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Old Crank

(7,029 posts)
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 06:29 AM Apr 2023

Can Clarence Thomas be charged with tax evasion?

Not just ethics violation but getting something of value and not reporting it. There are tax consequences for gifts and I think the value is very low before they have to be reported to the IRS.
It is also my understanding that if you make mistakes on your taxes there is a 7 year statute of limitations. That doesn't apply for knowingly violating the law. So the IRS could go back 20 years.

39 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Can Clarence Thomas be charged with tax evasion? (Original Post) Old Crank Apr 2023 OP
I hope so! 2naSalit Apr 2023 #1
The Giver pays the taxes NOT the receiver Farmer-Rick Apr 2023 #17
The IRS on gifts and taxation bucolic_frolic Apr 2023 #2
On bribes markodochartaigh Apr 2023 #15
The IRS will charge Clarence with tax evasion gab13by13 Apr 2023 #3
Are you suggesting gifts are taxable to the recipient? onenote Apr 2023 #12
Oh, thank god Farmer-Rick Apr 2023 #19
I've read the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) has the authority to conduct a criminal investigation ancianita Apr 2023 #18
Gifts up to $16000/yr aren't taxable and donor is responsible for gift taxes under IRS rules wishstar Apr 2023 #4
Also - gifts aren't valued at what they would cost to purchase FBaggins Apr 2023 #7
Gift taxes are paid by the giver, not the recipient FBaggins Apr 2023 #5
Yea. I look at this as bluestarone Apr 2023 #26
Absolutely. RocRizzo55 Apr 2023 #6
And like everyone else, he's not responsible for taxes on gifts he receives. onenote Apr 2023 #11
Up to $16,000 Mysterian Apr 2023 #13
after $16,000 the gift giver pays the tax. There is also a lifetime limit Hamlette Apr 2023 #22
Ooops! My bad Mysterian Apr 2023 #28
Gifts ARE non-income, by definition. Ms. Toad Apr 2023 #33
Right Zeitghost Apr 2023 #34
Right Mysterian Apr 2023 #38
No, my statement is correct. Yours is incorrect. onenote Apr 2023 #25
You're right! Mysterian Apr 2023 #27
I was answering the OP. RocRizzo55 Apr 2023 #14
26 USC 4941 Whatever Whatever Apr 2023 #32
Welcome to DU! KS Toronado Apr 2023 #37
welcome to DU gopiscrap May 2023 #39
Nope. progressoid Apr 2023 #8
There usually is when someone has shady ethics dlk Apr 2023 #9
Which is another reason the republicans are fighting the increase of IRS agents The Jungle 1 Apr 2023 #10
Yup, but if you fail to catch one of their Farmer-Rick Apr 2023 #20
Well what about Ginny's $600k that someone gave her and she dispersed to Proud Boys and used flying_wahini Apr 2023 #16
Yeah, that sounds more like an exchange for services Farmer-Rick Apr 2023 #21
under your theory, if my friend invites me to her house for dinner I'd owe taxes? Hamlette Apr 2023 #23
Clarence Thomas, face a legal penalty? PERISH THE THOUGHT! Paladin Apr 2023 #24
I will not be holding my breath... Chainfire Apr 2023 #29
Not a "gift" but payment for services rendererd. Chainfire Apr 2023 #30
So Thomas wasn't paid for something he did? LiberalFighter Apr 2023 #31
Why no JanLip Apr 2023 #35
This should be a question with a yes or no answer. elocs Apr 2023 #36

Farmer-Rick

(12,635 posts)
17. The Giver pays the taxes NOT the receiver
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:23 AM
Apr 2023

From the link below:

The donor is generally responsible for paying the gift tax. Under special arrangements the donee may agree to pay the tax instead.

markodochartaigh

(5,532 posts)
15. On bribes
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 08:54 AM
Apr 2023
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/162



LII U.S. Code Title 26 Subtitle A CHAPTER 1 Subchapter B PART VI § 162
Quick search by citation:
Title
enter title
Section
section
26 U.S. Code § 162 - Trade or business expenses
U.S. Code
Notes


(c)Illegal bribes, kickbacks, and other payments
(1)Illegal payments to government officials or employees
No deduction shall be allowed under subsection (a) for any payment made, directly or indirectly, to an official or employee of any government, or of any agency or instrumentality of any government, if the payment constitutes an illegal bribe or kickback or, if the payment is to an official or employee of a foreign government, the payment is unlawful under the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act of 1977. The burden of proof in respect of the issue, for the purposes of this paragraph, as to whether a payment constitutes an illegal bribe or kickback (or is unlawful under the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act of 1977) shall be upon the Secretary to the same extent as he bears the burden of proof under section 7454 (concerning the burden of proof when the issue relates to fraud)

Farmer-Rick

(12,635 posts)
19. Oh, thank god
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:25 AM
Apr 2023

Someone else who sees the flaw in the reasoning of making a receiver of a gift pay taxes on it.

ancianita

(43,303 posts)
18. I've read the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) has the authority to conduct a criminal investigation
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:24 AM
Apr 2023

and refer the case to the Department of Justice (DOJ) Criminal Tax Division for prosecution.

wishstar

(5,828 posts)
4. Gifts up to $16000/yr aren't taxable and donor is responsible for gift taxes under IRS rules
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 07:12 AM
Apr 2023

$16000 was the 2022 limit, was $15000 in earlier years. The donor could face consequences for not reporting gifts worth more than the tax exempt amount but seems likely that this donor limited what he considered the value of the yearly gifts to the exempt amount.

FBaggins

(28,705 posts)
7. Also - gifts aren't valued at what they would cost to purchase
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 07:31 AM
Apr 2023

A transatlantic flight on a private jet would vastly exceed any gift limits...

... but if you own a private jet and plan to fly to Milan anyway?... it doesn't really cost you anything to take a friend with you. That friend could never afford to stay at a villa in the mountains... but if you own one, the additional expense to let someone stay with you is not going to be reportable.

FBaggins

(28,705 posts)
5. Gift taxes are paid by the giver, not the recipient
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 07:19 AM
Apr 2023

Congress just passed a law requiring reporting of some of what was recently reported, which implies that there was no such (formal) ethical requirement at the time.

bluestarone

(22,124 posts)
26. Yea. I look at this as
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 10:06 AM
Apr 2023

Hey go ahead and lie cheat or whatever, because THIS rule covers their ass!! How much more BLATANT can it be?

onenote

(46,135 posts)
11. And like everyone else, he's not responsible for taxes on gifts he receives.
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 08:40 AM
Apr 2023

So absolutely not?

Mysterian

(6,458 posts)
13. Up to $16,000
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 08:47 AM
Apr 2023

So, your absolute statement, "he's not responsible for taxes on gifts he receives," is incorrect.

Hamlette

(15,556 posts)
22. after $16,000 the gift giver pays the tax. There is also a lifetime limit
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:33 AM
Apr 2023

I don't remember the amount but it is half a million or more.

Mysterian

(6,458 posts)
28. Ooops! My bad
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 10:16 AM
Apr 2023

It seems like this is a rule that is rife for abuse, i.e., classifying gifts as non-income.

Ms. Toad

(38,602 posts)
33. Gifts ARE non-income, by definition.
Wed Apr 12, 2023, 12:11 AM
Apr 2023

Income is compensation (for work, for use of money, etc.) Gifts are not compensation.

 

Zeitghost

(4,557 posts)
34. Right
Wed Apr 12, 2023, 12:29 AM
Apr 2023

Because we all want to carry a stack of 1099's to hand out with Christmas gifts.

onenote

(46,135 posts)
25. No, my statement is correct. Yours is incorrect.
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:40 AM
Apr 2023

The giver pays the tax, not the recipient. As has been noted multiple times in this thread.

 

RocRizzo55

(980 posts)
14. I was answering the OP.
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 08:47 AM
Apr 2023

Which, in its title asked if CT could be charged with tax evasion.
I do know that he does not have to pay taxes on gifts, but what about other things?
Audit the whole lot of them.

32. 26 USC 4941
Tue Apr 11, 2023, 11:59 PM
Apr 2023

Okay government officials are disqualified persons. It depends on how Harlan expensed the gifts -- through his company/foundation or personally (doubtful). Also, Thomas never claimed the $500k Ginni received through a foundation, so there's potential liability there -- especially subsection C.
-------------------

26 USC 4941: Taxes on self-dealing

(b) Additional taxes
(1) On self-dealer
In any case in which an initial tax is imposed by subsection (a)(1) on an act of self-dealing by a disqualified person with a private foundation and the act is not corrected within the taxable period, there is hereby imposed a tax equal to 200 percent of the amount involved. The tax imposed by this paragraph shall be paid by any disqualified person (other than a foundation manager acting only as such) who participated in the act of self-dealing.

(2) On foundation manager
In any case in which an additional tax is imposed by paragraph (1), if a foundation manager refused to agree to part or all of the correction, there is hereby imposed a tax equal to 50 percent of the amount involved. The tax imposed by this paragraph shall be paid by any foundation manager who refused to agree to part or all of the correction.

(c) Special rules
For purposes of subsections (a) and (b)-

(1) Joint and several liability
If more than one person is liable under any paragraph of subsection (a) or (b) with respect to any one act of self-dealing, all such persons shall be jointly and severally liable under such paragraph with respect to such act.

(2) $20,000 limit for management
With respect to any one act of self-dealing, the maximum amount of the tax imposed by subsection (a)(2) shall not exceed $20,000, and the maximum amount of the tax imposed by subsection (b)(2) shall not exceed $20,000.

(d) Self-dealing
(1) In general
For purposes of this section, the term "self-dealing" means any direct or indirect-

(A) sale or exchange, or leasing, of property between a private foundation and a disqualified person;

(B) lending of money or other extension of credit between a private foundation and a disqualified person;

(C) furnishing of goods, services, or facilities between a private foundation and a disqualified person;

(D) payment of compensation (or payment or reimbursement of expenses) by a private foundation to a disqualified person;

(E) transfer to, or use by or for the benefit of, a disqualified person of the income or assets of a private foundation; and

(F) agreement by a private foundation to make any payment of money or other property to a government official (as defined in section 4946(c)), other than an agreement to employ such individual for any period after the termination of his government service if such individual is terminating his government service within a 90-day period.

 

The Jungle 1

(4,552 posts)
10. Which is another reason the republicans are fighting the increase of IRS agents
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 08:36 AM
Apr 2023

The IRS is an open joke to the rich. They cheat and no one says a word.

Farmer-Rick

(12,635 posts)
20. Yup, but if you fail to catch one of their
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:28 AM
Apr 2023

Thousands of tax regulations, they fine you big. It's a game of gotcha with the middle class and a game of look the other way for the filthy rich.

flying_wahini

(8,274 posts)
16. Well what about Ginny's $600k that someone gave her and she dispersed to Proud Boys and used
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:20 AM
Apr 2023

On Rented buses for Jan 6. ?
It wasn’t declared as income, either, as I understood it.

Farmer-Rick

(12,635 posts)
21. Yeah, that sounds more like an exchange for services
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:29 AM
Apr 2023

That can be considered income and taxed.

Hamlette

(15,556 posts)
23. under your theory, if my friend invites me to her house for dinner I'd owe taxes?
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:35 AM
Apr 2023

With Thomas it just looks so bad. Especially to have his wife and the donor so involved in politics.

 

Paladin

(32,354 posts)
24. Clarence Thomas, face a legal penalty? PERISH THE THOUGHT!
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 09:37 AM
Apr 2023

And upon his mournful passing, his soul shall reside in the right hand of Jesus, for all eternity.

Any other questions?

 

Chainfire

(17,757 posts)
30. Not a "gift" but payment for services rendererd.
Fri Apr 7, 2023, 11:26 AM
Apr 2023

Billionaires don't become billionaires by giving money away to their friends. It is only reasonable to believe that if you "Friend" was giving you extremely valuable "gifts" that the "friend's" interests would be considered in a legal decision that might affect him. Of course, knowing and proving are two different things, especially when you are one of the most powerful men in the nation.

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