Tibetans Explain What 'Suck My Tongue' Means. It's Not What You Think.

[icymist]

The viral video showing the Dalai Lama asking a kid to “suck” his tongue—and the subsequent public outrage—has led to hundreds of Tibetans to come out and tell the world: It’s not what it sounds like.

Over the weekend, an edited video of a Feb. 28 interaction between the 87-year-old spiritual leader and an Indian boy went viral, leaving many of the 6.7 million Tibetans across the world in distress and shock over the way their language and culture were misinterpreted.

[...]Tibetans told VICE World News that the meaning of this common expression used to tease and teach children is completely lost in cultural interpretation and its English translation. The correct phrase in Tibetan for this joke is “Che le sa”, which roughly translates to “Eat my tongue.” English is the Dalai Lama’s second language and Indian news outlets have previously reported that the leader speaks in broken English at public events.

[...]At a press conference on Thursday in Delhi, Penpa Tsering, a political leader of the exiled Tibetan government, said their investigations showed “pro-Chinese sources” being involved in making the video go viral. “The political angle of this incident cannot be ignored,” he said.

Tibetan human rights groups have previously documented online campaigns aiming to discredit the Dalai Lama and paint occupied Tibet as a “contented and idyllic Chinese province.”

https://www.vice.com/en/article/jg5854/tibetans-explain-what-suck-my-tongue-means-dalai-lama-viral-video

[Hugh_Lebowski]

1. I knew I was right to defend him ... I'll leave it at that (nt)

[pnwmom]

8. Did you see how close their faces came? Their tongues could have touched at that distance

and that's not the same as just cracking a joke.

[Disaffected]

20. BFD n/t

[pnwmom]

23. Adults shouldn't be forcing kisses on children, period. And especially kids not in their family

and especially not on the lips.

All that happened before the tongue joke.

[Roy Rolling]

29. Chinese propaganda?

Not. It was a real event openly filmed transparently. If the exiled government of Tibet wishes to display to the world its endearing local customs—pick another custom. This custom is unsanitary and rejected by everyone but the small culture geographically who still practices this bizarre practice.

The Dai Lama should know this would be a culture war moment when he did it in front of the world via video.

I don’t care one way or another, but that’s the most reasonable context to me.

[FreeState]

55. What? My grandma kissed me like that my whole life

I think you’re misrepresenting what happened. He kissed him like my grandma kissed me most of my life. Just because it’s on the lips doesn't make it sexual or inappropriate. Your ignoring another’s cultural norm and applying your expectations.

[pnwmom]

61. He wasn't her grandmother. And if you willingly kissed your grandmother,

that's fine. This boy was under pressure. After the hug, which appeared voluntary, the boy pulled back, and the man grabbed his arm and asked for a kiss on his cheek. After complying, the boy pulled away, and the man pulled him back and asked for a kiss on the lips.

This was not his GRANDFATHER. This was a stranger who the parents brought him to see, and the boy, who was in front of an audience, had no choice in the matter. In one of the longer video clips, the boy even tries to shrug the man's hand off his arm. His body language said everything.

[live love laugh]

82. Different cultures do things differently.

[pnwmom]

85. Every cultural practice isn't equally valid. Our own cultural practices aren't equally valid.

It's common in our own culture to urge children to ignore their reluctance to hug and kiss adults -- and it's wrong when we do it, too.

[Maraya1969]

68. That was nothing! Some people have to look for problems.

[pnwmom]

101. If Pope Francis was demanding kids kiss him on the lips, while grasping their hand,

people here wouldn't be reacting the way they are to the Dalai Lama.

[BlackSkimmer]

56. I agree. nt

[Maraya1969]

70. An explanation of what it means.

"In a Youtube video, Jigme Ugen, a second-generation Tibetan refugee living in the U.S., explains how this display of affection was born out of a game played between the Tibetan elderly and children. Kids who go up to their grandfather, for instance, are asked to kiss their grandfather’s forehead, touch their noses and kiss them.

“Then [the grandfather] says that I’ve given you everything so the only thing left is for you to eat my tongue,” Ugen said. “The child probably never gets the candy or money but gets a beautiful lesson about life, love and family."”


I remember the Dalai Lama making jokes about farting on airplanes and also telling one host how he had a "Full evacuation" after a night's sleep there. Different cultures are different!

[Just A Box Of Rain]

52. I feel the same.

The was a serious rush to judgement and some awfully unkind statements made, even after the very different Tibetan cultural practices were pointed out.

Kudos to you.

The Dalai Lama had very few people questioning the undue haste of labeling him either demented or a pervert.

This place sometimes.

[FakeNoose]

53. It's a cultural misinterpretation

From the OP link:

“It’s a sign of blessing,” she added. “When a kid wants to hug an elderly man, the old man complies, and then gives a kiss as a grandfather or a father would, and plays with the kid.”

Kaysang, who goes by one name and is a Tibetan feminist educator in India, told VICE World News that “suck my tongue” in Tibetan is also a game for the elders to deter cheeky kids from pestering them.

“The word ‘suck’ in the Tibetan language is ‘jhip’, and this is not a word that is sexualised in our culture,” she said.

Too bad the reporters are so lazy. I'm happy that VICE has set this matter straight.

[pnwmom]

62. Then why did the boy try to shrug off the man's hand in one of the clips? nt

[JI7]

94. Becsuse he tickled him. The entire thing is misleading

the boy's mother was also right next to them along with many others.

[pnwmom]

97. He wasn't tickling him in the clip I saw -- not that that would be okay, either.

Hanging onto a boy you've just met so you could tickle him? No, that's not okay.

And I don't care that the parent was there. It's his body, not hers. Lots of parents in our own culture have pushed their children into accepting touches, and it's wrong when it's done here, too.

[JI7]

98. The boy asked to hug him

[pnwmom]

100. Yes, and that was fine. Then the boy pulled back,

and the man held onto him and asked for a kiss on the cheek.

And the boy pulled back and the man hung on and asked for a kiss on the lips, even cupping his hand over the boys chin to draw him in.
Then the man asked him to suck his tongue, and you can see the boy jerk his head back in surprise, but he hesitatingly bent his head close to the man's, and stuck a tiny tip of his tongue out.

Everything after the hug was instigated by the adult who was hanging onto the boy, while other adults laughed.

Yuk.

[Maraya1969]

69. I'm putting this here because it looks like it was left out.

"In a Youtube video, Jigme Ugen, a second-generation Tibetan refugee living in the U.S., explains how this display of affection was born out of a game played between the Tibetan elderly and children. Kids who go up to their grandfather, for instance, are asked to kiss their grandfather’s forehead, touch their noses and kiss them.

“Then [the grandfather] says that I’ve given you everything so the only thing left is for you to eat my tongue,” Ugen said. “The child probably never gets the candy or money but gets a beautiful lesson about life, love and family.”

[dembotoz]

2. media sure as hell fell for that one

[SWBTATTReg]

3. A shame, anyone that has any inkling of the Tibetan culture would have already known this.

There's been several shows on either PBS, etc. on Tibet and its culture, so in reality, no excuses in professing the fake shock and fake outrage that was generated.

[pnwmom]

9. Why did he apologize then? Why didn't he explain the "custom"?

[SWBTATTReg]

10. I don't know, why don't you ask him?

[pnwmom]

12. Because they knew his behavior was inappropriate.

The boy asked for a hug, but after the man hugged him, he asked for a kiss and pointed to his own cheek. The boy complied. Then the man asked for a kiss on the lips! That was already going too far, but the boy complied again. Then the man said "suck my tongue" and moved closer to the boy, and the onlookers laughed.

It was gross, and the boy's body language showed he was uncomfortable.

[SWBTATTReg]

91. Ah, you're an expert on Tibetan culture. Who would of thought such a thing?

[pnwmom]

99. Human beings are human beings. Adults in our own culture make the same mistake

of pushing children into accepting physical affection upon command from adults.

It's wrong here and it's wrong there, too, even if most of the people in both our cultures think it's just fine.

[Hekate]

48. "I am sorry you misunderstood my fractured English. Pardon while my translator shows up so you

…can all wait around listening to us talk in a language you don’t know so he can explain” ??

[LymphocyteLover]

79. but this was in India, not Tibet

[SWBTATTReg]

90. So?

[LymphocyteLover]

92. Do Indian kids understand Tibetan customs?

[Maraya1969]

102. The reason it is India and not Tibet is the Chinese ran all the Tibetans out of Tibet during the

second world war. So they escaped by horseback and walking, including the Dalai Lama. So they are in India but it is like "Little Tibet"

There was a fascinating movie about it. The Chinese were barbaric to them. AND now the CCP gives the Dalai Llama a lot of problems and are even telling people that the new Dalai Lama will be born in China. Which is absurd because no one knows where the new Dalai Lama will be born. It is a search that happens a few years after the death of the current Dalai Lama.

A great movie about that is, "The unmistaken child" And there you can see the custom of putting foreheads together like His Holiness did with the little boy in the clip.

[LymphocyteLover]

119. I know the history and what the Chinese did to Tibet is indeed terrible

the question I have is whether the kid he did this to knew the Tibetan custom

[Maraya1969]

120. I take offense at the words, "Did this to" As has been discussed through this thread what happened

was a matter of different cultures. But I do not know if the kid knew that.

But the foreheads coming together is another very nice tradition.

[underpants]

4. Here's another one. The stabbing of Bob Lee

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100217828279

but do read post#4

[Maeve]

5. More along the lines of "got your nose" or pull my finger

Grandpa games

[pnwmom]

13. And demanding a kiss on the lips after getting one on the cheek?

Just another Grandpa game?

And he's not a Grandpa or a relative the boy knew Children shouldn't be made to kiss people in general, but especially not adults they're not close to, and especially not on the lips.

[Maeve]

16. Yeah, it can be...depends on the culture

Not all cultures think lip kisses are automatically sexual

[pnwmom]

17. Lots of cultures have practices that are harmful to children.

Just because a practice is cultural doesn't mean it's not harmful.

[Hugh_Lebowski]

19. Yeah ... and I think 'children' are overrated as a general rule

And quite literally almost anything could be categorized as 'harmful' to them. The idea is constantly used as a political cudgel by both sides of the political spectrum.

This isn't even something that actually happened, it's just words, and there was no tongue sucking.

If a child had literally been forced or coerced into sucking an 87 year old man's tongue, sure I'd be freaking out a bit. But that's not what happened.

This is a cultural misunderstanding, like literally the words aren't interpreted by the people in the culture as meaning ... what was reported.

Definitely not worthy of the collective freakout. And NEVER underestimate how much the Chinese government ... hates this particular Dalai Lama.

[pnwmom]

21. I saw the kissing that preceded it. The boy was being pushed by adults to do things

he didn't seem enthused to do. The hug was fine, but that should have been the end of it.

But then the man asked him for a kiss on the cheek. The boy complied. Then the man asked for a kiss on the lips, and you could see the boy hesitate.

This was not okay, which anyone would have seen if the man had been a Catholic priest and to the Dalai Lama.

[Hugh_Lebowski]

32. Well I admit I've not seen the video ... and that does sound a bit untoward

Still, this man has been a wonderful example of humanity his entire life.

At worst, he's suffering from Dementia.

I'm not going to diss that guy as some kind of pedo without a lot more evidence than ... this.

[ShazzieB]

49. I'm with you, Hugh!

I find it really saddening to see so many people here being downright eager to dump on this kind man and drag him through the mud over what we now know was a cultural misunderstanding. Even now, after an explanation has been provided! It's unfair to him and to the Tibetan people.

I find it especially disturbing to see such attitudes expressed here at DU, a community where people are usually quick to leap to the defense of oppressed minorities. I think the same courtesy should be extended to Tibetans (an oppressed minority with their homeland under the control of the Chinese), but instead people want to criticize Tibetan customs and drag the whole culture through the mud! I. Don't. Get. It.

[Just A Box Of Rain]

65. You should watch the whole thing from the source where a cultural defense was mounted

as a prequel. I'll try to dig for the link.

You can watch the cultural defense, or not, but this version (towards the end) plays unedited.

Looks like the Dalai Lama mix up some teasing, with some affection, with some words about life (and not following bad people), and it included the moment when he stuck out his tongue.

Watch. See what you think. From the moment I saw this my impulse was to avoid a rush to judgement. I feel vindicated in that impulse.

Watch it in context. The Dalai Lama misjudged how his actions would be seen on a live telecast. But there was no issue immediately.

I don't want to mistate when this happened, but the Chinese government and their social media wings only started pushing this after McCarthy met with the Taiwanese PM.

Watch for yourself.

Bill

[Just A Box Of Rain]

67. This is the entire video of the incident unedited, that I mentioned above.

I feel that the cultural explanation at the head resonates with I see in the tape as an unbiased observer, but it is delivered by a strong partisan of the Dalai Lama, so take as big a grain of salt as you like, or ignore it entirely and just watch the "incident" in the full context.

And I'm really writing to the general "you," but you as well.

This was originally posted on DU by Richard D who deserves full credit.

[Goodheart]

86. The Tibetan government and their supporters have a very obvious motive

to excuse this away. I'm not buying the excuses.

If indeed it is a custom it should be quite easy to show me just ONE previous incident of a Tibetan doing such a thing.

[intheflow]

28. Right?

Some people need to get out more. I’m kind of amazed at how many DUers immediately jumped to “Pedophile!” with this. We are indeed an arrogant, assumptive, fearful and damaged society.

[reqd]

76. when Grandpa played that game, he didn't kiss me on the lips first

And he didn't stick his tongue out in front of my mouth.

[Hekate]

6. Media in this country is so triggered by the rightwing nuts that they couldn't stop for a moment...

… and just ask questions about culture. Not a moment.

And so are we all. All the RW has to do is yip about pedophilia and grooming and it becomes increasingly difficult for even those of us who are not in that camp to separate reality from their dark fantasies.

We look ignorant and ridiculous to the world, and this is oh so useful to, for instance, the Chinese government, which is engaging in cultural genocide in Tibet and among the Uighurs.

Recommend reading the whole article at link.

At a press conference on Thursday in Delhi, Penpa Tsering, a political leader of the exiled Tibetan government, said their investigations showed “pro-Chinese sources” being involved in making the video go viral. “The political angle of this incident cannot be ignored,” he said.

Tibetan human rights groups have previously documented online campaigns aiming to discredit the Dalai Lama and paint occupied Tibet as a “contented and idyllic Chinese province.”

https://www.vice.com/en/article/jg5854/tibetans-explain-what-suck-my-tongue-means-dalai-lama-viral-video

[MagickMuffin]

7. There were a LOT of DUers jumping on that bandwagon

Calling the Dalai Lama disgusting, and other attacks on him being a pedophile. Totally uncalled for.

[pnwmom]

14. I'm one of them. If he had been a Catholic priest, first asking for a kiss on the cheek,

and then demanding (and getting) a kiss on the lips -- as the Dali Lama did before sticking out his tongue -- would everyone here have been saying that's okay?

[cilla4progress]

24. Please!

Different culture - different customs!

I honestly don't know in this situation, but I am certainly aware of this through history.

When white christian colonizers came to this land they abhorred the practice in some indigenous cultures of multiple committed sexual partners. It led to oppression, gaslighting and worse!

https://www.lakotatimes.com/articles/what-about-the-rights-of-the-parents/#:~:text=Polygamy%20occurred%20in%20the%20tribes,to%20discern%20by%20the%20clergy.

[pnwmom]

26. Adult relationships are a completely separate issue. Children shouldn't be forced

to kiss adults on the lips, whether it's the Pope of Rome or the Dali Lama or even their own Grandpa.

[cilla4progress]

31. Maybe more research

is needed....

We recently watched this documentary

I came away with great regard for Tutu.

[pnwmom]

34. I like Pope Francis as well, but I wouldn't be defending him if a child came to him

for a hug; and afterwards the Pope held onto him, and then asked for a kiss on the cheek, and then asked for a kiss on the lips.

Yuk.

[cilla4progress]

40. I

hear you.

I just don’t know in this situation, but I want to be open to being educated on the topic.

[pnwmom]

44. This article is about hugging, not kissing, but I think the ideas are sound.

I think the boy looked willing to hug, but afterwards he drew away. The mistake by the Dali Lama was pulling him back by the arm, and then asking for kisses while he hung onto him.

And the whole thing happening while adults watched and cameras took pictures. Imagine the pressure this boy must have been feeling to perform.

[Sogo]

41. I completely agree with you....

I was always freaked out when it came time to kiss goodbye to grandparents….I’d immediately wipe off any wet kisses!

[Hekate]

36. First & foremost, Roman Catholic priests come from our own culture, so we'd look askance with good

…reason because a line would have been crossed in our own culture. We think tongues and cheek-kisses are sexual — but then, we think everything to do with children is sexual. I have known American families where a brief kiss on the lips between parent and child is considered very loving — whereas in my parents’ household this was Not Done.

As someone said, in context the tongue thing was a grandpa joke on the old monk’s part, and a mistranslation between his broken English and a custom considered innocent in his culture.

What if one of our elders did the “gotcher nose” trick where it ends with the adult’s thumb sticking out from between the adult’s fingers? The child would giggle and the adults would look indulgent. What if a tribe of foreigners then howled that the thumb was in reality a stand-in for a penis and this was the most gross thing conceivable to expose an innocent child to?

I found the Vice article fairly compelling. YMMV.

[pnwmom]

39. Here's a perspective from another culture that's not our own, and I found it compelling.

https://www.indiatoday.in/news-analysis/story/no-excuse-for-child-abuse-dalai-lama-controversy-2359330-2023-04-13

[treestar]

103. The Pope is part of western culture, not

Tibetan. It would not be inconsistent to think it was not OK for him.

And this does not have to be OK with us. It's just that it is not what was at first judged, by judging him by western standards.

[pnwmom]

107. Human beings are human beings. Many in our own western culture think it's perfectly fine

to force children to accept physical affection from adults.

It isn't fine here and it isn't anywhere, no matter what cultural excuses are made.

[treestar]

114. you can attack that culture for it as well as this

but the specific person may be just going with that culture, and not care for being judged for it by those outside the culture.

For instance we would condemn FGM, though it's OK with the culture involved. The individuals doing it don't get it, though. And when challenged by members of their own culture who want it changed, answer that with "why do you want to do things the white man's way?" Ironic, when white colonization is described as all bad. When it comes to FGM, I suppose it fostered progress for the good after all.

The world is getting smaller by the day, so I suppose they things will eventually harmonize. In the meantime, culture clashes occur.

[pnwmom]

116. I'm not attacking that culture or our culture, which also encourages this.

I am saying the particular behavior is harmful to children, no matter which culture practices it or excuses it.

And FBM is a good example, though much more extreme, of a cultural practice that is bad no matter where practiced.

[RocRizzo55]

15. Yeah, that gets me sick

If they knew anything about His Holiness, the Dalai Lama, they would know that it was some sort of cultural thing.
However, some folks think that their interpretation of cultural values is the only valid one.

[pnwmom]

22. Children shouldn't be made to kiss strange adults on the lips -- and even with a family member

it should be voluntary.

This boy was made to perform.

[intheflow]

33. Who hurt you?

Honestly, just because priests and some other Christian sects have a long history of child sexual abuse, it’s not a reflection on the rest of the world’s religions which came out of much different cultures than Europe and the Euro-settlers’ religion. I agree with you on a lot of things, but you seem completely blind to deep cultural differences, and even shallow ones like trying to make jokes in a foreign language. I admire your spirit speaking on behalf of abused children AND sometimes understanding is lost in translation and a western POV.

[pnwmom]

35. You're misinformed if you don't think child abuse can happen in all cultures.

This point of view is from India, which also has a separate, non-western culture.

https://www.indiatoday.in/news-analysis/story/no-excuse-for-child-abuse-dalai-lama-controversy-2359330-2023-04-13

There are also innumerable examples of child molestation by family members, with a few cases involving the child’s own parents. So, how can parents trust another individual with their child and give them complete autonomy over them?

(snip)

Here is a man in a position of power, who is probably revered by the parents, given control over an innocent boy. In the video, it can be clearly seen that the boy jerks back immediately when he is kissed on the lips. The Dalai Lama then went on to ask him to suck his tongue. At his age, a child depends on his care-givers and takes cues from their reactions. The boy was probably too confused to figure out how or what he was feeling. After all, Dalai Lama is a man who enjoys a hero status, with a cult following. He’s also a man the boy’s parents trust and revere enough for this young child to want to go up and hug him.

It is exactly this kind of power dynamic that makes innocent young children vulnerable to be exploited by those in power, or by anyone who holds control over them.

[intheflow]

43. I never said child abuse doesn't happen in all cultures.

Assuming I’m ignorant to global child abuse just cements it for me that you are limited here by your direct experiences. You can’t even entertain the thought it’s a cultural misunderstanding. But sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

[pnwmom]

45. I'm NOT saying the Dali Lama is an abuser. But I am saying that parents

pushing a child to perform like this are sending messages about bodily integrity that could make the boy, under other circumstances, more vulnerable to abuse.

And, no, since you keep fishing. I haven't personally been a victim of assault. But someone I'm close to was, and I understand how important it is for children to always be given the message that THEY and not the adult are in charge of deciding how much contact is okay.

What choice did this boy have when, after the hug, this important man held onto his arm and asked for a kiss on the cheek? And then pulled him back and asked for a kiss on the lips? And all the adults around him thought it was cute, and even took pictures?

He had to ignore his own instincts to pull away (which we could see in the video) and comply with the adults around him. And that wasn't a good thing to be teaching him.

Maybe this writer can explain it better than I can.

https://thebodyisnotanapology.com/magazine/your-child-should-never-be-forced-to-hug-anyone-yes-including-a-relative-here-are-7-reasons-why-2/

[Warpy]

11. I withheld juudgment on this one

because I know some rather poorly translated US advertising slogans, most notably "Coke brings life" which was translated to "Coca Cola brings your ancestors back from the dead."

So it was roughly the equivalent of "pull my finger." Got it.

[grantcart]

18. Exactly. No candy but you can eat my tongue grandson.

[Goodheart]

60. I don't recall that the young lad asked the Dalai Lama for candy.

Did I miss something?

[AnotherDreamWeaver]

38. Speaking of translations, I watched the movie Woodstock when I was in Japan.

They had the bouncing ball on the english lyrics when a band sang. As Sly and the Family Stone sang "I wanna, I wanna, I wanna take you higher" the bouncing ball went over "A motor, a motor, a motor cycle, Honda."

[Warpy]

51. HAHAHAHAHA!!

I'll bet a lot of countries did that sort of thing, don't want to allow America to export its drug culture. I'm going with that instead of a Mondegreen, I've met too many Japanese people who speak decent English for that, and given the military occupation followed by a huge amount of trade, I'm thinking it was the same in 69-70.

[reqd]

78. I don't use Coke idioms right after kissing a boy in the lips

But that's just me.

[Warpy]

88. Well, using coke is likely better before instead of after

I gave up trying to judge Asian culture by European standards a long time ago. The line between cultural norm and psychosis is often a thin one and I'm sure they feel exactly the same about us because I've asked them.

[demmiblue]

25. Yeah, I saw a Twitter reply that basically explained the misinterpretation soon after it happened...

and ignored the reaction here and elsewhere.

Perhaps the bandwagon will chime in.

[Kaleva]

30. It is sometimes wise to wait till more info comes out

[reqd]

81. it's also wise not to blindly believe the extra info

Especially when a man sticking his tongue out 1 inch away from a boy he just kissed he's trying to engage in damage control.

I would say that "waiting for more info that makes sense only" is better advice.

[Kaleva]

87. Who said anything about blindly believing extra info

I haven't expressed an opinion either way on the matter and it's fine with me if weeks pass before there's enough information provided for me to make an informed decision.

[Joinfortmill]

37. Good to hear & not surprised.

[yaesu]

42. China and Russia are pretty much the embodiment of evil empires which is why

We must break economic ties with China like we did with Russia, the sooner the better.

[NullTuples]

46. A more complete explanation of the cultural meaning of the saying:

In Tibetan culture, it is common to see the old grandparents not only give a pop kiss to the small children, but also give a small candy or piece of food to children from their mouths – directly mouth to mouth.

This may not be the norm of your culture, but this is commonly done. After the elder gives a pop kiss and a candy, since there is nothing left in their mouth, nothing left to give, they will say the phrase “Ok, now ‘eat my tongue” (not ‘suck,’ as His Holiness misspoke due to his less proficient English). The Tibetan phrase is “Che le sa”. They say that as in “‘ve given you all my love and the candy so that’s it-all that’s left to do is eat my tongue.” And itis a playful thing that the children know. This is not really done in the Lhasa region (capital of Tibet) so much, but it is more common in the Amdo region (where HH is from). However, it is definitely a Tibetan custom.

If we are honest with ourselves, we know that when we form an opinion on any topic without considering many aspects of context in any given situation, we are choosing to keep a significant degree of ignorance in our reasoning.”

https://www.elephantjournal.com/2023/04/the-tibetan-meaning-of-eat-my-tongue-dalai-lama/

Perhaps the problem is not the Tibetean culture, but the American one.

[Goodheart]

59. You know, we have a saying here in the USA: "kiss my ass"

But it's a SAYING; nobody expects that it should be taken literally. Tibet is making up excuses because its most representative commody has been shown to be creepy.

[Orrex]

47. Well, I'm sure that his culture would be equally understanding of a similar faux pas

Glad we sorted that out.

[friend of a friend]

50. My father and I kissed on the lips until the day he died, I was 32.

[pnwmom]

63. The Dalai lama is not his father or his grandfather. He's a famous stranger. nt

[reqd]

73. my father never once kissed me in the lips

Even more. My mom never did either.

[superpatriotman]

54. The Dalai Lama is NOT a pedophile!

I've been arguing with anonymous internet commenters for a week now and I refuse to believe he is anything but wholly pure and loving.

[Goodheart]

58. Nobody is "wholly pure"

I doubt he's a pedophile, but his action was creepy as fuck. And as somebody who's supposed to be "enlightened" he should have known that the world would judge it as creepy as fuck.

[pnwmom]

64. No one is saying he's a pedophile. My concern was that the boy was pushed into the interaction.

When he tried to pull away, the man grabbed his arm and pulled him close -- more than once. And at the end, the boy shrugged the man's hand off his arm.

Children should be able to control their physical interactions with everyone -- even those their parents view as beyond reproach.

[reqd]

75. I'm not convinced he's not a pedophile

After seeing this interaction.

[obamanut2012]

108. Lolz

[Goodheart]

57. I'm not buying this "explanation".

Mostly because it doesn't make sense. The problem with the "explanation" is that the creep didn't just use an expression... he actually offered his tongue and expected a physical response. And I would bet that it is NOT a custom in Tibet to hope that a perfect stranger, a young boy at that, would have tongue contact. Sticking out a tongue and lapping each other are two different things.

[LymphocyteLover]

77. yes, and also this was in India. Not clear how many Indians know this expression.

[JI7]

95. India has a large Tibetan community

[JI7]

123. Indian culture is far worse when it comes to males harassing females

and the excuses the men and some women make for it .

[elocs]

66. This is a disappointing thread where half of the DUers

appear to hold hands with the right-wing and sing Kumbaya. I'm sure there are places in the world that find some of our customs bizarre as well.

[pnwmom]

71. For those of us concerned, it has nothing to do with the bizarre aspect.

It has to do with any situation where a child's bodily integrity is ignored, which is common in the US, too -- and wrong whenever it happens. Reluctant kids shouldn't be made to kiss adults or accept their physical affection.

This boy was being pushed by adults to kiss and hug a man he didn't even know. The man was grasping his arm (you can't see that in every video, but it's happening) and repeatedly pulling him back when the boy attempts to pull away.

[reqd]

74. I wouldn't like to swing the pendulum too far the other way and pretend that hugs are sexual

Kissing a kid i in that manner s wrong. Hugging them is not wrong as long as there is no inappropriate touching.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

83. Hugging someone who doesn't want to be hugged is wrong.

[pnwmom]

109. The hug looked voluntary to me, so it was fine. But after that the man kept gripping the boy's

hand or arm, and pulling him back whenever the boy moved away, and asking for kisses. That was crossing the line.

[reqd]

72. does the saying require stickin the tongue out 1 inch away from the kid after kissing him on the lip

Please.

[redgreenandblue]

96. Glad to see you back on DU.

[LymphocyteLover]

80. It may well be a Tibetan thing, but should the Dalai Lama expected that everyone knows this?

I mean, he doesn't live in Tibet, the incident took place in India.

[Goodheart]

84. I doubt that it's even a Tibetan custom.

Sticking your tongue out at a grandson in a playful manner? I'll buy that. Actually expecting a physical tongue kiss from a perfect stranger? Sorry, not buying it.

[treestar]

106. "expecting?"

maybe he did not. It's a saying.

[obamanut2012]

111. It literally is not a Tibetan thing

As many, many Tibetans said when it happened. These late cherry picked quotes are damage control

[obamanut2012]

112. It literalky is not a Tobetan thing

As many, many Tibetans said when it happened. These late cherry picked quotes are damage control

[obamanut2012]

110. It isn't a Tibetan thing

The OP and others are cherry picking pro Dali Lama sources. Most Tibeatans and Tibetans experts say it is not a thing.

He has had issues for years: lgbt, women, being worldly/living in luxury, etc. Being a frigging God King.

People on here will twist logic for the Lama, but if this was an RC priest, LDS Elder, Baptist pastor, Iman, Rabbi, etc? Folks would rightly call them out.

And, dementia doesn't make someone a pedophile or similar, it just makes them forget to not act on it, at least in public.

The majes literally thinks he is a God King

[Kali]

89. good old DU

[JanMichael]

104. I guess eating someone's tongue is OK? Especially a kid? Sure. I buy that.

I know a lot of polyglots and most of them can figure out what "Suck my tongue" means in English. Even the ones that are not translators or interpreters.

[obamanut2012]

113. It is garbage

This man has been problematic for decades, and people excusing this are just.... jfc.

This is not a Tibetan thing, as many people said when it happened. Cherry picked damage control.

Imagine if this was a priest, a pastor, an imam, a rabbi?

[treestar]

115. How do we confirm it is not a Tibetan thing?

The explainers are just lying? Have the deniers made any posts?

[pnwmom]

117. Sticking out the tongue IS a Tibetan thing.

But I haven't seen any reliable source say that holding a child by the arm, asking him to kiss the man on the lips, telling him to suck the man's tongue, and then touching foreheads -- with the man's tongue still sticking out -- is part of the ritual. The child didn't seem to think so either, because he first jerked his head back -- farther away from the man -- before slowly moving closer to within inches of his the man's face, and then sticking out a tiny part of his own tongue.

[treestar]

118. might have taken the Dalai Lama

a second to get it. He heard that he was criticized internationally, and apologized.

The opposite of when Obama courteously bowed to the Japanese emperor, recognizing their forms of greetings, to the outrage of the right wing that believes no President should acknowledge any other cultural practice.

[demmiblue]

105. This must be some thread... I can only see less than half of the responses.

[Oregon1947]

121. I can't believe people excusing this behavior..

asked for a kiss on the lips then wanted the kid to suck his tongue. You people are sick.

[icymist]

122. U.S. arrests 2 for allegedly operating secret Chinese police outpost in New York

Washington — The FBI arrested two defendants on charges that they set up and operated an illegal Chinese police station in the middle of New York City in order to influence and intimidate dissidents critical of the Chinese government in the U.S., the Justice Department announced Monday.

...In a separate complaint, nearly three dozen MPS officers were charged with using fake social media accounts to intimidate Chinese dissents in the U.S. and disseminate "official PRC government propaganda and narratives to counter the pro-democracy speech of the Chinese dissidents," the Justice Department said, referring to the People's Republic of China.

...The group allegedly operated a troll farm of thousands of fake social media profiles on sites like Twitter to disseminate Chinese government propaganda and recruit agents inside the U.S. to do the same. In one instance, members of the 912 Group allegedly targeted an anti-communism virtual conference convened by a Chinese dissident with loud music, threats and vulgarities.

..."As alleged, the PRC government deploys its national police and the 912 Special Project Working Group not as an instrument to uphold the law and protect public safety, but rather as a troll farm that attacks persons in our country for exercising free speech in a manner that the PRC government finds disagreeable, and also spreads propaganda whose sole purpose is to sow divisions within the United States," Breon Peace, the U.S. Attorney for the Eastern District of New York, said in a release.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/fbi-china-police-station-new-york-2-arrested-harry-lu-jianwang-chen-jinping/