Why Is There So Much Ambiguity With Judge Cannon?

[gab13by13]

Is she permanently assigned to Trump's trial or not?

Was she assigned to Trump's case by the Chief Clerk or was she selected by a random draw?

If she is permanent will she set the trial date on Tuesday?

Will Jack Smith ask her to recuse herself and send the request to the Appeals Court?

I do not understand why no one knows if she is permanent, it makes her appointment seem shady.

Too many people here at DU are trivializing Cannon being in charge of the trial, she can do a lot of damage. If she is the judge it will be a travesty.

[intrepidity]

1. I think because we just don't know?

It is highly troublesome to me. I have read about the damage she can do, and I don't trust her, period.

We will know on Tuesday, sit tight.

[live love laugh]

2. ✔️

[Sneederbunk]

27. Most here are not aware of Federal Criminal Procedure.

[democratsruletheday]

3. I've read on Daily Kos that it's permanent

but there will be huge pressure on her to toe the line due to getting slapped down twice already by the appellate court. That appellate court is 2/3 Trump appointees and they still reigned her in. They could do it again if she gets out of line. Smith is no dummy....I think he has an ace up his sleeve or is playing a little rope-a-dope here in terms of the long game. Remember, the case in DC for the Jan. 6th shit show is stronger than this one from what I've read, plus WIllis In Georgia is in line too.

[gab13by13]

7. See what I mean,

you are trivializing her being the judge.

I guarantee you that if she is the judge she will never do what the Manhattan judge did in the Stormy Daniels trial.

Judge Merchan issued a semi-gag order on Trump, such as the following;

Trump will be permitted to view "limited" evidence but cannot publicly discuss or disclose the material.

Cannon will do no such thing, she will allow Trump to taint the jury pool, intimidate the jury pool and spew his lies all over social media.

That is just 1 example of what she will do, I have a lot more.

No way in a million years would Jack Smith want her to be the judge, will he deal with it, he sure will but he shouldn't have to.

[onenote]

21. How will he deal with it?

[onenote]

4. Because there a dozen voices, some claiming to be expert, who think they know how the process works

When in fact most of them don't actually know. I don't know either, but the process almost certainly has more elements to it than most of those commenting realize.

[gab13by13]

8. I was told here that Cannon was just appointed temporarily,

so I did some searching and found out that in Florida the Chief clerk has the authority to assign judges to cases. If that is what happened why hasn't someone said that?

I have been told that Cannon was chosen by a random draw and I will never believe that happened until I see the evidence.

Back to the title of my thread, why is there so much ambiguity?

[RockRaven]

5. Why are so many people spinning themselves up over ambiguities today when they know

perfectly well that clarity will be available in the near future?

Real answers based on official proceedings will be available on Tuesday. What is the point losing one's mind over pundit babble which includes "may" or "is expected" or "sources say" or "is possible" when you can get the actual information in a couple days?

[gab13by13]

9. I will bookmark your post and get back with you on Tuesday.

You know where I stand regarding Cannon being the judge, I am not afraid to give my opinions.

She was chosen improperly to preside over the search warrant for stolen documents, so I have some history to be skeptical why she was chosen a 2nd time.

[onenote]

10. What made her selection to preside over the search warrant improper?

And if it was improper, why was no effort made to challenge it?

Your OP makes the point -- most people, and that includes you, don't really know the ins and outs of the assignment process.

[gab13by13]

12. OMG hurry and turn on msnbc

Laurence Tribe is on and he must not know that there is a gag order about talking about Cannon until after Tuesday.

Tribe just said that by law Cannon should recuse herself because a reasonable person can infer that she is biased toward Donald Trump.

[onenote]

13. Well, the 11th Circuit disagreed, so Tribe's opinion is worth jackshit.

And I'd still like to hear why her assignment in the search warrant case was improper.

[gab13by13]

16. Tribe cited the law/rule that governs recusal,

I missed hearing it all, but he said that she is required to recuse herself if a reasonable person can assume that she is biased towards Donald Trump.

Your defense of Cannon is based solely upon the 11th Circuit not claiming that she was biased, I say, so what. The 11th circuit gave her a pretty good beatdown and she was almost reprimanded because of her actions that were favorable towards Donald Trump.

[onenote]

19. "almost reprimanded"?

Link?

And the 11th Circuit remanded the case back to her for her to carry out their order after they reversed her decision. District court judges get reversed all the time, sometimes brutally, and the fact that they get reversed doesn't create a presumption that they're biased.

If it was so clear cut, wouldn't Smith seek to have her recused citing the rule?

[LiberalFighter]

6. We can only wait until it happens.

[getagrip_already]

11. Media coin of the realm......

People are confused and concerned, so of course the media is dumping a vomit bucket of opinions.

It drives up viewership and engagement, and ad dollars follow.

It doesn't matter how certain they are. They will put out conflicting opinions.

Situation normal......

[brooklynite]

20. "It doesn't matter how certain they are. They will put out conflicting opinions."

Of course, so will people here.

Other than asking my wife might happen with bail on Tuesday, I haven’t spent my time pondering what Judge Cannon will do or when the trial will start, or what will happen to Trump’s accomplice. We’ll find out soon enough.

[getagrip_already]

28. Arraignment are usually boring stuff.....

Charges get entered, a plea made, and terms of release or bail/bond, as well as travel restrictions.

The presiding judge may or may not set a date for the next hearing where they will begin to schedule hearings and responses to initial motions.

It may not even be the primary judge doing arraignment.

So it really won't tell people much, except how much deference she offers in those few areas.

[Kingofalldems]

14. Looks like the goalposts have once again been moved I see.

[gab13by13]

15. OMG Tribe is really bashing Cannon,

and he just said that it looks like she will be the judge, WTF, doesn't Tribe even know how the process works? Why is he making assumptions without knowing squat about Constitutional law?

Tribe said that what Cannon did was beyond her authority in the stolen document case, and tribe said it was a travesty when she appointed a special master.

Why isn't Tribe waiting until Tuesday, he seems so uptight about Cannon?

[onenote]

25. Yes, it was a travesty that she committed a gross legal error in the search warrant case

But it also is well settled that, under 18 USC 455 (the recusal statute ), recusal "generally must involve apparent bias deriving from an extrajudicial source, meaning something above and beyond judicial rulings or opinions formed in presiding over the case." United States v. Bergrin, 682 F.3d 261, 282 (3d Cir. 2012), cert. denied, -- U.S. ---, 133 S.Ct. 674 (Nov. 26, 2012). And while the Supreme Court noted in Liteky v. United States, 510 U.S. 540, 551 (1994) that "
It is wrong in theory, though it may not be too far off the mark as a practical matter, to suggest, as many opinions have, that 'extrajudicial source' is the only basis for establishing disqualifying bias or prejudice," the Court went on to state that when a party does not cite to extrajudicial sources, the Judge's opinions and remarks must reveal a "deep-seated" or "high degree" of "favoritism or antagonism that would make fair judgment impossible." Id. at 555-56 and that "Judicial rulings alone almost never constitute a valid basis for a bias or partiality motion . . . [They] can only in the rarest circumstances evidence the degree of favoritism or antagonism required . . . when no extrajudicial source is involved. Almost invariably, they are proper grounds for appeal, not for recusal." Id at 555.

[brooklynite]

17. Answer, because the Court doesn't respond to the blogosphere.

You’ll have to wait till Tuesday.

[Fiendish Thingy]

18. It's the weekend.

We’ll know more in 48 hours.

Think of the months of uncertainty we’ve all endured, we can endure a couple more days.

[gab13by13]

22. What does Joyce Vance know?

She just said that Cannon was selected fair and square,

VANCE: This is about how the public will view this case. And because of her decisions in the earlier matter where the 11th Circuit didn’t just reverse her, but they said she was out of bounds, that she lacked jurisdiction. They moved extraordinarily quickly to prevent her from allowing Trump to engage in delay. I think that alone might hamper her decision-making.

But the judge who oversees the case has a lot of authority to make subtle decisions that don’t necessarily come to public notice in time to impact the outcome of a case. She could impact the selection of jurors. She will rule on pretrial motions.

She would rule on the admissibility of evidence if she was the trial judge. And the reality is, in a case like this, the public won’t have confidence whether she acquits or convict. Better to pass it on to another judge who doesn’t have that kind of a track record here.

Watch the clip above via MSNBC.

[EndlessWire]

23. I don't blame OP one bit

for questioning this. Saying "just wait" might be pragmatic but it sure doesn't help if you're trying to understand this very important event. Plus, what with Trump calling for people to show up to do G-d knows what, it is helpful to understand what might happen.

I am stunned that Cannon has returned. I recall that most everyone on DU said how idiotic her reasoning and rulings were. Many icons of the board freely analyzed, along with our favorite lawyers, every nuance of her crap and what it meant. In this way, we learned.

Well, the stakes are higher now. Now we are in the suck. I want to know how the hell this person arrived back to torment us with the high probability that she is biased in favor of Trump, and probably will seek to quash everything.

I do think that Trump deserves his day in court. But, he doesn't act like a normal person, and apparently doesn't want to present his side in any kind of litigant way. He just wants to game the system.

It seems like such an easy answer. What was the procedure, how did she end up back as the judge? Surely, someone must know. More important, how can we get rid of her? Yes, it seems like judge shopping--but my country depends on a fair and impartial judge, which she is not.

I am sure that if Donald can be gotten, Jack can. I hope someone will explain at end of day Tuesday what happened.

As much as I respect and enjoy MT boys, they relied on the court observer to inform everyone what was going on.

Good luck to us all! Trump has to go. He's a Hitler wannabe, and if he wins the next election, he's gonna hurt a lot of people.

[onenote]

24. Why so much ambiguity? Because the local assignment procedures are extremely flexible.

Feel free to read them.

https://www.flsd.uscourts.gov/sites/flsd/files/17-10-17-Internal-Operating-Procedures.pdf

[dalton99a]

26. The chief clerk said Cannon's assignment is permanent:

Asked over email whether normal procedures were followed and Judge Cannon’s assignment was random, Ms. Noble wrote: “Normal procedures were followed.” ...

The clerk clarified another matter: whether Judge Cannon would continue to handle the case. Since news of Judge Cannon’s assignment emerged early Friday, observers have speculated that it could only be an initial assignment before being handed to another judge.

But Ms. Noble confirmed that no court practice would return the case to be assigned to another judge. In short, Judge Cannon’s assignment is permanent unless she were to step aside.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/10/us/politics/judge-aileen-cannon-trump-documents.html
https://archive.ph/rXL95