Rick Wilson pours cold water on DeSantis' future - RawStory

[GGoss]

Rick Wilson pours cold water on DeSantis' future - RawStory

One person who won't be there making their case before the assembled conservative activists is Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) who is ducking out on attending due to having other plans.

According to former GOP campaign consultant Rick Wilson, DeSantis' non-appearance at such a important stop for GOP hopefuls is a tip-off that he is not ready for prime time and, as he said on MSNBC on Sunday morning, he appears to be "running away like a scalded dog." Speaking with the Guardian's David Smith, Wilson went in-depth on the weaknesses of DeSantis' bid for national office -- who he claimed has the "charisma of a toaster oven.”

According to Wilson, the supporters of DeSantis are “Culture war weirdos who believe this whole ‘woke’ thing, which is a meaningful but not enormous part of the party. National Review writers who are desperate, desperate, desperate, desperate, desperate for anything other than Trump so they can say, ‘See, we’re past that. We can go back to normal.’"

He warned, "I have some bad news for them. Nobody’s ever inviting them back in the room in the Republican party of tomorrow, just as nobody’s ever inviting guys like me back in the room. It’s over. The party’s run by the mob, not by the intellectuals, and it’s never going to go back. Once a movement becomes a populist movement dominated by the grassroots of the base, it never goes back to being a thoughtful, intellectually driven movement.”

Link: https://www.rawstory.com/ron-desantis-2024-2659469816/

[Kaleva]

1. What is the reason people should listen to Rick Wilson?

[Ocelot II]

3. Same reason as listening to anyone else. He has an opinion,

which we may take something useful from, or not.

[paleotn]

8. Exactly.

[Kaleva]

14. So did Wilson pour cold water on DeSantis aspirations?

Or is that hyperbole?

[Ocelot II]

16. Sort of, but the cold water is RawStory's headline,

which is, as usual, hyperbolic, which is why I dislike RawStory. Wilson just points out that DeSatan has all the charisma of a toaster oven and the MAGA crowd is still in TFG's clutches.

[Kaleva]

19. Some believe TFG is a 3D chess player, a mastermind, anointed by God

How a person is in reality sometimes doesn't jive with how supporters may view him.

DeSantis may lack a personality but he is gaining on tfg and support for TFG appears to be slipping .

[Ocelot II]

28. I think at least some people who supported TFG are getting tired of him.

He still has a hard-core following, though. Whether DeSantis can pick up more of the MAGAts remains to be seen, since much of TFG's attraction to that crowd came from his brash, obnoxious, transgressive style. DeSantis is unlikely to inspire the same kind of cult following. The money people are more likely to support him, especially if TFG's popularity continues to slip.

However, my opinion is worth much less than Rick Wilson's; I am notoriously bad at predicting political outcomes. I thought Hillary had it in the bag in 2016.

[Kaleva]

38. I agree

[PJMcK]

4. He has an insider's view

He’s a creep but he’s really smart about politics.

It’s good insight.

[FakeNoose]

41. Yes plus he knows "the dirt" on a lot of those Repuke candidates

... and that's something he'll never tell the rest of us. When they started up The Lincoln Project 3 or 4 years ago, those guys shut the door on ever working for any Repuke candidates again. So that includes Rick Wilson, George Conway, Steve Schmidt (who is no longer with the group) plus others.

I think Wilson has integrity even though I don't agree with his politics. And I also agree that DeSantis won't win many votes outside of his home state. The one we should fear EVER becoming a candidate is that weasel Michael Flynn. I believe Flynn could be a real threat running for President, but I also hope he's disqualified.

[PortTack]

44. Nailed it!

[peggysue2]

53. Wilson is far better tuned to the GOP's internal machinations than we are

He spent over 30 years in the belly of the beast, worked campaigns and yes, even brutal tactics and ads to defeat Dems. He's the Republican cousin of a James Carville, someone steeped in the history and psyche of his former party. Is he always right? No. But IMHO, he has a keen eye and keener warning to all Americans:

Beware the MAGAt movement. These people are Nazis, period; they've taken over the Republican Party and there's no going back.

DeSantis is the choice of the Republican elite and many of the big donors. These are Republican money men who squirmed under Trump's crass performance but loved the aggressive tax give aways, the libertarian focus on deregulation and shrinking the government into nonexistence.

DeSantis is their guy. It remains to be seen if 'Meatball Ron' has the stamina or thick skin to work a national campaign or if he can catch fire with the grass roots. Wilson and his cohorts don't think so. DeSantis is a bully but without the flair, the talent for bizarre spectacle. And he's exceedingly thin-skinned. Wilson predicts that even if Ronnie were to take the nomination, Trump will spend the entire cycle tearing him to shreds and splitting the vote.

The topsy-turvey win in the Florida midterms was not because of DeSantis' extraordinary political acumen, according to Wilson. It was the result of the GOP's political machine in the state, something Wilson helped build from the ground up.

Whether you like the guy or not, Wilson possesses a clear, unblinking vision of who and what we're fighting.

That's why I give him a listen.

[sheshe2]

57. +1

[Hekate]

58. So spot on, Peggysue2

[GGoss]

60. What You Said... + A Billion !!!

[Bernardo de La Paz]

18. His knowledgeable thoughtful opinions are powerful antidotes to rumpism and DeSatanism. . . nt

[Kaleva]

21. My guess is that the only people who listen to Wilson are those who don't vote R

[Bernardo de La Paz]

27. Could be, but there are many Republicans disgusted with the Reds

However, they too have been subverted by Shiny Object Distractions like abortion, drag queen story hour, and the Laffer Curve (trickle down) and think Democrats are slightly less worse than the rump and definitely worse than the Scotts and the DesAntics.

[Ocelot II]

2. Direct link to the original article here:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/feb/26/cpac-2023-washington-republican-presidential-primary-trump-haley-desantis

There's much more here than the interview with Wilson, and you can avoid RawStory's clickbait.

[ornotna]

12. Thank you n/t

[reACTIONary]

42. Thanks! nt

[bucolic_frolic]

5. That's the truth as he sees it, but i must point out

The criticism of a grassroots populist movement could be leveled at the Democratic Party a few times, notably 1932 and 1968-1970s. We seem to have survived just fine. I can't judge how much intellectual heft we had at the helm of the time, but the anti-war movement was a big one.

This MAGA cult is now a revolution. It won't back down. Revolutions always change societies and politics, often until they get their way in some form. I reference Brinton's "Anatomy of Revolution" here. WHy Rick Wilson hunkers down into party politics I have no idea. To me he seems to not consider other explanations.

[jaxexpat]

17. Rick, like so many Republicans, is a plodder.

The traditional Republican is a passbook savings version of political investment. They survive by mindlessly supporting "the system", timid and predictably reactionary to any sort of change, even reform. His type is predictably anti-Trump because Trump was an abandonment of "the system" and his supporters were too coarse for his taste.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

24. What the revolution will achieve is what it has in common with Sandersism and Krugmanism

Senator Sanders and Paul Krugman (economist).

1932 and 1968 were rooted in real problems with real solutions (jobs, Social Security, & exit Vietnam).

Gingrich's Contract On America, Bush's invasion of Iraq, and the rump's stolen Supreme Court were rooted in fake problems and didn't provide any real solutions.

What will change are the unsustainable wealth and income inequalities.

However, the populists among the reds have been subverted to rail against big tech and the media and the FBI/CIA/NSA alphabets. So for the moment, the angst that hard working red voters experience working in the middle class and not getting far has been put on hold. Same angst experienced by hard working blue voters in the middle class who aren't getting far.

[Martin Eden]

59. Is today's Rethug party really dominated by a "grassroots" movement?

Just like the tea party that quickly sprouted when Obama was elected, it's astroturf.

Sure, the rubes who vote for Trump and DeSantis and other peddlers of snake oil really do believe the poison they've been fed, but ultimately this "movement" is dominated by the big money interests that own the rightwing media and politicians who manipulate the rubes into voting against their own interests.

Take away the money that funds the rightwing noise machine (pays Tucker Carlson's salary and the campaigns of the "freedom caucus&quot and see what happens.

Of course, that's not going to happen anytime soon if ever. The question is whether the big money interests have created a "populist" monster they can't control, and if ultimately a party built on a putrid swamp of lies and grievance will sink in its own fetid muck.

Because, as was noted, previous populist movements had legitimate complaints about social and economic justice -- not lies about a stolen election and appeals to racial/religious/gender bigotry.

[2naSalit]

6. Well...

It may be over but they don't seem to know it yet.

[3Hotdogs]

7. "The party's run by the mob, not by the intellectuals." So let's look at those "intellectuals."

Last edited Sun Feb 26, 2023, 12:17 PM - Edit history (1)

Have they given us anything except adherence to a failed economic theory called 'trickle down? Or explanations on how less regulation will bring prosperity when it is not leading to disasters like Palestine?


What intellectuals?

[Ocelot II]

11. I think the distinction is between at least trying to come up with

a rational argument, even a bad one, and just throwing poo at the walls like a zoo monkey. In that regard some GOPers could be said to have once belonged to the "intellectual" branch because they could articulate reasons, however weak, for their positions. Now the GOP doesn't even try - they're just a bunch of screeching trolls whose sole reason for being is to own the libs.

[paleotn]

15. LBJ had to enlist their help to pass the Civil Rights Act....

when southern Dems wouldn't go along. Southern Dems like Sen. Albert Gore, Sr., Al Gore's father, who was dead set against any civil rights legislation.

As for failed economic theories, it was all marvelous success for the rich and was never intended to help the not rich. Hard to believe people still buy the bullshit. That's the intelligence of it. Intelligence used for evil, but intelligence none the less.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

25. The intellectuals who built the interstates and the EPA and accomodated Red China

It got all subverted by the Southern Strategy and the Laffer Curve and the abortion fight.

[3Hotdogs]

43. Interstate was proposed by Ike who saw the Autobahn as military genius and wanted one for U.S.

Last edited Mon Feb 27, 2023, 12:35 AM - Edit history (1)

It turned out to be a good idea. I drive on one part of it every day. It did improve the economy.

EPA? It was a response to Rachel Carson, and environmental concerns brought on by subsequent authors in the late 60's. Nixon signed it but called it a program generated by "ass clowns."

[Bernardo de La Paz]

46. Ike and Nixon were Republicans. . . . nt

[3Hotdogs]

48. Yes. But the programs were based on military and political expedience.

Not any conservative intellectual thesis.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

54. Ah, now I get your drift. You were focusing on the one half of the term and I on other half. Thx

[rubbersole]

9. "a thoughtful, intellectually driven movement."

Now, that's funny. Maybe when Lincoln was President. It's been the 'tax cuts for uber-wealthy white men' party for over 40 years.

[OMGWTF]

49. I think that the last honest Republican president was Eisenhower.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

62. Lincoln could think in terms of military expedience. The Emancipation Proclamation ..

... proclaimed that enslaved people were free, if they were slaves in Confederate states. Otherwise, no such luck.

Thoughtful? Intellectual?

[dalton99a]

10. Trump cult members will not drive 2 hours to see DeSantis - unless there is a lynching

or a free Lee Greenwood concert

[rubbersole]

52. Or maybe lynching Lee Greenwood 🤔...

Figuratively.

[C_U_L8R]

13. Even Mike Pence has more charisma

[jaxexpat]

26. Noe there's a WWE elimination event the world longs to see.

Maudlin Mike Pence vs Dirty Ron DeSantis

Winner gets to take on the Confederate Indian from S. Carolina, none other than "UN-Dip" Nikki Haley. (AKA: Say-Anything Haley)

It's destined to be an historic prime time drama, a grudge match to claim the eternally coveted, new neo-Republican brand, the "Trust Us, We're Not Trump Anymore, Really We're Not" championship belt.

[paleotn]

20. I sometimes wonder, which is more dangerous.....

The evil yet thoughtful Republican Party of old? Guys like Wilson, Lee Atwater, Bill Buckley and Karl Rove. Or the intellectually stunted cons and grifters like Trump, McCarthy, DeSantas or Gym Jordan? At least some of the old, thoughtful guys have some scruples when it comes to things like...you know...democracy. We may be far less than friends, but we do have common cause with them in that.

But never, ever forget, they're the ones who created the Trump, McCarthy, DeSantas, MTG monster in the first place. They're the unwitting authors of Jan 6.

Mary Shelley's Frankenstein analogy fits very well.

[CrispyQ]

23. +1

They've been courting the racists, zealots, & loons for decades so why are they surprised when those same people elect folks like Trump, McCarthy, DeSantas, & MTG?

[paleotn]

29. Yep. They played with fire, got burned and kicked out of their own party.

[dlk]

31. They've lost control of the monster they created

Their cynicism in legitimizing the radicals and extremists has cost all of us.

[hatrack]

55. The Old Big Lie is that Buckley and his ilk exorcised the John Birchers and crazies back in the day

The unfortunate truth is that the greed and emptiness never went away.

"Traditional" or "respectable" Republicans simply taught that faction of American conservatism to use finger bowls and napkins, until "traditional" Republican politics eventually stopped working in a world that changed. And it changed - largely for the worse - because Republican policies changed it.

The nihilistic rot was always there. It's just that the intellectual wallpaper that covered it up for a few decades has all peeled away.

[CrispyQ]

22. Didn't DeSantis beat out Trump in a recent poll in CA?

DeSantis will "out mean" even Trump. Plus he's in a position to actually be mean to people, like bussing immigrants around the country, & not just blow a bunch of hot air like Trump. I predict, at some point, Trump will realize two things: 1) He'll need to be on DeSantis' good side for a pardon, & 2) if he endorses DeSantis he can get in on the campaign funding grift.

[PortTack]

47. I see it the other way round. Tfg is already busy burying desatan and it's only going to get worse

If tfg loses the primary and does not form a 3rd party, he will tell his loyal cultists not to vote for him, or just stay home…and they will

As far as tfg seeing he might need desatan, he still believes he gonna skate.

[CrispyQ]

50. Oh, your crystal ball is as valid as mine!

I could see it going your way, for sure, he's such a mean, vengeful prick. He's going to struggle between greed or pride, IMO the two worst of the seven deadly sins.

It pains me to say it, but I think he's gonna skate too.

[JT45242]

30. Partially wrong, not grass roots, astroturf

This message comes from billionaires to stoke the bumpkins and yokels. There is no grass roots movement

[dlk]

33. Many were horrified by the social change of the '60's

And have been actively working to dismantle civil rights, women’s rights, environmental rights, and so forth ever since; dismantling our democracy piece-by-piece. Their successors continue the work.

[jcgoldie]

64. And Rick Wilson was a part of that

...until he wasn't. This intellectual vs populist dichotomy he's pushing to try to cleanse his image is nonsense.

[dlk]

66. He damaged Dem candidates in truly awful ways

Wilson understands Republicans, though, and now isn’t afraid to be straightforward about them.

[Kid Berwyn]

32. Lev Parnas adores Ron DeSantis.

Indicted Giuliani associate joined DeSantis on last-minute campaign swing

By GARY FINEOUT
Politico, 10/21/2019 04:30 PM EDT
Updated: 10/21/2019 06:21 PM EDT

TALLAHASSEE — Lev Parnas, a Ukrainian American businessman accused of funneling foreign money into U.S. elections, attended a string of events with Ron DeSantis in the closing moments of the Republican candidate’s 2018 campaign for governor in Florida.

In a photograph taken Nov. 4, two days before the election that propelled DeSantis to victory, Parnas is next to the smiling candidate at a campaign rally in South Daytona. Former Florida Attorney General Pam Bondi is standing nearby in the shot, which was published by Getty Images.

Continues…

https://www.politico.com/states/florida/story/2019/10/21/indicted-giuliani-associate-joined-desantis-on-last-minute-campaign-swing-1225738

Not like Putin would help DeSantis NAZIfy Florida or anything.

[JI7]

35. DeSantis and his wife look like Siblings

[Kid Berwyn]

37. Old married couples reflect each other's expressions a lot.

Maybe as a result their faces get lined the same.

Otherwise, she musta been surprised after the honeymoon.

[dlk]

36. Dark money in politics creates nasty bedfellows

It wouldn’t be surprising to learn how deeply Putin has infiltrated and infected the Republican Party. We might be surprised, though, by how long this has been happening.

[Kid Berwyn]

39. FBI guy charged to stop it turned out to be on Putin's payroll.

Did the FBI’s Charles McGonigal Help Throw the 2016 Election to Trump?

The shocking indictments against the former head of counterintelligence for the FBI in New York raise many dark questions.

By Craig Unger
The National Review, February 1, 2023

In the course of writing two books on Donald Trump’s ties to Russia, the same question occurred to me again and again: How is it possible that I knew all sorts of stuff about Donald Trump, and the FBI didn’t seem to have a clue? Or if they did, why weren’t they doing anything with it?

Specifically, I knew that:

* Starting in 1980, an alleged “spotter agent” for the KGB began cultivating Trump as a new asset for Soviet intelligence.

* The Russian mafia laundered millions of dollars through Donald Trump’s real estate by purchasing condos in all-cash transactions through anonymous corporations that did not disclose real ownership.

* Trump Tower was a home away from home for Vyacheslav Ivankov, one of the most brutal leaders of the Russian mafia, and at least 13 people with known or alleged links to the mafia held the deeds to, lived in, or ran alleged criminal operations out of Trump Tower in New York or other Trump properties.

* Trump was some $4 billion in debt when the Russians came to bail him out via the Bayrock Group, a real estate firm that was largely staffed, owned, and financed by Soviet émigrés who had ties to Russian intelligence and/or organized crime.

Much of my material came from FBI documents. A lot came from open-source databases. It made no sense. There was an astounding amount of data on the public record. The FBI had launched enormous investigations of the Russian mafia in the 1980s. They had staked out a New York electronics store that was a haven for KGB officers. They knew that’s where the Trump Organization bought hundreds of TV sets. They had their eyes on Ivankov and other Russian mobsters who were denizens of Trump’s casinos and bought and sold his condos through shell companies. They had to know that Trump laundered money for and provided a base of operations for the Russian mafia, which was, after all, a de facto state actor tied to Russian intelligence. They had to know that the Russians repeatedly bailed Trump out when he was bankrupt. They had to know that Russia owned him.

Snip…

As FBI director, Freeh had warned that Russian organized crime posed a grave threat to the United States that far transcended mere criminality. It is not clear how much he was paid by Prevezon after he switched sides, but Freeh later bought a $9.38 million mansion in Palm Beach, Florida, just a 10-minute drive from Trump’s Mar-a-Lago.

Then there was the late James Kallstrom, who ran the FBI’s New York office in the mid-’90s and oversaw successful investigations into both the Italian Mafia and later the Russian mob. Kallstrom had developed close friendships with two key players in the Trump-Russia saga. He worked closely with then–U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York Rudy Giuliani in the investigation of the Cosa Nostra network that led to the famed Mafia Commission Trial of 1985–1986. Going even further back, Kallstrom had also been friends with Donald Trump since around 1973, when Kallstrom was putting together a Trump-funded parade in New York to honor Vietnam veterans.

Continues…

https://newrepublic.com/article/170328/charles-mcgonigal-throw-2016-election

[dlk]

40. "American Kompromat" is on my list to read

Unfortunately, in politics, as in life, too many people can be bought. Anyone who hasn’t figured out Trump has deep mob ties, isn’t paying attention.

[PortTack]

45. lev Parnas is currently doing jail time. He will not be an influencer in the '24 election

[Kid Berwyn]

51. Great. What do you think of Parnas' support for DeSantis?

Seems to me, personally, so Putin.

[JI7]

34. It's not just that he lacks charisma but that he comes off as miserable

all the time. He is like someone nobody wants to be around becsuse they just come off negative and brings everything down. And people will just feel like they are annoying him.

Pence and Romney also have no charisma but they don't come off as miserable .

This is the reason I keep thinking DeSantis could not win in the Primary even without Trump.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

56. DeathSantis is not ready for prime time

Link to tweet

[Renew Deal]

61. DeSantis is very stage managed

And I’m guessing he thinks he doesn’t need this

[jcgoldie]

63. Yeah Sure Rick...

The GOP was such a "thoughtful intellectually driven movement" before the populist MAGAs got ahold of it. You thoughtful intellectual fuckers have been sowing the seeds of this bullshit back to Reagan, you are just mad because the Trump fuckers today say all the racist misogynistic anti-gay xenophobic and stupid culture war shit out loud.

[quaker bill]

65. I think he is correct in general terms

DeSantis can fire up the misanthropes and does so regularly. They are nasty and hateful and get film at 11:00 over and over, remember 'if it bleeds it leads'. All that said, there is not enough of them to win a national election, and they actively drive away anyone even vaguely more moderate.

I don't think DeSantis even gets to the GOP nomination this way. But if perchance he does, it will only push more folks to the blue side. The majority of us are not taken with the culture war, even those who might think highly of tax cuts and deregulation. They are and will remain uncomfortable in the company of overt racists and homophobes. They might not be as uncomfortable as I am, but all I need is that they not vote for them.

DeSantis has saddled the wrong horse.