Are they just insane? Why do the American People overwhelmingly think the economy is doing poorly?

[NewsCenter28]

So, the polls, if they are to be believed (which is a big if) show that Americans overwhelmingly think that the economy sucks. Is this because all they do is drunkingly listen to Sean Hannity?

I see:

1. A record number of jobs created in the first term of President Biden.
2. A stock market that is staying steady and also making incremental gains.
3. Inflation tumbling from a high of 9.1% to just 5% now and falling.
4. Record low 3.4% unemployment. Highest ever job numbers for the AA community.
5. Stabilizing, if not low, gas prices.

I'm sorry. my patience for the stupidity of the American people has run out (and I'm not a politician so I can call them out on their stupidity without having to be politically correct).

The simple fact is that I've been doing this for decades. The economy that President Biden is presiding over would, under any other administration at any other time in history, be considered roaring. By any fair metric, President Biden is a superb economic steward. It is quite frankly absurd to complain about this economy and I am more than a little tired of it. Perhaps, racism, bigoted and misogynstic beliefs are what people are really complaining about and they just cover it up by saying they are "concerned" about the "economy". The media trying to talk the economy into a recession is also horrific. Kind of like how we were told in 2016 that the vote for Trump was about economic angst. As if it was.

I mean, I get it. If you are a white supremacist Nazi who hates gay/trans and all non-Aryan and straight peoples, Trump is your guy, but don't tell me that you're voting for him because of the economy. Own your hatred and admit that you are a Republican because you are a backwards, bigoted, misinformed, misogynstic creep and proud of it. Again, own your hatred. Don't concoct a story in your head about the economy being "bad" as an excuse.

THERE IS NOT A SINGLE COMMONLY AND HISTORICALLY USED ECONOMIC INDICATOR OR PRODUCT THAT REMOTELY SUGGESTS THAT THE AMERICAN ECONOMY SUCKS RIGHT NOW.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

1. Manufactured outrage, though inflation is a real concern it is overblown. . . nt

[NewsCenter28]

4. For sure it is overblown

Also, worth noting that it is just 3% off of the Fed target of 2% right now.

[wnylib]

12. But the media are not reporting that.

The media are continually reporting how badly inflation is affecting people, especially food prices. Even when prices stop rising, they remain at a higher price than before. I haven't seen food prices go down.

Plus, the media are not reporting the causes of inflation and the extent world wide. So the American people believe that Biden's economic policies caused the inflation. The corporate media are happy to let the people believe that because their corporate bosses oppose Biden's economic policies that make businesses and wealthy individuals pay their fair share of taxes. For decades, ever since corporations and the wealthy started getting more and more tax breaks, the cost of governance and public institutions has been shifted onto the common people. The corporate wealthy do not want the costs more evenly balanced again.

[Claustrum]

22. And since Biden won, there are monthly "the economy is going to collapse" stories

coming from supposedly great "economists" or CNBC, not biased at all /sarcasm.

[wnylib]

25. We need to counter that corporate message.

[inthewind21]

96. And

those who are listening to media and not finding the facts for themselves ARE the problem.

[Zeitghost]

103. Ummm

That's a 250% overshoot.

Anyone like the OP who says Inflation is "just 5%" should not also be asking why people also thing the economy is rough. High inflation receding to 5% still means that prices are rising more than twice as fast as normal.

[2naSalit]

45. That's it.

Not only are goods at the store increasing in price, so is gas, and everything else. The electric company jacked up my "even pay" monthly bill by $40/mo, my rent went up $40/mo, my internet bill is about to go up $40, one of my two old cars need a compressor for AC replaced (can't drive it without it because the rest of the system-fan-is disabled until that gets done...) car repairs cost more, I am suddenly spending an average of $260/mo more than in Jan. of this year. I get about $1K/mo for SS. And that will decrease by $163. because I just aged out of disability so my medicare premiums come out of that now. weee.

So as long as the corporate overlords are controlling the narrative by keeping prices unnecessarily high, they can convince a lot of people that the economy sucks.

[liberal_mama]

90. Same here. I've never had it this rough financially in my adult life. With the greedy corporations

raising the prices of everything, there are many Americans that are really struggling now. Our town even raised property taxes by a lot two years in a row. Gas prices. All the utility companies are charging more, natural gas and electricity, internet ect. Most of my neighbors are always complaining about it too, so it's hurting a lot of people.

[inthewind21]

98. Welcome

to a capitalist society.

[Cobalt Violet]

2. It's not good for everyone.

[Phoenix61]

5. It's never been good for everyone.

It could be and Dems are much more likely to make that happen than any repub out there.

[Phoenix61]

3. It's the joys of a fact free universe that MSM seems hell bent to support.

I’m right there with you. If the numbers looked like this under under the sexual assaulter they would all be cheering.
Also, no one’s talking about him reducing the deficit while pumping millions? billions? of dollars into our crumbling infrastructure across the country.

[NewsCenter28]

6. Exactly, Phoenix, exactly-also I completely forgot about the bipartisan infrastructure bill and IRA

Thanks for reminding me. 2 other HISTORIC economic achievements.

[Skittles]

7. paychecks not keeping up with inflation

that's the most visible issue

[SunSeeker]

21. That's been an issue for the last 50 years. nt

[ruet]

102. While At The Same Time Blaming Inflation On "Rising Wages".

Dead-End Capitalism at its finest.

[Deminpenn]

8. Simple

Food, gas and utilities all went up significantly.

Food prices rose relentlessly although they are now coming down now. Some of that was driven by the severe strain of avian flu that is still affecting chicken and egg prices themselves but that also ripple through many other foods like baked goods and pasta. While pay has increased, it's been hard to keep up.

[femmedem]

9. Also high interest rates are jacking up peoples' credit card payments.

And at least where I live, rents have skyrocketed due to the proliferation of AirBnBs and the purchasing of multi-family homes by large corporations.

[Old Crank]

18. The Fed

Can be blamed for that. While trying to throw workers into the streets they a crashing banks and putting bankers out onto the streets.

[maxsolomon]

86. 100% this.

Most people don't see further than the end of their noses.

[uponit7771]

134. IINM housing went up the most and is not going down in most regions in the US

[JT45242]

10. Inflation.... especially for big things...and drug shortages

Just before COVID hit (December 2019), the furnace in our house died. Cannot complain, it was the original furnace from when the house was built in the very late 1990s for the original owner.

We thought about replacing the AC at the same time, but it would have been an extra $3-4 thousand that we just didn't want to spend just before Christmas if we didn't have to. We knew we were kicking the can down the road as 20 year old AC units could die at any time.

AC unit died this week, replacement cost is now a little over $6 thousand. Plus, the local electric company has ended rebates on AC. Plus the tax credit for AC has a lower cap and requires a higher SEER value for 2023. Our service guy said there were at least 6 price increases of at least 5 percent each on each of the brands they carry in the last year.

Son has to fly to a speech and debate tournament next month (he made nationals), flights into Phoenix, a hub, used to routinely be $115, are now over $400.

Luckily, we can afford this. But for many, these would be extreme hardships.

I do not blame anything but corporate greed for most of inflation.

Part two, drug shortages....every month I have to call around to a ton of pharmacies to find which one has son or wife prescription. Now the cat's medicine is also scarce.

We don't live paycheck to paycheck and have an 'oh shit' fund for car and home repairs. But we hadn't built it back up to $6k after the furnace and car repairs over COVID.

People do not think about the macroeconomics when the AC fails and it's 2-3 thousand more than it would have been a couple of years ago. When we decided to kick the can, I figured the cost would increase by 3 percent a year, so now it would be like $3300-4400 not $6200.

[mnhtnbb]

27. I had to get a plumber

Last edited Wed May 10, 2023, 09:55 AM - Edit history (1)

to come remove my garbage disposal yesterday because I brilliantly turned it on Saturday with a shot glass that had slid down into it. I spent two hours Sunday tediously picking small glass pieces out of it with tongs and then using the vacuum to suck out the smaller pieces because I was hoping not to have to call a plumber for $150+/hr. Didn't work.

I called four plumbers on Monday: two couldn't schedule a visit until the end of May or early June. One, whom I'd previously used with his own business and reasonable charges, didn't return my call. The fourth was able to come the next day. The estimate, when he got here, was almost $475. to remove the disposal and convert the sink to a regular drain. My other option would have been to let my long time handyman -- who still only charges me $50/hr-- do it. But, it would probably take him a lot longer and I'd be paying for his time to go get the plumbing supplies he'd need. And I'd still have to pay the $149. "diagnostic fee" to the plumber. I let the plumber do it and he was done in less than an hour. He had 15 years
experience.

When my house was being built three years ago I asked the builder not to install a garbage disposal because I don't like them. He refused saying it was a part of the contract with his sub that he couldn't alter.( We were offered lots of design choices). Probably BS. Anyway, I paid for something I didn't want and now I really paid to have it removed.

After I wrote the check to the plumber yesterday I told him I hoped he was getting a good part of it. He didn't say anything, so I assume he's not getting $300/hr. I imagine he's lucky if he's getting $50/hr.

And then the plumber I had hoped to use called me back. Next time I'll wait to hear from him and hope he won't be charging me $300/hr.

[radius777]

128. I'm sure the handyman could have done it

just as quickly, as it did not involve reinstalling the disposal, and drain/under sink plumbing is something the typical handyman or diy'er can do (supplies readily and cheaply available at home depot/lowes etc).

You were wise to remove the disposal. Best thing I've learned with these things is keep it as simple/standard as possible so when things break is easy to find a handyman (or diy) without needing to rely on some expensive tradesman.

[Delarage]

38. Get a few estimates

On the AC. Just replaced a 16-year-old gas furnace/AC combo with a dual-fuel heat pump (should rarely ever use the gas backup) and a gas hot water heater (it was like 30 years old) with a heat pump water heater.

Up front price was 17,000

But....

Energize Delaware is sending back $4650 soon.
Federal tax credit for heat pump AC will be $2000
Federal tax credit for heat pump water heater will be $1027

= $9323

One of my credit cards has a 0% interest for 18 mos, so I put the money I would have used to pay off these upgrades into CDs getting 4.5% for 18 mos. That interest will earn about $1000. I'll pay the credit card off before I get charged interest.

So....all told will end up being $8323 (less than half of the list price) for state-of-the art heat pump technology (replacement of heater, AC, and water heater) and a move away from fossil fuels. Still significant, but the best I could do. You also have to factor in the lifetime savings of higher SEER2 numbers. The water heater "Energy Guide" yellow sticker says it should cost about $100 to run for a year---compared to $400 for gas versions. So that's $300/year for at least 10 years (warranty period)---more than paying for itself. AC should do the same with its savings.

The salesmen that came out all agreed that prices jumped a lot recently and that "the best time to have bought would have been a year or two ago." But the new rebates did help me a lot and the new equipment (with 10-year warranties) is great---water heater seems better than the old one, heat pump AC is virtually silent--and efficient. Can't wait to compare utility bills to the previous ones with the old equipment.

[Freddie]

67. We need a new heat pump

Right now our house has separate gas hot air heat (which died) and regular AC, which is still working fine. HVAC guy suggested replacing both with a heat pump with gas backup. I know there are lots of rebates out there and we’re waiting til everything’s in place to move forward. Of course the f*cking R’s want to scrap the clean energy stuff as part of the debt hostage. Mr. President, HOLD YOUR GROUND.

[Delarage]

113. Where do you live?

There are apparently heat pumps that can do the job even in Maine---but I was afraid and went with the gas backup as well. Hopefully it will never run, but I did really enjoy seeing the gas line to the old water heater be capped off.

The "Bryant Evolution Extreme Variable Speed" heat pump is one option I considered that has a high cooling *and* good heating (HSPF) ability. I was back and forth, but went dual-fuel (heat pump with gas backup).

[Freddie]

114. Philly suburbs

The guy suggested the gas backup since we already have gas here. I understand that some of the rebates are still “in progress”. As long as our AC still works we can wait til August or September.

[Delarage]

115. That's what my guy suggested too

I didn't research enough whether or not a high HSPF heat pump would have been good enough. Would have loved to cap that gas line off, too. Stove and dryer will eventually be replaced as well.

[JT45242]

69. Our electric co-op phased out rebates for all but heat pumps...

Hard to justify switching to heat pump with 3 year old furnace. Did price it out, even with rebate would add an extra 2K to the AC on top of what I already paid for the furnace.

But, yeah checked all those options.

Glad for you though.

[druidity33]

11. This economy is really good for rich people.

Poor people, not so much. And there's a lotta poor people. Middle Class? They're pretty much gone. We've got working class and professional class. Sometimes there's a variation in pay that lends itself to vacations. Mostly not. When McDs and BK start hiring in rural and suburban communities for $25 an hour, then maybe i'll consider the economy really good.

[Backseat Driver]

68. Yes, I was just going to tell OP -

1. DH is 75 and still working in big box retail; he had to work as the high inflation last few years was eating into our forced early-retirement SS budget. It funds mainly our gap health policies we've only had for a year; still no dental one--just Plan G and vision. Today he tells me they can clock in 5 minutes before or be late clocking in 5 minutes, but if he's that 5 minutes early, it is deducted from his next schedule every two weeks, so yesterday and today, he comes home at 4PM instead of 4:30pm. He last got hourly raises of $0.02 and $0.08 on his initial $15. That's far better than the $9 from the convenience stores but likely 75% less than what we once made when we DID work in career gigs two decades ago.

2. We don't have a WS portfolio or own a home. That's been all gone for two decades from serial long-term unemployment in IT. Not everyplace payed like Silicon Valley but tech sector's been unstable for us for decades; we were always rust belt. We now have an often barely there svg account!

3, 4, 5. We're glad that gas prices seem to be decreasing, but our rent went up $200 last month and food and health insurance is still high. Newer cells are half-paid for with an unlimited plan. His SS barely covers the rent; since I now don't work (my 2002 car has been garaged for 2-1/2 years with a bad water pump I can't afford to fix without a loan), and he hasn't contributed to what I TRY to save toward that purpose. Good thing--we still have our good(?) health for being so OLD. Kids and I are terrified on that score! We're both never-Covid and no current DIAGNOSED diseases but plenty of stress! I suspect though, at the very least, mental health issues, dental disease, vision script changes/hearing problems, and HBP! We treasure our family friends--our senior doggies! I try not to complain; others have it so much worse. Slippery health slope to the grave coming soon to households near you! Sorry kids...you are my joy, but the state is 51% rural and red, but not by my vote, and I blame the GOP's attitudes and past policies for my adult lifetime of unhappiness and bad economy, on the fundies, and the politics of Nixon, Raygun, Bushies, and TFG and their robed stacked judges, and I won't be silenced about their daily horrors!

[Happy Hoosier]

123. The economy is at least as good...

… as the “greatest economy in history.” I think there are other considerations.

[druidity33]

124. I have no idea what you're talking about. nt.

[honest.abe]

13. Food, gas, rent, house prices, mortgage rates.

Not Bidens fault but it is a struggle for many folks. A Republican in the WH would no doubt cause things to become worse.

[2naSalit]

48. +1

[H2O Man]

85. +1

[Tree Lady]

91. +1

[uponit7771]

135. +1,

[betsuni]

14. According to Gallup polls, the number of Republicans thinking the economy was getting better

in October 2016 was 15%, jumped to 80% in February 2017. Their imagination. For many non-Republicans, constant negative reporting in media.

"This partisan flip-flop on the direction of the economy and the country showed that much of the 'voter anger' and dissatisfaction with the economy was about partisanship, not the actual economy. The most angry and disaffected voters -- Republicans -- quickly became the most optimistic once Trump was elected, even as the economic fundamentals themselves did not change dramatically."

From "Identity Crisis"

[Claustrum]

24. +1

And the opposite was true after Biden won. Supposedly great economists and CNBC and the like put out "the economy is going to crash" stories monthly since then.

[Celerity]

47. link for that, in case people want to use it

https://books.google.se/books?id=HFKeDwAAQBAJ&pg=PA208&lpg=PA208&dq=This+partisan+flip-flop#v=onepage&q=This%20partisan%20flip-flop&f=false

[MichMan]

106. That chart is quite informative

Last edited Wed May 10, 2023, 01:58 PM - Edit history (2)

A total reversal immediately following the 2016 election.

We act surprised here when others think the economy is troubled and how unfair they are being, when we behave the same way when Republicans are in power.

[Walleye]

15. It seems that certain segment of America has made selfishness into a virtue

[Emile]

16. Inflation artificially produced by predatory capitalism.

[RandiFan1290]

17. media

The media allowed republicons to claim Obama's economic numbers were fake for 8 years and then let them take credit for his accomplishments.

They started talking the economy down the night trump lost and have not let up.

[inthewind21]

99. Corrections

The people listening to the media ALLOWED republicans to take credit for Obamas accomplishments.

[Jimbo S]

19. Spot on, however

high inflation rates, now coming down, is still in people's memories. Like Skittles said, paychecks not keeping with inflation.

Inflation led to interest rate hikes, causing potential home owners to be priced out. More difficult to buy a house now.

Like the person upthread, my 1999 model AC just quit last month, but have the rainy fund to replace it prior to summer.

My Senator Johnson won re-election last fall in part due to he was able to convince voters inflation is caused by the budget deficit.

[SunSeeker]

20. K & R

[Hieronymus Phact]

23. For every problem in the world...

There is a Lever in the office of a Democrat which could fix it, but they refuse to pull it because they hate the United States.

[BlackSkimmer]

26. When a 12 pack of Pepsi costs 9 bucks, I don't think the economy is so great.

I don't drink soda, but a friend of mine does, and she is just horrified by the price. I was amazed when she told me.

My investment portfolio has lost value.

Money is not a huge issue to me, but prices are ridiculous. Gas has fluctuated almost daily, certainly weekly, cat and dog food and treats have skyrocketed. Food prices are up across the board.

I kept the thermostat much colder than usual last winter because I refuse to pay the ridiculous cost.

Very glad I don't have to feed and clothe a family these days.

So you can call me stupid if you want, but I find the economy not to be in such a good place. I don't know of any "commonly or. historically used indicator" that may or may not suggest the economy "sucks" as you put it.

But it ain't great.

[uberblonde]

28. I agree. It's the groceries.

Mine have gone up by about 30% -- and the portions are shrinking. People notice these things.

Yes, we know it's price gouging. So why isn't anyone publicly attacking the companies? Can't the FTC hold hearings? SOMETHING?

[BlackSkimmer]

29. Yes, it's obviously price gouging, and it seems to be continuing.

I've seen a product increase in price by $2, which is ridiculous.

[oldsoftie]

31. With some items, the news isnt giving the REASONS. Like eggs

We've had millions of chickens have to be killed because of bird flu. That cut egg production by a LOT. But the average person doesnt KNOW that, so they blame Biden.

[betsuni]

35. I don't live in the U.S. and the shrinkage is terrible.

Small sizes to begin with, now smaller and more expensive. These days it's no fun to shop. 30% price hikes, at least.

Last couple of times I went to my neighborhood grocery store I noticed they'd lowered prices on some items, probably because like me, many shoppers just stopped buying things and made do with less.

I try not to use electricity (except for computer) until after 5:00 when the rates go down. No central heating or air conditioner (when in-laws visit in winter they're freezing and in summer melting, and it's always too dark for them -- they think we're nuts).

[BlackSkimmer]

64. I eat very little, and I find "U.S." portions impossible for me to eat.

So the shrinkage makes me happy in terms of less waste, but I object to paying more for less.

Living alone, I thought maybe eating out would be cheaper. Wrong. Way too much food that never tastes the same the next day. Simply too much for me to eat. And the prices for a burger? Wowza!

[llmart]

125. I eat very little also.

I don't eat out at all. Mother's Day my daughter took me out and I couldn't believe how much food they gave me for one older, smallish woman. I took what I didn't eat home and had it for the next two days. That's three days of food in what most people call a meal these days. We are a country of quantity over quality. Most of the places people eat out serve mediocre food at best.

[MayReasonRule]

41. Definitions Define Narratives

Last edited Wed May 10, 2023, 01:11 PM - Edit history (1)

Their are many micro-economies that comprise our nation's macro "economy".

Your particular investment portfolio is one of those "micro-economies".

Economic indicators are dictated by people's dollars and feet.

Those measurements provide baselines for further analysis.

There are many ways to "read" the data, there-in lies the rub.

Depending upon the "cherries" that one picks, the sweetness of the economic pie varies considerably.

Astronomical prices are a sign of our nation's multi-national corporation's unfettered greed.

Untenable slave wages are a product of the Nazi GOP.

As far as "traditional" methods of market analysis are concerned, the macro-economy is purring along quite happily.

[BlackSkimmer]

74. "There-in"

Good to know macro is doing well.

Micros will be voting.

[MayReasonRule]

107. Lol, Speech To Text Is Tricky... Good Catch!

Micros vote.

Macros fund the "narrative".

This is true regardless of which part is in power.

Democracy is a macro function defined by the micro functions within it's whole.

Price gouging is the problem.

What is the answer?

The only answer I know is to work within arms reach of my ass and to vote for the Democratic candidate.

What's your take?

[intheflow]

58. The OP is based on business interests.

Like the stock market, those indicators are not at a human level. In some respects the numbers are misleading, like, lots of new part time minimum wage jobs suck for humans but business can claim new jobs = great economy. It’s an economist fantasy, a statistical puzzle for them.

[Sympthsical]

63. I keep wondering wtf is going on with potato chips

I don't eat them, but my partner likes the ruffles jalapeno ones. $6 for a medium bag. Every time we go to the store, I watch him have this internal debate in the aisle. Does he $6 want them? A year or two ago, they'd have sales for 3/$5. Well, those days are gone.

If splenda ever goes up at Costco, I'ma start rioting.

[BlackSkimmer]

120. Lol!

Potato chips really cost that much now?

My parents did me a huge favor by never introducing me to soda and/or junk food. I do like popcorn sometimes.

And they did instill a love of alcohol...so perhaps the trade-off is not all that it seems.

[phylny]

118. Groceries. Toiletries.

We have no problem paying for groceries and are financially extremely comfortable. During the pandemic, we bought name brands at the grocery store, when I usually buy the store brand/generic, to leave the cheaper alternatives for people with less means.

I just did a Kroger pick up order and was stunned at the prices. Butter was $4.50 - $6. A pound of chicken thighs $8.48. Granite cleaner was $8.58.

I went to CVS last week. Deodorant was $7. So many products were $9.99. It was just crazy.

When *I* notice the price increases, I know it's really bad for others.

[treestar]

129. If one is poor enough to notice this

the main problem is that the Rs are not going to help.

[oldsoftie]

30. Well, a negative or flat GDP for 2 qtrs is considered "recession'. We've had that.

But we still haven't had nearly the slowdown some expected. And we're back to a small increase in GDP. The increase in food & gas prices is what the average people base their feelings on. With gas prices that in some states are STILL WAY above where they should be with oil prices where they are. Both food & gas are excluded from the CPI numbers.
People base their opinions on how they FEEL more than data & if eggs are $4 a dozen when they were $1.88 2 years ago, people are gonna blame who's in office

The pandemic exposed our economy's weak links; too many important items coming from foreign countries and FAR too many important things coming from China. Add to that the tons of money put into the system by both trump near the end of his "reign" & Biden at the very beginning, we were going to have inflation & too many people chasing too few goods.
But I believe by mid-NEXT year, when the campaigns are actually starting to matter, the numbers will be better as supplies are back to more normal levels & US oil production will be at or near record highs. And hopefully the Russians have been put in their place in UKR. And new plants will be making chips HERE thanks to the CHIPs Act.

[The Wizard]

42. If you think the price

of perishables is too high, leave them on the shelf. Before long they become worthless and the purveyors of the perishables have to reduce prices. Rotting food is mostly useless. We have to make temporary sacrifices to regulate the market.

[Red Raider 85]

32. because of a lack of critical thinking skills

people are incapable or unwilling to use skepticism and critical thought. how many people do you know who ardently believe in ghosts or gods or psychics or ufo abductions? Too many are so easily deluded.

[inthewind21]

101. Bingo

[onethatcares]

33. go to a big box home improvement store

pretty much any day of the week. Count the monster trucks being loaded with lumber and other items along with the number of people in line buying all that stuff.

Either they're living on credit and just fixing up homes to sell (flipping)or somebody got some hidden money.

[inthewind21]

105. Huh

I was just in Home Depot this weekend, in the truck, buying gutter screens and paint. Funny thing, I'm not a flipper OR living on credit or have hidden money. Glad to know you can tell all that about people who are just shopping at Home Depot? So, following that logic, you also buy into the "I was in line at Walmart and saw a woman with 6 kids all dressed in designer clothes using food stamps to buy liquor." we hear so often from republicans right? I mean after all, you can tell the life story just by looking at those shopping at Home Depot so it stands to reason so can they right?

[onethatcares]

110. no, none of the above

what I meant was, people must have a good deal of disposable income in order to keep those stores as full as they usually are in my neck of the woods.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

34. The only economic indicator that matters when it comes to politics is how people feel, and the

majority of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck.

[BlackSkimmer]

77. This. Absolutely.

And pretty much all that counts when a person walks into that voting booth.

[obnoxiousdrunk]

78. +1. N/T

[liberal_mama]

94. Absolutely. A lot of people are really struggling financially now. When someone is living paycheck

to paycheck, the economy is bad for them.

Things have been very tight in my family. We have to eat a lot of pasta, rice, and ramen noodles. The only meat we buy now is chicken thighs, pork roasts on sale, and an occasional pack of ground beef. Our primary fruit is bananas. Fresh produce just costs too much. We used to be able to afford to eat seafood like haddock, shrimp, and salmon, but not anymore. Most healthy fresh food is out of reach for us now.

On my local community Facebook groups, people are asking for food donations because they have no food in the house. It was very sad on Easter when someone posted asking if anyone could spare 2 plates of their Easter dinner because they had no money to buy their own meal. Then a whole bunch of other people joined the post saying that they needed Easter dinner too.

Seems like the rich people are doing well though.

I'm happy for the people who are doing well, but a lot of Americans are struggling.

[Withywindle]

116. +100

Most Americans are closer to being homeless than they are to being rich.

[usonian]

36. MSM. NT

[The Wizard]

37. Polling often gives false impressions.

One loaded question concludes the country is going in the wrong direction. Can anyone cite a poll saying the country is going in the right direction? It's all about click bait. The language of the poll's questions often determines the answer. How would the average person react to "If you saw the video of Lindsey Graham dressed as a drag queen would it change your vote?" Using the article "the video" assumes the video exists.

[Vinca]

39. It comes down to one thing, IMO. The price of groceries.

I think overall they're coming down, but eggs are still high and people don't know about the avian flu that hit the birds and caused the prices to go up. I also think there's been a whole lot of price gouging going on. What really puzzles me though is that people seem to think unemployment is a thing. No . . . it's not. It's at the lowest rate it's been in more than half a century. I don't know how you get through to people who don't want to know the facts.

[Autumn]

40. Have you gone grocery shopping lately? Have you looked at materials

for home repairs? Have you seen what it costs to buy or rent a house? The economy might be good for some people but not for everyone. My grandson has a friend who works full time and lives in his car.

[Fla_Democrat]

43. The nerve of some people,

The nerve of some people, believing their own lying checkbook.

[Sympthsical]

44. Do people want an answer?

Or do we just want to call anyone who doesn't agree with a narrative a bunch of idiot racists?

In discussing the economy - particularly the current numbers - people keep pretending like Covid just didn't happen. I've never understood this. "We've created the most jobs ever!" Well, the numbers certainly look great if you pretend your starting point isn't from an economic shithole that resulted from a once in a lifetime pandemic when the economy was shut down.

If I start with 5 apples, then 3 of them get smashed, I have 2 apples. But then I gain 2 more apples. Sure, that's a 100% increase in apples! The apple market is amazing!

But I'm still down 20% on apples than I was before. But people want to pretend the 100% apple increase started from 5 apples. It did not. This is a dishonest framing, and if it's the framing you're constantly using for narrative purposes, then yeah, I see your confusion. Why aren't people thrilled about this 100% increase in apples? Are they ingrates?

No, they're just ordinarily observant and know despite that 100% increase statistic you keep throwing in their faces, they're still down an apple.

Unemployment is low, because people left the labor force in droves during Covid. Either voluntarily or involuntarily. We're still not where we were. A lot of people just tapped out permanently. A lot of Boomers looked at the employment landscape and thought, "Nah, I'm good. I'ma head out."

At the end of 2019, America had 157.5 million jobs. You know how many we have right now? 158.3 million. That's not that millions upon millions upon bajillions number that keeps getting thrown around.

We can look at wage growth. "Wages are up 5%!" Have you looked at data for wages vs. inflation? Guess what hasn't been going well for people? Mix in increased housing costs, increase in borrowing rates, food costs which haven't really come down.

It all adds up, especially with people who are already living on margins that are sensitive to slight changes. People can either acknowledge the reality of what life is like for Americans, or we can yank out massaged statistics using a pandemic to make them look inflated as hell, and then scream at people when they're not joining us in the narrative fantasy we've constructed for political purposes.

Oh. I see what's been picked.

Well, fortunately Republicans are a disaster at the moment. Otherwise I feel like I'd be watching a crazy out of touch campaign season lose it for us. Small blessings. As long as Trump and DeSantis are rolling trainwrecks, we can keep calling everyone stupid, insane, and racist.

Everyone wins!

Meanwhile, down at the food bank (people should get off the internet and visit once in awhile) things have been fun since the end of emergency benefits. Have we tried yelling at these people? Could be a rousing feel good activity for those who want to get a good look at all the ingrates.

https://www.feedingamerica.org/about-us/press-room/latest-food-bank-survey-finds-majority-food-banks-reporting-increased-demand

For the month of March, nearly two-thirds of responding food banks reported an increase in demand for food assistance, according to Feeding America’s latest food bank pulse survey, a marked jump from the previous survey. In the latest survey, fielded between April 17 and May 1, around 95% of responding food banks reported seeing demand for food assistance increase or stay the same in March compared to February, with around 65% reporting an increase in the number of people seeking charitable food assistance. This is the first food bank survey gauging demand since the nationwide end of a critical pandemic-era food benefit.

Supplemental benefits and programs due to Covid covered up a lot of problems for awhile. Well, those are over now. And problems can be papered over with cherry-picked statistics and name-calling for only so long before people get tired of it. You do you. I'ma live in the world we live in.

[Farmer-Rick]

59. Well said

It's the fact that we started Biden's economy from the hell that was Trump's economy, is why it looks like we should be having a great life.

For example, Biden gave us on Social Security a cost of living raise. But that was after they charged us $164.90 each month for Megicare. It use to be free. The amount changes every year and it hasn't gone down. That's 41% of my food budget.

I have 2 millennial adult children. Both have full time jobs but their savings has been wiped out. Their pay barely covers food and rent and those prices keep going up. Their prospects of getting the kind of good paying jobs they had before the pandemic are gone. Those jobs were wiped out.

So, on the surface Biden's economy looks good but living in it is hard. There seems to be 2 Americas. You get the choice of no benefits, crappy pay with ignorant bosses jobs or if you are lucky or born to wealth, great jobs that everyone wants and the competition is staggering.

My daughter applied for a job the other day, 500 people had already applied for it. Probably all those people already have jobs too. But I never had that kind of competition when I applied for any job I've ever held.

[OldBaldy1701E]

60. No, they do not.

To answer that question would mean to expose a lot of things that are grossly unfair and biased and yet they are ingrained in our society and enough people manage to survive that they maintain the illusion. When last I checked, Congress, and most state and local governments, are populated by the rich. Millionaires and on make up around 5% of our population, but they hold a 58% margin in Congress. What makes anyone think that such a setup would ever admit that our economy is unfair? Not those who are continuing to make lots of money. Of course they say the economy is doing great. For them, it is. But, do we really want to crow about less than ten percent of the population doing 'well' while the rest are suffering and barely hanging on? I am sure that once they managed to secure enough slaves, the pyramids were a model of 'success' as well, eh?

[Fix The Stupid]

76. Bravo. This post deserves it's own OP. So much truth. n/t

[oldsoftie]

79. Last time I pointed this out I got a hide.

Because facts matter but SOME facts are willfully ignored or called "RW talking points".
You are correct. And Hopefully trump keeps imploding his own campaign. DeSantis has already seen his bloom fall off his rose.

[inthewind21]

108. By your own

numbers, yes, we are over a 100% recovery in jobs since covid. People got use to cheap $$$, low interest. People got use to the covid $$ flowing in and protections provided. Are prices up? Yes, but newsflash, prices don't stay the same for decades, or even a year. Never have, never will. Is the economy great? Depends on who you are asking. Are we on the brink of food lines and total devastation? I say no. I'm certain there are those who think otherwise. The economy is what the economy is because THE PEOPLE allow it. Blaming the media, blaming the republicans, blaming corporate America, blaming anyone but the real responsible party, THE PEOPLE! Bottom line. The Government makes laws and regulations that have a great impact on how the economy is working. WHO is in that Government making those laws and regulations (or taking them away) is the PEOPLES responsibility. So we can all sit here and blame this or that, but until the PEOPLE decide enough is enough, well, be prepared to complain indefinitely.

[uponit7771]

136. Prime age LFPR is back where it was before pandemic (WH Link), people are retiring or died during

pandemic

UE is not low because of LFPR ... its a relatively good economy for workers but not for prices because of profit inflation



"OVERALL" LFPR is down only .7%

While prime-age participation is now above prepandemic levels, overall labor force participation has declined 0.7 percentage points since February 2020. However, this is largely due to population aging, not the pandemic. Overall labor market participation rates are now in line with many prepandemic forecasts. As can be seen in Figure 2, overall participation is now slightly above CBO’s January 2020 projections for 2023Q1.[1]

[Sympthsical]

139. That doesn't contradict what I said.

It's part of that Boomers tapping out thing. One thing the pandemic did was push older people into retirement when they would have otherwise hung on a bit longer. This was particularly pronounced in health care (for obvious reasons). That's why prime age overtook overall in 2020. One thing that's also happened in the past few years is the tail end of Millennials - the current largest generation - began entering the workforce in earnest after a delay to replace those workers, which results in higher paying jobs being replaced by lower waged workers resulting in higher corporate profit margins in some areas.

It's a whole thing.

(Note: I don't use WH provided data when researching economic matters. It is necessarily massaged for the most positive possible spin and often bereft of nuance or full context. Just a bugaboo. When wanting reliable knowledge, removing a political motivation for statistical constructs is just a thing I prefer).

[uponit7771]

140. unnn, ...

Unemployment is low, because people left the labor force in droves during Covid. Either voluntarily or involuntarily. We're still not where we were. A lot of people just tapped out permanently. A lot of Boomers looked at the employment landscape and thought, "Nah, I'm good. I'ma head out."

Unemployment is not low because of LFPR

[Johnny2X2X]

46. Wage growth vs inflation

Any discussion of inflation is not complete without also talking about wage growth. Wage growth is 4.4% over the last 12 months, inflation is expected to come in at 5% today. So yeah, inflation is a concern, but wage growth ate up 88% of the price increases the last 12 months for the average worker. Real inflation was 0.6% year over year. Hardly a crisis.

And month over month, we actually came out ahead the last few months. Wages are going up faster than prices right now.

The media has constantly droned on about a recession, when it's never been a given we'll even have one, despite the Fed. They seem interested in harming Biden's presidency.

And an equal aspect to this op is the media not checking Trump on his economy. Even before Covid, his economy had tepid growth, and poor jobs growth. Biden's economy is better than Trump's in job growth, wage, growth, and GDP growth even if you forget the collapse during Covid becuase of Trump's mismanagement of it. We were always going to see things pull back when Covid hit, but it was a lot worse because of Trump's poor leadership. Trump inherited less than 5% UE, and a growing economy, Biden inherited an economy with near 7% UE. Trump

[mountain grammy]

49. Stayed with my cousin in CT last week

actually my cousin by marriage, my cousin, her husband, died 14 years ago.

She's well off, plenty of money for her old age. Said things were better under the asshole. Her words were "much better." I don't even know how to respond to such a huge disconnect.. but living in the beautiful Connecticut countryside with plenty of money, I guess.....

The fact that she married into a Jewish family doesn't seem to phase her at all.

[maxsolomon]

117. Did she qualify how?

The Inflation that began as the Pandemic ended was not caused by Biden. It was GLOBAL, and only the US has managed to reduce it in the last year.

Nor was the steady economy fueled by zero-interest rates the responsibility of Trump.

[mountain grammy]

121. No because she has no idea..

all she knows is eggs cost more and she's racist and hates seeing two men kissing on tv.

[Ilsa]

50. There are big companies doing reductions in force, and I know

a few people that are acutely aware of this. For some, the economy is about what's happening to them and their coworkers.

[Bettie]

51. The media and gouging

Lead story every night is how terrible the economy is.

Gas prices are higher than they want them to be, food prices are high too...but people are still buying stuff and going places.

Corporate profits rise every quarter, higher than they've ever been (generally speaking, I'm sure someone can and will point to a corp or two who aren't doing well as "proof" that the economy is failing).

It's all smoke and mirrors to create an illusion.

[RandiFan1290]

53. and the economy is never perfect for everyone

but the trolls will continue to use that excuse to defend the right/media narrative.

[Emile]

52. I lost money in the third and fourth years of Trump's presidency.

Lost money in Biden's first year, but now it is slowly coming back.

More people are employed now than when Trump was president. Matter of fact Trump lost jobs over his four years.

The only reason why people feel like the economy is bad must be because of predatory capitalism causing inflation.

[Celerity]

54. Black Americans are more likely to be working than white Americans for the first time on record

https://www.businessinsider.com/black-white-employment-population-ratio-unemployment-rate-racial-inequality-jobs-2023-4

Apr 7, 2023, 9:16 PM CEST

For the first time since at least 1972, Black Americans are more likely to be employed than their white peers. That's according to new job market data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics. The Black employment-population ratio climbed from 59.8% in February to 60.9% in March. The white employment-population ratio climbed from 60.1% in February to 60.2% in March.




As seen in the above chart the white employment-population ratio has been higher than the Black employment-population ratio in every month since the BLS started measuring both ratios in January 1972, until now. The employment-population ratio measures the share of a group that has a job, meaning that for the first time on record, Black Americans are more likely to currently be working than white Americans.

Additionally, the unemployment rate for Black Americans fell by 0.7 percentage points to 5.0% in March, the lowest rate on record, according to Black unemployment data starting in 1972.

Despite these records, Friday's report did show that the overall US labor market has been slowing down from its recent rapid growth. The US added 236,000 nonfarm payrolls in March, just shy of the median forecast of 239,000 from economists. It was also below February's gains, which was 326,000, according to a recent revision noted in Friday's report, as well as January's revised job gain of 472,000.

snip

[intheflow]

55. These are only business economic indicators.

On a human level, the economy sucks. Food prices up 40%. Housing unaffordable in most of the country, rents are out of control and small houses cost a quarter of a million with high interest rates. And job creation is the most bs indicator because what are the jobs and what do they pay? Part time minimum wage jobs? The economy does suck right now for a lot of people.

[Botany]

56. 90% of U.S. media, is owned by 6 companies

n 1983, 50 companies owned 90% U.S. media*. Since the Telecommunications Act of 1996, the act that reduced the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) regulations on cross ownership, 90% of U.S. media, is owned by 6 companies, Viacom, News Corporation, Comcast, CBS, Time Warner and Disney (Corcoran, 2016; Lutz, 2012).
Author: Faculty Librarians
Publish Year: 2016

[onenote]

130. One of the most ridiculous false claims ever.

I've never understood how anyone could believe such an obviously bogus claim as the one that "six companies control 90 percent of US media."

For starters, how do you define "media"? It's never clear, but it's obviously not a true reflection of what constitutes media, which generally is viewed as sources of news, information and entertainment delivered electronically or in print form.

Let's start with electronic "media"

The six largest "traditional" multichannel video distributors (Comcast, Charter aka Spectrum, DirecTV, Dish, Verizon and Altice) had around 86% of that market in 2021. But not everyone subscribes to a traditional multichannel video programming distributor -- in fact, while around 80 percent of all households subscribed to a traditional MVPD ten years ago, that number is now less than half of all households.

What has taken their place? A wide array of services: YouTubeTV, Netflix, AppleTV, AmazonPrime, etc. And while many streaming services have ties to existing traditional television providers (e.g., Hulu, Paramount+, Peacock), there are many that are independent.

In addition, millions of people simply rely on broadcast television. At the end of 2022, there were around 1370 full power commercial television stations and another 380 full power educational television stations (or 20 percent or all full power television stations). Those cable companies I listed above? Apart from Comcast, which owns NBCU, none are vertically integrated with any broadcast television stations or broadcast networks, and in terms of ownership of stations, NBCU doesn't make the the top 6. These numbers do not include low power television stations.

And then there are the other non-broadcast creators of content -- the cable programming groups. Again, only Comcast is significantly vertically integrated with cable networks. However, a number of the larger cable network groups are wholly or partially owned by broadcast groups or networks -- Disney/ESPN and ABC; Fox Cable networks and Fox broadcasting; CBS/Paramount (formerly Viacom). But there are dozens of cable programming networks and channels that aren't co-owned by any broadcaster or MVPD -- most notably Discovery Time Warner.

Of course, the above discussion focuses on video. But any rationale definition of "media" would include radio. And there are over 15,000 broadcast radio stations, including over 4200 (or 27%) educational stations. The largest single owner of radio stations, iHeartMedia, has around 860 such stations, or less than 6% of the total. The next three largest Audacity, Townsquare, and Cumulus, combined have another 6% of the total number of stations. As you can imagine, to get to 90 percent, you need a whole lot more than six companies. And none of those top radio station owners are co-owned with any of the top cable companies.

But we're really only getting started, because "media" typically would include the print media -- newspapers and magazines. While the number of newspapers has declined sharply, there still are a lot of newspapers, and a lot of newspaper owners, out there. A few, such as the Wall Street Journal and the New York Post, are co-owned by News Corp., which owns Fox. But other papers with large circulations, such as the Washington Post, New York Times, USA Today, and the LA Times are independent of these other media companies.

As for magazines -- can't even begin to count how many there are. The highest circulation magazines include the AARP magazine and magazines such as Better Homes and Gardens and Good Housekeeping. Those are "media", but if you just wanted to consider those that offer "news', defined as those that are quoted and linked to here on DU's late breaking news group, you'd have to include Time, Newsweek, Rolling Stone, Fortune, Vanity Fair, the Atlantic -- none of them owned by the six companies that allegedly control 90 percent of all "media."

Finally, there is the Internet. The number of sites where people can go for news, information and entertainment is almost too large to count.

So there you have it: compared to any other time in history, ownership of "media" is more widely distributed than at any other time in history. Think back to 1970 -- there were around 6700 radio stations (compared to over 15,000 today). There were only 875 tv stations (including both commercial and educational). There were three national broadcast networks, and cable barely was scratching the service, both in terms of number of subscribers and programming (there were no satellite delivered network at that time). Even if you jump to 1991, the number of radio and television stations was smaller than it is today. Many of the big cable providers were vertically integrated -- that is, they owned both the distribution and the content. Even Clear Channel, iHeart Media's predecessor, owned several hundred more stations than iHeartMedia owns now.

[doc03]

57. Why do people think the economy was better under Trump when he left office with the worst jobs

record since Herbert Hoover? IMO the media has been telling us that we are going into a
recession or a war for over two years now. There is inflation, the Ukraine war, China threatening war,
North Korea threatening war, homelessness gets worse every year, the border crises, etc.
It is just a general feeling of doom, and that son of a bitch Trump won't go away. There are people here that
are convinced Biden can't lose in 2024. We heard that about Hillary Clinton (Blue Wall). We have all those other
problems and my biggest worry of all is the president's health.

[Wounded Bear]

61. Same reason they thought it sucked in 2016 and got better under trump...propaganda...nt

[MichMan]

62. My retirement accounts are still down significantly and inflation has been the highest in decades

The fact that one is coming back up slowly and the other going back down slowly doesn't change the fact that both are much worse than they were before.

I retired 2 years ago; to make up for what I lost in my IRA, I would have to unretire and go back to work for 3 years without spending any of it.

[BlackSkimmer]

81. Yes, I find it very concerning.

This is pretty bad.

[milestogo]

65. Rents are rising and the price of food is astronomical.

Those are the indicators people look at.

[brooklynite]

66. The inflation RATE dropping is a meaningless indicator to the average voter...

....the indicator is everyday item prices which are perceived to still be high. Plenty of folks here make the same complaints.

[MichMan]

73. Right, prices are still going up, just not quite as fast as they were before

Nothing the average voter is going to take much solace in.

[Johonny]

70. They literally thought Obama destroyed the economy

They thought Clinton was destroying the economy.

MSM message is always the same the last 50+ years, Dems are bad at economics, Republicans are good at economics. The fact this can't be proven, and the opposite is often very, very much true doesn't seem to change the tired narrative.

[yardwork]

71. The media tells them lies.

[Ace Rothstein]

72. Seems insane to me to tell people the opposite of what they are experiencing.

The cost of almost everything is through the roof. While that may not be Biden's fault, he's the President and will get the blame for it. Always has been the case and always will be.

[Demsrule86]

75. Stop listening to worthless polls...and consider the GOP won't give Biden credit for anything.

[Marthe48]

80. Overall I agree economy is great

But: went out to an upscale restaurant to celebrate my grandson's birthday. My daughter allowed him to choose the restaurant, and treated me. I picked a Thai salad and added chicken. $22. Except for appetizers, that was the cheapest item on the menu. I didn't see the bill, but I bet it was well over $100. for 5 people. My daughter and her husband can afford a nice meal like that, and we didn't really celebrate the boy's birthday last year. But that's a lot to pay for a meal out. My granddaughter, who is 12, said, "Wait! Is that number the price?" And we said yes. I could tell even she was taken aback. Covid broke my restaurant habits, and if I get take out, takeout, I use a coupon or I skip it. (sigh)

On top of that, my daughter has put off buying a new or used car, and is basically running her car into the ground. She is at the point that the costs of repairs is not worth the time it keeps the thing running. They have a house, but I bet she spends more time in the car. She and my son-in-law were looking at car prices while we waited for dinner. They can afford a new or used car, but can everyone? I'm holding off on house repairs and hoping my car will stay roadworthy, hoping the prices will go down. Some people will have to let things go, because working 3 jobs still won't cover their basics.

I see the price of houses for sale in my (Appalachian) area, and can't believe the price of existing homes or the price of rentals. I don't know how people can live, and I often think of boiling a frog. I remember the eyerolls when my parents said they could get a candy bar and a bottle of pop for a nickel. I remember buying a Hershey bar for 5 cents. There isn't a single food item in a store that costs under a dollar, except bananas by the pound. My Dad bitched over an electric bill of under $30/month for a 9 room house with 9 people in it. Thirty dollars probably doesn't pay for a day in these times.

I am happy the numbers work for the economy. But we either need to increase workers' wages, or get the prices on everything down across the board. It is wonderful to see sentiments like 'the best things in life are free', but if keeping body and soul together takes such great effort just for basics, for so many people, how can anyone enjoy anything?

I got a slice of the pie. I want everyone else to get a slice, too.

[BlackSkimmer]

82. Nope, not insane.

Living in reality.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100217900830

[XanaDUer2]

83. Even buying Wal-Mart brands prices went up

This is the kind of kitchen table issue most Americans perceive

[BlackSkimmer]

84. No kidding!

An old Cuban lady told me years ago to drink aloe juice every day. I liked and respected her, so I took up the habit.

Very cheap juice. (No taste, really). However, several months ago, a gallon went from 6 buck something to over 9 bucks. AT WALMART! That is ridiculous.

Not only is that ridiculous, the price only increased one dollar at Publix. This makes no sense! How is it cheaper at Publix than at Wal-Mart?

So recently I've learned to make aloe juice myself. Not hard.

[XanaDUer2]

92. Majority of Americans live paycheck to paycheck

All they know it's they have to tell their kids they can't afford to buy them a box of Tasteos cereal anymore. Thus, perception is reality. Most folks are not holding stocks or 401ks, etc.

[BlackSkimmer]

95. I agree.

Funnily enough, we do seem to have had quite a few gofundme requests here since the last election too.

[XanaDUer2]

97. Omg

Your e right! One specifically asking for make-up money for EBT lowering. Yup, that's what people see.

[FBaggins]

87. Probably because it is?

“Not as bad as a devastating period” is not the same as doing well.

Your final statement is simply incorrect. Your initial points are the best possible spin on the current situation… but it’s still asking too many people to ignore their own experience.

[karynnj]

88. I suspect it is partly a desire for those polled to sound knowledgeable and to project the future

They hear mostly young news presenters speak of the record high inflation. It is record high ONLY if you look just at the last 20 or 30 years. The period from 2008 until about 2022 had atypically low inflation and interest rates. For some, that may be their entire adult life.

Additionally, there are the constant reports that the FED rate increases will lead to a recession. The fact that this possibility was discussed, not as a big negative, by the fed also leads to fears.

For many, experiencing everything you listed, they are not answering based on what they see now, but what they fear. However, for many who are more economically vulnerable, the very real increases in cost that they personally experienced have lead to real hardships.

[Happy Hoosier]

89. Three main reasons, IMO....

1) Inflation - It hit hard, and although now in retreat, it'll take a while for the perception that "inflation is rampant" to subside. Inflation tends to hit people living paycheck to paycheck the hardest.

2) Increasing inequality. Even when the economy is doing fairly well, if all the benefits are going to the investor class, there is a perception that the economy isn;t doing well because most of us are seeing only marginal improvements in our situation.

3) Manufactured outrage. The right-wing noise machine tells these people thingare bad, and they have trained themselves to accept the right wing noise machine narrative regardless of the actual facts. Look at the reponse to the Trump verdict and Santos getting arrested. Facts do not matter to a huge chunk of the population. They adopt the narrative they most identify with.

[GoCubsGo]

93. They believe it because the MSM's fear-mongering has been incessant.

Every fucking day, they're screaming about inflation, rising interest rates, gas prices, the alleged "banking crisis", etc., while failing to report that the banking situation is only a few banks and self-inflicted. And that inflation and gas prices are mostly the result price-gouging. No mention that corporations are making record profits off the back of consumers. And, of course, none of the good news you mention ever gets reported. Every good jobs report or report of lowering inflation gets met with, "Meh. Whatever. Move along. Nothing to see here." It's not surprising that most people don't know what the hell is going on.

[iemanja]

100. Because they aren't as afluent as you are

Some compassion for the poor would seem in keeping with liberal ideology, but instead you decide to insult them. I wouldn't listen to you if I were them.

[liberal_mama]

112. Exactly! Why insult people who are experiencing a totally different economy right now than the

people who are affluent? I'm glad OP is doing so well now, but a lot of us aren't okay.

[617Blue]

104. The most talked about recession that never was. nt

[pinkstarburst]

109. grocery prices, rent, can't afford a house, gas...

Here's a few reasons middle class and lower wage earners are unhappy with the economy:

Grocery prices are crazy.

Rent is skyrocketing.

Young people can't afford to buy a house, even if they are a couple with two moderate incomes.

Inflation.

Layoffs across many industries and those who have lost jobs are finding it hard to get rehired.

None of these things would be better under a repub president of course. Things would be disastrously worse But we shouldn't kid ourselves. The economy might be fine if you're wealthy and lucky enough to be employed. But it's not great for a lot of people right now.

[Caliman73]

111. They are not insane. They are misinformed and Partisan.

Other people on the thread addressed the situation well but I will add that our perception of the economy is influenced by many things including how we are personally experiencing financial situations, our political leaning, and how the economy is being presented in media and popular culture.

The reality is that the economy, unless acted upon drastically by some event (war, natural disaster, human made disaster like a pandemic, etc...) will typically move in a cycle of boom and bust.

The problem here is not whether the economy is "doing well" or "not doing well" the problem is WHO IS THE ECONOMY WORKING FOR? That is the question that should be asked, but sadly, it is the question that one party has very definite preferences about and our party, the Democratic Party, wants to address, but likely not to the extent that it really needs to, mainly because of the situation in which the Republican Party's "preferences" puts us as a society. The economy, barring any global disaster ALWAYS WORKS FOR THE WEALTHY. Democrats tug around the edges to try to make the economy work better for everyone, but the reality is that while we have Billionaires, who could ABSOLUTELY NEVER spend all of their money in several lifetimes, they will ALWAY rig the economy to keep themselves wealthy, and people who really try to stop that, run the risk of being destroyed.

The "Economy" is a vague term. For some people, who are struggling to afford their rent or mortgage payments, or for those who used to be able to maybe take a vacation, or who need a new car but can't afford one, the economy absolutely sucks.

For people who want to keep their taxes low and the rules in their favor (coincidently those people own most of the media outlets) it is in their best interests to keep anyone who wants to change the status quo, out of office. So, blaming how people feel about the economy on the party who might actually do something to make the economy work for more people (at the very minor expense of the wealthy), is the strategy.

My finances have not changed dramatically in the span of time between Trump's time in office and when Biden came in. We have managed okay, even with the Pandemic and shut downs. I certainly think that Biden and the Democrats do a better job, but that is because I know that many if not most of them (Democrats) are looking at ways to make my taxes go down, to make school more affordable, to raise wages, etc... They aren't having much success because of Republican obstruction, but they try.

I know that if Republicans take over government, they will look for ways to lower taxes on the wealthy and shift the burden to the middle and working classes, AND try to gut the already struggling social safety net. Again, that is because I get information from sources I believe are trustworthy who give me that narrative. If you are getting a narrative that "Democrats are causing inflation, and are looking to raise your taxes, or shut down businesses with regulations" all day and all night, AND you are stuggling, you start to believe it.

Not stupid (though some truly are) but significanly misinformed. The problem is and has always been the problem of ATTRIBUTION. Both sides are MAD, but conservatives are mad at the WRONG people.

[obnoxiousdrunk]

119. How times have changed

From I feel your pain to are you insane .

[Amaryllis]

122. For those of us living on social security or close to it

and dealing with skyrocketing rent and food prices, it does not feel like a roaring economy.

[SYFROYH]

126. Inflation is still punishing on daily expenditures

Sure, the year to year inflation is decelerating from a high of 9% but 5% OL still hurts when most people have not experienced much inflation in the last 30 years.

[Initech]

127. Because of fucking Fox News, that's why.

It's brainwashing and mental conditioning at its' finest.

[onenote]

131. Not as many people watch Fox as you seem to think.

The average audience for ABC's World News Tonight alone dwarfs the typical prime time audience for Fox.

I guarantee that a lot of people who are still struggling to make ends meet are not Fox News viewers.

[uponit7771]

137. True but FAUX News sets the ratings agenda for the rest of media which is sickening. Obama had

... good LFPR, low UE and no inflation and MAGA still complained about the economy.

Looks like from a link above most of the complaining about economy is partisan - https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=17900131

[Initech]

142. And they also call the shots for nearly the entire GOP.

The GOP as we know it currently wouldn’t exist without Fox News. Fox is basically their PR firm and that’s about it. The GOP reps and senators that get elected by Fox, it’s their job to basically be content creators for that channel.

[uponit7771]

143. +1,

[Polybius]

132. Because it is for many of us?

I base a good economy on stocks, inflation, and gas prices. Triple negative for me.

[Xolodno]

133. It's these kind of OP's that will get us into denial later.

Just looking at the statistics at one point of time and assuming its all roses and rainbows. But a point of time is not indicative of a trend.

Reality, consumer spending is starting to slow down. We haven't heard enough yet on how much previous consumer spending is financed by debt (i.e. credit cards), that will have a negative impact eventually.

Inflation has the misery of making those poor, even more poor. Wealthy? they know where to hedge their investments.

The Fed is saying they may actually slow down rate hikes, that is extremely telling.

Low unemployment numbers? Be careful there. Sometimes that could be indicative of over employment, that is, more people working longer hours or multiple jobs to make ends meet. Or worse, unable to shift jobs for better pay.

It's easy to be emotional when you see the raw numbers, but an economy isn't just static raw numbers, it ebbs and flows.

Culture wars are not doing the GOP any favors that's for sure. But the second they can jump on an economic message, they will. So don't throw caution to the wind. Future numbers may come out worse, the question will be, how do you point out it will get better?

[uponit7771]

138. The UE numbers are real and underemployment is low also(link). Housing up 20% is the

... big one all the way around nationwide and is not going down with the rest of prices.

https://www.rocketmortgage.com/learn/2022-housing-market-predictions#:~:text=Home%20Prices,-Low%20mortgage%20rates&text=Although%2C%20the%20price%20trend%20will,%2C%20according%20to%20Realtor.com.

United States U6 Underemployment Rate

https://www.fxstreet.com/economic-calendar/event/b31ce2fd-dcc8-45a5-9c33-db417e6d939d

[Raine]

141. Hmmmmm because it is. nt

[lpbk2713]

144. MSM likes reporting bad news.

Even if the aren't entirely correct.


"The sky is falling! The sky is falling!"