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CDC goes door to door in East Palestine, neighbors want more done - WKBN2715 Hours Ago (AOP)
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Diamond_Dog
(40,520 posts)There’s a clinic set up at a church in the town for health issues.
Various agencies are monitoring air, soil, and water.
Free water and cleaning supplies are there for the taking and NS will give you $1000 for an inconvenience fee if you want it. And Sherrod Brown has encouraged people to take the money and has assured everyone there are no strings attached to taking it.
Cleanup of the wreckage is ongoing.
I can’t pretend to understand everything they are going through but it does not seem like anyone is being forgotten.
2naSalit
(102,663 posts)To be able to leave but they can't afford to so they want FEMA to put them up. I tend to agree with them on that. The town should be evacuated and people return only after all the cleanup. Honestly how hard is that to figure out for government officials? It's what they would demand if it were them.
TheRealNorth
(9,647 posts)That Biden is putting Republicans into FEMA camps. 
2naSalit
(102,663 posts)They will but, fuck 'em.
RobinA
(10,478 posts)those people who want FEMA to put them up until everything is cleaned up are the same three families in town who didn't vote for Trump and whatever MAGATs were running for local office. Damn libtards, always wanting a government handout. 
Oh wait...
Yeah, I've been to East Palestine and environs. Cute little town. Solid red. Government help for me but not for thee.
Happy Hoosier
(9,531 posts)The party that guts regulation and has done everything it can to detroy the EPA.
I have limited sympathy.
Though, from listening to a town hall and watching a quick interview with Ms. Brockovich, I think what they really want is to be evacuated until it's for sure safe to be there. I would agree with the residents on that. Since it's a poor community, nobody can afford alternate housing for however long that takes. So they seem to want FEMA to help them go elsewhere because they are living paycheck to paycheck and there is no housing anywhere.
If this had happened in a more upscale area, everybody would have been evacuated until it deemed safe to return. Nobody is confirming anything so why are these people being forced to remain in place? WTF?
GGoss
(1,273 posts)Ain't no train tracks runnin through Beverly Hills, or Martha's Vineyard, or...
They aren't big donors and the RR wrote them off a long time ago.
MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)Having personally escaped the nearly intractable grasp of the Abrahamic blood cults, I understand what it's like to be beat to hell, then lifted out, and odd to say, both times by doubt.
It is not until they embrace doubt that they may even begin to embrace reason.
It is virtually impossible to reason with delusion because of that very fact.
When someone rejects doubt, they reject reason.
For their is no reason without doubt.
May reason rule.
Happy Hoosier
(9,531 posts)it's that if it were someone else, they wouldn't give a shit.
They vote for people who deregulate industries and dismantle public services that they now feel entitled to.
It pisses me off.
2naSalit
(102,663 posts)I'm not going to argue with you over that point because I do agree with you there. But I live in a more liberal area of a red state yet, if that happened along the local rail line, I would want that sort of relief regardless of politics, something that can be addressed after the emergency is dealt with.
MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)2020 Presidential Election results for Ohio
3,154,834 Republicans for Trump
2,679,165 Democrats against Trump
Happy Hoosier
(9,531 posts)0008 E PALESTINE VILL 1-A 158 0 8 406 0
0009 E PALESTINE VILL 2-A 122 0 7 329 1
0010 E PALESTINE VILL 3-A 151 1 11 357 3
0011 E PALESTINE VILL 4-A 210 1 12 455 2
The first column of numbers is Biden. The Fourth is Trump.
Biden: 641
Trump: 1547
Discounting other candidates, that:
Trump: 70%
Biden: 29%
Now, I certainly have sympathy for the 29% who don't have their heads up their asses. But this is the word 70% of them voted for.
doc03
(39,075 posts)rest of the state is Kentucy or West Virginia.
we can do it
(13,024 posts)MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)The 70% all have children. It's not the children's fault.
I have tremendous empathy for all of these victims of Y'all Qaeda Nat-C Fascists.
This is wholesale environmental destruction that ultimately impacts the entire nation. Agruiculture all along the Mississippi is impacted in ways that will unfold as debilitating harm for our nation's populace.
While I understand your sentiment, I see a much larger problem than the 70% of registered Palestine Nat-C Fascists.
This is a national tragedy still unfolding.
May reason rule, where delusion dwells.
Happy Hoosier
(9,531 posts)I'm not saying don't help. OF COURSE, we help. It's the right thing to do. But I have no inidividual sympathy for these hypocrites. This is what they voted for. They WANT to deregulate. The WANT to detroy the EPA... until THEY need it.
They're thoughless assholes.
That doesn't mean we don't help. We do. And we remind them of this tragedy as we try to make sure this doesn;t happen again. I have ZERO hope they'll actually change what support on the ballot. They're special. It matters when it happens to THEM.
Deminpenn
(17,481 posts)A picture of these folks should appear beside the word "hypocrit" in the dictionary.
They generally hate government, taxes, regulation, but now that something bad happened to them, they want everything to which they feel entitled and then some.
Was out that way yesterday. All the dirt containing hazmats is being dug up and transported someplace else. Think the residents of East Palestine care where or what the impacts of whatever hazmat landfill the dirt is going to is on that community or the environment? Not a chance.
MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)we can do it
(13,024 posts)MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)...as is everything along the Mississippi watershed, including all agricultural products produced within that region.
This affects the entire nation.
While I'm a huge fan of Darwin and his awards, I'm not for punishing the helpless, nor am I in favor of withholding aid to our enemies.
That's what Nat-C' Fascists purvey; crimes against humanity.
we can do it
(13,024 posts)MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)Thank you for the reply.
Might you elaborate further?
Thanks again...
we can do it
(13,024 posts)MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)doc03
(39,075 posts)miles from East Palistine Ohio. The RR sevices a natural gas processing facility. Every time I have
ever rode the trail I see a train transporting LNG tankers. Yesterday instead was a vehicle traveling
on the tracks labeled Ultrasonic Rail Flaw Detector. I am not sure what rail company
it is, anyway it appears they are thinking about safety now.
Diamond_Dog
(40,520 posts)Deminpenn
(17,481 posts)but RRs have some inherent dangers that simply can't always be mitigated.
MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)Deminpenn
(17,481 posts)was linked on another DU thread.
The safety systems worked as designed, but the bearing failed outside of the assumption that it would fail with enough notice to stop the train before a derailment. The train passed 3 hot boxes. The temp registered 38 deg above ambient air temperature, then 103 above, then 253 above which was a critical temp. The first two temp readings were within acceptable limits then next reading was an above critical temp. The bearing gave no warning it was about to fail before it did. That absolutely could not have been anticipated.
NTSB will examine the bearing and axle along with the hot boxes and tracks. It's entirely possible the bearing or axle had an undetectable manufacturing flaw that caused it to fail.
Concluding that the derailment was "entirely avoidable" isn't currently justified.
MayReasonRule
(4,099 posts)
Deminpenn
(17,481 posts)There are still a lot of questions to be answered about the bearing/wheel/axel. From my experience managing aircraft engine spare parts, parts made from forgings can fail due to an inherent flaw in the forging itself unrelated to the actual manufacturing process. But you don't know that until the part fails, then it's 20/20 hindsight.
This train passed 3 hot boxes in travelling 30 miles. The bearing/wheel/axel completely bypassed the temp criteria of 170-200 where the train would have been stopped and the car inspected. It went right from essentially fine to failing. That the temp criteria exists tells me this is based on the experience of how these parts fail and how long that takes - that it's a more gradual process than what happened.
I'm sure there'll be some safety recommendations like replacing aluminum pressure relief valve covers with steel ones. Possibly there'll be a recommendation to recalibrate the hot boxes. But my guess is the ultimate culprit will be a poorly maintained (by GTX) and inspected tanker car (by GTX).
doc03
(39,075 posts)RR. Over those 40 years we had well over a dozen fatalities in the plant and most of
them were from the RR department. It's a very dangerous job.
That is surprising to me - thanks for the first-hand account.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)transport of dangerous materials by rail.
We're seeing acted out the dangerous ignorance bred by pernicious manipulators that promotes an alternative-reality world in which truth and untruth are interchangeable, intuitive feelings are more valid than information, anti-science is true, government is corrupt and out to get us, and scientists and experts are sent by the government to lie to us.
Add to that the encouragement of as many as possible to blame everything that happens to them on an uber-powerful "they" out to victimize them, and of course the seditious media that work 24/7 to fuel all this grievance and set it ablaze.
And you have the bewildered, resentful, helpless people most media are showcasing -- incompetent to care for themselves because they're unable to make anything close to sense of an incomprehensible, thus scary, world. What's good, and rather heart wrenching, is that most would want to do better if they weren't encouraged to believe this is it for them.
The large majority of adults (EVEN in East Palestine) do think and do for themselves, but they don't fit the victimization theme. Competent adults whose evaluations pretty much reflect reality are also strikingly lacking in most of the media coverage copied here. Even though they're the majority.
Of course ALL of this furthers the aims of those seeking to take over our nation. Our founding fathers knew an informed and involved people is critical to the success of democracy. Wannabe RW dictators all know it too.
ProfessorGAC
(76,643 posts)...is than over-the-road transport of hazardous goods is even higher risk than rail.
Not just more accidents & spills, but greater total volume.
Because of that DOT &/or EPA banned or severely restricted OTR transport of several dangerous items of commerce. (Sulfur trioxide & ethylene oxide are prominent examples.)
So, rail is a risk but that risk is lower than OTR alternatives.
Pipelines would be better, except: we have pipeline releases now, and if we have more pipelines the chance of such releases go up.
It's a tough situation either way.
I'd prefer staying with rail, but quit deregulation, limit consolidation & quit cutting inspection budgets. And, when violations are found, bring the hammer down.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)I've been waiting for a far worse accident than this to wake people up to the danger. Hundreds severely injured and dead, homes uninhabitable is far from impossible.
But a population trained to be ignorant and passive and in the end accepting of their role as (real) victims is just what the anti-regulation, anti-tax scoundrels need.
ProfessorGAC
(76,643 posts)A wholly unregulated environment, limited inspections, safety staff with no certifications, idiots running critical functions due to nepotism & bribes....
At least 4,000 people died. More than likely a much higher number than that.
It shouldn't take that to get people's attention.
The high level (in air) of acrolein, xylenes, toluene, & benzene seems mechanistically unrelated to this spill. That suggests to me that the area was already a toxic swamp and we never would have known if Nit for a compounding event.
There are a lot of environmentally tenuous areas in Ohio.
But, they should keep voting R, because business something, something.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)polluted states in the nation. I was reading that dozens of sites are on the EPA's priorities list.
Well, hope they don't belatedly determine there are any long-lived additions for people living in that very pretty area to worry about, including the hapless specimens who've been cherrypicked to push the theme.
Today the governor announced the evacuation area safe for those who'd left to return. If I lived there, I'd like knowing that at least the month of investigations hasn't identified any new nearby priorities sites either.
moondust
(21,284 posts)is home testing kits for water, soil, and maybe even air, though I haven't heard of anybody working on that.
ProfessorGAC
(76,643 posts)Air monitoring requires specialized sampling equipment & the level oconcern of most chemicals is too low a number to make simple colorimetric tests almost useless.
Gas chromatography, mass spectroscopy, high resolution Infrared, etc. are typically used for analysis. Those require a reasonably high level of user expertise. I
If the level is so high that they could use a simple bench test to accurately quantitate, they'd already be perilously high & one could probably smell the contaminant.
It's a nice idea, but not practical when we're talking low levels of organic compounds.
Too bad.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)No doubt they're being reviewed by various experts with various questions in mind.
moondust
(21,284 posts)Even a very basic home test that could be done 5 times a day could help relieve some anxiety if, upon receiving a positive reading, residents could then call the professionals for an advanced test.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)I had an anxiety attack once, and it was dreadful.
If a basic, affordable test that could provide even a little realistically reliable information for a chemical of concern were available, it might make a good alternative to asking a physician if an anxiolytic should be prescribed.
Reliable information worked for me in 2020 when we believed my worsening breathing problems and chest pain were Covid. Before we left for the hospital I looked up the mortality stats for my age group. I knew my chances were at least statistically good in spite of an autoimmune disorder, but just confirming the general picture I had once again with reliable professional data was very soothing.
However, anxiety or trust issues didn't prevent me from being able to accept the public data available by that time.
In this case, I suspect ProfessorGAC knows what he's talking about (and how nice to have input from a retired scientist).
Emile
(42,205 posts)what more could they need?
Renew Deal
(85,102 posts)Buy their homes if they have to. Help them move. Provide any resource reasonably possible.
Emile
(42,205 posts)we all know he doesn't pay his bills.