Latest trump defense on classified docs

[Laura PourMeADrink]

"I'm a busy guy, I wanted to go thru every single box. Who knows, there was a vast amount of personal stuff.( Like ties) That's what I was looking for. " !Paraphrasing)

In all honesty, to me, best defense ( albeit tons of holes) he's come up with. IMHO. If you've got a better one, explain...

[LetMyPeopleVote]

1. The National Archives have responded to TFG's stupid claim

Link to tweet

[Laura PourMeADrink]

2. Thanks. Do wish David Heath had provided a link though, huh.

Don't think this message is getting thru at all. That is to the people who support Dipshit. They literally believe him that he has the power and would never read this statement for themselves. trump knows this very well. Why, if he inexplicably gets the nom, he won't debate.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

13. Here is a good link to the press release issued by the National Archives

This press release was released after the indictment and makes clear that all of TFG's claims about complying with the Presidential Records Act are false

Link to tweet

https://www.archives.gov/press/press-releases/2022/nr22-001#June-9-2023-statement

June 9, 2023, statement
Recent media reports have generated a large number of queries about Presidential records and the Presidential Records Act (PRA), 44 U.S.C. 2201-2209. The PRA requires that all records created by Presidents (and Vice-Presidents) be turned over to the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) at the end of their administrations. Below is additional information about how NARA carries out its responsibilities under the PRA. Please note that the PRA treats the records of the President and those of the Vice President in almost the same manner such that, in most cases below, President and Vice President can be used interchangeably.


How much time do outgoing Presidents have to go through their papers to determine what to retain as personal documents?

The Presidential Records Act (PRA) requires the President to separate personal documents from Presidential records before leaving office. 44 U.S.C. 2203(b). The PRA makes clear that, upon the conclusion of the President’s term in office, NARA assumes responsibility for the custody, control, preservation of, and access to the records of a President. 44 U.S.C. 2203(g)(1). The PRA makes the legal status of Presidential records clear and unambiguous, providing that the United States reserves and retains “complete ownership, possession, and control of Presidential records.” 44 U.S.C. 2202. There is no history, practice, or provision in law for presidents to take official records with them when they leave office to sort through, such as for a two-year period as described in some reports. If a former President or Vice President finds Presidential records among personal materials, he or she is expected to contact NARA in a timely manner to secure the transfer of those Presidential records to NARA. ...

How are documents in the White House determined to be an official Presidential record or a personal record?

The Presidential Records Act (PRA) defines what constitutes “Presidential records” and what are “personal records.” 44 U.S.C. 2201. Personal records include “diaries, journals, or other personal notes serving as the functional equivalent of a diary or journal which are not prepared or utilized for, or circulated or communicated in the course of, transacting Government business.”

The PRA also requires that all documentary materials “be categorized as Presidential records or personal records upon their creation or receipt and be filed separately.” 44 U.S.C. 2203(b). The President does not have discretion to categorize a Presidential record as a personal record. ....

What are “Presidential records” under the Presidential Records Act (PRA)?

"’Presidential records’ means documentary materials created or received by the President, the President’s immediate staff, or a unit or individual of the Executive Office of the President whose function is to advise or assist the President, in the course of conducting activities which relate to or have an effect upon the carrying out of the constitutional, statutory, or other official or ceremonial duties of the President.”

[Laura PourMeADrink]

16. Thank you SO much LMPV !!

[LiberalFighter]

7. Byron Donalds has demonstrated his lack of intelligence numerious times.

[MissMillie]

17. I read the entire NARA press release

As with every president since Reagan, NARA offered TFG and his staff assistance with sorting through documents before 1/20/21.

TFG decided he didn't want the help.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

18. This press release guts most of TFG's defenses

[MissMillie]

20. It may not.... (hear me out)

TFG is not being charged under the PRA.

I think that what NARA has to say is useful, but it may have--in a legal sense--no bearing on charges under the Espionage Act.

The most rock solid thing that Smith has (IMO) is the obstruction charge--if he has evidence that will convince a jury of obstruction.

There WAS a subpoena for all documents with "Classified" markings. The indictment lays out a narrative where TFG actively worked to keep some of these documents from being returned. If Smith has evidence that will convince a jury of what the indictment says, then it's game over.

What's his/not his... not legally relevant to whether or not he returned all documents with "classified markings."

What's classified/not classified/declassified... not legally relevant to whether or not he returned all documents with "classified markings."

Moving boxes around, having his lawyer(s) attest to thorough searches and statements that they've returned everything... VERY relevant to this legal case.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

21. TFG is trying to use the Presidential Records Act as a defense

The Presidential Records Act does not apply to the charges against TFG and is not a defense to these charges. The statements by the National Archives are designed to gut the claimed defense by TFG based on the Presidential Records Act.

[MissMillie]

24. Exactly

I guess that's what I was trying to articulate. You were better at that than I was.

I believe NARA's press release (the original one) came out long before the indictment did. It does indeed slam down TFG's "defense," but of course it appears he's trying to "defend" against something he hasn't been charged with. Doesn't sound like a winning strategy.

[Tommy Carcetti]

3. Except he was on tape bragging about...

…”super secret documents” that he admitted weren’t declassified.

[malaise]

4. Busy playing golf

and prancing on stage at rallies
Fuck off scumbag!

[ProfessorGAC]

22. Nope

He was busy cheating at golf!

[malaise]

23. Indeed

He cheats at everything😀

[tanyev]

5. Sure, how many times did President Obama have a half empty box of classified documents

sitting out in his residence and absentmindedly toss in a tie and pair of shoes at the end of a long day?



Oh, I'm being told that that happened ZERO times.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

9. Lol. Read Obama team was meticulous with classified

docs. Post meetings people would scramble to collect ALL copies.

Still don't get why critical defense and intelligence depts weren't and aren't squawking.

Ties? His red ones are so long they wouldn't fit with anything else

[ExWhoDoesntCare]

26. The defense and intell departments can't talk about any of it.

That's sort of the point about classified information.

They'll do their squawking through appropriate channels, and those won't be any that the public will see.

Ever.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

27. They can't even say x # of classified docs were retained by prez?

They either didn't follow up when the copies weren't returned...like during trump's reign of terror. OR they did and reported it to a trump lover who laughed?

We've talked about this before. No one wants to make their dept look bad. But can't believe no one is talking about how piss poor the tracking of docs is. Guess they can consider themselves lucky

[Kid Berwyn]

6. "No time to go through this stuff."

“Because I used the transition period to try and overturn the election.”

[gratuitous]

12. And in a state of denial; don't forget the denial

Which continues to this day, the defendant's refusal to believe that he could have lost the 2020 election. Takes up a lot of a guy's time.

[kentuck]

8. And all the time he was searching for his personal stuff...

He never came across any of those national security secrets, because that is not what he was looking for? He could have skipped right over them as he was looking for a tie or a photo? He was such a busy man, with all the charitable events he had to attend. He never had a lot of time at Mar-a-Lago. But, he eventually would have found them all and turned them over to the Archives. Yeah, that's the ticket.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

10. You made me think - let's just say 100 highly classified

docs were at ML. And we know that the attys found x of those in the "setup/staged" boxes for subpoena.

Maybe trump had shuffled them around? Hid the most important ones ( to him ) and intermingled the ones he didn't care about for the atty to find. He knew it would be suspicious if attys found zero. Now why he would ask the atty what the damage was is unclear.

[kentuck]

11. He had written on a lot of the box lids...

..and they replaced a lot of the lids.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

19. Ah. Most suspicious thing in indictment - him ordering

new lids!! Why in the world would he care? Jeez never thought HE wrote on them. You're probably right. I was thinking that lids might have had the contents or origins written on them. Like NSA, VIA, DoD... Big stuff.

Holy shit Kentuck! Lids are smoking gun!!!

[sarcasmo]

14. The guy who has worn the same red tie since 2016, says he was looking for ties. LOL

[ananda]

15. Ermm.. ties in a classified documents box?

Give me a big fukking break!

[ecstatic]

25. UMMM... then just return all boxes and let the Archives mail you any ties

or shoes that (for some dumbass reason) were packed alongside top nuclear secrets.

I mean, you claim to be a fucking billionaire. Why would a billionaire be worried about losing a tie or two?