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Grins

(9,520 posts)
Wed May 24, 2023, 11:17 AM May 2023

WaPo. "Shoot the messenger!"

As a WaPo subscriber I get "The Early 202" via a daily email.

Today's email hit a nerve. Its opening story was about the debt ceiling. Some snips:

Democrats are growing increasingly frustrated with how the White House is handling the negotiations. Some Democrats... have privately groused that the White House has bungled the messaging, is putting Democrats in a terrible negotiating position and could be forced to eat most of McCarthy's demands.

“I’ve never seen such a massive, surprising and consequential potential failure. We'll see where this comes out, but by definition we're only measuring success on how much we lost.” - Dem Congressman.

Democrats point to substandard messaging from the White House and the lack of visibility from the president ...(who has) not spoken publicly at length about the debt limit. ...a stark contrast to McCarthy and his top negotiators, (who) have been holding court with reporters multiple times per day and hammering home their party’s message.

Anyone disagree with that? A test:
- Name the RNC spokesman.
- Now name the DNC spokesman.

I'll bet most got the first but not the second. The RNC spokesperson is always in front of the media, often multiple times a week. I can't remember the last time the DNC spokesman appeared!! A year ago? Longer?

On almost every major issue we seem to be responding after-the-fact. From Afghanistan, to inflation, to the price of gas, to the supply-chain, to Ukraine, and now the debt ceiling, we don't get out and in front of the issue(s).

My guess is there is some problem between the White House and the DNC, but really don't know. But it's a big problem. Will Rogers' famous line: "I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat." has become dangerously true.

23 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
WaPo. "Shoot the messenger!" (Original Post) Grins May 2023 OP
Unfortunately, that's the way it usually is... tableturner May 2023 #1
They would have to actually want to avoid cuts to social programs. Look at the big donors. n/t brewens May 2023 #2
Who are you defining as the spokesman for either Party? brooklynite May 2023 #3
WOW............ Lovie777 May 2023 #4
This was the topic of one of my own threads f_townsend May 2023 #5
+++. Coordination sucks. Wisconsin has Ron Johnson Tetrachloride May 2023 #10
I think Lawrence O'Donnell's explanation on his show last night cilla4progress May 2023 #6
Thanks for that link. It's a good explanation of what wnylib May 2023 #12
Never mind that the Debt is never negotiated. pwb May 2023 #7
So their complaint is that Biden isn't tipping his hand? Mister Ed May 2023 #8
Jeff Jackson is the BEST Dem 'explainer' to public blm May 2023 #9
And now blm May 2023 #11
He's so good, gotta wonder cilla4progress May 2023 #13
Not only that. I totally disagree with the thesis of the article. Scrivener7 May 2023 #14
Yeah, well, when the public starts blaming Biden and the Dem members of Congress for f_townsend May 2023 #16
Spreading sunshine again, I see. Scrivener7 May 2023 #17
Feels like a "Well, I have to write something" article Sympthsical May 2023 #19
The whole debt ceiling discussion seems like kabuki. The same stories every time it Scrivener7 May 2023 #21
It's why I'm not stressing/reading about it mostly Sympthsical May 2023 #22
Exactly. And then it will be caravans and pizza parlor sex rings again. Scrivener7 May 2023 #23
Unfortunately this problem was inevitable liberalmediaaddict May 2023 #15
Don't know who rnc spokesperson is. Don't have a clue. spanone May 2023 #18
Which cowardly "Dem Congressman" is hiding behind anonymity onenote May 2023 #20
 

brewens

(15,359 posts)
2. They would have to actually want to avoid cuts to social programs. Look at the big donors. n/t
Wed May 24, 2023, 11:19 AM
May 2023
 

brooklynite

(96,882 posts)
3. Who are you defining as the spokesman for either Party?
Wed May 24, 2023, 11:21 AM
May 2023

Its certainly not the Party chair, because that's not their job.

 

f_townsend

(260 posts)
5. This was the topic of one of my own threads
Wed May 24, 2023, 11:28 AM
May 2023

I wanted to know what TV/radio ads the DNC was producing to inform the public how the GOP is holding the economy and Social Security/Medicare/Medicaid hostage. Instead, I got shouted down by apologists.

Apparently, Joe and Jane Q. Public all spend their time reading liberal blogs or paying close attention to liberal Twitter posters, so they don't need to see billboards or hear radio ads warning the public about the GOP at all (sarcasm)

Party messaging and strategy continues to pretty much suck. There's little or no coordination between local, state, and federal level Democrats. And we know that many local and state Democrat party chapters have been left to fend entirely for themselves, abandoned by the party leadership -- a total repudiation of Howard Dean's efforts. New blood is needed in the party.

cilla4progress

(26,526 posts)
6. I think Lawrence O'Donnell's explanation on his show last night
Wed May 24, 2023, 11:37 AM
May 2023

was plausible.

He thinks Joe and his advisor in the matter Steve Richetti are playing it just right!

You can catch it here.

wnylib

(26,455 posts)
12. Thanks for that link. It's a good explanation of what
Wed May 24, 2023, 12:17 PM
May 2023

is likely going on in the debt and budget discussions. McCarthy is delivering a message that makes him look good to Republican voters, but Biden is quietly using the discussions to get what he wants, without fanfare.

At some point, Biden will need to take credit for what he accomplishes in order to satisfy his Dem critics (including the ones on this board) that he knows what he's doing.

pwb

(12,802 posts)
7. Never mind that the Debt is never negotiated.
Wed May 24, 2023, 11:44 AM
May 2023

Debt= Never negotiated.
Budget= always negotiated.

Some democrats in congress need to read the Constitution. My copy is worn.
Article 1 section 8 line 1
"The Congress shall have the Power to lay and collect, Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the
Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of The United States."

Mister Ed

(6,991 posts)
8. So their complaint is that Biden isn't tipping his hand?
Wed May 24, 2023, 11:57 AM
May 2023

I'm not much of a card player, but I think that would be bad strategy.

blm

(114,761 posts)
9. Jeff Jackson is the BEST Dem 'explainer' to public
Wed May 24, 2023, 12:02 PM
May 2023

and Dem party leaders are idiots if they don’t take advantage of his unique abilities.

Scrivener7

(60,067 posts)
14. Not only that. I totally disagree with the thesis of the article.
Wed May 24, 2023, 04:16 PM
May 2023

I am usually the first to complain about Democratic messaging.

In this case, I think Biden's low key response is exactly right. Let the republiQans run around with their hair on fire. Biden knows what he's about and he's not going to descend with them into silly season.

My guess is there's no problem, some sidelined Democrat gave them a sentence and they are making hay about it.

 

f_townsend

(260 posts)
16. Yeah, well, when the public starts blaming Biden and the Dem members of Congress for
Wed May 24, 2023, 11:49 PM
May 2023

what the GOP is doing, we'll all know you were completely wrong.

Sympthsical

(11,114 posts)
19. Feels like a "Well, I have to write something" article
Thu May 25, 2023, 08:48 AM
May 2023

There are only so many angles of attack about a story, and eventually writers run out of things or find the other angles covered by other reporters in house. So you end up with these nibbling around the edges, I found one guy for a quote, so let's do 500 words about tenor, tone, or texture of the thing rather than discuss the thing itself.

It fills space, but it doesn't feel useful.

Scrivener7

(60,067 posts)
21. The whole debt ceiling discussion seems like kabuki. The same stories every time it
Thu May 25, 2023, 10:11 AM
May 2023

happens, told the same way, engineered to create maximum fear and panic.

I once knew a very abusive person who loved to manufacture situations like this. That is what the republiQan house is doing. Creating fear for fear's sake.

Just once, I would LOVE to see the press cover the facts of it: do a story on how it never happens when a republiQan is president, how it doesn't mean what republiQans and the vast majority of Americans think it means, and how this is the republiQans fucking with their fawning constituents' own finances in a very real way for no reason whatsoever.

That's why I think Biden is right to downplay it. When they create fear for fear's sake, don't give it air. Instead, show what they are doing.

Sympthsical

(11,114 posts)
22. It's why I'm not stressing/reading about it mostly
Thu May 25, 2023, 10:23 AM
May 2023

It feels like theater. Some kind of deal with be reached. The world will move on to the next crisis.

It's mostly political positioning/posturing to come out of it with a narrative advantage. McCarthy knows he can't look like he's master of a burning house (bit too late), so we get all this.

I fully expect there will be no default at the end of the day.

Scrivener7

(60,067 posts)
23. Exactly. And then it will be caravans and pizza parlor sex rings again.
Thu May 25, 2023, 10:25 AM
May 2023

The continually amazing thing about American politics, though, is that NOTHING the republiQans EVER get hysterical over is real. And we DO let them get away with that.

liberalmediaaddict

(998 posts)
15. Unfortunately this problem was inevitable
Wed May 24, 2023, 04:40 PM
May 2023

The minute the MAGA Sedition Caucus won control of the House every sane DC lawmaker knew they weren't going to agree to raise the debt ceiling or to any budget.

Biden's approach at this point is to work out a deal that 1. Raises the debt limit until after the 2024 election and 2. Sets up a budget agreement to avoid a government shutdown in September.

Biden knows from experience that any downgrade in our credit rating or government shutdown will get blamed on him. So he's trying to put this issue to bed so the Republicans don't repeat this hostage negotiation in 9 months.



onenote

(46,228 posts)
20. Which cowardly "Dem Congressman" is hiding behind anonymity
Thu May 25, 2023, 08:53 AM
May 2023

to attack Biden? Would like to know.

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