Death by starvation.

[KentuckyWoman]

I have an acquaintance in her 30s that died on Friday. She died of malnutrition - according to the death certificate.

She was 150+ pounds overweight.
And died of starvation.

We walked at the community center 3x a week for the last 4 months or so during which she'd lost 50 or so pounds. I learned this morning from one of her close friends who also comes with her to walk. No one knew she was only taking water for the last 4 months.

I would guess everyone on DU knows at least one person more than 100 pounds overweight. To think someone that overweight can starve to death is boggling. People do desperate things when they are in extreme pain. Please check on your family, your friends etc who are struggling.

***

Also, if you are riding someone hard because of their weight - stop being an abusive asshole.
If it was as easy as calories in calories out then this dear sweet lady would still be alive.

That is all.

[Diamond_Dog]

1. A huge K and R

[Tetrachloride]

2. I know a family that didn't want to say their refrigerator is empty

After a while, i was more forward in giving them enough for a few days at a time .

A couple days were bad.

[Dr. Shepper]

3. I am so sorry.

[Ocelot II]

4. Some extreme diets can be very dangerous.

Water-only fasting for a few days has become something of a fad, but it's unsafe and can have serious metabolic effects if it's continued for longer than that. If this woman had been existing on nothing but water for four months, the sad result wasn't surprising. People do lose weight quickly if they don't eat any actual food, and that encourages them to continue not to eat, but they are messing up their bodies in a lot of ways. I'm very sorry for your friend, and it's sad that nobody knew what she was doing and so could encourage her to find a safer diet, even one that didn't work as quickly. Being overweight does suck and people who pick on others on account of their weight are assholes.*


*I am making an exception to this rule for TFG because even though he's overweight he ridicules other overweight people.

[slightlv]

11. It's not unhealthy to the extreme to water fast that long,

but once you get past 3 days of fasting, the urge to eat is pretty much gone. That makes it much easier to stay on this type of diet. Having fought weight all my life, until I turned a senior citizen, I know what it's like. You lose 20 and gain back 40. You grab tight on to every new diet that comes along, hoping this one will be the one that works for you. Meanwhile, people make fun of you, kids are cruel, and you can't stand to go clothes shopping so that demoralizes you even more.

And you're right, it's not as simple as calories in/calories out. I do wish people would understand that. How much you weigh is a conglomerate of different aspects. Genetics do play a large role in it, as does the Nature/Nurture concept so many people talk. But there's so many different hormones that affect people in different ways. What works for one person probably won't work for the person standing next to you, who is your height and weight.

I will always believe the giant food corps set us up for this. Between Big Food and Big Pharma, it's a money making game for everyone but those of us who need to lose weight. How much money have we pumped into doctors, pills, exercise clubs, etc., through the years. If only I had 1/10 of what I'd spent over my lifetime.

In the end, I lost weight through no work on my own part. I was diagnosed with lupus and fibro, and from them, I lost 150 pounds. My heart aches for anyone going through something like your friend went through. But understand it's incredibly hard to open up to anybody about your body issues, especially women, because so much of what's thought of as "desirable" and wanted is tall, thin, and leggy. If you don't fit the ideal, you beat yourself up over it -- inside and out.

[Ms. Toad]

29. Please don't make an exception for Trump.

When you ridicule anyone for their weight, it is a gut punch to many overweight people who hear/read it.

There are plenty of things to ridicule him about other than weight.

[Polybius]

5. I didn't think that it was possible

Don't you have to exhaust all of your bodyfat to starve?

[KentuckyWoman]

6. No - and it surprised me too.

I happened to have a doc appointment yesterday and she gave me a sheet with this info on it.

Within one or two days of your last meal, your body will have exhausted all the glycogen stored in the liver and muscles. Most of your energy requirements will be met by breaking down stored fat into ketones, but brain cells and red blood cells can't metabolise ketones, so their glucose requirements must be met by breaking down muscle.

Even if you have lots of body fat left to burn, you can still starve to death if you don't have enough muscle because vital muscles like the heart will have been weakened to the point where they stop working. For this reason, doctors normally consider 40 to 50 per cent weight loss as life-threatening, regardless of your initial body weight.

Total starvation is normally fatal in eight to 12 weeks. In less extreme cases, however, where you are still receiving some calories - particularly if these calories include a high proportion of protein - being fat will help you survive much longer, because your body will be able to meet the majority of your calorie requirements from stored fat.

There is no magical ‘one-size-fits-all’ solution.

But do any diets actually work? The answer is, surprisingly, yes, although perhaps not for the reason that is often being marketed.

In one respect, the truth about diets is a simple one: for a diet to work, there has to be a calorie deficit. If we forensically examine ALL the diets that show some evidence of working, the vast majority all share one (or more) of these three characteristics:

They explicitly restrict calories (do not go below 1000 calories a day)
They are high in protein
They are high in fiber

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

20. Thank you for this.

I likewise didn't think it was possible for someone to starve to death if there was still fat on the body.

So while it is generally true that calories in minus calories out matters, it's not the only thing at work.

How many calories a person uses up in their everyday life also matters. I've watched some of the shows about seriously obese people getting weight loss surgery. Some of those gain weight afterwards, and invariably they are people who absolutely refuse to get out of bed, and often have family enablers who bring them food. I recall in one case the doctor specifically saying the person had an extremely low calorie need, because she wasn't ever getting out of bed.

[Ligyron]

24. A morbidly obese person who refuses to get out of bed and an enabling "feeder".

There's gotta be some weird dynamics going on in that relationship.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

31. So true.

I'm referencing the shows that have morbidly obese people getting surgery. It is blindingly obvious that most of those connected to the morbidly obese are themselves obese/morbidly obese, and that there are lots of connections/things to consider.

In so many of those shows, the morbidly obese person is not surrounded by those of normal weight. Rather, that person is surrounded by others who ore overweight or extremely overweight or morbidly overweight. Obesity does not occur in a vacuum. It is part and parcel of an obesity connection. If everyone around you is overweight/obese, it is very difficult to figure out a normal connection to food and eating.

[thesquanderer]

36. The fat is your energy reserve, but you still need other nutrients to live. n/t

[Farmer-Rick]

38. Exactly

Many people who fast forget about all the other vitamins and minerals your body needs daily. Salt, potassium, magnesium, calcium and vitamins. We normally get these in abundance on a regular diet. But stopping eating, then not replacing these very necessary minerals and vitamins will kill you.

You tend to use up a lot of these minerals and vitamins when you switch to using mostly ketones from stored fat. They must be replaced. I fasted for a few days and found I had all the symptoms of low vitamin B. Pernicious Anemia will kill you. Replaced those vitamins and minerals if you are dieting.

[raising2moredems]

27. Think about it..

Concentration camp prisoners had not an ounce of fat on their bodies yet some survived. We see citizens of nations with famine, not an ounce of fat on their bodies yet are still alive. There is a world of difference between the ratio of fat to muscle. I've always been a firm believer that when your number is up, you leave above ground Earth. How else can you explain a drunk driver surviving, an addict of any number of years (be it drugs (legal or illegal)/nicotine/alcohol living into his/her 80s, 90s (yes, I knew a smoker who lived to be almost 94). Malnutrition is just that - healthy foods cost more money than junk food. And far, far too many citizens, particularly seniors and children live in food deserts. Pro-life my ass is all I can say.
Sorry for the loss of your friend. It is hard.

[Ocelot II]

42. No. You see those photos of people suffering from the effects of famine,

and they are extremely thin. But they were probably not overweight in the first place, and had already used up their body fat. They might have also been getting some minimal nourishment from whatever small amounts of food they could find, and so hadn't completely depleted the stores of minerals and other nutrients people need for their metabolism to function. But if you are trying to lose weight on a water-only diet you will screw up your metabolism before you lose the weight. And the OP's friend didn't technically die of starvation, since she still had fat reserves, but of malnutrition. Fat supplies energy but not the chemicals you need to keep your heart beating, like potassium.

[Kali]

7. that is really sad, on so many different levels

I'm sorry.

[IbogaProject]

8. Whew

And after days of even dieting your body locks down and will be ready to store any extra calories. The way to avoid this and not break down as easily is to diet for 4 days then eat for your current weight for 3. The diet days don't need to be drastic, just part way to the target if going for huge reductions. I'm sorry about your acquaintance.

[roamer65]

9. Wow.

I’m sorry to hear of your loss.



I’ve always been about portion control, but not portion elimination due to my type 2.

[Joinfortmill]

10. So sad.

[Warpy]

12. Thank you so much for your post

It's astonishing she lasted that long, honestly. I imagine what did it was electrolyte depletion, low potassium is a pretty efficient killer and her cardiovascular system was already stressed by the obesity.

A one day a week fast is likely beneficial in healthy people. Longer fasts need to be under medical supervision and electrolyte replacement as necessary. /PSA

I'm sorry you lost a friend. It's a real indictment of our health care system that either she couldn't afford a doctor or she'd run into one too many judgmental assholes when she tried to find one. I hope she went gently.

[airplaneman]

26. I would agree the electrolyte depletion probably killed her not just Potassium but Sodium and Magnesium

[Warpy]

33. It could as easily have been anemia

starving her heart of oxygen.

Water fasts are extremely dangerous. Even liquid nutrition fasts are done in the hospital under close supervision.

[Farmer-Rick]

39. So true

Even a lack of daily intake of certain vitamins will kill you, like Pernicious Anemia.

[Warpy]

43. Pernicious anemia means you have an inability to absorbe B-12 from your food

Last edited Wed Jul 5, 2023, 04:30 PM - Edit history (1)

and B-12 is the vitamin that helps metabolize iron, among other things. People with pernicious anemia need B-12 shots, usually once a month.

Sorry to be nitpicky here, but it's different from a dietary deficiency.

[raising2moredems]

28. The US does not have a health care system..

it is self-care. And how much self-care depends on one's financial means. All the while the "health care" system says it is your right be informed (sarcastic "yeah right&quot . HDHP want you to be more vested in your care - tis the rare doctor whose ego can deal with this. It truly sucks.

[markodochartaigh]

30. True.

The US does not have a health care system. The US has a profit making system which produces as much profit as possible while producing as little health care as possible as a byproduct.

[Farmer-Rick]

40. You just described every system under capitalism

Produce as much profit as possible while producing as little product or service as possible.

[stopdiggin]

32. quite possibly true. but also not really the topic

the thread is concerned with. This person was self medicating (dieting) herself in a horribly unwise and extreme fashion. The health care 'industry', or providers, seemingly had little or no part in this. And you simply aren't going to convince me that any provider that was aware of this behavior - was condoning or okay with it.

[iluvtennis]

13. Yes, so very sad. Sorry for your loss. n/t

[wendyb-NC]

14. That is terrible

I'm very sorry for your loss of a dear friend. What a loss. May she rest in power and peace. It is hard to understand why the world looses so many good and gentle souls.

[shrike3]

15. I'm very sorry.

Last edited Tue Jul 4, 2023, 04:30 PM - Edit history (1)

Obese people can be treated so cruelly. By people all across the political spectrum, I'm afraid.

[Evolve Dammit]

16. So tragic. Thanks for posting though. It's important for awareness.

[yardwork]

17. What a tragedy. I'm so sorry for your loss.

[liberalla]

18. I'm very sorry about your friend. I can't imagine the pain she must have been.

Do you know if she had a particularly difficult time during the pandemic? Maybe she never "bounced back" and resumed normal life and relationships. She must have so distorted things in her mind to believe a "water only" diet was the solution. She needed professional help... but sometimes even that is not enough. I'm honestly surprised she lasted 4 months with no nourishment.

So very sad.
RIP.

[Hekate]

19. I am so very sorry for your loss, KentuckyWoman

May all take to heart what you have said.
May she rest in peace

[Demovictory9]

21. Sorry about your friend... I wondee if she picked that up from youtube

Youtubers and tiktokee always poating wierd diet stuff

[NickB79]

22. Malnutrition is surprisingly common in people who are classified as overweight

It seems like a paradox, but it isn't. The average American diet is filled with so many empty calories, with all the processed crap we regularly consume. Even our fruits and vegetables are lower in nutrients than they were 75 yr ago thanks to modern farming practices. So we get plenty of calories, that our bodies store as fat, but don't get the nutrients we need to keep bodily functions operating as they should.

That's likely why her death certificate stated malnutrition instead of starvation; she had sufficient calorie reserves so she didn't technically starve, but her body cannibalized it's muscles, including heart muscle, to provide the protein it was lacking for supporting brain function.

I'm sorry for your loss.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

23. K&R

[Ligyron]

25. "But, but... Jesus fasted for forty days and forty nights and it didn't kill him!"

"If the Lord can do it, it must be perfectly safe and just imagine all the money I'll save. Think I'll start tomorrow!"

I'm waiting for something along those lines to emerge if it hasn't already.

[Ocelot II]

37. Jesus also turned water into wine, which seems to be a particularly useful skill.

[malaise]

34. How sad

[LymphocyteLover]

35. Yes, a good reminder. Sorry of your loss.

[Lurker Deluxe]

41. tragic

As someone who struggles with both weight and type II diabetes I can relate to the struggle. It only with much research and actually trying different "diets" that finally lead me to a healthy, actually very healthy, diet.

Not a temporary thing, but a permanent change in what, and how, I eat.

The American diet is horrible. Fast food is a killer. As is alcohol and smoking.

There are tons of "diets" out there which will drastically shorten your life through malnutrition, lack of the things your body needs to function. Protein, fat, and carbs are the "trackers" in most diets, but most of the time they ignore the needed vitamins and minerals a body actually needs to survive.

Once I finally found a doctor who asked me the most important question of my life, "how long did it take you to get this overweight"? All my life ... "well, it will take all of your life to not be that way". When I was young I was an athlete, I could eat anything and never gain "fat", I ate 3/4000 calories a day. I as aged that muscle mass declined and my body composition began to change, as did my diet. I went from a lot of calories from proteins to lots of calories from fat and carbs from junk food. I craved it, and it did a lot of damage.

I hit 250 pounds from 165 when in crazy good shape, loss of lean muscle and gains of body fat. A diabetic retinopathy brought it home and it was, literally, change or die. I changed. However it was still two plus years before I became "healthy". Listening, reading, and watching others tell me what to do did little good ...

My fitness pal saved my life. Truth.

My diet is now very balanced. I am not about to tell anyone else how to eat to resolve this issue as every single person is different and what ended up working for me may well not work for you.

The only thing I can promise is that until you are honest with yourself and begin actually tracking what you put into your body, nothing will work to change your health. Track calories and consume 6000 mg of salt, your just changing the issue from fat to a bad heart.

It is a struggle for many. Fat shaming and stupid comments like, "just eat less and exercise more" do nothing to help those who struggle with the issue. The only advise that can, and will, help is honesty ... with yourself.

I am sorry that this issue lead to the loss of a friend, that is tragic. The American diet is tragic and to many have this issue because of it.