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Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:30 PM

The fake electors scheme is the one that blows me away

And people in states actually signed their names to fake elector rolls that would be sent into the Fed archives? How stupid is that? That's called forgery, among other things.

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Arrow 33 replies Author Time Post
Reply The fake electors scheme is the one that blows me away (Original post)
vlyons Dec 2022 OP
bucolic_frolic Dec 2022 #1
Chainfire Dec 2022 #2
Celerity Dec 2022 #4
mobeau69 Dec 2022 #6
Hortensis Dec 2022 #3
canetoad Dec 2022 #8
Hortensis Dec 2022 #11
ancianita Dec 2022 #15
Wounded Bear Dec 2022 #5
mobeau69 Dec 2022 #7
Wounded Bear Dec 2022 #9
mobeau69 Dec 2022 #12
Lucky Luciano Dec 2022 #23
Alexander Of Assyria Dec 2022 #16
liberal N proud Dec 2022 #10
moniss Dec 2022 #13
Alexander Of Assyria Dec 2022 #17
BumRushDaShow Dec 2022 #14
Alexander Of Assyria Dec 2022 #18
peppertree Dec 2022 #30
William Seger Dec 2022 #19
Sneederbunk Dec 2022 #20
rubbersole Dec 2022 #21
Wounded Bear Dec 2022 #28
rubbersole Dec 2022 #29
Mr.Bill Dec 2022 #22
Hamlette Dec 2022 #24
republianmushroom Dec 2022 #25
Evolve Dammit Dec 2022 #26
3Hotdogs Dec 2022 #27
dchill Dec 2022 #31
honest.abe Dec 2022 #32
Ford_Prefect Dec 2022 #33

Response to vlyons (Original post)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:31 PM

1. Proof Republicans live in their own delusional minds

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Response to vlyons (Original post)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:32 PM

2. I know how you feel. It seems like an open and shut case of fraud to me.

Yet, two years later...

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Response to Chainfire (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:36 PM

4. +1

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Response to Chainfire (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:39 PM

6. But I'd bet the fraudsters haven't had a good nights sleep since signing.

See “Crime and Punishment”.

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Response to vlyons (Original post)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:35 PM

3. I suspect a lot of these "patriots" were carried away enough to

believe they'd be writing the history books and arranging for arrests. Of those who'd tried to stop them, of course.

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Response to Hortensis (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:47 PM

8. I agree

They must have truly believed the scheme would work and they would be heroes. It will be nice to see them sent down.

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Response to canetoad (Reply #8)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:52 PM

11. Yes!

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Response to Hortensis (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 07:31 PM

15. So carried away that they forgot the 12th Amendment existed.

And why Judge Luttig said so. Not to mention all the lawyers who conspired to break that law. Including congress people.

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Response to vlyons (Original post)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:38 PM

5. The original Constitution was pretty vague on how electors are selected...

Hell, the Constitution doesn't even mention having popular elections for the Presidency. That's kind of assumed and all the states do it. The current law concerning Presidential elections is from the 1870's and has some glaring holes in it. It certainly needs updating and upgrading.

The fake electors scheme as they attempted it is illegal in a couple of ways, as you point out. I fear that there are "legal" ways to circumvent the intent of the Constitution that need to be legislated away.

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Response to Wounded Bear (Reply #5)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:46 PM

7. The framers really didn't have a lot of confidence in true democracy.

See An Economic Interpretation of The Constitution by Charles and Mary Baird.

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Response to mobeau69 (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:51 PM

9. Jefferson came closest to wanting real democracy...

but he was a slave owner, so hardly perfect. He wasn't involved with writing the Constitution, either.

The two major camps were Hamilton and Madison, and neither were really enamored with the common man.

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Response to Wounded Bear (Reply #9)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:54 PM

12. Wealth preservation was paramount for them.

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Response to Wounded Bear (Reply #9)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 08:25 PM

23. I'm less and less enamored with the common man myself.

There are some real wackaloons out there.

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Response to Wounded Bear (Reply #5)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 07:32 PM

16. Textbook criminal forgery and fraud, with intent and malice fromtheirassesthought.

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Response to vlyons (Original post)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 06:52 PM

10. They were disillusioned in thinking they would be heros

Of the new world Florida Man was going give them.

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Response to vlyons (Original post)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 07:00 PM

13. Also

it is willfully making an improper claim to a title or an official position or appointment. It is false swearing in furtherance of a conspiracy. That conspiracy resulted in deaths and those persons who were a part of the conspiracy should be charged with responsibility for those deaths under all applicable statutes. If there is no federal statute that is applicable then possibly a state or DC prosecution for those deaths might be possible.

It is long past time to sugar-coat the death and misery caused by the previous President and those who conspired with him. They were advised that their purposeful inaction would cause hundreds of thousands to die from Covid 19 and many millions to suffer severe illness and lasting long term effects. They were advised by the duly appointed highest legal authority in the country that there was no election fraud for which to take action to overturn an election. They focused their insurrection mob on a falsehood despite knowing it was false and then they assembled that mob on a specific date, gave them the specific location to attack, gave them the specific time to attack, ordered them to march, ordered them to fight and allowed the attack to continue for hours despite having the ability to end the attack.

Both instances caused preventable deaths and injuries and the commission of those acts are not just a matter of malfeasance in office but rather the most heinous of crimes and callous disregard for the Constitution they swore to uphold, the very life of their fellow citizens and was all done for the personal political gain of the ringleader of that conspiracy.

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Response to moniss (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 07:35 PM

17. Well said moniss! Multiple charges under criminal law, on this I am wondering why the wait?

Lot simpler than prosecuting an ex President and ex Cabinet…unless the Indictment Drop Date will deliver all the ordinance in one salvo?

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Response to vlyons (Original post)

Mon Dec 19, 2022, 07:14 PM

14. What was fascinating about it

was that the states receive a "brochure" (it's online too) for how they handle the Certificates of Acertainments and Certificates of Votes (the Elector votes) and it explicitly indicates how many copies of things need to be sent wherever and THAT not only includes NARA, but the "President of the Senate" (the U.S. VP), and even their local Federal District Court's office.

I.e., - https://www.archives.gov/electoral-college/state-officials/so-instructions

NATIONAL ARCHIVES

Electoral College
Home > Electoral College > For State Officials > SO Instructions


Instructions and Guidance for State Officials and Points of Contact

(snip)

Distribute Paired Certificates of Ascertainment and Vote

Distribute the SIX (6) pairs of Certificates to the designated Federal and State officials as follows: 

  • Send ONE (1) pair to the President of the Senate,  
    The Honorable Michael R. Pence. 

  • Send TWO (2) pairs to the Archivist of the United States, 
    David S. Ferriero, c/o Office of the Federal Register (F). 

  • Send TWO (2) pairs to the Secretary of State in your State.

  • Send ONE (1) pair to the Chief Judge of the Federal District Court located where your State’s electors met.


  • (snip)



    And IIRC, I think at least one state sent exactly as above (including to their local Federal District Court)!

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    Response to BumRushDaShow (Reply #14)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 07:38 PM

    18. Only way to get around that is send fake certificates to the VP and get him to count them instead!?

    What kind of evil mind would even dream of that in American democracy?

    This is all a dream, right?

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    Response to Alexander Of Assyria (Reply #18)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 09:20 PM

    30. And when he proved unwilling to do so, they were counting on Chuck ASSley instead

    A real paragon of democracy and clean politics, that one.

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 07:59 PM

    19. And, it was a perfectly senseless thing to do, UNLESS...

    ... unless you consider it in the context of the whole plot: Specifically, it was supposed to just give Pence an excuse, no matter how lame, for not certifying the votes, throwing it either to the Supreme Court or to a one-vote-per-state Congressional decision.

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 07:59 PM

    20. Prosecute each and every fake elector.

    Show no mercy.

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 08:04 PM

    21. Not only these delusional magats were convinced to sign their names to an obviously phony document..

    ..the insurrectionists had a film crew documenting their every move. Decent Americans thank them for the free evidence.

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    Response to rubbersole (Reply #21)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 09:03 PM

    28. Don't forget all the selfies and Tik-Tok vids they post real time...

    they posted the proof of their crimes on the Internet.

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    Response to Wounded Bear (Reply #28)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 09:07 PM

    29. Well, that way Lauraleen might see it and want to marry me.

    Hey Skeeter, Lauraleen is your cousin...

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 08:19 PM

    22. Their downfall was they thought

    they were going to win. That's true of most stupid criminals.

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 08:36 PM

    24. the thing that bugs me the most is Trump sat there for 3hours watching it on TV and did nothing.

    that's my trigger

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 08:45 PM

    25. How many of these people will be indicted ?

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 08:54 PM

    26. How many people were responsible for these fake electors? This took a bunch. Separate investigation

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 08:58 PM

    27. Not forgery.

    Fraud.

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 09:30 PM

    31. It's the ancient religion of IOKIYAR.

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 09:35 PM

    32. Yes. Agreed.

    Remarkable they thought they could actually consider trying it and pull it off.

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    Response to vlyons (Original post)

    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 09:46 PM

    33. As I recall they were PROMISED they would be pardoned by El Jefe once he was reinstated.

    Hence they were under A LOT of Pressure to do it as much as they were led like lambs...And were fully MAGA indoctrinated.

    Fools though they were, they were lied to all the way by people who KNEW it was all lies.

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