General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsJoe Biden is building the border wall
Valid criticism is allowed & I'm not going to lie, I'm very disappointed in this descion.
Link https://archive.ph/2dWnD]
Environmental protection advocates and immigrant rights campaigners expressed horror
over a DHS plan
that will waive more than two dozen laws in order to expedite the construction of the U.S.-Mexico border wall.
Here's a list of environmental protections that will be stripped away to build the wall. In an age of climate change this is not good.



Link https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/biden-administration-waives-26-federal-laws-border-wall-103738662]
McALLEN, Texas -- The Biden administration announced it waived 26 federal laws in South Texas to allow border wall construction on Wednesday, marking the administrations first use of a sweeping executive power employed often during the Trump presidency.
The Department of Homeland Security posted the announcement on the U.S. Federal Registry with few details outlining the construction in Starr County, Texas, which is part of a busy Border Patrol sector seeing high illegal entry. According to government data, about 245,000 illegal entries have been recorded so far this fiscal year in the Rio Grande Valley Sector which contains 21 counties.
There is presently an acute and immediate need to construct physical barriers and roads in the vicinity of the border of the United States in order to prevent unlawful entries into the United States in the project areas, Alejandro Mayorkas, the DHS secretary, stated in the notice.
The Clean Air Act, Safe Drinking Water Act and Endangered Species Act were some of the federal laws waived by DHS to make way for construction that will use funds from a congressional appropriation in 2019 for border wall construction. The waivers avoid time-consuming reviews and lawsuits challenging violation of environmental laws.
More at link above.
Link to tweet
Link to tweet
Link to tweet
Link to tweet
Recycle_Guru
(2,973 posts)suddenly everyone is all over this today. I would suggest people here do their homework on these issues and mot easily fall prey to corporate media and conservatives who are constantly looking for ways to get Democrats to lose faith in Biden administration.
FSogol
(47,623 posts)LiberaBlueDem
(1,167 posts)he's gonna take the issue out of the RWNJ hands and they can't use the border against him?
Down and dirty politics?
treestar
(82,383 posts)Biden could build TFG's wall itself and the MAGATs would still say he maintains "open borders."
Autumn
(48,962 posts)AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)you have several activist orgs including immigration activists along with climate groups calling this out expressing their disappointment. And Indy media who's on the left is also calling this out, not only corporate media.
The right is literally using this saying they were correct all along. Including their "media outlets". That's not the same.
Cha
(319,076 posts)Link to tweet
Before whipping up a mob.
Yeah
The fucking "right" LIES.
Yeah, I bet the "left media"" is all over this like they always are to drag on Pres Biden.
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)When the tweet you shared was posted to Twitter 90 minutes AFTER my post here.
I don't have a Delorean that takes me into the future, sorry.
Cha
(319,076 posts)the time to get the truth out.
Because the magas & the factions like cornel west & greens won't care about the facts in this horrible constriction of THE WALL
wnylib
(26,014 posts)fact check before posting, especially when the posted info puts out such a negative image of Biden. The poster at Xitter managed to get the info.
I am wary of OPs that cast a negative image of Biden and other Dems, especially with the hyped up anti Biden disinformation coming from Trump and his acolytes.
Cha
(319,076 posts)Thank You for your Post!!
wnylib
(26,014 posts)lapucelle
(21,061 posts)Cha
(319,076 posts)lapucelle to the rescue.. Mahalo!!
Good to know and the OP should know that, too.
lapucelle
(21,061 posts)The construction project reported today was appropriated during the prior administration in 2019 and the law requires the government to use these funds for this purpose, which we announced earlier this year. We have repeatedly asked Congress to rescind this money but it has not done so and we are compelled to follow the law.
This Administration believes that effective border security requires a smarter and more comprehensive approach, including state-of the-art border surveillance technology and modernized ports of entry. We need Congress to give us the funds to implement these proven tools.
https://www.dhs.gov/news/2023/10/05/statement-secretary-mayorkas-recent-news-reports
Cha
(319,076 posts)My guess is this will all be coming out soon & overwhelm the "Out of Context" crap.
wnylib
(26,014 posts)reflect the information that you now have.
Or, since this building of a wall is so out of character for Biden, try exercising some skepticism and doing some research before posting an OP. The poster at Xitter managed to get that info, so saying that you posted before they did sounds lame. With so many members in your group ID, maybe consult with them?
When you post dubious OPs that spread negative info about Biden, you lose credibility here.
lapucelle
(21,061 posts)June 11, 2021
FACT SHEET: Department of Defense and Department of Homeland Security Plans for Border Wall Funds
The Biden Administration inherited a broken immigration system one that wasted billions of taxpayer dollars and neither kept the American people safe nor adhered to our values. Wall construction along the Southern border in recent years is just one example of the prior Administrations misplaced priorities and failure to manage migration in a safe, orderly, and humane way.
The Department of Homeland Security (DHS) and the Department of Defense (DOD) have developed plans reaffirming the Administrations commitment to serious policy solutions. Under these plans, DHS and DOD are: 1) canceling wall projects funded with resources diverted from military construction and other efforts and return the remaining available funds to their original appropriated purposes; 2) ending wall expansion to the extent permitted by law; and 3) addressing safety and environmental issues resulting from border wall construction under the previous Administration.
Additionally, the Administration is reiterating its call for Congress to cancel funds it previously appropriated for border barrier projects so that these resources can instead be used for modern, effective border management measures to improve safety and security.
snip================================
https://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/briefing-room/2021/06/11/fact-sheet-department-of-defense-and-department-of-homeland-security-plans-for-border-wall-funds/
betsuni
(29,078 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)How "disappointing" for Biden to respect it!!!!
MorbidButterflyTat
(4,512 posts)IMO.
Recycle_Guru
(2,973 posts)we can do it
(13,024 posts)Autumn
(48,962 posts)JOE BIDEN: No, there will not be another foot of wall constructed in my administration, number one. Number two, what I'm going to focus on, and the fact is that somebody in this group written a lot about the border. I'm going to make sure that we have border protection, but it's going to be based on making sure that we use high-tech capacity to deal with it. And at the ports of entry, that's where all the bad stuff is--
He had a great plan, I'm so disappointed in this. Those laws are protective laws.
ripcord
(5,553 posts)Illegal border crossings are at an all time high and there is an election approaching. The republicans won the messaging battle when liberals complained so much about immigrants bussed to their states. We are going be to hit hard this election on the fact that we don't control our southern border anymore. Get ready to see the border with Mexico and its woes plastered across the media heading into the election.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)It's been a focus for them and the pukes for years now. Why does anyone expect it to be any different now?
ripcord
(5,553 posts)We haven't seen numbers like this at the southern border before, you can be sure that immigration will be an issue in the presidential and other elections. By agreeing to build this wall President Biden is admitting that there is a problem and that he has been unsuccessful so far in dealing with it. Expect to see a lot of picture of overcrowded shelters filled with recent immigrants around the country, it will no longer be limited to the border states because now the problem has extended beyond there.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)ripcord
(5,553 posts)It is to redirect around an area that simply can't take anymore people.
Response to Autumn (Reply #19)
agingdem This message was self-deleted by its author.
Elessar Zappa
(16,385 posts)Bookmark this post for November of 2024.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)but the law did not allow that.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)Think. Again.
(22,456 posts)...at a time when we (Democrats and humanity alike) can not afford any mistakes.
Cha
(319,076 posts)SickOfTheOnePct
(8,710 posts)To simply not use the money. Obviously not optimal, though.
forthemiddle
(1,459 posts)If Biden disagrees with the wall, dont build it.
The money was appropriated, but it doesnt need to be spent. Save the Country the money.
Im sure that he realizes that the border will be an election matter, and if he doesnt have it under control the optics will kill them.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)On September 30th of the fifth fiscal year appropriations that are not used are closed or canceled, and are no longer an obligation.
sheshe2
(97,628 posts)The mistake was the OP's and should be deleted.
Think. Again.
(22,456 posts)...my comment was #5, written before the responses.
sheshe2
(97,628 posts)So what do you think about the OP now that you have read the whole thread?
Think. Again.
(22,456 posts)Last edited Sat Oct 7, 2023, 02:52 AM - Edit history (1)
...but as the morning progressed, and a number of other threads came up on this same topic, my position did indeed evolve from my immediate reaction.
That evolution is probably best experienced by reading my various posts on different threads, all available in my journal. This topic took quite a few different directions here on DU, and I can't fully explain all the nuance I was following and responding to in a recap like this.
EDIT to add: My apologies, I just checked and apparently my journal, open to all, does not actually show all of the replies and responses I have made, only my original threads, and so you would not be able to see how my position on this issue, and my thoughts on surrounding issues, has developed ove the course of the day.
Suffice to say that although I still believe this could be a damaging move to both our election efforts and to the ecology of the area this project is slated for, I am more comfortable knowing Biden's point of view on this action.
leftstreet
(40,681 posts)Oh man, the lawsuits...
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)Chainfire
(17,757 posts)Take away an important issue of the far right?
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)I am baffled & befuddled by this.
The right is already calling this a huge gigantic win for them saying it proves they were right. It's already being used against Biden in his bid for re-election.
I honestly don't get it.
Torchlight
(6,830 posts)Good luck.
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)Do better.
There's no need to act like that. We're adults here. This isn't 4chan.
Torchlight
(6,830 posts)I certainly hope the adults will act as such.
Recycle_Guru
(2,973 posts)ripcord
(5,553 posts)They don't really believe there is a problem at the border.
leftstreet
(40,681 posts)Most people here can see the media reports about the border and know there's a problem.
The issue has always been what to do about it
inthewind21
(4,616 posts)Start nailing the employers that hire them. Now there's a novel idea. It's like putting out a giant bowl of cat food every night then being shocked you are now overrun with cats. Does anyone actually think these people are just coming to be coming? MOST come to better their lives and god only knows the US has more than enough employers who are ready and willing to to exploit them for cheap "off the books" labor. But hey, nothing like completely missing the obvious.
leftstreet
(40,681 posts)redqueen
(115,186 posts)I remember reading that they were enforced more during Clinton's terms than Bush Jr's
ripcord
(5,553 posts)E-Verify was supposed to crack down on employing people without work authorization, liberals and immigration activists made sure it wasn't made mandatory because it wasn't perfect, it had a 1.1% chance to give a false flag.
Mosby
(19,491 posts)Nt
uponit7771
(93,532 posts)uponit7771
(93,532 posts)... same.
We can do better
Immigrants are going from the frying pan into the fire at this point.
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)Well we can start with an ancient & out dated immigration system rooted in cold war ideology along with all the people fleeing their countries due to American intervention. The president of Mexico nailed it -
Link to tweet
Mr.Bill
(24,906 posts)elected official gets in front of a microphone they say Biden has an open border policy probably isn't helping things.
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)It's literally every damn time when they're interviewed. You're right.
Elessar Zappa
(16,385 posts)and undocumented immigrants cause very few problems here. Its the natives that are responsible for most of the crime.
uponit7771
(93,532 posts)Ace Rothstein
(3,373 posts)Would love to hear some ideas that actually work.
uponit7771
(93,532 posts)Chainfire
(17,757 posts)To believe that a wall will stop illegal immigration is just silly political myth. It didn't work for the Chinese, it didn't work for Hadrian, The Atlantic wall didn't work for the Germans and a Southern wall won't work for us. The wall solution makes the assumption that people from South of the border are too damn dumb to defeat a wall. I have worked shoulder to shoulder with illegal immigrants, they are not dumb; they laugh at the wall. Given standard construction tools and I as an old man could be through that wall in five minutes. For a wall to be effective, it has to be manned around the clock and if you are going to man the border around the clock, you don't need a wall.
Stopping immigration won't be done by a wall because it is an employer issue; no jobs, and the economic migrants don't come. I was working construction when a recurring national construction slowdown kicked in. Within weeks, the non-papered immigrants went home. Lock up the people who hire them and the flow slows to a drip. No one wants to admit the real problem because too many people make too much money from it, so we build silly walls with taxpayer money while the employers hire the immigrants as fast as they can find them.
The whole thing is a farce.
inthewind21
(4,616 posts)ripcord
(5,553 posts)Like the border wall in California it is meant to redirect people away from an area that has been overrun and can't handle anymore.
uponit7771
(93,532 posts)... border?
I don't think MAGA xenophobia should be amplified in any way
Recycle_Guru
(2,973 posts)There is presently an acute and immediate need to construct physical barriers and roads in the vicinity of the border of the United States in order to prevent unlawful entries into the United States in the project areas, he said.
Chakaconcarne
(2,787 posts)But he can say he tried and fix the narrative he isn't doing anything.
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)Cha
(319,076 posts)Demsrule86
(71,542 posts)for anything else. Thus, my guess is Biden will allocate the money which is already only to be used for a stupid wall, But in return,we will get money for Urkaine and get funding until 24 after the election. Good for him. We need to keep the lights on.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)mention a just a few important protective laws ? The money might have been designated for a wall by Trump but the money hasn't been used and in a few years that money or the balance that was allocated is canceled.
Recycle_Guru
(2,973 posts)Autumn
(48,962 posts)Recycle_Guru
(2,973 posts)and dealt with many transmission line projects going through NEPA.
In general, an important process. At times, in urgent situations they can and should be waived.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)Under over or around.
Recycle_Guru
(2,973 posts)not just barrier. however, barriers at more populated areas are necessary and useful
that's why there are barriers for a lot of things in urban areas but mot out in the countryside
uponit7771
(93,532 posts)WarGamer
(18,613 posts)I don't think there is much political upside for doing this.
Response to AntivaxHunters (Original post)
Scrivener7 This message was self-deleted by its author.
pwb
(12,669 posts)Trumps wall feel apart already. Joe will build it right, with Union Labor.
Elessar Zappa
(16,385 posts)Sure, it would be expensive and wouldnt prevent migration but other than that I dont care about it. What I always opposed was the separation of children from their parents and the terrible conditions they were being held in.
Scrivener7
(59,522 posts)MorbidButterflyTat
(4,512 posts)Eleventy billion.
Propaganda and blatant lies work, eh?
Marthe48
(23,175 posts)and stop enforcing human movement. With climate change getting worse, the migration we see now is only gong to increase.
Some of the people on the move are refugees, from politics, policies, changing geography, persecution. Some are migrants who follow work, or other opportunity. Some of the people want to immigrate and settle permanently in a new country. Some are criminals.
Humans have moved since time out of mind. I'm more familiar with what archeology discovers about prehistoric humans. This idea of tracking humans and counting heads has been around since Sumerian times, but the borders get stricter and stricter as time goes on, depending on whose territory is getting the people on the move. Even when colonists first started coming to the U.S. nobody checked them at any entry points. The Swedish government (or churches) kept track of emigration starting in the 1600s.
Enforcing borders from people trying to make a living is an extension of selfishness, not just in the U.S. but across the world. As a post mentioned, the flow at the our southern border includes a lot of people who have been harmed by U.S. policies from the 1950s into the present. Anybody remember nixon going on a goodwill tour of South America and getting attacked in Venezuela in 1958? Wonder what instigated that attack? And then Cuba in the 1960s, Central America in the 1980s, on and on. The U.S, had The Monroe Doctrine, but none of the countries south of us had the same recourse.
Living people have to be somewhere. We all need safe geography, protective government or religious institutions, economic policies that allow the poorest to obtain food and shelter. The way things are, and the way people are, I don't see a chance of any migrants' lives getting better, no matter where they are or where they go. After WWII, people in Europe and the U.S. were concerned with Displaced People (D.P.s) and tried to resettle the people who had lost everything but their lives to WWII. Then we had C.A.R.E packages and Peace Corps. We've lost our humanity and our way, and it is a shame.
Nevilledog
(55,081 posts)Link to tweet
Ben LaBolt
@WHCommsDir
·
Follow
The funds for ~20 miles of border reinforcements were appropriated in 2019 before @POTUS took office. He called on Congress to reappropriate the funds for smarter, more effective enforcement uses. Congress failed to do so. Rule of law requires the project be completed in 2023.
Jennifer Jacobs
@JenniferJJacobs
Replying to @JenniferJJacobs
BIDEN on border wall: The money was appropriated for the border wall. I tried to get them to reappropriate it, to redirect that money.
"They didn't. They wouldn't.
"And in the mean time ... they have to use the money for what it was appropriated" for.
"I can't stop that."
Image
9:36 AM · Oct 5, 2023
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)Between my post here & the tweet you posted.
Nevilledog
(55,081 posts)I think it's important, in this time of compromised media, that we look for official confirmation or explanation. I've certainly posted things that turned out to be wrong, or more nuanced.
uponit7771
(93,532 posts)we can do it
(13,024 posts)AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)You may want to compare timestamps.
The tweet you posted didn't exist until after an hour & a half I posted this. SMH...
MorbidButterflyTat
(4,512 posts)It's over the top and NOT TRUE.
we can do it
(13,024 posts)uponit7771
(93,532 posts)we can do it
(13,024 posts)Shake shake shake
Demsrule86
(71,542 posts)sheshe2
(97,628 posts)You should have deleted the OP when you were told the information you posted was incorrect.
Yet you leave it up, WHY!?
Autumn
(48,962 posts)we can do it
(13,024 posts)Autumn
(48,962 posts)of time the appropriation is closed or canceled. If I remember correctly it's like 5 years. The funds were appropriated in 2019 so what? One more year? That would explain Mayorka's need for the waivers.
we can do it
(13,024 posts)Autumn
(48,962 posts)You can look it up. Try Google. Myself? I don't care if Biden builds a wall, I'm sure he will pick one that will be nice and effective to some degree. I also know he won't insist on cash kickbacks to line his pockets like Trump.
I do not like the waivers for the environmental protections.
we can do it
(13,024 posts)Autumn
(48,962 posts)gulliver
(13,985 posts)People just have no sense of scale or proportion. We're all on our last nerve over trivia as a result.
On edit: And, of course, not all people have no sense of proportion, and not all of us are on our last nerve.
ripcord
(5,553 posts)California has had a 14 mile long wall on the border in the Otay Mesa area for years.
Think. Again.
(22,456 posts)...most of the concern is about the lifted environmental laws, not the fence itself.
Response to AntivaxHunters (Original post)
elocs This message was self-deleted by its author.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)I haven't seen one and I have read every thread on this. Link it.
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)Response to AntivaxHunters (Reply #56)
elocs This message was self-deleted by its author.
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)We're not some authoritarian club that demands hive mind thought. We're the exact opposite. We're the party of critical thinking & logic. We're the ones who realize our elected leaders aren't Gods & make mistakes. No, we're the very opposite of the other side. We're not a cult. We're the ones who are rational.
Autumn
(48,962 posts)government to influence it to pursue their best interests." I don't remember who said it but that's the only way a government of the people and for the people will work.
Demsrule86
(71,542 posts)I am sure this is not your intention but that is what is happening.
Kingofalldems
(40,278 posts)AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)Explain please
MorbidButterflyTat
(4,512 posts)not the whole truth.
Multiple shouty tweets determined to undermine Prez Biden. Shameful.
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)I question why you single me out specifically when the General Discussion area is filled with posts very similar to mine. And multiple posts to undermine Biden? Really? Come on now. We're Democrats. We don't do whacky conspiracy theories.
MorbidButterflyTat
(4,512 posts)You have accused others on this thread of being "toxic." Your OP is nothing but toxic LIES against our Democratic president and his administration.
You have been informed, repeatedly, that your OP is A LIE.
You have been asked, repeatedly, to edit or self delete these LIES.
You have doubled down, dismissed proof, provided directly from President Biden and others you have repeatedly ignored, or attempted to gaslight.
I don't know who you are and I don't care. What I care about is your steadfast stubborn refusal to admit YOU ARE WRONG, and bizarre determination to amplify right wing MAGAt xenophobic LIES.
AntivaxHunters
(3,234 posts)sheshe2
(97,628 posts)The truth is not toxic and I see no reason why they should chill.
betsuni
(29,078 posts)Torchlight
(6,830 posts)"Come on now..."
dchill
(42,660 posts)...any move Joe Biden makes.
Chainfire
(17,757 posts)dchill
(42,660 posts)Response to dchill (Reply #60)
Post removed
dchill
(42,660 posts)I can't help how you think, either!
None so far with me, but if I disagreed with one I'd question it. Like if he suddenly opposed a future ban on assault weapons.
dchill
(42,660 posts)... but if he ever did something inexplicable and crooked, I'd be shocked.
Response to AntivaxHunters (Original post)
elocs This message was self-deleted by its author.
leftstreet
(40,681 posts)regardless of which party is in office
I happily recc'd it
Response to leftstreet (Reply #75)
elocs This message was self-deleted by its author.
MorbidButterflyTat
(4,512 posts)Agree.
Polybius
(21,901 posts)I live in NYC. Go Biden!
Elessar Zappa
(16,385 posts)I dont see an advantage in hounding Biden in an election year where the fate of America is at stake.
Chainfire
(17,757 posts)just leave them the hell alone and let them live. If they are criminals, jail them or deport them or both. All of this screaming, hate and fear about immigration does nothing other than making sub citizens out of a substantial part of our population. The undocumented workers that get here are our American Untermensch, they are damned by the government and a substantial number of the citizens, they are mistreated and abused. They have to live with the fear of the knock on the door in the middle of the night for the crime of working for a paycheck.
They come for jobs...they come to better their families; they want the American dream, just like all of our ancestors did.
If the rednecks can't compete with our Spanish speaking inhabitants, tough shit...up your game!
If people need someone to be angry at, go after the real evil in our society, the ones with the unfettered greed for power and money. The only thing they do is swap wealth around, they don't create a damn thing, and they don't want the people who do to have a any thing. They are the danger to our society, not undocumented Hispanic Americans.
Mr. Biden, tear down that wall...
Gregory1230
(77 posts)I regret to inform DU community about I will vote FOR independents, NOT for Joe. I told WH via email about border wall AS Berlin Wall and I think they are racists similar to Trump is DOING!
They are good job to give Trump to be FREE! I am a Democrat since 1996 so that is HUGE deal for them if they are continuing to Berlin Wall. I will campaign for independents, sorry.
Good bye DU!
leftstreet
(40,681 posts)No offense if English is not your first language.
ripcord
(5,553 posts)Texasgal
(17,240 posts)if our immigration process wasn't so f'cked up!
Skittles
(171,715 posts)canetoad
(20,769 posts)You should think about deleting this post or editing it and the title to reflect the truth, as posted upthread.
betsuni
(29,078 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)that would not make the news had TFG not made such a big deal about a Wall.
There have been walls and fences for a long time.
MAGATs are not going to vote for Biden because of this.
moondust
(21,286 posts)TFG's wall project stemmed from his hate and fear of immigrants "poisoning the blood of our country.
But now the flood of immigrants has increased so much that the wall may need to be expanded out of necessity.