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babylonsister

(172,759 posts)
Wed May 17, 2023, 03:51 PM May 2023

"I'm a Professor. Florida Just Banned Everything I Teach."

https://www.thedailybeast.com/im-a-professor-florida-just-banned-everything-i-teach?ref=home?ref=home

Opinion
I’m a Professor. Florida Just Banned Everything I Teach.
UNFREE STATE OF FLORIDA
Gov. Ron DeSantis doesn’t want college students to learn anything but whitewashed history about racist violence in America.
William Horne
Published May. 17, 2023 11:18AM ET


Writing during the apartheid regime of Jim Crow, famed historian and founder of Black History Month Carter G. Woodson observed that “the philosophy and ethics resulting from our educational system have justified slavery, peonage, segregation, and lynching.” That system is exactly what Gov. Ron DeSantis has tried to resurrect in signing SB 266 into law, a whitewashing tactic that has historically coincided with white supremacist violence in the U.S.

The law builds on a wave of book, content, and course bans passed by Republican legislators, schools boards, and governors in 36 states over the last year. SB 266 not only forbids scholars of race, class, gender, and inequality from teaching in their areas of expertise, but also requires that general education courses indoctrinate students in the “Western canon,” drawing on a right-wing “American Birthright” curriculum organized in part by DeSantis ally Chris Rufo.

The information that college instructors like me are now forbidden by law from sharing with their adult students under SB 266 leaves them less able to understand the world around them and to critically engage Republican policy priorities like voter suppression or attacks on trans persons that promote inequality. It leaves students less informed and more vulnerable—that appears to be the whole point.

snip//

Attacks on education and access to information like Florida’s SB 266 have never been about “protecting” students or promoting education. They are about wielding power and eliminating dissent. That is what makes this tactic so dangerous and, historically, a precursor to white supremacist violence.


William Horne is an Arthur J. Ennis Postdoctoral Scholar at Villanova University who writes about the relationship of race to labor, freedom, and capitalism during Reconstruction and Jim Crow.
39 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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"I'm a Professor. Florida Just Banned Everything I Teach." (Original Post) babylonsister May 2023 OP
I cannot imagine how angry I would be if I were in this position. MontanaMama May 2023 #1
Time for liberals to leave FL. roamer65 May 2023 #2
No! Lunabell May 2023 #5
This! We have a certain responsibility to those coming after us. Biophilic May 2023 #6
That's Correct!! Reason Never Desists, Reason Always Resists, For Reason Allows Freedoms To Exist! MayReasonRule May 2023 #8
Lawyers hear you, are readying the petitions and billing fees as we speak! One side paid by taxes. Alexander Of Assyria May 2023 #11
One would hope, but... paleotn May 2023 #18
Don't tell liberals what to do. ancianita May 2023 #9
I think you meant good fight tavernier May 2023 #19
lol yeah I was typing on my phone in a loud bar. ancianita May 2023 #26
"Hell no, we won't go!" CaptainTruth May 2023 #13
Agreed Snackshack May 2023 #20
Absolutely not. They actually want liberals to leave. tinrobot May 2023 #23
Stay long enough and you all will need a house boat. roamer65 May 2023 #25
So Devastating for those who Cha May 2023 #3
I never thought I'd see this sci fi come to pass. Farenheit 451 LiberalLovinLug May 2023 #4
Actual History? NowISeetheLight May 2023 #7
Those factual topics would make some "uncomfortable." Yes they will ban all of it. Fascism is here Evolve Dammit May 2023 #12
Why does some people's discomfort outweigh others? royable May 2023 #17
Exactly. My uncomfortableness is equal to that of all the others. ancianita May 2023 #27
History should be factually presented. What we are seeing now is an increasing attempt to not teach Evolve Dammit May 2023 #34
The Democrats are still trying. Yet it all seems unconstitutional and the BeckyDem May 2023 #10
GOP everywhere is passing laws that won't stand up to the first challenge in the Courts. malthaussen May 2023 #14
I'm hoping that is the case. maxsolomon May 2023 #35
Possibly, but they really didn't have enough time to destroy the courts utterly. malthaussen May 2023 #36
People can establish their own informal groups. wnylib May 2023 #15
Why should we find ways to adapt to fascism, even until the courts overturn fascist law? ancianita May 2023 #28
I fully agree that no one should have to go underground wnylib May 2023 #31
I understand the spirit of your suggestions. I just don't agree with it. My stance is that unjust ancianita May 2023 #32
The two approaches are not mutually exclusive. malthaussen May 2023 #37
I hear you. I'm not saying they're zero sum, except when covert study drains public energy from ancianita May 2023 #39
Are you still allowed to stand in front of the class and sing America the Beautiful? Chainfire May 2023 #16
I'm Unclear RobinA May 2023 #21
Yes. malthaussen May 2023 #38
This message was self-deleted by its author RobinA May 2023 #22
From Villanova U's site in Pennsylvania where Dr. Horne teaches: Hortensis May 2023 #24
Where are the universities' legal teams in defending academic freedom?! ancianita May 2023 #29
Fighting in the courts takes a long time, but the U of FL's legal teams Hortensis May 2023 #30
Obama being president blew their racist brains malaise May 2023 #33

roamer65

(37,957 posts)
2. Time for liberals to leave FL.
Wed May 17, 2023, 04:07 PM
May 2023

Leave before the Great Florida Property Crash.

Once the harsh realization of climate change hits the Florida real estate market, it’s going to be a financial bloodbath.

Biophilic

(6,552 posts)
6. This! We have a certain responsibility to those coming after us.
Wed May 17, 2023, 05:26 PM
May 2023

Our job is to claw Florida back from the fascists in order for everyone to have the same rights and freedoms. The only question is do we turn tail and run or stand and fight for what we value.

MayReasonRule

(4,099 posts)
8. That's Correct!! Reason Never Desists, Reason Always Resists, For Reason Allows Freedoms To Exist!
Wed May 17, 2023, 05:35 PM
May 2023

May reason rule where delusion dwells.

 

Alexander Of Assyria

(7,839 posts)
11. Lawyers hear you, are readying the petitions and billing fees as we speak! One side paid by taxes.
Wed May 17, 2023, 05:51 PM
May 2023

paleotn

(22,218 posts)
18. One would hope, but...
Wed May 17, 2023, 06:43 PM
May 2023

after the first 4 years of DeSantis, he was reelected by a wide margin. Nearly 60% if the vote. I fear FL has become nutter central and a lost cause.

ancianita

(43,307 posts)
9. Don't tell liberals what to do.
Wed May 17, 2023, 05:39 PM
May 2023

Last edited Wed May 17, 2023, 09:01 PM - Edit history (1)

We’re here to fight the good fight, and the negativity is not helping.

ancianita

(43,307 posts)
26. lol yeah I was typing on my phone in a loud bar.
Wed May 17, 2023, 09:05 PM
May 2023

Last edited Thu May 18, 2023, 12:01 AM - Edit history (1)

Food fights are beneath Democrats.

We Dems in red states need the national party to back us with the attitude of John Brown:

I have fought a good fight.
I have finished my course.
I have kept the faith. (Timothy 2)



Snackshack

(2,587 posts)
20. Agreed
Wed May 17, 2023, 06:46 PM
May 2023

They say $ makes the world go around. Even when liberals/progressives get together and get an issue on a ballot that gop does not like they just ignore it anyway. Like Az with the cannabis issue. People voted it in gop said you don’t know what you’re doing people we will ignore this.

So yea…people start leaving these places and maybe then the gop will realize that they are not huge demographic they are made out to be and they will either get mature reasonable people that know how compromise is governance or they will slowly die out as their demographic does.

tinrobot

(12,062 posts)
23. Absolutely not. They actually want liberals to leave.
Wed May 17, 2023, 07:37 PM
May 2023

Florida is still a very close state. It could turn blue very easily (as Jacksonville proves)

These anti-education, anti-LGBT, anti-Women laws are awful on purpose. They're partly designed to hound liberals out of the state. If enough liberals leave - then the GOP gets to keep the electoral votes and Senate seats Florida represents.

Cha

(319,086 posts)
3. So Devastating for those who
Wed May 17, 2023, 04:15 PM
May 2023

have spent years being educated to get a degree and have a career teaching.. and this little pos Dictator comes along a wipes that all away in Florida.

My Best Wishes for them to be able to find work where they are appreciated.. And for deSadist to get what's coming to him.

NowISeetheLight

(4,002 posts)
7. Actual History?
Wed May 17, 2023, 05:34 PM
May 2023

If they teach actual history, as it happened, does that become illegal too? My reading of the wording of these Flori-duh laws is that they are banning any teaching of things like “systemic-racism”. But what about just teaching the realty of what happened? The slave trade, plantations, the right to vote, the right to marry, teach the “facts” as its real history. It seems to me these Flori-duh laws are all about not making the snowflakes feel guilty by implying they should feel guilty. So don’t. The facts are bad enough that any reasonable person can comprehend what and who us responsible without actually saying it. As for everyone else, they were a lost cause anyway.

Evolve Dammit

(21,777 posts)
12. Those factual topics would make some "uncomfortable." Yes they will ban all of it. Fascism is here
Wed May 17, 2023, 06:03 PM
May 2023

royable

(1,426 posts)
17. Why does some people's discomfort outweigh others?
Wed May 17, 2023, 06:41 PM
May 2023

What if someone is uncomfortable not being taught the full spectrum of history but only a biased whitewashed slice?

What if someone is uncomfortable learning about white male racist property-holders' manifest destiny?

What if someone is uncomfortable learning about the Repub party of the past 50 years?

ancianita

(43,307 posts)
27. Exactly. My uncomfortableness is equal to that of all the others.
Wed May 17, 2023, 09:07 PM
May 2023

I am uncomfortable with Ron DeSantis. BAN HIM.

Evolve Dammit

(21,777 posts)
34. History should be factually presented. What we are seeing now is an increasing attempt to not teach
Thu May 18, 2023, 12:08 PM
May 2023

certain pieces to make a sanitized version. Talk about "grooming". And much of our history is a blood-soaked nightmare.

BeckyDem

(8,361 posts)
10. The Democrats are still trying. Yet it all seems unconstitutional and the
Wed May 17, 2023, 05:42 PM
May 2023

demagoguery is intense...all to out do Trump.


Democrats bid to use censorship law against DeSantis and ban his book

Opponents say memoir The Courage to Be Free, published in February, violates law governor signed last year

Seeking to take advantage of such uncertainties, Florida Democrats are highlighting instances of language in DeSantis’s book which they contend could violate his own guidelines.

As reported by the Beast, in The Courage to Be Free, DeSantis “use[s] the terms ‘woke’ and ‘gender ideology’ 46 times and 10 times respectively, both of which could constitute ‘divisive concepts’ the governor has argued should stay out of curricula up to the college level”.
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2023/apr/05/democrats-ron-desantis-censorship-law-book-ban

malthaussen

(18,572 posts)
14. GOP everywhere is passing laws that won't stand up to the first challenge in the Courts.
Wed May 17, 2023, 06:10 PM
May 2023

They're doing it deliberately, because until the laws are overturned, they will affect millions.

-- Mal

maxsolomon

(38,729 posts)
35. I'm hoping that is the case.
Thu May 18, 2023, 01:10 PM
May 2023

I'm thinking they have an expectation that the disaster for the Federal Judiciary that was the Trump years may keep them intact.

malthaussen

(18,572 posts)
36. Possibly, but they really didn't have enough time to destroy the courts utterly.
Thu May 18, 2023, 01:35 PM
May 2023

The appeals process still takes time, and will be abused at every chance, and then when it gets to the USSC, the result will depend on how the law fits in with the Court's agenda. Which does not mean that every crazy law the RW passes will be safe, as they are finding out. The Court is an ally, but they do not endorse everything the RW loonies desire.

-- Mal

wnylib

(26,019 posts)
15. People can establish their own informal groups.
Wed May 17, 2023, 06:14 PM
May 2023

These groups do not need to be associated with any particular organization or school.

Call them book clubs. For group reading and discussion, choose books about the history of race relations in America, from slavery to Jim Crow, the lynchings, hoses, dogs, the civil rights movement and MLK, etc. Cover all the topics that the fascist governor has outlawed for state schools and colleges, including systemic racism.

African Americans might be the ones most interested in groups like this, but I'm sure that there are Whites and other POC who'd be interested. The groups can include issues faced by Asians, Native Americans, Hispanics, Jews, Muslims, and other non Christian religions.

They could meet in people's homes so that no church, library, or other public place could be ordered to shut down or stop allowing the meetings.

Facts and truths would continue to be known and passed on. Children could be included if they are old enough to understand and deal with the material.



ancianita

(43,307 posts)
28. Why should we find ways to adapt to fascism, even until the courts overturn fascist law?
Wed May 17, 2023, 09:15 PM
May 2023

We have to nip this unconstitutional fascism in the bud. and fight local, district, state and federal censorship.
We should never have to go 'underground' over unjust laws.
People in their private groups will be under fascist surveillance by neighbors, and bounties offered to those who turn them in. The right of privacy and free association are already under attack by those who hate LGBTQ, BLM, etc.
This is no way to live.
Where do we end up when fascism is the standard? The moral people who have their freedom stolen are in jail.
We can't let any state get to that point.

wnylib

(26,019 posts)
31. I fully agree that no one should have to go underground
Wed May 17, 2023, 09:59 PM
May 2023

Also agree that we have to fight this at all levels to defeat unjust fascist laws and get the fascists out of power.

But so far, it is not illegal to hold meetings in one's home to study what is no longer available in schools. So why not continue to teach privately what is not being taught publicly? Just like women who are denied abortions and emergency medical care are finding ways to get the care when they need it.

For several generations, until the 1960s, it was illegal in the US for Native Americans to practice Native religions because the dominant culture believed that Native prayer dances were incitements to violent rebellions. In residential schools, the children were not allowed to use their Native language or practice Native customs. Even outside of the schools there were attempts to prevent Native people on reservations from teaching the language and customs to returning children or for adults to practice them. But people found ways to do it, sometimes right under the noses of Indian agents by using Christian holidays and saints' days as pretexts for gathering to acknowledge Native sacred events and practices. Traditions and knowledge were preserved that way until it was no longer illegal to practice them.

The point is that people can defy the laws while working to get rid of them and the people who pass them. I am not suggesting that people hide to discuss and learn on their own time in their own homes. The laws say that these things cannot be taught in schools and colleges. They do not forbid people from passing on knowledge outside of educational institutions. If DeSantis tried to stop that, it would be such an outrageous violation of rights within one's own home that he would not be able to do it without federal intervention to stop him. It would become an act of civil disobedience to refuse to be silenced. It is one way to fight back, while also fighting back in court. Outrageous that it is necessary? Yes, of course it is. That's the point. Show the fascists that they cannot suppress knowledge.









ancianita

(43,307 posts)
32. I understand the spirit of your suggestions. I just don't agree with it. My stance is that unjust
Wed May 17, 2023, 11:35 PM
May 2023

public laws should be fought in the open. Taken to trial. Covered by media. Appealed, lost asap, and then campaigned against in every election ever after, then written about in history books.

I can't find any group that's fighting censorship except PEN America and Penguin Random House, who right now are suing just one Florida school district today over removing books about race and LGBTQ+ identities.
One district is too narrow a fight, even if it's intended to get to appellate levels and be constitutionally overturned.

What I don't get is why, when they sue a district that is following state law, the plaintiffs don't also challenge those actual FL laws themselves, not just district decisions forced by those laws. It's the cause, those laws that need overturning, not just teh symptom.

All FL citizens with school kids should have standing in any suit against that Florida HB 7 law, as it's called. Another two related laws are HB 1557, Parental Rights in Education, and HB 1467, which requires school districts to be transparent in the selection of instructional materials, including library and reading materials.

Anyway, this is not the way a state school system's curriculum should be run, where a few parents dictate what all the other parents' kids in a district or state are allowed to read. Every state in the country already allows for citizen input into state curricula through the State Board of Education, which decides what content is literally taught for school accreditation, student textbook use and graduation requirements. The rest of published books are not censored, except by individual parents who, under state policy, must then select a substitute for any discretionary reading assigned in classrooms. And school libraries? Pfffft Ridiculous. Parents should blame themselves for what their kids check out of libraries, and certainly not the librarian professionals with library science degrees.

Ron DeSantis disdains public schools, as all fascists do, and abuses his power to run them like his kids' private school is run.
Here's his defense of anti-wokeism in state schools.
https://www.flgov.com/2023/03/08/governor-ron-desantis-debunks-book-ban-hoax/

Here is the PEN America plaintiff's background work toward their suit:
PEN America's State of Book Bans in the USA: An Overview
https://pen.org/report/banned-in-the-usa-state-laws-supercharge-book-suppression-in-schools/





malthaussen

(18,572 posts)
37. The two approaches are not mutually exclusive.
Thu May 18, 2023, 01:37 PM
May 2023

Open fight does not preclude covert study.

-- Mal

ancianita

(43,307 posts)
39. I hear you. I'm not saying they're zero sum, except when covert study drains public energy from
Thu May 18, 2023, 03:15 PM
May 2023

the open public fights, and court fights. And I'm not dismissing wnylib out of hand. But to me, coping doesn't sit right.

I realize that people's first response is often to try to adapt and carry on.
But we need to learn from history about how that's not really worked, even as recently as the Obama administration.
My stance is that we as Americans must never try to "cope" with unjust fascist laws under 'rule of men' like DeSantis, or 'under' any other elected deprivers of freedoms.
Which is why I'm a Biden Democrat.

Since Biden has reclaimed the word "freedom," we should be like Biden and act like it.

RobinA

(10,478 posts)
21. I'm Unclear
Wed May 17, 2023, 07:02 PM
May 2023

as to how this is even legal. Doesn't the 1st Amendment trump (sorry) this kind of state law? What am missing? Or are they showboating knowing full well this won't stand.

malthaussen

(18,572 posts)
38. Yes.
Thu May 18, 2023, 01:39 PM
May 2023

The GOP is doing this all over the country, in many ways. They pass laws that will not stand the first challenge in court, because it looks good. While the suits go through the appeals process, people will suffer, and that is the point.

-- Mal

Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
24. From Villanova U's site in Pennsylvania where Dr. Horne teaches:
Wed May 17, 2023, 07:50 PM
May 2023
Areas of Interest:
African American History, Slavery and Emancipation, Race and Capitalism, Incarceration, Racial Science

Course List: (at Villanova in PA)
Spr23-ACS-1001-CA1 Moderns
Spr23-ACS-1001-CA2 Moderns
Spr23-HIS-1155-001 TOP:Black Freedom Struggle
Spr23-PJ-5000-001 TOP:Lovecraft Cnty &Racl State

I didn't look the "Moderns" classses up, but it certainly looks true that "everything he teaches" is now banned at Florida's state-funded institutions.

ancianita

(43,307 posts)
29. Where are the universities' legal teams in defending academic freedom?!
Wed May 17, 2023, 09:18 PM
May 2023

State universities do not turn over their institutional rights at the legislature door.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
30. Fighting in the courts takes a long time, but the U of FL's legal teams
Wed May 17, 2023, 09:57 PM
May 2023

work for the State of FL.

Others not controlled by state government are beyond doubt hard at work on the defense of academic freedom and other related rights, as they are everywhere rights are under attack.

A plus, of course, is that many of these far-right attacks on people's rights are obviously unconstitutional or otherwise legally flawed and will be overruled. I haven't read about the state's right to say what state money will fund versus other issues involved. I'm sure academic freedom isn't the only one.

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