that up..

[LeftInTX]

11. Antifa are old anarchists and a failed political party pre- WWII in Germany

They are a branch of the communist party.
They've been in Europe for 90 years.
They started up in the US in the 90s.

[OAITW r.2.0]

13. Nope. Not in 1941.

The Fascists already had a history, Germany, Italy, and Japan.

[LeftInTX]

15. Antifa was a failed German political party. (Communist)

Antifaschistische Aktion (German: [ˌantifaˈʃɪstɪʃə ʔakˈtsi̯oːn]) was a militant anti-fascist organisation in the Weimar Republic started by members of the Communist Party of Germany (KPD) that existed from 1932 to 1933. It was primarily active as a KPD campaign during the July 1932 German federal election and the November 1932 German federal election and was described by the KPD as a "red united front under the leadership of the only anti-fascist party, the KPD."[1]

In the postwar era, the historical organisation inspired new groups and networks, known as the wider antifa movement, many of which use the aesthetics of Antifaschistische Aktion, especially the antifa moniker and a modified version of its logo. During the Cold War, Antifaschistische Aktion had a dual legacy in East Germany and West Germany, respectively. In East Germany, it was considered part of the history and heritage of the KPD's successor, the Socialist Unity Party of Germany. In West Germany, its aesthetics and name were embraced by Maoists and later autonomists from the 1970s.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifaschistische_Aktion

[elleng]

3. Anyone who is against fascism is Antifa.

[NullTuples]

19. I am Antifa.

[rubbersole]

4. Donations to Antifa headquarters are sent to...

..George Patton etal...

[OAITW r.2.0]

14. I don't know about Patton.

He was a full head-on anti-communist at the end. Meaning he hated Russia. But he was a hammer looking for a nail.

[keithbvadu2]

5. Photograph Emerges of Leftist Anti-Fascists VIOLENTLY Disrupting Conservative White Supremacists!!!!

Photograph Emerges of Leftist Anti-Fascists VIOLENTLY Disrupting Conservative White Supremacists!!!!!

[Just A Box Of Rain]

6. Most of this just isn't true.

In 1930's Germany Antifaschistische Aktion declared that the liberal Social Democratic Party (SPD), were "social fascists." The liberals were the primary targets of Antifa, not the Nazis.

Antifa and the German Communist Party (KPD) of which Antifaschistische Aktion was a subsidiary) had the policy that they needed to destroy liberal democracy in Germany and they aided the Nazis path to power, rather than opposing it.

From the always reliable Wikipedia:

The Communists and the Nazis explicitly sought to overthrow the liberal democracy of the Weimar Republic while the social democrats and liberals strongly defended the republic and its constitution...

However, after the Comintern's abrupt ultra-left turn in its Third Period from 1928, the KPD regarded the Social Democratic Party of Germany (SPD) as its main adversary and adopted the position that the SPD was the main fascist party in Germany. This was based on the theory of social fascism that had been proclaimed by Joseph Stalin and that was supported by the Comintern during the late 1920s and early 1930s, which held that social democracy was a variant of fascism.[14] Consequently, the KPD held that it was "the only anti-fascist party" in Germany.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifaschistische_Aktion

Thälmann's KPD thus fought the SPD as its main political enemy, acting according to the Comintern policy which declared Social Democrats to be "social fascists". This made it difficult for the two leftist parties to work together against the emergence of Adolf Hitler.[9] The KPD under Thälmann declared that "fighting fascism means fighting the SPD just as much as it means fighting Hitler and the parties of Brüning."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernst_Th%C3%A4lmann

Comparing American soldiers--such as my father who nearly died in combat fighting fascism to Antifaschistische Aktion is insulting. You should study the history.

[Deuxcents]

10. Thank you for your post

There was never any intent to insult any combat fighters in my post n I can be sure no one here would, either. We may not know the intimate details of these factions n how or why they split off from each other but I enjoy history so I’ll see what I can learn. Thanks, again.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

12. I believe that if you study the history of that period that

you will discover that Antifaschistische Aktion (ANTIFA) was an opponent of liberal democracy.

They branded democrats as "fascists." People like us were their prime targets.

The memes that go around comparing GIs storming Normandy with Antifaschistische Aktion are hard to take.

[Scrivener7]

24. But the fact remains that the current republiQan boogeyman "antifa" doesn't exist.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

27. That's not entirely true either.

Sure the Trumpists falsely blame all sorts of stuff on ANTIFA that is bogus or are things that the Trumpists have done themselves. They have tried to create a "boogeyman."

However that doesn't mean ANTIFA doesn't exist. Don't kid yourself. ANTIFA does exist. It is an organization, just one that is cellular on nature.

And it is small and marginalized (thank goodness). For they attract people who have political violence on their minds and are just as much enemies of liberalism as the original Antifaschistische Aktion.

Anyone who have lived in a community were ANTIFA-cells are active and has participated in political demonstrations--as I have over many decades--has encountered ANTIFA forces. They come to fuck up peaceful demonstrations. No one is happy when they show up.

We need to stop pretending that this group, no matter how small (or how much is is exploited by Trumpist propagandists) are not real, as that is "reality-denialism."

[Scrivener7]

28. Then those people are actually republiQan provocateurs who have nothing

to do with the liberals that republiQans use the word to vilify.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

30. No, they are mainly Revolutionary Communists and Anarcho-Communists.

In Berkeley (where they are actually based in nearby Richmond) most were affiliated with Bob Avakian's RCP.

Not Republicans. Rather violent anti-liberals who wish to undermine liberal democracy.

The progressive mayor of Berkeley labeled them a criminal gang and has urged the State to use CA's anti-gang injunctions against ANTIFA due to their ongoing violence.

You are quite mistaken to pretend they don't exist or to otherwise give ANTIFA a pass.

Just because Trumpists have attempted to exploit ANTIFA as a boogeyman doesn't mean ANTIFA doesn't exist.

Good liberals who live in places where ANTIFA shows up to wreck demos can wish they didn't exist, but that ain't the reality.

[Sympthsical]

32. What do you base this on?

As someone who lives and works in the Bay Area where protest groups are everywhere, I promise you Antifa isn't a bunch of secret Republicans.

We talk about conspiracy theories and how bad they are, but this Antifa stuff is really weird. It exists. It's not Republicans. They're not liberal in any way we care about, and they're not fun if they show up in your neighborhood.

They're not the massive problem Republicans would have everyone believe, but they are a pestiferous thing.

This "Antifa doesn't exist, and if they do exist, they're Republican" is purest conspiracy with no basis in fact.

[Scrivener7]

33. Just A Box of Rain confirms that the antifa you are talking about are an

anti-liberal group. Therefore not Democrats.

And I still maintain that we are talking about two different things here.

You guys are talking about a small anti-liberal group you have seen in your local areas. I will take your word that it exists, but they're not, apparently, voting for liberals and Democrats.

RepubliQans are talking about a big secret violent Democratic conspiracy that is bent on taking down the government and scaring Devin Nunez's cows. That doesn't exist.

[Sympthsical]

34. They're a protest group that exists across the country

No, they don't have a building in downtown SF with a big sign out front who you can write a check to. They're not centralized. They're a loose network of local groups that ebb and flow between other far Left groups like Black Bloc, BAMN, etc.

But they do exist concretely, and they are not a good time whenever they show up at a protest. Which they do. Often. And, yes, they do get violent, because they are at heart authoritarians themselves. I have literally witnessed it with my own eyes in protests in Berkeley.

I don't think anyone on our side thinks they're the vast far-flung organization of Republican fantasy. That is obviously an untrue thing.

But "Antifa does not exist" is something I have read here dozens of times, and it blows my mind every single time. Come chill in my neighborhood some time. You'll see them just fine.

[Scrivener7]

36. Then we agree that the organization that the republiQans have been using as

a boogeyman does not exist.

I think it's an important point to make because the republiQans use THAT definition of antifa to justify the proliferation of anti-Democratic and anti-democratic militias and messages. They use it to justify the white supremacist led militarization of republiQans. They use it justify their own horrible violence against the rest of us. They use it to make people believe there is a threat they need to fight, and that threat is violent Democrats.

I am sorry you have had to deal with the other definition of antifa. It sounds terrible.

But how are we to fight the republiQans' fallacious definition of antifa, which represents an extreme nation-wide danger, if we are not able to say their boogeyman named "antifa" - which we agree does not exist - is a nonexistent entity?

[Just A Box Of Rain]

41. It isn't " the other definition of antifa."

It is actual ANTIFA. A cellularly organized group of violent political extremists who are active and exist.

Yes, Trumpists try to smear liberals as "antifa" and that is a bad joke (at best).

But no Democrat should give Trumpist lies cover by claiming that US GIs or Eisenhower are ANTIFA.

ANTIFA is as an anti-liberal group as there is. I'm glad you have not (seemingly) experienced them firsthand.

[Scrivener7]

43. Then what, exactly, would you like us to call the nonexistent republiQan boogeyman called antifa?

[Just A Box Of Rain]

44. You are mixing things up.

ANTIFA isn't non-existent.

When Trumpists attempt to link ANTIFA with us, it is best for us to have a strong record of denouncing ANTIFA violence and extremism and steering clear of that cellular organization.

The worst thing we can do is to pretend ANTIFA doesn't exist (such is reality-denialism) or to give these people cover by claiming our parents or grandparent who fought fascism are ANTIFA.

Know what I mean?

[Scrivener7]

45. Oh, Lord.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

46. So, I guess that's a no?

Not sure what to say at this point.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

40. Exactly.

I've witnessed ANTIFA myself firsthand in Berkeley and Los Angeles.

I'm sure you recognize these people by their faces. They sometimes wear different t-shirts and appear to form and re-form under different banners.

But when they show up, it is always bad news.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

35. ANTIFA--the cellular organization that actually exists--is neither democratic or Democratic.

They are also not Republicans.

Rather they are the fringiest of the fringe, living in that strange space where far-right and extreme-left are hard to sort.

When they show up at demos, people who know what time it is move away or leave. No one wants these violent a-holes around.

These are not allies.

These are a few things that the progressive mayor of Berkeley, Jesse Arreguin who has to deal with them on an ongoing basis, has had to say about ANTIFA:

"I think we should classify them as a gang," said Arreguin. "They come dressed in uniforms. They have weapons, almost like a militia and I think we need to think about that in terms of our law enforcement approach."

"We also need to hold accountable and encourage people not to associate with these extremists because it empowers them and gives them cover," said Arreguin.

Arreguin, if it matters to some, is a Bernie Sanders endorsed politician. Not a Trumpist. Not a Republican.

Listen to the people who have experience with ANTIFA firsthand.

Equating Americans who fought fascism with these asshole is an insult to people like my dad.

Stop getting your "history" from memes.

[Scrivener7]

38. Huh. This was an interesting post right up to the nasty ad-hominem.

See my post #36. And have a nice day.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

39. Read the thread.

How many times do memes that suggest American GIs were "ANTIFA" need to get posted on DU?

People ought to study the fairly-recent history instead of buying into memes that distort reality.

My comments were aimed generally, and not at you specifically.

[Dirty Socialist]

29. I agree

What passes for Antifa nowadays is not necessarily good.

[Deuxcents]

7. I posted this tonight b/c of a thread

About Devin Nunes saying Antifa had come to his cow farm. I found it ridiculous...even laughable so I pulled out an old poster n relayed it here.

[LeftInTX]

17. Should have told him he should be glad a gang of white nationalists did not come to his cow farm

You're feeding a false narrative and giving them ammunition.

They are the bad guys

Antifa is a side show. However, antifa is not completely benign. They don't support Democrats at all. They don't support government.

[LeftInTX]

8. Not this again

Antifa is a real thing
It was founded in Germany around 1932
It was political party which did not have much success
Antifa is anarchist based, so there is no membership
Antifa does not vote
Antifa does not serve in the military
They do not support the Democratic Party
Antifa is anti-military

Also WWII veterans were not even anti-fascist. Did you see the Ken Burns series????? The US did not even want Jewish refugees. Survey after survey and poll after poll showed that Americans did not want to accept Jewish refugees. Did you ever hear of "Voyage of the Damned"? It was a ship of Jews who were sent to Cuba because the US would not accept them. Then Cuba wouldn't accept them.
Then, they had to go back. We were at war with Germany, We were not at war against fascism. Soldiers did not know about the concentration camps until they found them. The US is racist. It was racist then and it is racist now.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifa_(United_States)

[Scrivener7]

25. Yes. But the current republiQan imaginary enemy comprised of violent liberals does not exist.

[Initech]

9. No, they made the whole thing up!

Just like they made up Benghazi, Pizzagate, Critical Race Theory, and "wokism". Antifa is a made up boogeyman made to scare the cult into doing their master's every evil bidding.

[OAITW r.2.0]

16. To all the anti-anti-fa posters on this thread.

I didn't live in 1930's Germany, but I am totally opposed to the Republican-Trump reality that wants to create a One Party State. Does that make me Anti-Fascist?

[LeftInTX]

18. It makes us sound ignorant and juvenile.

Know what antifa is and stop posting stupid fake memes about antifa. It's a protest group. It's not the US Army!!!!

[Wounded Bear]

20. Technically, Communist USSR was anti-fascist in WWII...

they propagandized about it extensively, even though one would have a difficult time telling the two systems apart without a poly-sci degree.

[AntivaxHunters]

21. "There is no organization called "Antifa"

Would you like to place a bet on this?
WW2 vets were NOT ANTIFA.
ANTIFA was literally Nazi resistance inside Hitler's Germany. They were Communists and AnCom.
They were murdered in concentration camps.

And yes, they are VERY organized today. And thank God they are.
You can read more here about the history of ANTIFA https://archive.ph/qHn7X
Notice that flag in the middle of the photos? Yup yup!
"Karl-Liebknecht-Haus, the KPD's headquarters from 1926 to 1933. The KPD leaders were arrested by the Gestapo in this building in January 1933, when Hitler became Chancellor."

[tavernier]

22. Interesting posts.

But you guys know the real truth… we all meet in my basement on Thursday nights where our leader George Soros gives us a million dollars each, and we go around to different elections and steal them. And then we eat pizza and babies.
Q explained it perfectly.

[rubbersole]

23. We're led by JFK Jr.

Who's tfg's VP....wait, why would he be VP? Let me ask the genius down the street with the "Don't tread on me" flag and nary a female in his life.

[Roisin Ni Fiachra]

26. I'm a non violent anti-fascist Democrat, like most of the folks who are

labeled "Antifa" by the American right wing.

It is unfortunate that a few idiots who claim to be anti-fascist destroy property under the banner of Antifa, giving hard core GOP fascists a basis to use the blanket term Antifa as a boogieman to fear monger against democracy, progressives, and democratic progressive policies.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

37. Which is why anti-fascist Democrats should disassociate entirely from ANTIFA.

It is "necessary," but not "sufficient" to be anti-fascist.

ANTIFA nutters believe liberal democracy and liberal Democrats are "fascists."

Do not be confused on this point.

Mercifully ANTIFA has miniscule membership in their nation-wide cells.

We should never give them cover.

[The Grand Illuminist]

31. The way it is now....

We might not have a choice and become the WWII veterans to fight this growing fascist movement.

[Tommy Carcetti]

42. You are in fact 100% correct. However...

...at this point making a point of going by the "I'm Antifa because I'm anti-fascist!", while correct, is not a hill worth dying on.

The "Antifa" label is silly at this point. Let it die. Won't make us any less against fascism.