'Ready-to-rumble' are violent teens reliving Boomers past?

[Model35mech]

I'm remembering when 'West-Side' story was a super-hit weaving together love, ethnic and gang violence of the 50's and 60's.

This is brought to mind by two 'Rumbles' at Church festivals in the past 2 weeks.

The most recent one was last night a Annunciation Greek Orthodox Church's large GreekFest where fighting teens created chaos and then panic as fear of a kid with a gun spread through the Carnival-like midway of the event on the WI State Fair grounds. The panic may be understandable as two weeks ago it was multiple fights and shooting at St. John Viani Parish Festival, in Brookfield WI.

It seems that in Milwaukee County it isn't possible to get large groups people together without violence. Last week it was a mass shooting immediately after the Juneteenth's celebration's Parade.

This of-couse raises the question on many peoples' minds, WHAT THE HELL GIVES WITH THIS?

And as a boomer I am swept back to my youth and to legendary myths that emerged around 'Rumbles'. Rumbles were essentially street battles between groups of teens often of more than a dozen on each side coming together spontaneously or organized to attack each other with iconic weapons including knives, chains, baseball bats and zippos.

And Street Battles between teens is exactly how the local police and county sheriff spokesman are describing the phenomena of the past month in MKE.

Why after decades are we back to this? Is this really just a phenomenon to be blamed on human social behavior?

Other than never attending an event or a shopping place with crowds, how are citizens to protect themselves and members of their families?

[walkingman]

1. I much preferred the Hippie days of the 60's - Peace and Love ☮

[Model35mech]

2. Yes. Though without the part where

anti-war protesters (aka hippoes) attracted police/militia violence in places like Grant Park, and the lawns on Kent State.

[walkingman]

6. The "May 4th Massacre" was all about PEACE NOT WAR and the "greaser subculture" rumbles

of the 50's was about lack of economic opportunity and equality - both are still present today. It will be interesting how this plays out in the future.

[marble falls]

3. Zippos? Maybe Zip guns?

All the rumbles and zip guns were much more 50s than 60s.

[Goonch]

4. 👇👇👇👁️👁️

[Tickle]

5. I've been thinking the same

It's like all those peace matches and the civil rights act never happened. People died for peace back then. From colleges to farmers. Then came the selfish 80s and somehow I lost track as I was involved with my career and family.

[A HERETIC I AM]

21. Read your post again

You DO see the irony there, don’t you?

[WhiskeyGrinder]

7. There are very few safe, free, public places for young people to hang out.

[Model35mech]

8. Are you saying free admission contributes to teen violence?

Or are you saying that more places with free admission would help deconflict people who show up at large events?

I don't really understand where you are going with this in the context of answering my question about what can be done.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

9. No, I'm saying that the more society shuts down hangout spaces, the more kids will congregate in

the few places that are available to them, which is one of the things that can lead to more violence.

[Model35mech]

10. Thanks, I think you are saying the lack of free places contributes

to the concentration of teens.

[leftyladyfrommo]

11. Seems to me there has been an uptick in gang violence.

No gathering is safe in gang territory. They can't even have funerals without getting shot at.

[Model35mech]

12. Yes, it often seems so...

But them the question is, what's making it tick-up?

[leftyladyfrommo]

14. For one thing the drugs they use now are a lot more

crazy making. I don't remember the greasers in the 60s being into drugs. Alcohol was the big problem. Alcohol and cigarettes. And having a cool ducktail. The guys I knew carried switchblades and chains.

[Celerity]

13. The oldest Boomers were not even yet teens when West Side Story came out.

Tens of millions of Boomers were not even yet born.

Everything post WWII doesn't always revolve around the Boomers, despite many of their efforts to make it appear so.

[Model35mech]

15. I think my own memories of it surround the tv presentation of the movie.

I really am not trying to make everything wrap around me or Boomers.

Thanks for the dressing down.

What I was trying to say is that gang violence was well known and part of news and entertainment that boomers remember and may have experienced from 60 +/- years ago. And our society seems to be back at it.

[H2O Man]

16. Recommended.

I liked the YIPPIES!, and a few years back -- actually 15 I think -- did a DU interview with Mark Rudd, formerly with some other groups back in the day. I was also friends with some hippies, and remain friends with a number of them today.

The common factor that connects the eras in your post is, of course, young men. I suspect that most everyone knows by now that the brain doesn't reach maturity until about the age of 25. This is associated with the seeming inability to recognize consequences. But it is more than that. Much more. In males, the brain is saturated with chemicals to a much higher degree than at any other time for males, and more than any time for females. That saturation is directly connected to risk-taking behaviors. Add lack of awareness of potential consequences with risk-taking behaviors into a male brain not remarkablt different than our pre-modern human's, and territorialism -- often focused on the supply of attractive females -- and such group fighting is as expected as what one sees on the documentary "Chimp Empire."

[Model35mech]

17. A chemical imbalance...

That's the same thing that's been said for decades about mental illness.

At some level it must be correct as in reductionist perspective the very existence of life comes down to the activity of molecules.

But I don't have the feeling that if it -is- a temporary age related anomaly in chemical activity I'm not sure much could within medical ethics be done.

[H2O Man]

18. No it's not.

Not even close. It is the natural development of the brain, and in no sense an imbalance or related to mental illness. There is absolutely no need to "treat" it, as it is absolutely not an "anomaly" -- the exact opposite: it is the standard.

The obvious "solution" is actually having appropriate older role models who encourage young men to take risks to achieve positive results, rather than negative results. When such encouragement is lacking, it encourages negative risk-taking. In that sense, there is a societal issue.

[H2O Man]

19. On the other hand,

post-youthful risk-taking is associated with the Cluster B personality disorders. It is a learned behavior, an attempt to get one's needs met -- however unhealthy those "needs" are. In the extreme, of course, it is associated with sociopathy.

[Model35mech]

20. Sorry I misunderstood. You wrote about

"In males, the brain is saturated with chemicals to a much higher degree than at any other time for males, and more than any time for females. That saturation is directly connected to risk-taking behaviors."

And I took it that temporary anomaly that later clears up as an imbalance. My mistake

[H2O Man]

22. It's natural.

Having raised both two boys and two girls, although they were all good kids, there were times when I asked the boys, "What were you thinking?" Ha! Even good young men will do things that make you scratch your head.

I've spoken of this before, but as an example, I remember coming home from a fight card many years ago. My oldest brother and I traveled around the state, boxing every city's best fighters. A friend of ours died from injuries that night. I remember thinking, "Poor Frank!," but not having a clue that it could happen to anyone who got into the ring.

[GenThePerservering]

23. My dad told me about rumbles in the streets of New York

in the Depression era. Street fighting is nothing new. Hundreds to a side used to fight in 18th century London, for example, and over the dumbest stuff, as dumb as we do today. The medievals took care of it with a game call 'campball' (still played in some areas).

The fights my dad remembers grew out of the Irish faction fights chiefly of Dublin - both men and women fought (men against men and women against women, and no, the women didn't hair pull) weapons were rocks, chains, stones in socks, sticks, cudgels and some daggers.

There's even an old joke my Irish relatives tell when Paddy, sitting in his easy chair reading the papers hears a lot of noise outside and says to his daughter "Mary, my dear, will you go outside and see if that's a rumble, and if so can you papa join?"

Anyway, Boomers just participated in this ongoing culture - everything is NOT bounded by 'back in my day'.