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Wed Dec 21, 2022, 09:54 PM

OMG after watching HRC on CNN... We HAVE to get her elected

as president!? As VP! ? She's 100% brilliant, 100% savvy, 100% experienced. She lived thru trump with grace and never freaking complained. She WON the popular vote !!!!

We should not abandon her!!!
Don't fall into RW trap of saying no.

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Reply OMG after watching HRC on CNN... We HAVE to get her elected (Original post)
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 OP
tritsofme Dec 2022 #1
enough Dec 2022 #2
Dan Dec 2022 #7
triron Dec 2022 #101
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #11
tritsofme Dec 2022 #38
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #58
tritsofme Dec 2022 #60
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #67
karynnj Dec 2022 #94
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #69
Demsrule86 Dec 2022 #130
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #157
msfiddlestix Dec 2022 #163
iemanja Dec 2022 #34
tritsofme Dec 2022 #41
iemanja Dec 2022 #56
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #72
betsuni Dec 2022 #77
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #79
betsuni Dec 2022 #80
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #81
betsuni Dec 2022 #88
sheshe2 Dec 2022 #108
LetMyPeopleVote Dec 2022 #114
Malmsy Dec 2022 #156
MrsCoffee Dec 2022 #165
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #166
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #71
Hortensis Dec 2022 #137
betsuni Dec 2022 #147
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #158
Hortensis Dec 2022 #159
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #160
Hortensis Dec 2022 #161
Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #3
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Dec 2022 #5
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #13
Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #92
Ocelot II Dec 2022 #4
Chin music Dec 2022 #6
milestogo Dec 2022 #9
Chin music Dec 2022 #12
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #17
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #73
onenote Dec 2022 #8
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #16
onenote Dec 2022 #18
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #75
Demsrule86 Dec 2022 #129
Karma13612 Dec 2022 #10
Chin music Dec 2022 #14
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #20
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #15
iemanja Dec 2022 #36
Sparkly Dec 2022 #121
betsuni Dec 2022 #124
Karma13612 Dec 2022 #126
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #162
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #19
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #22
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #25
Chin music Dec 2022 #31
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #40
Chin music Dec 2022 #43
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #47
Chin music Dec 2022 #51
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #83
A HERETIC I AM Dec 2022 #84
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #85
Demsrule86 Dec 2022 #141
Demsrule86 Dec 2022 #131
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #82
former9thward Dec 2022 #45
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #48
Demsrule86 Dec 2022 #138
Chin music Dec 2022 #139
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #164
Chin music Dec 2022 #167
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #33
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #35
Chin music Dec 2022 #44
Chin music Dec 2022 #27
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #37
Chin music Dec 2022 #42
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #46
Chin music Dec 2022 #50
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #78
Demsrule86 Dec 2022 #133
iemanja Dec 2022 #30
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #39
iemanja Dec 2022 #55
Trenzalore Dec 2022 #57
Demsrule86 Dec 2022 #136
Mr.Bill Dec 2022 #21
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #24
Mr.Bill Dec 2022 #28
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #52
iemanja Dec 2022 #32
Autumn Dec 2022 #23
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #26
Autumn Dec 2022 #49
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #53
Autumn Dec 2022 #54
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #59
Chin music Dec 2022 #61
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #65
karynnj Dec 2022 #95
Chin music Dec 2022 #96
inthewind21 Dec 2022 #98
Celerity Dec 2022 #99
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #102
Celerity Dec 2022 #104
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #103
Celerity Dec 2022 #105
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #106
karynnj Dec 2022 #109
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #110
karynnj Dec 2022 #111
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #112
karynnj Dec 2022 #115
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #117
karynnj Dec 2022 #127
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #128
karynnj Dec 2022 #142
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #150
Demsrule86 Dec 2022 #132
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #155
Demsrule86 Dec 2022 #135
iemanja Dec 2022 #29
Beautiful Disaster Dec 2022 #62
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #68
Demanchor Dec 2022 #63
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #70
KentuckyWoman Dec 2022 #64
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #66
brooklynite Dec 2022 #74
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #76
brooklynite Dec 2022 #91
FlyingPiggy Dec 2022 #86
Polybius Dec 2022 #87
dembotoz Dec 2022 #89
Chin music Dec 2022 #90
Autumn Dec 2022 #100
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #122
Autumn Dec 2022 #140
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #154
karynnj Dec 2022 #93
Chin music Dec 2022 #97
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #116
Chin music Dec 2022 #143
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #148
Chin music Dec 2022 #149
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #152
Chin music Dec 2022 #153
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #107
marmar Dec 2022 #169
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #170
LetMyPeopleVote Dec 2022 #113
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #118
betsuni Dec 2022 #119
Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2022 #120
betsuni Dec 2022 #123
Captain Stern Dec 2022 #125
Chin music Dec 2022 #144
Hortensis Dec 2022 #134
Vinca Dec 2022 #145
WhiskeyGrinder Dec 2022 #146
themaguffin Dec 2022 #151
marmar Dec 2022 #168
Tarc Dec 2022 #171

Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 09:56 PM

1. She's not running, and it isn't interested. It's insulting to insinuate

that anyone who doesnít share your position is falling for a ďright wing trapĒ

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Response to tritsofme (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 09:58 PM

2. +1

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Response to tritsofme (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:10 PM

7. Hilary is #1 for me.....

I really wish the best for her, she would have been the best for us.

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Response to Dan (Reply #7)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:17 PM

101. Me too. 2016 election was corrupted.

I agree with Jimmy Carter; Trump did not win the election.

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Response to tritsofme (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:42 PM

11. Talk about insulting

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #11)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:07 PM

38. Your OP says it is a RW trap to not support a non-existent campaign for a non-existent candidate.

Not sure what to tell you?

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Response to tritsofme (Reply #38)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:33 PM

58. What? The whole denigration of Hillary WAS a right wing trope

In fact, many of us were affected albeit subconsciously. I had to catch myself thinking ... Ahh but the baggage... It worked !

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #58)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:36 PM

60. What in the world are you talking about? Hillary isn't running, doesn't want to run. Biden is.

It really stinks that Hillary got screwed out of the White House, but life isnít always fair.

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Response to tritsofme (Reply #60)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:21 AM

67. Wow. That there's no acknowledgement is just plain weird

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #67)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 10:21 AM

94. I would say it's the norm

Remember when Gore returned a year after losing? He was attacked with people saying he was angry .. and he had grown a beard. Kerry returned to the Senate and there was a whisper campaign that he thought he was one of the Democratic leaders ! .. ignoring that he actually was.

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Response to tritsofme (Reply #60)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:24 AM

69. Yes life isn't always fair. Great mantra

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #58)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:16 AM

130. No it wasn't. The left -Greens - and others cost us the election.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #130)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 09:33 PM

157. So you honestly think there was unmitigated enthuusiasm

For Hillary???

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #58)

Sat Dec 24, 2022, 09:58 AM

163. The RW HATED her as far back as 1992. They HATED her as First Lady. Their HATE continues

That HATE for her is about a lot of pathetic, and deeply rooted misogynistic based mental issues which affected just enough of the electoral population to turn out the vote for a demented ass clown and give public officials the ability to rig the system enough to install that ass clown along with the help of Putin who also hated her.

Things are not much different right now, I'm sure you're well aware.

I just don't see the benefit of circling back, personally. It's time to accept it and move on.







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Response to tritsofme (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:04 PM

34. You're right that she isn't interested

But anyone who can't see how amazing she is has poor judgment.

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Response to iemanja (Reply #34)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:10 PM

41. No doubt, that's why I supported her presidential ambitions for over a decade.

That doesnít make 2024 or 2028 a good idea, or even a real one.

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Response to tritsofme (Reply #41)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:31 PM

56. I agree

Because she's made very clear that she isn't running again.

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Response to iemanja (Reply #56)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:29 AM

72. Do you blame her? With luke warm base support? I'd say

That too!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #72)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:43 AM

77. "With lukewarm base support?"

What do you mean? Hillary had about 94% of the black woman vote in 2016, the base of the Democratic Party and most reliable Democratic voters.

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Response to betsuni (Reply #77)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 01:00 AM

79. That's really sad. All I know is totally anecdotal.. from

comments here and in general. There wasn't universal support, IMHO.

Sounds like she just needed that extra ooph to take her past the EC.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #79)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 01:01 AM

80. What's really sad?

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Response to betsuni (Reply #80)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 01:10 AM

81. That a 1 million % able, experienced person didn't

Last edited Thu Dec 22, 2022, 06:58 AM - Edit history (1)

get our full support. Republican smear of the long term constant denigration ilk was new to us. And we didn't ever even imagine the stakes.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #81)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 06:18 AM

88. Wasn't Republicans targeting left-leaning voters, especially young ones.

Social media flooded with propaganda, elected official (not Republican) and media aimed at left-leaning audiences endlessly trashed Hillary as a corrupt warmonger racist worse-than-Trump cartoon villain character created to convince people not to vote or vote third party because Democrats are "ideologically and morally bankrupt." They knew what they were doing. Something about "revolution."

Hillary's career as a passionate advocate for human rights, especially for women and children, was erased and replaced with lies and conspiracy theories. Dollar bills thrown at her when arriving at a fundraiser with George Clooney. The real Democratic base isn't stupid enough to believe that campaign donations to get Democrats elected somehow makes anyone "beholden" and hopelessly corrupt and worse than Republicans ("at least Republicans have the courage of their convictions" they said); aren't stupid enough to be trained by populists to knee-jerk boo at the words "Democratic Establishment" with much more vicious hate than at the words "Republican Establishment" and boo Democratic icons who've, like Hillary, spent their entire careers fighting for equal rights; aren't stupid enough to believe that primaries are somehow rigged by the DNC (as if it's a shadowy powerful diabolical organization stopping at nothing to prevent progress because of course more evil than Republicans) and voters (the actual Democratic base) don't count because they're tricked by the bad evil Democrats. It worked well enough.

The real Democratic base fully imagined the stakes.

LOL at all the idiots who said Obama and then Hillary were warmongers. Plenty of that here and everywhere.

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Response to betsuni (Reply #88)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 07:46 PM

108. Spot on!





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Response to betsuni (Reply #88)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:03 AM

114. Great post

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Response to betsuni (Reply #88)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 06:37 PM

156. +1000 (eom)

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #72)

Sat Dec 24, 2022, 10:49 AM

165. Some of your posts in this thread seem very contrary to your OP.

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Response to MrsCoffee (Reply #165)

Sat Dec 24, 2022, 10:56 AM

166. Think it's called communication? You posit something and rhen

You read responses and take in things people say that you agree with?

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Response to iemanja (Reply #34)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:27 AM

71. Like that .! Kind put down lol

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Response to tritsofme (Reply #1)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:38 AM

137. Is it insulting to warn not to fall for the far-LEFT deceits

that caused well meaning people to help tRump and the Republicans take over in 2016?

Populist negativism, with its defining hostility to existing "establishment," is completely incompatible with the positivity of progressivism, which requires the establishment to put to work. As the Biden admin is doing, as Hillary would have and would in any office. People need to KNOW that.

And of course, to know what anti-Democratic, and severe contempt for cooperating with those with other ideas, mean after living through the devastating tragedy of 2016. When influencers claim to share our goals but won't accept the choices and representatives chosen by the majority, believe they mean just that. They will try to spoil future Democratic elections and aspirations..

?fit=1024%2C1024

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Response to Hortensis (Reply #137)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 02:50 PM

147. +1

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Response to Hortensis (Reply #137)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 09:45 PM

158. Lovely photo !!! I'm a strict believer in reengineering.

Start with a blank sheet of paper, from ground zero and work with requirements to find the most perfect nominee. I know this is not the way it's done. It's typically a giant fiasco and anyone can run if they want to. So reality doesn't match the way I think it should happen. No surprise there

For 2016, HRC was always called the presumptive nominee. And everyone else tried to play catch up and knock her off the throne

By the time; f the election she was bruised and soiled

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #158)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 10:18 PM

159. Yes, her image and that of the Democratic Party certainly were.

The problem with blank sheets is the enormous advantage it gives the character assassins; they had several vicious assassination narratives created for mostly blank sheeet I-Sanders that they never needed.

The huge weakness they exploited for her wasn't that. She was well known and had approvals in the 70%s as senator and SoS. It was that she was a woman and this was the presidency. And of course the viciously dishonest libel of a strong progressive liberal as a corrupt corporatist for our party's weakness on the far left -- those wired to lap that stuff up.

Oh, well. The stakes and the setbacks were enormous, but they didn't destroy us. Battle's still on.

It's just such a waste not to be able to turn her loose on some big national problems.

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Response to Hortensis (Reply #159)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 10:41 PM

160. Yes. You have to have firm confidence and courage

of your convictions and most of all stop over- apologizing.

I think the massive brain washing effort by Rs against Hillary worked. Have said this before - but think it even affected us. Someone said she had baggage I had to stop and think oh wait, she doesn't - they've just subconsciously made us think she's horrible.

What's ironic or hypocritical about what you said about Rs not wanting a strong woman, I have wingnut inlaws who LOVED Hillary when she was running against O. Guess that's anecdotal evidence that Rs are more bigoted with race than gender.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #160)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 10:51 PM

161. Right. But unfortunately the misogyny mined and turned into

the "evil witch" persona wasn't just RW.

As for "her baggage," it wasn't real. It was RW deceits manufactured over 30 years of RW swiftboating and schlepped around by them, and much of the MSM, wherever she went.

How awful that people are still under the infuence and still haven't noticed that 30 years of fake swiftboating "investigations" never turned up anything the Republicans could have her charged for. Does anyone doubt they would have prosecuted if they had even a fair chance of "locking her up!"?

That's how powerful lies repeatedly constantly can become. Especially when oppositional factions on both right and left double-team their "dishonest Hillary" themes to take out our candidate.

Sigh. Off to bed. Hopefully the power won't go out like it did last night. A wind-blasted but nevertheless balmy 10 degrees compared to what so many DUers have.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:01 PM

3. She is amazing, isn't she? But we lost our chance with her.

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Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:05 PM

5. Yep

Plus this place is littered with anti-Hillary posts from 2016. Most of these people don't post anymore.

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Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:42 PM

13. Why?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #13)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 09:44 AM

92. Because she shows no inclination to put herself through that again. And who can

blame her?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:03 PM

4. She's made it very clear many times that she is no longer interested

in running for office. Acknowledging what she actually wants to do with her life now is not abandoning her, it's respecting her.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)


Response to Chin music (Reply #6)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:38 PM

9. She wasn't robbed.

We were robbed.

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Response to milestogo (Reply #9)


Response to Chin music (Reply #12)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:49 PM

17. +1,000,000

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Response to Chin music (Reply #6)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:30 AM

73. +1

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:19 PM

8. So are you suggesting we abandon Biden and or Harris in 2024?

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Response to onenote (Reply #8)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:48 PM

16. Jeez

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #16)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:53 PM

18. That's not much of an answer.

You suggested we needed to get HRC elected President or VP. Well, the next opportunity for that would be 2024. But that would mean pushing out Biden or Harris to make a spot for her on the ticket.

It was your suggestion, not mine.

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Response to onenote (Reply #18)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:33 AM

75. So what? Seriously, why not. Would definitely show

We had backbone and the courage of our convictions. Exactly what we need now! Unabashed conviction! IMHO



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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #16)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:14 AM

129. Biden is the best presidentof my lifetime. He will be reelected.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:38 PM

10. No

It really is time to let go.

The young electorate that is beginning to vote is not going to embrace an older generation as much as we want them to. We know their strengths, but they are now best suited to be mentors.

We do need to accept that we need new blood in the Democratic party if we want to inspire the younger voters. Itís time for the Fettermans and the Abrams to name just a few. We have to put forth the sane young passionate Democratic alternates to the GQPís Boeberts and Greenes.

I wish people like Schiff and Raskin and Whitehouse would show an interest. But, I guess we still need them to keep Congress respectable. LOL!

No offense to the OP, I just think Hillary did have her moment, and it has passed. Let her be a consultant.

🙋‍♀️

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Response to Karma13612 (Reply #10)


Response to Chin music (Reply #14)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:53 PM

20. Have always thought if you were running and older

You should team up with a younger idealistic running mate. Like to see her with Beto . But that's just my personal dream team. Experience + youth and promise!

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Response to Karma13612 (Reply #10)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:47 PM

15. Not sure why her moment has passed. Why? I would venture a

Guess that if all Ds stood unabashedly for her she would be thrilled to accommodate ! But pipe dream obviously

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Response to Karma13612 (Reply #10)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:07 PM

36. Do you oppose Biden's reelection bid then?

One would assume you'd try to be ideologically consistent rather than holding different standards for men and women.

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Response to Karma13612 (Reply #10)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:30 AM

121. Yet a big part of her defeat was that young whippersnapper, "Bernie!!"

So it all depends how one is "packaged," it seems.

I wouldn't say,
"I just think Hillary did have her moment, and it has passed. Let her be a consultant."


I'd just say, the woman has accomplished so much, taken us all so far, shattered so many molds and broken HUGE glass ceilings -- it was OBSCENE that this country put that cretin in office over her. Just disgraceful.

And she owes us nothing more. If she chooses to enjoy her grandchildren now, and offer wisdom now and then, that's what she should do. I'll admire her forever.

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Response to Sparkly (Reply #121)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 07:32 AM

124. +1

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Response to Sparkly (Reply #121)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 09:52 AM

126. Bernie and Hillary

Are two entirely different human beings.

I liked Bernie immensely. I adore Elizabeth Warren. Hillary was NEVER my cup of tea.

I did not become a Bernie Bro and voted for Hillary in 2016 as all good Democrats did in the general. But Bernie got my primary vote.

In 2020, I was heartbroken that by the time NY got their primary, Liz had suspended. I voted for her anyway. For the general, I voted for Biden. In 2020, Bernie was not on my radar at all. I knew he hadnít sold in 2016 so I moved on. I think Liz should have thrown her hat in the ring in 2016. I was heartbroken and I believe she could have won.

Hillary just never did it for me. Many apologies to most of DU as I know there are scores of members in this community who want her to run again, even tho she has not shown an interest. And I respect that Michelle has repeatedly said she has no desire to run. I would love it if she changed her mind. Love her whole persona.

Peace

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Response to Sparkly (Reply #121)

Sat Dec 24, 2022, 01:31 AM

162. Like " young whippersnapper"

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:53 PM

19. Ship sailed

She is 75. Biden runs in 2024 she would be 81 in 2028.

We can't nominate an 81 year old for a first term in the White House.

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #19)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:54 PM

22. We can do anything we want to do, no?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #22)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:58 PM

25. and lose yes

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #25)


Response to Chin music (Reply #31)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:09 PM

40. 80 is 80

I'm not thrilled about Biden running for re-election.

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #40)


Response to Chin music (Reply #43)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:20 PM

47. I'd be a terrible President

but there are people in my generation and the generation before me that would do a good job.

I will vote for Joe Biden and if he chooses to run I want an unopposed primary.

That being said, we need to start promoting people that are younger. Father time is undefeated.

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #47)


Response to Trenzalore (Reply #47)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 01:32 AM

83. Seriously... Who is younger in our party that could be

President? I fear that given our leadership avg age that we aren't mentoring and grooming the younger people? That said you've got trump's stench to remove. And trump's dismantling of institutions you have to restore. Think Biden's been stellar with that. But fear that no matter what we do, his spilled garbage will take a long time to clean up. It does take experience to do that? Maybe not?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #83)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 01:41 AM

84. Gavin Newsom

Seriously... Who is younger in our party that could be President?


The current Governor of California, that's who.

As qualified as HRC might be, as a party we need to move away from the Old Guard types and find new blood.

The answer to your question is actually "Plenty of people, if we just looked for them."

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Response to A HERETIC I AM (Reply #84)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 01:48 AM

85. Yes. Newsom! But operative words are "if WE just looked

for them ". Unless I am blind there is no "WE". Perhaps someone in leadership is looking for new talent? Or maybe it has to happen organically? I Don't know.

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Response to A HERETIC I AM (Reply #84)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:43 AM

141. No we need electable candidates in the General. Newsome would lose needed

Rustbelt states and likely Georgia and Virginia.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #83)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:18 AM

131. She lost and I think would lose again. You always run the incumbent if you want to to win.

She would not be able to win the restbelt.

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #40)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 01:19 AM

82. Don't you think it's the individual? Jeez my mom is 97

and knows more about what's going on than tons of 40 year olds. But then there are 60 year olds that don't have a clue my point,? It does not matter how old you are, what color you are, what sex you are... It's about something that transcends all that?

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Response to Chin music (Reply #31)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:18 PM

45. 70 is not the new 50.

Only 70 year olds who are pretending say that.

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Response to former9thward (Reply #45)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:21 PM

48. Speaking as someone in their mid 40s

40 is the new 40. I take relatively good care of myself and I can't do what I could do physically 10 years ago.

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Response to Chin music (Reply #31)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:40 AM

138. She lost in 16 and I doubt very much she would win at this point.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #138)


Response to Chin music (Reply #139)

Sat Dec 24, 2022, 10:43 AM

164. Don't forget just because you like someone it automatically means you

Don't like someone else!! Contorted logic!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #164)


Response to Trenzalore (Reply #25)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:03 PM

33. Ah. Our major problem . We can't unite and say absolutely

this person will be great! Trying to second guess a shrewd corrupt opponent is a fool's errand.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #33)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:05 PM

35. The growing demographic within the democratic party is voters under 30

They aren't going to be motivated to run to the polls for an octogenarian.

We need to get younger. We did so with House Leadership.

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #35)


Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #22)


Response to Chin music (Reply #27)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:07 PM

37. My mom is 75 and retired 10 years ago

She shouldn't be a nurse anymore and retired after a successful career. Why can't the baby boomer politicians do the right thing and bow out to a new generation gracefully.

Age is a real thing.

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #37)


Response to Chin music (Reply #42)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:18 PM

46. I'm in my mid -40s

Obviously if my mom is 75 I'm not a voter under 30 in 2028.

My mom votes democratic and would vote for whoever the nominee is and at the same time thinks Biden is too old to run again.

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #46)


Response to Trenzalore (Reply #37)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:55 AM

78. I would love to support a younger person! Guess they

Would have to be great in other ways? To balance out experienced! Who do you see as an option, seriously

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #22)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:23 AM

133. Sure if we want to lose the General.

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #19)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:01 PM

30. Do you hear yourself?

It's okay for Biden to run at 80, but a younger woman dare not.

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Response to iemanja (Reply #30)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:08 PM

39. You suggest she challenge Biden

That will go well for us in 2024

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #39)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:30 PM

55. No, I'm addressing the point that she's too old

while Biden isn't. That says a lot to me.

Hillary would not challenge Biden. Nor does she want to run.

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Response to iemanja (Reply #55)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:32 PM

57. I personally don't think Biden should run again

but if he does I'll support him because it is better to have an unopposed primary for an incumbent President.

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Response to Trenzalore (Reply #57)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:25 AM

136. Incumbents have a advantage and Biden has done a great job legislatively.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:54 PM

21. She would make a great Secretary General

of the United Nations. I doubt she is interested, though. She devoted her entire life to service to her country and she deserves whatever she wants in retirement.

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Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #21)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:57 PM

24. Wonder ( should know) what her and Bill's everday

life is like. It would be interesting to know what she really would like to do, if anything.

Think it sucks that we can't do anything to somehow say we are sorry.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #24)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:00 PM

28. Right now as a practical manner I suppose

she is preparing to be subpoenaed by most if not all the committees in the new republican House. Just because.

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Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #28)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:26 PM

52. Reminds me of an interview on NPR of a career IT manager

He said you can never look at the past through the lens of today, with IT ! There was a time when we all just relied on "that guy from IT" w,ho just told us what to do,. And that Hillary should have honed in on that and definitely not apologized.

I hear ya... Just hoping she sees the past more clearly

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Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #21)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:02 PM

32. Absolutely!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:54 PM

23. She will not run again. Yes she won the popular vote, so did Al Gore.

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Response to Autumn (Reply #23)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 10:59 PM

26. Run him! We can't just abandon these great people!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #26)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:22 PM

49. Do you know how old either would be if they did run and somehow won?? No. Just no

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Response to Autumn (Reply #49)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:28 PM

53. Yup. 80 is the new 60. I get it, no worries.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #53)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:29 PM

54. No, 80 is not the new 60. There come a time when the younger generations have to step in.

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Response to Autumn (Reply #54)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:34 PM

59. Agree with that too. Why I think an older experienced

Person coupled with a young idealist is perfect!

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Response to Autumn (Reply #54)


Response to Chin music (Reply #61)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:18 AM

65. Absolutely, positively the best post I've ever read on DU! nt

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Response to Chin music (Reply #61)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 10:34 AM

95. Actually when you mention, global warming, John Kerry's current role is an example of what

I think you are speaking of. Biden is using him for his diplomatic skills, contacts, and talents on that issue which was important to him since the 1980s. His closeness to Biden is an additional asset.


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Response to karynnj (Reply #95)


Response to Autumn (Reply #54)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 11:47 AM

98. Indeed

And 2016 would have been a great time for that stepping in!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #53)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:06 PM

99. She would turn 85yo in her first term if she ran and won in 2028. And no, 80 is not the new 60.

If Biden wins in 2024, we will have had 36 non stop years of Boomer (plus the even older Biden, who missed being a Boomer by around 3 years) Presidents. If Harris (another Boomer) runs and wins 2 terms starting in 2028, that would make 44 straight years. Some Gen Xers would be in their 70's before they saw a post Boomer POTUS if that plays out, some even approaching 80(!) if another Boomer won in 2036 and 2040 (easily possible under your '80 is the new 60' maxim). No single generation (plus an even older one in the middle) should hold POTUS power for that long.

Even 60 (let alone 70 or 80) is outside the norm for American first term POTUS's age at election age. Biden is an extreme outlier. If Harris had won in 2020 (not 2024, not 2028, I am talking 2020), only 3 Democrats in the almost 200 year history of our Party would have been older than Harris was (had she been sworn in), when they were first elected or first sworn in due to a POTUS death: Truman after FDR died in 1945 (LBJ was younger in 1963 when JFK was assassinated than Harris would have been had she won in 2020), then all the way back to James Buchanan in 1856, and finally, the very first Dem POTUS, Andrew Jackson, in 1828.

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Response to Celerity (Reply #99)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:51 PM

102. Had to refresh my memory with generation chart

Harris just on the edge tho

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #102)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 01:30 PM

104. I am a late 1996-born (missed being Gern Z by 2 and half months) Zillennial (micro gen born 1993-98)

Sometimes we are called Zennials (that seems to be fading as a label), and some include 1992 as a birth years as well. I am not typical for my age, as I skipped multiple grades and started uni right before I turned 15, so many of my closest friends and classmates are 2 to 4 or so years older than me, plus I am the youngest in my nuclear family. I can deffo relate more to a 1991 or 1992 born person on average than a 2001 or 2002 born one, and the differences are pretty stark on the gens-related subreddits. I also grew up in London (and have lived in Sweden for well over 4 years now, after a few years in the US), so realise that the cultural gap between me and continuously US-dwelling, mostly or entirely US-raised people can help flavour and magnify some of those differences as well.

A pretty decent article (I disagree with some things, but overall it is a good primer):


Too Old For Gen Z, Too Young For Millennials: Life As A Confused Zillennial

https://www.refinery29.com/en-gb/generation-zillennial



When 2021ís so-called 'generation battle' erupted, itís safe to say I felt like a conflicted bystander. Born in 1996, my identity as 'millennial' or 'Gen Z' is often called into question and after reading every definition on the internet, I still don't know where to place myself. As someone who parts their hair both to the side and in the middle, I'm confused about who I should claim as my contemporaries, and the increasingly cringey dialogue surrounding the generational conflict makes the task that much harder.

You might wonder why finding a generation to belong to matters at all but with the internet constantly hammering in the importance of belonging to certain Ďtribesí, figuring out my collective identity has always felt important. Considering that I can remember watching Disney films rented from Blockbuster, I often find myself identifying with millennials Ė but the minute they start talking about picking their Myspace 'top eight', I feel completely lost. On the other hand, Gen Z uses technology in the same way that I do but as soon as I start reminiscing about putting song lyrics in my MSN status, they all look completely bewildered.

As it turns out, this no manís land between the internet's two dominant generations has a name all of its own: zillennials. Growing up during the crossover from analogue to digital, zillennials are a product of a changing world, experiencing old and new in quick succession. Classified as a 'micro-generation' of people born between 1993 and 1998, Urban Dictionary defines zillennials as "too young to relate to the core of millennials but too old to relate to the core of Generation Z. They were 2000's kids and transitioned from teenagers to adults during the 2010's."

The zillennial's defining trait might be a constant state of identity crisis but according to a series of Reddit forums, the determining factor seems to come down to whether or not you remember 9/11. Whereas millennials were old enough to fully understand the events of the day, Gen Z might not even have been born; zillennials, meanwhile, likely have hazy memories of the event, with most of us just starting school at the time. Itís this type of experience that underpins the differences between the two groups and solidifies zillennials as a breed of their own.

snip

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Response to Celerity (Reply #99)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:58 PM

103. Hillary would be 80 at end of term 2028

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #103)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 01:32 PM

105. Biden's VERY likely running in 2024, Harris will be his VP, so 2028 is the soonest Hillary could run

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Response to Celerity (Reply #105)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 04:09 PM

106. Right. It would be if Biden didn't run

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #106)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 07:51 PM

109. However, if Biden does not run, it will almost surely be because of health

In 2024, Hillary Clinton will be 77 years old.Given that the Democrats had one president step down, I could imagine people will be very sensitive to the risks of someone else who is old running. I wouldcsay the same for Gore or Kerry.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #109)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 08:09 PM

110. Funny you don't even mention approval numbers. Just because

It just seems like it's a giant elephant in the room. Guess everyone just thinks it will get better?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #110)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 08:56 PM

111. Sorry, I don't know the approval numbers you are referring to

I would assume that Clinton's approval numbers, if even polled recently, would be high among Democrats. However, that would change if she were actively running.

I stated as speculation that if a president needed to step down or not run, age might be a greater concern at that point. Whether that would be true or not is not provable and completely unrelated to approval numbers.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #111)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 12:23 AM

112. No problem. It's just that latest polls say 70% of US

don't want him to run. Think 61% don't want trump to run. Think it was 67% don't run from Quinnipiac earlier for biden. Taking all partisanship out of it.just wonder how a person gets beyond that? And I think it must be that you think it will get better? I think it surely will. Just interesting that it doesn't appear to be a factor.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #112)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:06 AM

115. I don't trust polls this far out. There is also a problem with this vs a head to head poll

Last edited Fri Dec 23, 2022, 10:27 AM - Edit history (1)

I am more concerned that some head to head polls are not good.

The reason is that ANY incumbent can look bad when the poll is should he run or the incumbent vs (unspecified) someone else. I can remember seeing a senator get slightly less than 50 percent, who went on to get over 60 percent in both the primary and general election. In addition, until the midterm, the constant meme was Biden's low popularity would lead to a huge red wave. In actuality, as Schumer said, his first term was very very good in historic terms.

Not to mention, let's say Biden opts not to run. I think HRC who did not run in 2020, will not run in 2024 and if she did, I don't think she gets the nomination.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #115)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:15 AM

117. Yay! You won. Knew someone would say that!/ - that

They don't believe/trust polls!!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #117)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 10:22 AM

127. Give me a break

The full sentence included this being far out in time. It also referenced the question asked.

By the way, I worked at Bell Labs doing statistics and operations research for 25 years. I know how to design samples and I understand the difficulty people doing political polling race when response rates are very low. I know the value of polls and the very real limitations. In particular, I know how important what and how the question is asked is.

My comment addresses the fact that we are nearly 2 years out. Any poll taken now reflects the current view. As I mentioned polling essentially Biden vs ANYONE will likely be worse than Biden vs any specific Republican. I have also seen no poll where they test Democrats other than Biden and Harris against likely Republicans. Your comments imply that HRC would do better in an election than Biden. I do not think this has been polled.

As to governing, I think Biden has done far better than people could have expected, given a 50/50 Senate and a narrow margin in the House. Without the Supreme Court allowing t h e gerrymandered districts in the south and NY state democrats completely screwing up, he would have had an amazing midterm result including holding the house. I seriously doubt a president Hillary Clinton elected in 2020 could have done better.


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Response to karynnj (Reply #127)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:13 AM

128. Sorry, no snark to you! it was just too easy to point out since it inevitably happens.

I think you're saying that the CNBC (70% of US adults surveyed don't want him to run) poll and the previous Quinnipiac poll ( 67%) might not be accurate. This could be true.

My point is only that I wonder how a person who is deciding to run or not run rationalizes this. IOW, do they just brush off as too soon, not true, or think "I can turn that around" ? Must take a lot of self confidence. Perhaps HRC foresees a run as just too much of a mountain to climb. No one knows.

I don't have a clue if HRC could garner better poll numbers. Just think in the big scheme of things we've somehow done her wrong.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #128)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 12:18 PM

142. My thoughts

As I said, polls showing him losing or tied with potential Republican nominee would be far more concerning Even a Biden vs generic Republican is a better guide. The problem with this format is that some solid Democrats might respond no Even though they would vote for him in a general election. (The example I mentioned was a poll taken in 2007 to make John Kerry look bad and if I remember right he got 48 or 49, but there were also a significant not sure. When he actually ran, he got nearly 66% of the vote.)

Another reason not to push this now is it makes Biden a lame duck now. He has gotten a wide range of legislation passed. The next 2 years are unlikely to have much new legislation. It will be tough just to get budgets and other necessary stuff done. However, the Senate can confirm judges and other people to positions needing confirmation.

Predicting how that will play is what campaign strategists are likely studying. Can Biden run against a do nothing, angry, House where Jordan is running crazy investigations? Will he be able to do enough via executive order? Will the Senate pass popular, bipartisan bills giving the House the choice of voting down stuff that is popular or allowing the Democrats to have a victory. Additionally, we have no idea how the investigations play out, but it's a pretty good bet that they pale in comparison to January 6, which implicates many Republicans, and all the other Trump fraud.

As to HRC, I think that on one hand, she was given a lot by the country. She was First Lady for two terms, she was the party favorite over the NY representative long thought to be the one to get the Senate nomination, and she was the party favorite over Obama in 2008. Then, Obama gave her the SoS nomination. By 2015, she was far and away the party favorite for the nomination over the VP. Note, of course, that she used her positions of First Lady, Senator, and SoS to help the party and the country.

However, as I am sure you agree, nothing is the same as what someone could do as President. It is easy to argue that Gore, Kerry and HRC would have won if there were no voter suppression, tricky ballots, and a Republican echo chamber (far broader and more sinister than we thought).

With all three, we do not know what any of them actually being president would have been like. You never know the path not taken.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #142)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 04:00 PM

150. I hear ya... But last poll I saw had JB lagging behind

Desantis too. No, we don't know how all the moving pieces will play out! Gonna be a wild ride. Were you referring to a MA senate poll for Kerry? Cuz he was ahead in pre-election day polls and exits in 2004. National that is. Didn't realize Rs were bastardizing polls back in 2007

Agree tho... If we just throw out a guess, that the country is 50-50 it means 20% aren't behind it. Rough #s of course. These people may indeed vote D in the end ! But will they be enthusiastic and work? likely not... Probably what happened to HRC.

I think what bothers me the most about this poll is that if it's age concerns, he's not gonna get any younger. And if it's accomplishments, Like you said, it will be difficult to remedy given lane duck position. Here's hoping economy turns around.

Of course all bets are off if ex prez Dipshit I nominee. Actually that would really help JB!

We have strategists?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #112)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:21 AM

132. I don't believe polls . The midterm is my poll.

You never liked Biden. But consider the legislation he got passed. Not since Roosevelt have we seen a first term like Biden's.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #132)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 06:02 PM

155. Are you serious? Me and Lake Arenal were the very first Biden supporters

Last edited Sat Dec 24, 2022, 01:30 AM - Edit history (1)

who picked him immediately!! He is the perfect antithesis to Slimeball! But we are talking 2-6 years from now! Only prudent for an organization to analyze if they have the right person for the future!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #26)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:24 AM

135. Yeah no.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:01 PM

29. We didn't deserve her as President

and she won't run again.

All the people who trashed her during the election ignored the fact she is the smartest, most well-equipped person to do the job.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Wed Dec 21, 2022, 11:41 PM

62. Pretty sure we tried this - twice. Both times didn't go too well for her.

Though, the third time worked for Biden. So...

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Response to Beautiful Disaster (Reply #62)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:23 AM

68. Yup. Without our full support. But it's obvious that will

Never happen. So we will never know

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:08 AM

63. She would have been great. But here we are.

Iím with you in your fantasy.

But can you join me in reality?

In my reality Biden is way cool!!

Please join me.

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Response to Demanchor (Reply #63)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:26 AM

70. I guess. Of course I will support him if he's our nominee!

Of course!

Definitely not the issue. But whatever

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:14 AM

64. I think she's done.

Her own decision.

Of course Biden came out of retirement to help save American democracy so you never know.

The Democratic party has a wealth of talent. No matter who is next, Mrs. Clinton is a great asset.

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Response to KentuckyWoman (Reply #64)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:19 AM

66. Just curious. Who is the future wealth? In your opinion?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:31 AM

74. How about, No, because she doesn't want to run. Is that "RW"?



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Response to brooklynite (Reply #74)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:35 AM

76. How many politician play coy and say that? Like most all?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #76)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 09:21 AM

91. A few...along with all the candidates who DON'T want to.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 02:09 AM

86. I was on team HRC from the get go. Would have no problem picking that torch up again.

She is absolutely brilliant and we need someone like her. My only concern is that is a lightning rod to the right.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 02:41 AM

87. I'm convinced that the time was 2008

She would have been re-elected in 2012, followed by 8 years of Obama.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 08:13 AM

89. no she remains the perfect person to generate gop votes

they may dislike biden but they HATE hrc
2016 was years ago and they still hate her.

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Response to dembotoz (Reply #89)


Response to dembotoz (Reply #89)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 12:12 PM

100. They hated her when Bill was president. It only got worse. She was the best First Lady ever.

Limpballs and Newt were the ring leaders ginning up the hate.

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Response to dembotoz (Reply #89)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:32 AM

122. You may underestimate their hate? I have a Trumper

In my immediate family. They hate Biden with a passion. They will hate anyone we run. But good point ..politics 101..never run a candidate who starts below zero

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #122)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:43 AM

140. Do you ever wonder why Biden didn't pick her as his VP? She was certainly more qualified

and had a higher approval rating than VP Harris.

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Response to Autumn (Reply #140)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 05:54 PM

154. Age? Wanted to pair up with younger person? Thought

It might sure up the black vote? Thought prosecutorial skills would help given so many trump crimes? My guess.

As I remember, I think I was probably pushing for HRC as VP at the time. LOL.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 10:16 AM

93. While I understand your passion on this, it won't happen

Hillary Clinton now is a respected party elder and has the credibility of her history to speak out on issues and work through her foundation on things important to her. I could see a Democratic president appointing her to something that befits her interests and uses the talent she has.

To me, there is the same sense of what could have been with both Al Gore and John Kerry. Gore realistically probably won in 2000. After J6, his response to constant left wing cries that he should have fought harder after the SC ruled that there were no other things reasonable to do looks even more responsible, statesman like and honorable.

While nothing is the same as being president, both of these men have continued to contribute to the world and our country. This is the path HRC is on too.

As to the presidency, unless Biden develops health problems, he will be our nominee in 2024 and there is no reason to think he would drop Harris for HRC. HRC will nit challenge him. If Biden were to develop health problems, there are 2 situations. One, he steps down before 2024 and Harris is the sitting President. I doubt HRC would primary the new president. Two, he announces he is not running, which creates an open primary. I do not think HRC would run, but I think a party that just had an old president step down would reject anyone in their late 70s or older.

As wonderful as people like HRC, John Kerry and AL Gore are, they will not be President.

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Response to karynnj (Reply #93)


Response to Chin music (Reply #97)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:13 AM

116. One exception ! I am. I'm suggesting she be our nominee

In 2024! She, IMHO, is our best Dem. Know I am a minority of one Arguing birthdates crazy talk. People just don't plain like her is infinitely better than playing an age card!! I know, she's an acquired taste

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #116)


Response to Chin music (Reply #143)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 03:22 PM

148. Ya, it's not gonna happen. We can't turn the clock back

( like to 2016) As much as we'd like to sometime.

Think I just got nostalgic because I had just heard her being interviewed and she's effing brilliant and no one more infinitely qualified.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #148)


Response to Chin music (Reply #149)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 04:07 PM

152. Your 5:00 wish is my command Chin Music!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #152)


Response to karynnj (Reply #93)

Thu Dec 22, 2022, 04:22 PM

107. Not sure about him keeping Harris. He probably will

But approvals lower than his. Not dissing just a fact at this point.

Yes Gore probably won. But I think Kerry did too. He was ahead in pre-election FL polls by 2?. He was ahead in exit polls ( back when Drudge leaked them) and the kicker - same polls said people had made up their minds weeks ago. Then Bush "wins by a handful? Think it was like a miraculous 5-6 point swing that night.

Can't find video but I distinctly remember footage of bush family in a hotel. Bush was behind and jeb came in and told him not to worry, he'd call some I-4 people. Then the turnaround commenced

To this day still think Kerry won Florida.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #107)

Sat Dec 24, 2022, 12:19 PM

169. Dropping Harris would be bad optics, particularly to the most loyal part of the Democratic base.

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Response to marmar (Reply #169)

Sat Dec 24, 2022, 05:35 PM

170. Totally agree. Dropping her would have a VERY negative down side. nt

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 12:58 AM

113. 'Hillary Clinton was right all along' about Donald Trump: MSNBC's Mika

Hillary was right about everything


https://www.rawstory.com/trump-tax-returns-2658992916/

Donald Trump has been fighting the release of his tax returns since he first positioned himself as a presidential candidate, and MSNBC's Mika Brzezinski said their long-awaited disclosure proves he was always lying about them.

Trump claimed the returns couldn't be released during his 2016 campaign -- and throughout his presidency -- because they were under audit, but the House Ways and Means Committee concluded the IRS failed to audit his taxes, as required under a mandatory presidential program, for the first two years of his term and did not complete any of them.

"It proves that Hillary Clinton, was right all along," Brzezinski said. "Nancy Pelosi was right all along, Chuck Schumer was right all along. The Democrats were right all along. Reporting from the New York Times was right all along, Washington Post, too, was 100 percent correct all along. Donald Trump was not under audit. Donald Trump was lying. He was desperate to hide the truth from Americans."

"That truth, that far from being a shrewd businessman, he was, in fact, the biggest loser out of the 300 million Americans who filed their taxes with the IRS," she added. "The man lost more money than any other American, at a time when he was writing "The Art of the Deal," this was happening, and worse than that, the fact his own Treasury Department under the bumbling hands of Steve Mnuchin refused to audit the president after Trump got into the White House -- that's usually done. So that lie continued and continued and continued until last night."

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Response to LetMyPeopleVote (Reply #113)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:18 AM

118. In 2015! Long before impeachment

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Response to LetMyPeopleVote (Reply #113)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:20 AM

119. Ugh, all the face palms.

Media people literally couldn't say any teeny tiny rare positive thing about Hillary without prefacing it with negatives.

I'm annoyed by everyone now saying "Hillary was right about everything" as if it's a surprise. Then why the hell ... oh never mind, don't get me started. When I think of all the people who said they just didn't trust her, just didn't like her, emails, let alone the conspiracy theories and trusting liars who lied about her...

Better late than never, I guess.

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Response to betsuni (Reply #119)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:23 AM

120. I always wonder .. chicken and egg thing... What comes

First...lack of media support or lack of strong surrogates with an overwhelming positive support message? Is it that hard to plan a unified media blitz? Must be.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #120)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 07:15 AM

123. Hillary's approval ratings reached the high 60s when senator and SoS, 17 years most admired woman

in America, had strong Democratic "surrogates with an overwhelming positive support message" and endorsements.

In 2008 her approval rating didn't change with Democrats, in 2016 it decreased with potential Democratic voters and that wasn't because of Republican propaganda, which doesn't work on Democrats. Something new had to be created to convince left-leaning voters to hate Democrats, especially Hillary. It was never about policy. They made the election about a fictional Hillary. Liars said the Democratic Party wasn't progressive, would stop at nothing to thwart progressives, were the same as Republicans -- corporatists, neoliberals. Obviously this is the opposite of Republican propaganda. Republicans copied the populist "rigged" "corrupt" "immoral" "warmonger" "elite, establishment, has no economic policy, ignores the white working class" accusations to use against Hillary.

Luckily demonizing Democrats and Biden from a non-Republican direction didn't work in 2020, as in "I've got news for the Democratic establishment. They can't stop us" nonsense.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 08:10 AM

125. Well....if we're going to try nominating somebody that doesn't want to run...

....how about Al Gore?

Honorable Military service, 16 years in congress, 8 years as VP, 'robbed' of Presidency....and younger than Hillary Clinton.

Biden is our President. Harris is our VP. And I think if they both run in 2024, that's who we HAVE to get elected.

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Response to Captain Stern (Reply #125)


Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 11:23 AM

134. I would really like to see her and her to-do list in a big to-do position.

She'd be great. Doesn't have to be the presidency or VP. Though I'd certainly vote for her again if she stepped up.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:41 PM

145. She would have been a great president. I don't know that she's interested and I

can't blame her. To want to go through that nightmare again is hard to imagine.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 01:42 PM

146. No.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Fri Dec 23, 2022, 04:04 PM

151. What the fuck.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Sat Dec 24, 2022, 12:16 PM

168. It's not a "right-wing trap" to realize that ship has sailed.


We have plenty of great emerging candidates -- Buttigieg, Whitmer etc. Hillary has said unequivocally that she's no longer interested.


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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Sat Dec 24, 2022, 06:01 PM

171. That ship has sailed, sorry. We need to look forward.

Hillary would be 79 in 2026.

Absolutely not.

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