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yardwork
(69,299 posts)They love us to death.
ShazzieB
(22,548 posts)And they're too stupid to understand how offensive that is! It makes me want to 
I went through this with my sister when she was upset that her lesbian granddaughter cut off communication with her. I could not make her understand that when you reject a core part of who someone is, you cannot expect them to feel loved by you. Duh! She. Did. Not. Get. It. 
bucolic_frolic
(54,993 posts)BlackSkimmer
(51,308 posts)I wonder if a thread like this would do with any other religion as the subject.
I'm not involved in religion at all, but this hatred toward one religions is ugly.
I'd like to see President Biden, Carter, or Obama read some of the comments posted here about the faith they follow.
Effete Snob
(8,387 posts)The basic idea of Christianity is forgiveness of sins, not punishment for them.
The OP is based on this dumb idea that is unfortunately common to the effect that Christianity is based on some notion of "you'll be punished if you are bad, and rewarded if you are good" which has utterly nothing to do with the entire point of that religious belief system.
azureblue
(2,724 posts)It's about doing what Jesus tells his followers to do. IOW, to be a Christian, you must walk the talk. Best described in Matthew 25:31- 46, and the Beatitudes.
BlackSkimmer
(51,308 posts)You are correct.
Religion-bashing bores me, and I shouldn't even have responded to that post probably.
quakerboy
(14,851 posts)ZonkerHarris
(25,577 posts)and elderly.
Thats about it.
quakerboy
(14,851 posts)(assuming you trust the origins of the books) Not the one achieved with approximately 2000 years of political maneuvering.
ExWhoDoesntCare
(4,741 posts)None of it is original. In fact, your deity ripped off nearly all of it from Judaism. And Judaism hardly had a lock on any of it. Those have been tenets of every culture and every religion since we came down from the trees.
Don't make me instruct you on the many passages in the Jewish book that support love thy neighbor, feed the poor, and minister to the sick. And don't make me instruct you on how it's a good thing that Jews were around during the Middle Ages in Europe to keep some semblance of reality-based medical knowledge alive there. We'd be even further behind than we are now without them retaining what they knew about medicine. Not to mention the contributions of Muslims and Asians, who were all light years beyond christians in medical knowledge and practice well into the 15th century.
So in the end that loaded remark of yours was extremely bigoted and dishonest to imply that only that one deity supported such things, that nobody had a clue about any of it before him or can have it without buying his BS.
Knock it off. It gets old that so many of you do that.
Wonder Why
(6,913 posts)doesn't mean they are.
To be a Christian, one has to follow (or at least try to follow), the teachings of Christ. These so-called-Christians totally ignore His teachings and just use a small portion of the Old Testament to justify hatred, bigotry and discrimination.
Some people here need to talk to the real Christians who do what they can to help others, who do not teach hate and bigotry, who try and follow Christ's teachings and who love their fellow humans. There are zillions of them but few are the big mouths like the bigots because they are Christian.
Go to a small, rural Black church and listen to them sing and preach about love instead of how others should vote for Trump or hate anyone who disagrees with them. Those people are all colors, all faiths, all "different", all caring about others.
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)If we were living in an Islam-dominated country, the anger would be directed at Islam. And just because some people who are admired here are Christians doesn’t undo all the harm that religion has caused for centuries, and continues to cause. (Yes, the same goes for Islam and other “faiths.”) Most religions are just misogyny wrapped up in nonsensical tales.
(edited because I have to be cautious here)
atreides1
(16,799 posts)
azureblue
(2,724 posts)they are Biblicans. They use the Bible to justify their dogma, and to justify pushing their religion on others.
Then there are the followers of Jesus, who understand his message of helping others. Empathy.
BlackSkimmer
(51,308 posts)comments, I find that to be fairly usual).
But this constant bashing here does nothing to alleviate any of the ills which you seem to attribute to it.
I have to admit that I enjoyed your thought that if we "lived in an Islam-dominated country, the anger would be directed at Islam." You really think so? Tell me which country you have in mind and let me know how that works out for you, 'mmkay jewels?
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)Last edited Wed Apr 26, 2023, 11:37 AM - Edit history (1)
Women there have had it with the draconian religious rules governing the way they must dress, etc., and the incredibly harsh limits on their freedom. They are angry. They are protesting. I'd hope that we DUers would be of a like mind if we lived in Iran.
Effete Snob
(8,387 posts)
flying_wahini
(8,273 posts)
wryter2000
(47,940 posts)Not all of us are sending money to hack preachers who disseminate hate. And because we don't have boatloads of money, we have no more political power than our vote. People say "take back your religion," and I wish to God I knew how because I'd be on the front lines of the struggle.
The Bible also says there are false prophets, and every single one of the clowns who put their hands on Donald Trump to bless him are false prophets.
Upthevibe
(10,171 posts)Well stated.....I agree with you 100%.....
I don't mean to "bash" anyone but IMHO, organized religions have been a disaster if we look at the totality.....
"Most religions are just misogyny wrapped up in nonsensical tales." I completely agree with your opinion.
flying_wahini
(8,273 posts)But when the GOP has claimed Christianity as THEIR identity (like the flag pin) then people lump the GOP as Christofascist and it’s easy to lump them all together.
The problem is when some Christians don’t act like Christians.
Upthevibe
(10,171 posts)100%.....
Mariana
(15,622 posts)
MayReasonRule
(4,097 posts)Faith rejects doubt.
Reason requires doubt.
I embrace reason and reject faith.
May reason rule.
Thomas Hurt
(13,982 posts)make sure you suffer the consequences of your sins, if you don't. You know to save you from yourself, because in their hearts they think they are God.
azureblue
(2,724 posts)The Baptist line of dogma..
flying_wahini
(8,273 posts)
WhiskeyGrinder
(26,895 posts)not to drink poison. For them, that’s love — telling someone they don’t know that they’re not saved.
Ilsa
(64,318 posts)remember that they don't get a vote on anyone else going to Hell.
flying_wahini
(8,273 posts)Doesn’t sounds that good to others, just them.
Upthevibe
(10,171 posts)That's the point.
From your post:"Telling a gay person they're going to hell IS love." THAT IS CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!
Just like it's crazy that a loving and kind person who's spent their life helping others won't get into Heaven but a person who does HORRIBLE things throughout their life will get in because they've "accepted Jesus Christ and their only Lord and Savior."
I'm not buying that. It's ridiculous. And I don't need THEM to tell ME how to live my life or what to believe. I mean their stance on choice, birth control, The LGBTQ community is NONE OF THEIR EFFING BUSINESS!!!
And now, we're in trouble with these laws the extremists are passing because of what THEY believe. It makes me sick and infuriates me...
haele
(15,366 posts)And just as an observation, most of the ones who grab their rewards here don't seem to happy with their lives under their veneer of (self)righteous salvation.
Haele
Effete Snob
(8,387 posts)Do people actually believe that the basic idea of Christianity is that you'll be punished if you are bad, and rewarded if you are good?
That was the shockingly radical idea there?
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)They believe the basic idea of Christianity is you will be punished if you don't believe, or rewarded if you do.
The Gospels state this pretty explicitly, so if their position on the Bible is that it is the inerrant word of God, then it shouldn't be surprising that this is what they believe.
lees1975
(7,036 posts)The gospels are accounts of the teachings and the ministry of Christ. The main point of the gospels is follow the example of Jesus. He directly attacked and dismantled the religious system of "believe and be rewarded, don't believe and be punished," and also made it clear that the practice of the Christian faith was only pure if it were separated from political authority and power.
Now, is that what most American Christians believe? No, they've bought into the prior argument, and work diligently to make Christianity a business and a political party from which the privileged few benefit, while taking resources from everyone else.
Act_of_Reparation
(9,116 posts)Those who are interested in this kind of thing can debate whether there is Biblical justification for Sola Fide, but there is no way anyone could read the Gospels and conclude that there is a mechanism for salvation without faith.
Just open your Bible to the Gospel of John and give it a good read.
As for this "American Christians" thing, let's not pretend their flavor of Christianity is anything new or uniquely American. It's not. Christian theocracy has existed in varying forms and geographic locales for almost as long as Christianity has been a thing.
azureblue
(2,724 posts)if you do not do what he taught
Matthew 25:
41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’
44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’
45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”
Effete Snob
(8,387 posts)Do you visit a prisoner a week, a month, a year?
There are people starving to death right this minute, but we're posting on DU and not really doing anything about it.
You mean, I should do those things after taking care of the bills, the retirement fund, etc., and making sure I'm in good shape first, right?
I had this silly notion about forgiveness for NOT doing those things, but I guess the forgiveness thing doesn't mean much when there is a lake of fire handy.
uponit7771
(93,530 posts)piddyprints
(15,102 posts)Hate the sin. They’ll tell you that every time. Of course, it’s not true, but that doesn’t matter to them.
Effete Snob
(8,387 posts)...by Jesus himself.
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)
LiberalLovinLug
(14,674 posts)Yes this is their go to mantra if someone tells them they are not practising "love" as Jesus wants them to.
So
You HATE their life style
You HATE their clothes
You HATE the way they talk
You HATE their choices in life mates
You HATE that they live near you
You HATE the idea that their marriage is equal to yours under the law
and smile to yourself thinking how they will soon be burning forever in a lake of fire for their "sins"
But you LUUUUUUUUUUURV them so much.
judesedit
(4,590 posts)Christian or not. 
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)As primates living in highly social and interconnected groups, we need to cooperate to survive and thrive. I'll help you gather berries if you help me build this shelter out of leaves and reeds. That kind of thing. No supernatural beliefs are necessary.
judesedit
(4,590 posts)A rule everyone should adhere to.
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)Effete Snob
(8,387 posts)Why the fuck would I want a masochist following a rule like that?
judesedit
(4,590 posts)That fact would be known if the books were actually read.
Ilsa
(64,318 posts)in one form or another by all major religions.
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)All of the major religions treat women like shit and view them as lessers and keep them out of power and don't allow them any major character roles in their stories (i.e. all the major characters, like God/Yahweh/Allah, Jesus, Mohammad, etc. are males. In Christianity, one of two major female roles, Eve, gets blamed for the downfall of humanity and the other is basically a vessel for a supernatural male offspring). And that doesn't even touch on how gay people have been treated by most religions...Suffice it to say, it ain't good.
Effete Snob
(8,387 posts)God does not treat others as he wants to be treated.
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)and seems to enjoy inflicting death and suffering and destruction. I wouldn’t worship that deity even if I actually believed in its existence.
Farmer-Rick
(12,625 posts)And they tell you it's "free will". People can chose to do evil.
Yet they want to pass laws that prevent the exercise of that same "free will".
If a person is forced by Christian Fascists to behave like a Christian. Will their God buy it and allow them into heaven? Can ChristoFascist actually trick God like this? Can they fool God into thinking people are good Christians when they keep the lump of cells in their womb, when really all along they wanted to get rid of it?
Can ChristoFascist trick God into thinking that the men who wanted to love other men, really weren't gay? Is their God fooled when women who love other women are forced not to express their love?
Seems they think their Christian God can be tricked and fooled rather easily.
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)God won’t do squat cuz of free will.
Also, God has a plan (so much for free will, I guess) — again, why pray? I mean, “He” is just gonna go by that grand plan, right?
None of it makes any sense whatsoever, even as fiction. Too many contradictions and convoluted plot lines.
Farmer-Rick
(12,625 posts)Religion is just a scam to control people and make money. It's just another con game that the filthy rich use to keep the masses in check.
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)MarcA
(2,195 posts)No coincidence that the proponents of a Religious State continue to like those terms. No place for any Democracy or Individual Freedoms in their Religions or Governments.
Effete Snob
(8,387 posts)Farmer-Rick
(12,625 posts)Got to have a king to lord it over everyone.......pun intended.
sarisataka
(22,618 posts)Of the week that ends in 'y'?
My how time flies.
patphil
(9,019 posts)Angels incarnate into a physical body to establish an individualized consciousness, develop a personality via experiences in a 3D body, and, as I said, learn the lessons of love.
The first two steps are necessary to facilitate the 3rd, and most important, step.
So far, most of humanity has failed at step 3. You can't become a full-fledged, permanent Angel until you pass the tests of love. Until you do, you will continue to reincarnate again and again on this planet.
I've spent my entire adult life pursuing a spiritual path, and this is a summation of what I have learned. Love is the opening door, love is what we came here for, no one can offer you more. And when you know what I mean, when your eyes have truly seen, then you are ready to graduate from here...not before.
Farmer-Rick
(12,625 posts)We would have learned our lesson by now.
And where did all the 7.8 Billion new angels coming from?
Imagination is a great tool.
Response to Farmer-Rick (Reply #31)
Post removed
Farmer-Rick
(12,625 posts)It is just made up crap to make you obey these religious leaders. It's all made up like a Science Fiction story is made up. I seem to remember a sci-fi writer who made up a story very much like that.
Give me evidence not stories. Show me a god or even your angel. In the 6 million years humans have been on this planet, no one has ever proved the existence of gods or angels.
patphil
(9,019 posts)And, if you want to see an Angel, look in a mirror, or out into the crowds of people on the street, and look around.
Note: At least half are on the path of darkness.
I knew you weren't going to accept what I said, but I said it anyhow. Sometimes you just have to run with the spirit of the wind.
Farmer-Rick
(12,625 posts)Look at a tree, look up into the sky, that's such a typical religious response. For not following a religious sect, you sure sound like a religious apologist.
patphil
(9,019 posts)If religion isn't for you, then I'm okay with that.
Being accused of being a religious apologist is actually quite an insult!
I'm not part of any religion, and I can't see any way that I would ever apologize for them.
There is a vast difference between being a religious person and a spiritual person. Again, I don't expect you to understand that, and I'm okay with that also.
Farmer-Rick
(12,625 posts)Apologetics (from Greek ἀπολογία, "speaking in defense) is the religious discipline of defending religious doctrines through systematic argumentation and discourse. Early Christian writers (c. 120–220) who defended their beliefs against critics and recommended their faith to outsiders were called Christian apologists.
The field of Apologetics has been around for thousands of years. Now it is an insult? It's what they call themselves.
You should look into it. A lot of what you write resembles what they say.
Celerity
(54,309 posts)This is one of the most bizarre posts I have seen in my almost 5 years here.
It is scientifically absolutely loaded with utter falsehoods and completely bonkers conspiracy theory.
It also is racist and offensive AF:
What the hell???
I am extremely racially/ethnically mixed and seeing this shit posted here enrages me.
You need to take this dodgy claptrap down ASAP.
sanatanadharma
(4,089 posts)How can so-called devotees of God, ignore God's words, translate God's words, interpret God's words, deny God's words and still say "I a christian" (same truth in other named religions)?*
Motes and beams and all that one chooses to see. See reality, eschew illusion. One is constant, the is a shape shifter.
* The existence of different christian denominations demonstrates that the word of God is not clear, is differently translated and interpreted, often is ignored and sometimes denied.
Different denominations would be impossible if the theologians' claim of inherent scriptural accuracy, guaranteed by God, is true. Translations and preachers would all say the same thing; they do not!
Claiming inherent accuracy of their scriptural understanding, requires denominations to deny that other denominations are actually Christian.
BTW, I am not.
twodogsbarking
(18,630 posts)
SilasSouleII
(486 posts)How did they love a maga zealot? Or a 1/6 insurrectionist? Or Ted Cruze?
Aviation Pro
(15,534 posts)The dead give zero fucks because they're dead.
Extinct.
Not breathing.
Pining for the fjords.
Bereft of life.
Rests in peace.
Pushing up daises.
Metabolic processes are history.
Kicked the bucket.
Shuffled off the moral coil.
Run down the curtain.
Joined the choir invisible.
And ex-.
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)Silent3
(15,909 posts)When you die, God isn't going to ask you.
TeamProg
(6,630 posts)these same people or feel threatened by their existance is simply because those Christo bigots are unsure of their own sexuality.
1WorldHope
(2,037 posts)dchill
(42,660 posts)Freedom OF religion must also mean freedom FROM religion. There is nothing more subjective than the concept of religion.
NullTuples
(6,017 posts)The OP meme is one take on it.
Most conservative Christians however follow a very different belief system - in effect a very different Christianity. Think of them perhaps as religious homonyms: spelled the same, pronounced the same, but they have very different meanings.
Conservative Christians - including the sects that once treated Catholics as their mortal enemies - have somewhat blended into the same belief system. It's one that was widely spread around the globe by the Catholic church a couple decades ago in regards to health care when they started their hospital buying spree here in the USA. In it, anyone who has power over someone else that decides not to use that power to stop the other person from sinning has themselves committed the equivalent of the same sin.
Taking that mindset into account, the OP meme is seen by them as "not true Christianity". And that's the joy of religion - each sect gets to decide their own beliefs, values and even their own interpretations of the same primary text. And since each is convinced they are Divinely Inspired, they simply dismiss all others as Not True Christians.
It's a hell of a racket if one like gathering power over others, cult-building, wealth and such.
hamsterjill
(17,544 posts)As a Christian myself - one who fails every day at trying to live up to the teachings of Jesus Christ - I find this meme to be true.
I also find some of the comments on this thread interesting. First of all, there are many different sects of Christianity (just as there are of other religions) so you can’t lump all believers into one pot that is “Christianity”.
Second, I do feel “attacked” here every once in a while for referencing my faith. I try to let it slide. I don’t try to force anyone to believe as I do, but I don’t expect anyone to question my right to believe as I see fit or anyone else’s right to believe as they see fit. It’s courtesy of nothing else.
Otherwise, would you walk up to Joe Biden and tell him that his God doesn’t exist?
Permanut
(8,353 posts)We humans, even in the DU Community, have a tendency to simplify, stereotype and generalize.
Comes up often with religion, and also with geographical references, e.g., "Florida should secede".
I plead guilty
ShazzieB
(22,548 posts)But I hate it when people generalize about "Christians" as if there were not many different flavors of Christianity that are different from each other in a lot of significant ways. There are many things I dislike about certain branches/denominations of Christianity, but I know there are other branches and denominations that do not share those things.
I feel like the word "Christian" has (inaccurately and unfairly) come to be associated with a lot of negative things that do NOT pertain to all Christian Churches. I can tell the difference myself, but a lot of people either can't tell the difference or don't want to believe it exists.
dalton99a
(94,017 posts)wryter2000
(47,940 posts) claudette
(5,455 posts)
11 Bravo
(24,305 posts)another ritualistic bashing of people of faith.
I was correct.
Butterflylady
(4,584 posts)And the rest are false. So I would like to know who is correct? Is it the Christians, is it the Jews, is it the Muslims or could it be that none of them are right? All I know is that this planet has been around for millions of years because I believe in science and that is what science tells us. It wasn't till homo sapiens and those before came on the scene that there was even the thought that there were gods or even just one god. So I believe that humans were the ones that created gods because death is so mysterious that we are so afraid of death we need to believe that there is something beyond death.
So if God created the earth and everything in it why didn't he/she show himself/herself to the civilizations that came beforehand. Why did he/she wait till the last couple of thousand years?
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)this universe is 14 billion years old and contains billions of galaxies. But many people still think that the last 2,000 years on this one little planet amongst trillions is the sole focus of the omnipotent creator and ruler of the universe. I can understand thinking that back before there were telescopes and before humans had any concept of how old and vast the universe is, but, in my opinion that's a very myopic view to hold in this day and age.
Or even if some "believe" in science (like that the age of the Earth is 4.5 billion years or so), they still don't really consider that statistically there has to be quite highly evolved and intelligent life on likely millions of other planets. So why would "God" focus on one type of relatively recently evolved primates (200,000 years or so) on one little planet in this vast universe? I guess humans have a need to feel special amongst the unfathomably huge cosmos.
Personally, I embrace my insignificance. I know that I am a blip of nothingness in the scheme of things, just one carbon life form among untold multi gajillions (that's a scientific number -- pffft) that will come and go over the course of billions of years, and I find that quite comforting.
Skittles
(171,509 posts)but I take great exception when they use their fantasies in politics
Upthevibe
(10,171 posts)Thank you for this post.
I read it a couple of weeks ago and posted it on my FB page. I very, very seldom make original posts on FB.
I read and "like" posts and I enjoy it for the different groups I'm in (mainly fan clubs of various podcasts, T.V. shows, old movies, etc.).
I received quite a few positive comments and "Likes."
Xolodno
(7,348 posts)Otherwise they would have read Matthew 7:1-3
“Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get. 3 Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?
But sadly, they gravitate to clergy that tells them what they want to hear. Many right leaning religious people no longer argue with me as I point out their hypocrisy. And then I usually knock them down a bit when I point out that the oldest Gospel is the Gospel of Thomas which is not included in the Bible and the Bible is nothing more than a collection of books that at one time included the Apocalypse of Peter. Nor is it uniform as the Coptic Church excludes Jude and Revelation and the Ethiopian Orthodox includes the 1st Book of Enoch and Constantine, wasn't baptized until he was on his death bed...
...and one I love to point out, there is no solid proof text for the Trinity Doctrine. It didn't really materialize until about 300+ years later and their was much debate on it. Later, it was made doctrine and opposers of it met a bad end. That's what happens when you marry Government and Religion.
Some think Religion + Government is a wonderful thing....I find it horrifying. Faith is the concept of believing something that can't be proven and they want to make faith regulated by the rule of law. Scary shit if you are or aren't a Christian.
pansypoo53219
(23,024 posts)ExWhoDoesntCare
(4,741 posts)There won't be any thinking, because their brains will be off. For good.
And show us the evidence of the deity or these supernatural hangouts existing that will pass muster with people who do have functioning brains.
I'll wait.
Ever hear the aphorism about what we call alternative medicine that works?
Answer: Medicine.
Same thing with the supernatural. If we had any evidence of it existing, it would be called natural.
Besides, even if any of it were real, i wouldn't want to hang out with a bunch of people I couldn't stand to be around in this lifetime, and, worse, kissing the arse of a genocidal maniac alongside them.
That would be worse than hell to me.
sarisataka
(22,618 posts)All Christians to have non-functioning brains? Including the 50+% of Democrats who profess to be Christians?