Dad shoots, kills Dept. of Corrections truck driver who fatally struck son, police say

[BlueWaveNeverEnd]

PERSON COUNTY, N.C. -- A father is in custody for shooting and killing a driver who hit and killed his son with a truck in North Carolina, according to the Person County Sheriff's Office.

It happened before 6:30 a.m. Monday. A family of three ran out of gas in the area.

They were walking down a road when a Department of Correction truck driven by Jeffrey McKay crashed into the youngest member of the family of three.

The boy died from the crash.

"He was a good person. He was a real good person," the boy's brother told our sister station, ABC11. "Wanted to be an IT technician. He was doing, he wanted to be positive in life. He wanted to help people. He was a people person."

McKay stopped his truck and called 911.

According to Person County Sheriff's Office, the boy's father, Chad Woods, pulled out a gun and shot McKay.

"He was just out of it, going off and stuff. He was going, 'He just he killed my son. He killed my son,'" Woods' father Lawrence Clayborn said.

McKay was rushed to the hospital but died before he arrived.

Investigators said Woods and the other surviving member of the family of three then took McKay's truck and drove to their home.

https://abc7chicago.com/person-county-nc-dad-shoots-driver-pedestrian-killed-truck-crash/13647307/

[TheRealNorth]

1. Horrible tragedy....

But is the father now going to get away with murder on a "temporary insanity" defense?

[ZonkerHarris]

90. tragedy with only one accident. One death was intentional.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

2. Too many people think that guns are the be all, end all solutions to problems.

Now this father is probably going to be convicted and sent to prison for his actions.

[dflprincess]

4. I hope so

No way should he get off for this.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

8. I agree, he acted out of impulse instead of logic.

The driver didn't hit the child on purpose, it was an accident, but dad didn't think things through, instead his first reaction was to pull his gun and kill the driver, if he hadn't had a gun on him, then most likely the driver would still be alive and dad wouldn't be charged with 2nd Degree Murder.

A gun made things much worse in this situation.

[shrike3]

18. Yes, I agree.

Tragedy all around. The act of someone in unimaginable pain, and the gun was there ...

[WarGamer]

22. I'd disagree... this type would have grabbed a tire iron.

Or used his bare hands.

The gun just makes it easier/faster.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

24. Quite possibly true,

but at least the driver would have had a better chance of defending himself and emerge only banged up instead of dead.

You're right, the gun made it easier/faster and now the father has to face the consequences of his actions.

[WarGamer]

29. Moreover... just incredibly sad.

Trucker doing his job and Dad loses his son...

Two families wrecked because... violence.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

39. 100+. nt

[Polybius]

175. He would have had a total chance of defending himself

A correction officer carries a gun on the way to and from work.

[BlueWaveNeverEnd]

33. then driver and father would have been more evenly matched to fight it out

[WarGamer]

37. The father, in a black-out state of rage and adrenaline...

Was never a fair fight.

Truck driver was probably in a state of shock and despair, certainly not physically or mentally in "fight for your life mode"

[W_HAMILTON]

41. Do tire iron deaths in other countries equal...

...gun deaths like this in our country?

Just wondering.

[Polybius]

172. Then the dad would have died

Correction officers carry guns on the way to and from work. But in that case, it would have been self-defense. Tragedy all around.

[keithbvadu2]

45. 'Impulse' rationale is lost when he took the truck and went home instead of waiting for the police.

'Impulse' rationale is lost when he took the truck and went home instead of waiting for the police.

Same/same for temp insanity. He got sane very quickly.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

46. 100+. nt

[ForgedCrank]

153. I don't know

if I would call something like this an "accident" unless it was dark, pitch black and they were walking in the roadway, which also wouldn't be an accident in my eyes. It is likely the result of negligence or inattention.
That doesn't excuse murdering someone, but I think I could understand the unimaginable and instant grief and anger.
I don't want to jump to conclusions, but we see careless people countless times per day. Driving like they are the only ones in existence, texting or talking on their phone while they are driving, swerving all over, driving 25 under or over the speed limit due to their distractions. They get by with it day after day after day and cause countless deaths, injuries and property damage. Then one of them hits and kills your child.
Anyway, that's a lot of unfounded speculation on my part, and it doesn't in any way justify shooting and murdering another human, I'm just saying I think I can at least in a small way understand his reaction.

[obamanut2012]

176. It was 630 am and they were walking in the middle of a country road

Many people had called 911 about a family walking in the road. The driver accidentally hit the son, pulled over and called 911. The father murdered him, he and his wife stole the truck and drove home. LEAVING HIS DEAD SON IN THE ROAD

Blaming the victim like you and many others did in this thread is mind-blowing.

[ForgedCrank]

183. Show me

where I blamed the victim. This will require reading everything I posted, and you'll need to rely on the words I typed, not the inaccurate assessment and translation you made.
And IF what you are saying is actually true, then I was right. This wasn't an "accident", it was caused by negligence and inattention.
First, walking down the center of an active road is negligent. Also, hitting a human sized object that is in the road is the result of negligence.
Best I can tell, you appear angry at me for merely telling the abrasive truth of the matter.

[LonePirate]

9. A crafty lawyer could frame the shooting as self-defense. A jury could believe it.

It's not much of a leap to claim that the truck driver just killed the defendant's son and he feared the driver was coming for him next.

[BlueWaveNeverEnd]

11. ...except driver had already called 911, then shot

[stuck in the middle]

26. A crafty lawyer...

…had better have some evidence if he wants me as a juror to channel my childhood experience of watching “Duel”.

[Hortensis]

124. For sure! Lol, I'd never heard of Spielberg and was flabbergasted

when I found myself glued to the screen watching this incredibly, unbelievably STUPID movie I'd paused on briefly. Yelling repeatedly at Dennis Weaver in outraged exasperation to just get. out. of. the. car. and. off. the. road. But then I'm female. Thank goodness I was home alone. I can admit it anonymously now, 50 years later.

[brush]

28. Nah. The father was IMO negligent in not making sure his...

Last edited Tue Aug 15, 2023, 10:31 AM - Edit history (1)

whole walking party was far enough out of the line of traffic and safe. It's obvious he didn't. He was the adult, ya don't leave that to a young son. You make sure he's safe.

[questionseverything]

44. In Illinois the pedestrian always has the right of way

If I see people walking along the shoulder of the road it’s my responsibility to slow the fuck down and avoid running them over

[ecstatic]

56. Of course pedestrians do, but if you want to live

you have to use common sense too. We all know the environment we're in now with texting, etc.

[questionseverything]

60. Literally everyone is blaming the father for the driver negligently running over a child

The pedestrian has the right of way

[MarineCombatEngineer]

66. So the father was justified in shooting and killing the driver?

You, like another poster here, have already jumped to the conclusion that the driver was at fault without even knowing the full story of this tragic event.

[questionseverything]

68. I didn't say anything about the shooting but

Yes I am totally convinced the driver who ran over the child and killed him was negligent

All they had to do is slow down and avoid the collision

[MarineCombatEngineer]

70. So,like I said, you've already determined that the driver was at fault

without even knowing the full story or waited for the investigation to conclude.

[questionseverything]

72. Well I'm pretty sure the white corrections officer

Will be found blameless by the white sheriffs department for running over and killing the black teenager for the crime of

Illegal walking or illegal running out of gas

But

In Illinois they teach us the pedestrian has the right of way

[MarineCombatEngineer]

73. Oh, so now the racist card is thrown.

[questionseverything]

75. Would it be the first time white cops cover for each other?

[MarineCombatEngineer]

76. And you know this is the case......................How?

[questionseverything]

79. I'm saying I probably won't trust this investigation

And

I can’t imagine any circumstance where the co wasn’t at fault for running over the teen

[MarineCombatEngineer]

80. ....

I can’t imagine any circumstance where the co wasn’t at fault for running over the teen

So, you've already made up your mind that the CO is guilty?
Even without the investigation being started or concluded?

[BlackSkimmer]

206. This thread.

Wowza.

[Bettie]

106. You and some others seem to have jumped to the conclusion

that the son deserved to die because his dad ran out of gas. That the driver bears zero responsibility.

[MorbidButterflyTat]

108. +1

[ecstatic]

71. He was at fault for running out of gas. If he had been as concerned about gas

as he was about arming up, everyone would be alive today. Priorities were all wrong. This doesn't even begin to address the fact that a three-year-old child was freely walking on the middle of the road. Mistake number 2. This guy didn't take any responsibility for the mistakes he made.

[questionseverything]

74. I read the article the kid was a teenager not a 3 year old

I didn’t know running out of gas was punishable by execution

People walk near / on the road all the time, that doesn’t mean drivers get to kill them

[ecstatic]

77. I think you're missing my point

Everyone has responsibilities. Drivers have the responsibility of following the rules of the road, and yielding to pedestrians. Pedestrians and/or their guardians have the responsibility of not placing themselves or their families in dangerous situations. You don't put your child's life in the hands of random drivers who might be drunk or texting. Period.

[questionseverything]

78. I'm not saying the father used perfect judgment but

The cop/ driver still has the duty to avoid killing a pedestrian

[MarineCombatEngineer]

82. And suppose the driver was coming over a hill and had no time to react?

Would you still say that the driver was at fault?
Not saying this is what happened, but you seem convinced that the driver is at fault without any proof.

[Red Mountain]

115. The road has limited sight lines in spots

and the speed limit is 55. Hilly and curvy.

Drive it once a week.

[questionseverything]

125. We have hills and curves in Illinois too

I was taught to look far enough ahead to avoid a collision, if I couldn’t see far enough ahead to do that then I should slow down

Is nc that different?

[Red Mountain]

136. I'll drive the stretch of road tomorrow and let you know

I recognize the spot on the news I've seen.

Do people ever hit deer in Illinois?

Must not.

[questionseverything]

141. I personally have never hit a deer, I don't know anyone that has but I'm sure it happens

I thought deer jump in front of you then freeze?

These folks didn’t jump in front of him

[Red Mountain]

159. What part of Illinois do you live in?

I've hit 4 so far. It's not like I'm trying. Could not have avoided any of them.

I have a neighbor who claims to have veered off the road to hit them but he hunts and mostly eats venison. Weird but whatever. He has worse habits.



IL-In 2019, a total of 16,213 crashes involved deer in Illinois. Of these, 15,605 resulted in damage
to property or vehicles, while 604 caused personal injuries. Four of the crashes were fatal.

NC-Data show the number of N.C. deer-related crashes in 2020 fell by approximately 10 percent to 16,640 (two of which included fatalities and 582 of which included reported injuries), compared with 18,254 in 2019 (one of which included a fatality and 693 of which included reported injuries).

Number of people in IL - 12.67 million (2001)

Number of people in NC - 10.55 million (2001)

Number of deer in IL - 2013 to 2021 in the 640,000 to 690,000 range

Number of deer in NC - North Carolina Deer Population An estimated population of about one million deer in 2016 to 2018. About the same in 2019 through 2021


Short of it is.....lot more deer in NC. Somewhat fewer people. I'd reckon there's a lot more development in NC than IL (we're gaining population and you're losing) so that's of a driving force in these sorts of interactions. IL driver's ed may need work.


All that said......at 6:30 am around here you can hear a car coming a half mile off. If they were in the middle of the road they contributed to the accident.

Deer at least try and run.

[questionseverything]

160. Other posters from the area said that would be a busy

Time of day, with people going to work and all, but you’re saying that wouldn’t be true?

If you have hit four deer you must have a deer magnet in your ass j/k j/k

[Red Mountain]

161. Correct. Not true. It's not a busy road.

it's not a main artery. Just a side road you can take. Faster ways to get to where most people are going first thing.

Mostly open land with a few houses.

I rarely see more than a car or two when I traverse it.

Based on the news footage I think it was along here:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Dink+Ashley+Rd,+North+Carolina+27583/@36.3027232,-78.9390917,890m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m6!3m5!1s0x89ad17245c513beb:0x37f9d1bbe6ef1bce!8m2!3d36.3053084!4d-78.9421923!16s%2Fg%2F1tk70cn8?entry=ttu

but not sure if that was where the accident happened or where the shooter was arrested. The road is only about 1.5 miles long so not much difference.

I live about 10 miles away.

Normal deer experience in these parts.

One deer jumped off a bank and landed in front of me. Had a second to brake but damaged the car. Drove home. Deer had a broken leg but disappeared when I went back to finish it off. Hope it made it. They are TOUGH.

One ran under the front right wheel from the undergrowth. No time to break. No damage to the car. Probable KIA. Not possible to stop. Busy road.

One jumped off a bank and slid under my REAR right tire. Slowed down and hoped but.... No damage to the car. Slamming on the brakes would have made a bad thing worse. KIA.

Last one did a face plant into my right front quarter panel (dented) and ran off. I was sliding to a stop and managed to avoid the other 12. Still can visualize that deer's face smushed up against the window. Probably OK.

Don't even get me started on how NC became (for a while) the Good Roads State. Most paved mileage in the country.

Also, narrow roads with no shoulder. Makes walking on the road more attractive for pedestrians but down the middle is still a bit unusual.

[questionseverything]

166. I just don't get how the driver didn't see three people in the middle of the road

How the driver hits the teen square enough to kill him….

People called the cops to report them walking in the road so obviously it was light enough to see

So why can’t the driver see them?

[Red Mountain]

174. I'd guess tired or distracted

by a cell phone.

[questionseverything]

194. I would agree but both of those reasons make it the driver's responsibility

[usonian]

163. I had two encounters.

One totaled my pickup truck. Deer bolted onto a highway. Struck the side, fortunately for me. The other got a fender. I have no idea about the first. The second was deer behavior. Apparently they think they can evade trouble by jumping in some random direction. With cars, half the time that is a collision. They are not adapted/evolved fast enough.

Two times in a populated CA suburb, I had near misses. Deer crossing the road. Slam on brakes. Must have been goofy mating season, because within a day or two.

I many areas of the US, they are the prime cause of accidents. Insurance agents yawn them off, and say to hit the deer rather than swerve and hit a possibly oncoming car. Shoulders in most places are really bad, as well.

[Red Mountain]

173. Paved road surfaces are like ice for their hooves

when they really try and accelerate. I've seen them try and run on a road and go splay legged flat.

The smart/experienced ones kind of tip toe across the road.

[ecstatic]

180. When I visited family in rural New Jersey

Ringoes. I couldn't believe how many deer were out near or on the roads. I've never seen anything like it. And I live in Georgia.

Doesn't hitting them straight on run the risk of their hooves coming through the windshield? Yikes either way.

[BlackSkimmer]

181. I've had a deer run into ME.

Driving along a country road at dusk, eyes open for deer as always, and I sae her coming across a field then disappearing into he roadside woods.

Not two minutes later she reappeared barreling straight into the passenger side of my vehicle. She seemed to bounce, and if she was injured, she dints show it, but it did a number on my car.

Other than that, I've come close to hitting both animals AND people back in the day when I used to run a paper route in the early morning. It amazes me to see people walking on the wrong side of the road, dark colors, and paying no attention in early morning or dusk twilight.

I walk my dogs before the sun is up in the summer, and I wear all white clothing, have reflective leases and dogs are togged out in their reflective vests. We walk facing traffic if there is no sidewalk, and we move completely off the road when a vehicle approaches.

[usonian]

182. That's what happened to me.

Came flying and hit my right side. Mirror crashed thru the window and landed in the back seat behind me. Took out all glass on the right side.

No idea why it bolted onto a busy hwy. 11 am or so.

Something chasing it?

[BlackSkimmer]

187. That sounds almost identical to what happened to a friend of mine!

My damage was not that severe, but hers was like yours, plus she ran off the road in terror and managed to flatten both her tires.

I shudder when I think of people in other states who have to deal with MOOSE!

[brush]

86. So you don't think the father should've looked out for the...

safety of his son? Of course he should've. And it's come out that they were walking in the middle of the road. How irresponsible can you get?

It's negligence.

The truck driver showed responsible behavior. He stopped after hitting a pedestrian IN THE MIDDLE OF THE FUCKING ROAD and called 911, only to get killed by a negligent and irresponsible father, who then stole his truck. Didn't wait for the 911 respondents.

[questionseverything]

92. How does the cop/ driver not see three people in the middle of the road?

[brush]

99. What were the road conditions? Was it at night, around a curve?

Whatever they were, no way pedestrians should've been walking in the road.

When has that ever been safe?

There's no defense for that.

[Wingus Dingus]

127. I missed hitting a cow on I-25 in southern New Mexico, just barely--

walking oncoming up the left shoulder, it was a black cow or steer and it was dark and rainy. My brain didn't process what I saw until I had passed it--and I had been paying close attention because I hate driving in the rain and at night. Are you serious? How many deer are littered all over highways all over the country? Things in the road get hit when people don't see them, all the time, every day.

[questionseverything]

128. It wasn't dark or rainy though, it was dawn and clear

To miss three people walking in/on the side of the road seems improbable

Like he wasn’t paying attention to his driving

[Wingus Dingus]

130. This poor guy is dead. Maybe we'll never know how much he was responsible for

the accident--if at all--because he can't make a statement in his own defense, unless he told 911 that he was totally drunk and/or not looking at the road (doubtful). Sometimes you just don't have a line of sight until it's too late, and dawn doesn't equal readily visible, necessarily. Might still have been dim light. Even a sunrise glare in your eyes can prevent you from seeing what's ahead. And there's absolutely no reason to assume it WASN'T an accident, either. Pretty sure he wasn't trying to run over a family in the road on his way to or from work.

[questionseverything]

132. Accidents are one person's negligence meeting its natural consequence

[Wingus Dingus]

133. No, that's not true, we all have merely human capabilities and senses and brains.

We can't overcome some circumstances, even with rule-following, diligence and attention. A few inches to the left and I would've hit a cow while I was going less than the speed limit, wipers going fast, watching the road. It would have been an accident, but I wasn't the negligent one. I couldn't fucking see it until I was almost past it. I also wasn't expecting there to be a large land mammal on the left shoulder of the interstate. Because it's not supposed to be there. So perhaps someone was negligent (a rancher?), but it wasn't me. Are you also saying that a deer jumping out onto the road in front of your car is your own negligence?

[questionseverything]

145. If you couldn't see it you were going too fast for conditions

Just saying

[Wingus Dingus]

150. Yes, I was going too fast to see the shine of cow eyeballs in my

headlights off to the left.

[questionseverything]

140. Maybe reading his cell phone

[treestar]

146. Yes, comparative negligence can exist

and the one who is hurt worst can be part of the negligence. Here a child is not, but the parent may have had some negligence.

It was surprising to find that some liberals/DUers think that the one with the most damage is the victim totally, and to suggest otherwise is somehow outrageous. For example a pedestrian negligently steps out into the road and gets killed, then it has to be the driver's fault.

But just because you were killed or your child was killed doesn't make it impossible that it was not all or partly your own negligence.

So to people like that, this has to be all the driver's fault. It's like they just can't get the concept contributory or comparative negligence. Maybe if on a jury and they heard the judge give instructions they might get it.

[Ace Rothstein]

134. That just isn't true.

(625 ILCS 5/11-1007) (from Ch. 95 1/2, par. 11-1007)
Sec. 11-1007. Pedestrians walking on highways.
(a) Except as provided in subsection (e), where a sidewalk is provided and its use is practicable, it shall be unlawful for any pedestrian to walk along and upon an adjacent roadway.
(b) Except as provided in subsection (e), where a sidewalk is not available, any pedestrian walking along and upon a highway shall walk only on a shoulder, as far as practicable from the edge of the roadway.
(c) Except as provided in subsection (e), where neither a sidewalk nor a shoulder is available, any pedestrian walking along and upon a highway shall walk as near as practicable to an outside edge of a roadway, and, if on a two-way roadway, shall walk only on the left side of the roadway.
(d) Except as otherwise provided in this Chapter, any pedestrian upon a roadway shall yield the right-of-way to all vehicles upon the roadway.

[questionseverything]

144. I may be saying it wrong but I'm sure you don't get to run over a

Child who isn’t following the rules

[treestar]

148. you don't, but it does not mean

you are entirely at fault.

Speeding and not paying attention, yes, but negligence is not always on the part of the driver just because they were the driver.

If kids are to be expected in an area, you have reason to look out for them, expecting them to do the unexpected, as kids will do. The reasonable person standard means if you expect kids to be around or see a lot of them around, you take more care.

But that does not make it impossible that you were doing the reasonable thing and could not avoid that accident. People feel terrible if they hit a kid, but it does not in itself prove they were negligent in their driving.

We don't know enough about this accident yet, but the father could have been negligent to some degree. That might explain his extreme reaction.

It's not either/or anymore - many jurisdictions figure out comparative negligence in percentages as the most fair way. Contributory negligence used to sink a claim entirely.

[Ace Rothstein]

154. Unless you're being negligent, you're probably not going to be charged.

[treestar]

147. so in violation of a statute

you can have negligence per se, I believe.

[Ace Rothstein]

155. Yeah, I don't think you can go run someone over on purpose and get away with it.

You'll probably also get in trouble if you were speeding or on the phone. Now if the guy was just driving down the road and didn't see them until it was too late, they probably won't get charged let alone given a ticket.

[treestar]

190. He could have been in violation of a statute too

It depends a lot on what he was doing. And what the reasonable person would expect. If the speed there was 55 mph, that makes it very negligent to walk in the road even without the statute.

[obamanut2012]

178. They were in the middle of the road

[jimfields33]

15. I don't know. That's the worst thing a parent could ever go through.

[Happy Hoosier]

31. True... and why it's a bad idea to carry a gun around.

That is a devastating experience, and having access to a firearm when you experience something line that is not a good idea. Now there are two people dead and a third whose life is ruined.

[brush]

19. Father should've made sure all walking on the side of the road...

were far enough out of the line of traffic. That one son who got hit obviously wasn't.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

23. I agree,

it's not like the correctional officer purposely veered off the road to hit this kid, this was a tragic accident that cost a child their life and now the father, because of his emotions and having a gun, will now face criminal charges that could put him away for a long time and families on both sides will suffer for.

[MorbidButterflyTat]

107. "it's not like the correctional officer purposely veered off the road to hit this kid"

How do you know?

I thought the family was negligently walking in the middle of the road. Where does this weird defense of the driver not veering off the road deliberately come from?

Pedestrians have the right of way, period. A driver who hits a human being with any kind of motor vehicle is negligent. I mean this isn't rocket science.

[treestar]

149. It is not that simple either.

A pedestrian can be negligent and contribute to the accident. A kid can't but then the parent's supervision comes in.

It being deliberate would be really odd, and there's no suggestion of that.

[questionseverything]

167. Maybe the father thought the driver did it deliberately

I still can’t believe he couldn’t see three people in the middle of the road in time to avoid an accident

It was light enough to see, we know that because people were calling in to report people walking in the road ( which seems so odd and petty to me, I mean why do they care?)

[Ace Rothstein]

168. Why would people care about others taking a dangerous action?

Such as walking down the middle of the road with a 55 mph speed limit. Really stumped by that.

[questionseverything]

197. Again.... So why couldn't the driver see them and avoid running over the teen and killing him?

[treestar]

189. over time it could have gotten darker

how straight was the road; was there a recent turn? A whole lot of questions before settling the proportions of fault to each side.

[questionseverything]

193. It was daybreak, getting lighter

[The Magistrate]

3. I'd Leave The Man Go

Living with the night is enough. He'll never know peace long as he lives.

[BlueWaveNeverEnd]

7. then we all get away with gunning down motorists after accidents?

[The Magistrate]

13. I Repeat, I Would Leave The Man Go

There is no need to add to his suffering. I find his action understandable, and by that I mean, as most people do in saying this, that I might well have done the same, whether with arms or bare hands, whatever was available.

[Kaleva]

17. They were walking down the middle of the road.

[The Magistrate]

21. So What?

I am not wrangling about relative negligence or some such. Guy killed his kid, he killed the guy on the spot. That's pretty ancient.

[Kaleva]

27. Vigilante justice is ancient too

We could just make it legal for those who lost a loved one in a car accident to execute the driver of the other vehicle

Modify the Stand Your Ground law to allow for this.

I don't think that's a good idea myself.

[Recycle_Guru]

32. you don't get to do that in our society

Father should be tried for murder

[bottomofthehill]

35. Jesus, I am a self defense guy, but this kind of thinking is dangerous.

If the law is an eye for an eye, than after the accident, the driver should finish off the family in self defense.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

48. Does the truck driver's family get to kill someone now?

Maybe the father’s wife or maybe a sibling?

[BlackSkimmer]

51. Lol!

I know it's not funny, but that cracked me up!

Point well made.

[MorbidButterflyTat]

109. No

it's not funny.

[Celerity]

139. gallows humour

[stuck in the middle]

25. Then we'd be talking about...

…whether or not to let you go.

[yowzayowzayowza]

34. Disagree. It is not just about the father. What about the suffering of the Driver's family?

Certainly not premeditated, but murder none-the-less. The Driver made a mistake that he certainly did not deserve to die for. HE should have been left to "the night".

[Happy Hoosier]

36. So... you'd kill someone over an accident?

I haven‘t seen a suggestion of negligence on the part of the driver, who properly stopped and called 911. sounds to me like it‘s dangerous to actually stop at the scene of an accident!

No. He killed a man. Deliberately. That cannot be permitted to pass.

[questionseverything]

57. The negligence was hitting and killing a pedestrian

It’s the driver’s responsibility to avoid hitting the pedestrian

[MarineCombatEngineer]

58. So you're basically exonerating the father for shooting and killing the driver?

[questionseverything]

63. That's not what I said at all but the driver hit and killed a human being

Who legally had the right of way

It’s making me upset that a careless, negligent driver who killed somebody is getting a pass

[MarineCombatEngineer]

65. You have jumped to the conclusion that the driver was negligent,

yet you don't know the whole story, you've already made your mind up that the driver is at fault.

[MorbidButterflyTat]

111. You have jumped to the conclusion

that the driver wasn't negligent, yet you don't know the whole story, you've already made your mind up that the driver is not at fault.

[BannonsLiver]

118. A pass? He's dead.

If that’s what you call “getting a pass” I’d hate to see what accountability looks like. 🤦‍♂️

[questionseverything]

120. I'm not addressing anything that happened after the child was hit and killed

I’m upset that people seem ok with a cop/ probation dude hitting and killing a teenage pedestrian

[BannonsLiver]

121. Well you won't have to worry about him doing that again.

[treestar]

151. nobody is OK with that

but simply saying it is not so simple as to fault.

And calling the guy a cop is trying to create bias against him. A probation officer is what he is.

[questionseverything]

152. He is in the cop crew and he is white

That’s facts

I’m really surprised at the hate this black family has received from du

When their crime seems to be not being able to keep their gas tank full/ walking “wrong “

[Ace Rothstein]

157. Their crime is one of them murdered someone likely due to their negligence.

Are they supposed to get a pass since they are black?

[questionseverything]

158. I have never given the father a pass

I have only stuck up for the child who was run over and murdered, probably by a distracted driver

[treestar]

165. accidents are not "murder"

[treestar]

164. didn't know the races

but you seem to think that guilt is determined by that.

[questionseverything]

195. If you didn't know the races then you didn't watch the news reports

Or read the articles so how are you doing all this arguing?

[treestar]

205. The facts of what happened

are here in this thread.

But why do we need to know the races? So we can prejudge who is guilty?

It is not hate or racism to determine who is negligent or partly negligent in causing accidents.

[treestar]

191. I did not know anything until this about who

was what race.

It is not hate to consider negligence! Black people can't be negligent and nothing is ever even partially their fault?

And being white does not make the driver guilty of negligence either - not that alone. Nor being "cop crew" whatever that is.

These positions are just bigoted! No one "hates" anyone. Why can't we consider behavior without being accused of "hate?" Damn.

[Celerity]

138. +1

[Happy Hoosier]

59. So if a pedestrian is hit, it's always the driver's fault?

I think you’ll find that’s not the case. But let’s day it is. Does that justify his murder? And what if the driver had not been killed and returned fire and killed the father? Is that the world we want!? FFS….

[questionseverything]

62. The pedestrian always has the right of way

I didn’t say anything about the father murdering the driver but the driver is far from blameless

[Happy Hoosier]

64. There are PLENTY of cases...

… where a pedestrian is hit and the driver was not found to be at fault. If the driver was not driving irresponsibly, there are circumstances where hitting a pedestrian is simply unavoidable. The idea that when a pedestrian is hit, it’s always the drivers fault is ludicrous.

https://www.alllaw.com/articles/nolo/auto-accident/driver-at-fault-pedestrian-car.html

[questionseverything]

67. All the driver had to do was slow down or stop

[Happy Hoosier]

69. OFFS....

…. Sure. It’s ALWAYS the drivers fault

[orleans]

88. this happened to me tonight

it was practically dark out.
i was at a four way stop, waiting for the two other cars at their stop signs.
then it was my turn. i was going to make a right turn.
i checked the right.
i checked the left. no car. but there is a big evergreen with low branches on the corner lot, partially blocking my view of the sidewalk a ways down from the corner. there was no one as far as i could see.
i looked to the right. again.
and as i started to slowly go forward for my right turn i double checked and looked to the left again.
and slammed on the brake as a fucking teenager on a bike who had come racing around from behind the tree branch (on the sidewalk to my left) was flying into the street and directly in front of my car.
he didn't have a light on the bike. he was wearing dark clothes. he never. slowed. down.
and poof -- he passed my car, flew up onto the sidewalk on my right and went on his merry way.

i was going slow enuf that i wouldn't have killed him or run him over, but i could have knocked him off his bike if i hadn't looked again.

he, on the other hand, didn't look around at all and never slowed down

hope he continues to lead his suburban charmed life

[questionseverything]

93. Are you saying the three people walking ran in front of the

Cop/ driver?

Good for you for being a defensive driver and avoiding the collision, that’s what is supposed to happen

[orleans]

110. no, i'm not saying the kid ran in front of the truck. i heard they were walking down the middle of

the road and i think that was stupid as hell. (wondering was there drop offs on either side of the road so it was too dangerous to walk on the side/shoulder?)

was it daylight yet?

i'm not saying it wasn't the driver's fault. i'm just wondering what the fuck they were doing in the middle of the road? and just because you're not behind the wheel doesn't mean you get to act irresponsibly or like a careless idiot.

b/c accidents can and do happen.

[ecstatic]

95. Wow. The interesting thing is you saw him before you knew it

New study shows a 15-second lag in processing visual stimuli

Our brains are constantly uploading rich visual stimuli. But instead of seeing the latest image in real time, we actually see earlier versions because our brain's refresh time is about 15 seconds.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2022/01/220113194121.htm

With this in mind it's actually amazing that we don't have more accidents. This is a good reminder for everyone reading this thread to triple check. Sometimes I quadruple check but I feel pressured by others to keep it moving. Lol

[haele]

198. Driver is dead, because he stopped.

We don't know what really happened because the driver is dead, only the father now has a say.
As posters who know the area indicate, that stretch of road has curves and hills. And it's posted for highway speeds, not a school zone. A driver cannot expect a child in the middle of the road, period. Even slowing down 10 miles an hour or so coming over a hill or coming around a curve, at highway speeds, there's simply no way to avoid something small that suddenly appears in the middle of the road after cresting a hill or coming out of a blind curve.

A 3 year old is small, just like the dog that suddenly appeared in front of me coming around a curve one morning in a residential area one morning when I was going to work. I was going 20 miles an hour and still bumped her as I hit the breaks. Luckily, she wasn't hurt, just startled - but she was in the middle of the lane and not visible at all until I came out of the curve and she was about 15 ft. In front of me.

Look, one of my grandkids was a runner until she was around five. When walking anywhere, especially in a parking lot or along a road, we have had to to keep a good grip on her or she would run out into the road just to pick up a leaf that caught her attention. We also made sure an adult was always between her and any traffic.

The kid shouldn't have been hit. But then again, a three year old should also never be in a traffic lane where he could be hit because a driver coming up behind him might not see him over the hood of a truck coming over a hill.

Parents were just as much responsible as the driver for that child's death. And the father is totally responsible for the driver's death.


Haele

[questionseverything]

199. It was not a three year old, it was a teen

[haele]

201. I've heard both? Still, a blind curve or hill, at highway speeds, it's difficult to see.

If the road is posted between 45 and 55 miles an hour, even the most careful driver would only slow down to around 40 mph going over a hill or around a curve.

Rule of thumb - Driver's training manual estimates 10 ft of sudden braking distance for every 5 mph of speed. That's once the driver hits the brakes, not counting the distance travelled in the 15 seconds or so it takes for the driver to react once he or she notices the hazard. At 50 mph, that's 50 ft + maybe another 20 ft to cover the response time. And only in the last 10 ft, an impact might be survivable to the pedestrian.

A 5 1/2' or so tall teen or a 3' tall toddler - it doesn't really matter if they're in the middle of the lane if the driver doesn't expect them and is going any faster than 15/20 mph.

Haele

[questionseverything]

202. In the op there is a video from abc news

They interview the dead boy’s family who say he wanted to be an it guy…. So not a three year old

The video also shows the road with lots of cop cars parked on a level grade, no twists or turns

I am not saying walking in the road was the best choice but it certainly shouldn’t be a death sentence

I firmly believe it was the driver’s responsibility to avoid hitting the pedestrian

[brush]

102. Pedestrians in the middle of the road? Could've been at nignt...

around a curve, over a hill. You don't know so to say pedestrians always have the right of way is unsound reasoning.

[BlackSkimmer]

53. And then stolen the dead man's truck?

That's what this guy did.

All good? Huh?

[The Magistrate]

55. That's A Bit Much

But the other? I stand by what I said.

[BlackSkimmer]

97. All good to shoot a man who hit someone walking in the road in low light, huh?

Not much of a believer in accidents, are you?

Too bad for his family, right?

[yardwork]

101. I sympathize with a grieving parent, Sir.

I'm having trouble understanding why the mother and father abandoned their child's dead body in the road. They stole the truck of the man who was shot and drove home, leaving their child's body behind.

I can think of one scenario and it doesn't justify the loss of a child, but it might shed light on why they were hit while walking in the road before dawn.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

196. Murder ok but you draw the line at grand theft auto.

[BannonsLiver]

117. Not one of your better takes.

I guess even the magistrate has off days.

[obamanut2012]

143. He stole the truck snd left his kid in the road

The driver immediately pulledover and called 911.

[WarGamer]

5. lock him up... throw away the key. And add Grand Theft Auto charges to the rest of the family.

Wonder if the perp was legally in possession... Just curious...

[AKwannabe]

6. Wow

Just wow

[Solomon]

12. Yeah

I'm really surprised at the Magistrate.

[Wingus Dingus]

43. Really uncharacteristic and strange.

Like someone hacked his account or something.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

49. Yeah, I was wondering that myself,

this is not the Magistrate I'm used to seeing.

[MerryBlooms]

81. Definitely not the regular Magistrate. Where's all the Sir/Madam

references? These posts are completely, Out Of Character.

[senseandsensibility]

83. I agree

Very strange content for him as well.

[BlackSkimmer]

98. Well, he's doubled down on it elsewhere in this thread.

I don't find it out of character at all, actually.

[brush]

103. Agreed. Doesn't seem like the familiar, always sensible poster we know.

[MorbidButterflyTat]

113. So he's not "sensible,"

because his opinion differs from yours?

As some like to say, This place sometimes.

Almost forgot..."Interesting."

[brush]

123. Since he's advocating for a killer and truck thief to not...

be charged, hell yeah.

[Celerity]

185. you are very new here, so you likely do not understand that The Magistrate almost ALWAYS uses sir

or ma'am in his addressing if other posters.

Also, I have never seen him defend vigilante murder justice either.

It faces up like his account has been hacked.

[Celerity]

184. +10000000000000000

[obamanut2012]

169. Not really

He has had some really bad takes over the years.

[Kali]

85. he lost his own son a while back

I think he knows his feelings.

[Solomon]

94. Didn't know that. Even so, its still surprising.

[sinkingfeeling]

10. The truck driver did what we're told to do in an accident: call 911. The father was

irrational, but may not have murdered if he hadn't had a gun immediately available. He can plead temporary insanity to the murder charge.

[TheBlackAdder]

14. They were walking down the middle of a 2 lane road? The yellow line? There were cut grass shoulders.

[shrike3]

20. That happens a lot where I live.

I remember turning onto my road at night, almost home, and there was a figure all in black, right in front of me. Almost had a coronary: I wasn't going that fast, thankfully. Was able to stop and get around him. Just some local guy who decided it would be a good idea to walk in the middle of the road.

[Act_of_Reparation]

84. Stroads

This shit happens all the time. Poor city planning.

[Kaleva]

16. While I have a CPL, I don't carry a loaded gun in public

I don't have the level of training I feel required in order to handle a gun responsibly in all situations that may occur. I meet state standards to carry but not my own .

[MarineCombatEngineer]

42. Very wise decision on your part,

Last edited Mon Aug 14, 2023, 08:39 PM - Edit history (2)

you're the good example of a responsible firearm owner.

[Kaleva]

47. The odds of something bad happening if I were to carry .. .

far out weigh the odds of me having a gun saving my life or preventing me from suffering serious physical harm or someone else's.

I'm not trained well enough to reverse those odds.

[ms liberty]

30. Person County is not an unpopulated rural area. It's just north of Durham

This guy should have never been walking with his children IN THE DAMN ROAD before 6:30 in the morning...when it's still dark or dusky at best outside, but a lot of people are on the road heading in to work. All he had to do was make his kids walk on the shoulder or grassy verge. Instead he made two awful, terrible decisions today - and caused the death of two people.

[bluedigger]

38. A true tragedy.

At least two families lives forever diminished due to running out of gas, a completely predictable and preventable occurrence.

[Deuxcents]

40. I agree

[LeftInTX]

50. It will really get interesting when they attempt "stand your ground" on cops!

[leftstreet]

52. Jesus. This thread

lol

[Hortensis]

122. Agree. I brought it on myself, though, opening to find out how

this tragedy turned into a 119-post thread, so far. Makes me wonder, once again I'm afraid, if there could be a REAL DU somewhere and this one a Kremlin clone. Gog help us.

[ecstatic]

54. He should have shot himself too. Ran out of gas?

This was 100% your fault buddy, to run out of gas, in the middle of nowhere apparently, which created the need for your entire family to be walking down the road (with your 3 year old son unattended?).

RIP to all the victims of this completely reckless individual.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

61. John Gotti had the man who fatally struck his son killed.

It was a horrible accident and Gotti knew it. The man was warned to move as far away as possible. Gotti didn't want to have him killed but it was reported his wife wanted him dead.

[JI7]

87. The father killed his son

if it's true they were walking down the middle of that road then the father is to blame for his son's death and should be charged for the deaths of 2 people.

[ZonkerHarris]

89. murdering scum with a gun.

[Bluesaph]

91. Running out of gas happens when you are poor also.

He should have sold his gun. Sounds like the dad wasn’t too smart.

[Captain Stern]

96. A little more info..

https://www.wral.com/story/nc-father-charged-with-shooting-man-who-hit-and-killed-his-son/20999750/


Evidently, multiple people had called 911 before the accident.....to report a family walking in the middle of the road.

The father (shooter) and his wife then stole the driver's truck, left their son's body at the crash site, and threw the weapon into a pond.

[yardwork]

100. Thanks for posting that.

I think it's odd that the mother and father left the scene - and their child's dead body - while stealing the truck of the man the father had just shot. And they drive home.

I think there's more to this story. It is a tragedy to lose a child, but we aren't allowed to be judge, jury and executioner. And it's hard to imagine a circumstance where grieving parents would leave their child's body alone on a road.

[Wingus Dingus]

104. Hmmm... very weird. Yep, this wasn't an emotional/grief killing.

[yardwork]

105. I think it was an emotional killing, but I think there's more going on, too.

I wonder about substance abuse, for instance.

[SYFROYH]

114. What makes you say that?

How are emotional grief killings supposed to happen?

[Wingus Dingus]

126. They don't usually involve 911 calls beforehand for a family seemingly trying to get hit

while walking in the roadway, they don't involve dad being armed and loaded to shoot, they don't involve murder, they don't involve auto theft and leaving a badly injured kid behind. I mean, this is a weird fucking story.

[SYFROYH]

129. If I watched someone kill my son I might get weird, too.

YMMV

[Wingus Dingus]

131. You wouldn't just be in terrible shock that an accident just happened?

And you wouldn't be 100% concerned for your injured kid lying on the ground? You'd suddenly grab your conveniently loaded gun and seek instant "justice" or vengeance? And then convince your wife and other kid to jump in the murdered guy's truck and drive home? That IS weird, you're right.

[SYFROYH]

135. When a truck runs over a child, there might not be any doubt.

Most people who carry guns carry them loaded. It’s not surprising.

After all that, taking your family home in the teuxb is kind of a minor thing, isn’t it?

Again, your mileage may vary.

[Snooper9]

162. I would never leave my dead child on the side of the road

EVER

[obamanut2012]

170. All of you saying that make it seems like it was murder

IT WAS THE FATHER'S FAULT HIS SON DIED

The driver pulled over, called 911, then was murdered, hsd his truck stolen, and the thieves left their dead son in the road.

[SYFROYH]

179. If what I said makes you think it sounded like murder -- thats about you.

[ecstatic]

137. That's insane. They left their child at the scene?!

To get hit many more times by unsuspecting drivers? Like fucking roadkill?!!!! I'm speechless.

[BlueWaveNeverEnd]

156. that is strange

[SYFROYH]

112. I don't know if I could control myself (gun or no gun) if I watched someone kill my son.

It's unimaginable.

[obamanut2012]

171. The father killed his son

Stop making it sound like murder. The only murderer is the father

[SYFROYH]

177. Not according to the facts as reported.

[obamanut2012]

186. Yes, he did -- the father killed his son

The driver did not cause the death, the father did.

Then he murdered the driver of the truck, stole the truck and left his dead son in the road. Yeah, he really fucking loved his teenage son, didn't he? Drags him down the middle of a country road at lowlight and gets him killed, then leaves his so-called beloved son like a piece of trash in the road while he steals a truck. What a stand up guy!

It wasn't a fucking hit and run. The driver immediately pulled over and called 911. And guess what, there had already been people calling in about a family walking down the middle of a fucking two-lane country road in the Piedmont and how they were a danger.

I lived in Durham. I have driven this road, and it is rolling and curvy with few clear site lines, and it is 55 mph. The father was a fucking idiot and killed his son. Then committed murder and grand theft and left the scene of a crime, and left his dead kid like trash.

[SYFROYH]

188. Where I come from drivers are responsible for not hitting pedestrians in the road.

Yes, there can be mitigating or exonerating circumstances, but that's usually when someone darts out in the road.

And by the way, since you know so much about this road, where exactly did it happen?

I'd like to see this "rolling and curvy with few clear site lines, and it is 55 mph" road in google maps street view.

I'll wait.

[yardwork]

192. I just looked up "Dink Ashley Rd near Timberlake NC" on google maps.

I haven't read a report that says exactly where the accident occurred. This is definitely rural. Bicyclists and walkers get hit by cars on these rural roads in Piedmont NC. The roads often don't have shoulders. There are usually trees very close to the roads. It was likely dark and shadowy. It may not have been the driver's fault, and without knowing more, I can't fault the father for running out of gas and having to walk his family home before dawn. It's a tragedy. It happens a fair amount around here, usually to bicyclists.

The part I can't agree with is shooting the man who stopped and tried to help. Even if the driver was at fault, that's what law enforcement is for.

And I don't understand leaving the body of his child behind, stealing the truck, and driving home. But people do strange things when they're traumatized.

We'll probably learn more. He's been arrested.

https://people.com/father-accused-killing-driver-allegedly-struck-killed-son-7644118

[obamanut2012]

203. What does that have to do with anything?

[BannonsLiver]

116. Dad is going to prison, as he should

[obamanut2012]

142. This was not a hit and run

The man pulled over and called 911, the dad and mom stole his truck and drive home, leaving their dead son in the road.

He is a murderer.

[Baitball Blogger]

200. The unfortunate result of this is that people will hit and run for fear of losing their lives.

[XanaDUer2]

204. This nt

[Polybius]

207. This is why some people leave the scene of an accident

Fear of retaliation.