I have never seen this board so divided

[edhopper]

as I do now over the Israeli/Hamas war.
But you know what, it's not a bad thing. We are all passionate people when it comes to politics and world events. There will be things that we disagree on. I think the Mods have done a good job of letting us go at each other over this (always with civility and grace )
One thing I know though, we all still support President Biden and the Democratic Party. And next year we will all do whatever we can to ensure Biden wins and the Democrats can take Congress from a GOP that is a true danger to our country.

So I won't let our disagreements over this tragic event stop me from staying here and looking ahead to 2024.

Shalom

[Lonestarblue]

1. Thank you. Indeed the divisions here are strong.

Along with our passions. As strong Democrats, we can disagree, though, without being hateful.

[Arazi]

2. Many years ago I was active in the I/P group

Theres a reason it’s always had its own space…. It’s a mess and very divisive.

Good post.

Thanks mods

[hurple]

3. That's why I am staying out if it all altogether

In this vase, BOTH sides are wrong, and both are guilty of unbelievable atrocities. I refuse to support either.

[AncientOfDays]

17. Amen

[question everything]

4. At least it is not lopsided. I have never seen so many post supporting Israel

Usually it is against Israel with the excuse of “the government, not the citizens,” even though events like these result in many antisemitic attacks across the country.

[marybourg]

6. I long ago put the worst anti-semites

on this board on “ignore”, so I actually found reading and participating somewhat reassuring.

[JohnSJ]

7. Exactly. I suspect another reason is some of those refusing to vote for Hillary in 2016 have left

[yardwork]

13. I agree. There are many fewer trolls here now.

We may disagree and things can get heated, but we're not disagreeing on fundamental facts.

It was so awful in 2016. I hope to never see that again.

[anciano]

5. Good post....

well said.

🙏

[twodogsbarking]

8. There is no happy ending.

[FakeNoose]

9. Personally I'm not a fan of Netanyahu

To me it seems he's done nothing but stir up trouble with the Palestinians ever since he came into office. I could be wrong though. I recognize that our opinions on DU are formed by what we learn from the media, and we all know the media slants things.

The fact is that the Palestinian "question" could have been answered over 50 years ago, if the Saudis, Egyptians, Syrians, Jordanians etc. had WANTED the question to be answered. If the other Arab countries had wanted to find a solution, they could have. But no! What they really wanted was to keep the Palestinians angry and deprived, because that's how you foment an uprising. Therefore the Arab neighbors all turned their backs on their Muslim brothers & sisters, and let them suffer all these years.

Apartheid is never fair, it's never right. The Palestinians have been deprived refugees for three generations.

Some of the Israeli leaders did try to find a solution but the Arab countries refused to help. That's because they will never cooperate with Israel. Syria is nothing but an opportunistic troublemaker. Lebanon used to be one of the good guys, but not any more.

[edhopper]

14. I don't disagree

after 3 generations, those countries still kept most in "refugee camps".

[NoMoreRepugs]

10. It's an over simplification but Israel/Hamas as with

EVERYTHING else demonstrates Biden good/tRump bad.

[GuppyGal]

11. I feel like there was a certain primary that divided this place much much much more.

[edhopper]

12. That is true

And there were unfortunate consequences for the country because of that.

[womanofthehills]

29. I think the primary was nothing compared to this division

And I survived here having been a Bernie supporter. . My boyfriend didn’t. This could be WW 3 - it’s escalating by the minite. We are not arguing about which candidate is better for this or that - we are arguing about life & death and if it’s ok for innocent children to be collateral damage - on video right before our eyes.

[MontanaMama]

15. Lots of effort globally to dive democrats

and our liberal counterparts in other countries. Eyes on the prose, folks. 2024.

[tiredtoo]

16. "I have never seen this board so divided"

Apparently, you haven't been around during an open primary. Personally, I got locked out during a previous primary. Said what was considered a bad thing about one of the candidates. Not a problem, I served my time and now try to control myself. I do agree with what you wrote otherwise.

[keopeli]

18. I seem to recall that 9/11 had deep divisions as did th 2008 primary.

It was 21 years ago so I may be mistaken. But the LIHOP/MIHOP thing was deeply divisive and became a verboten topic with a special forum.

Skinner, EarlG, and Elad made very smart medium and long-term changes that really minimize those issues today. As a result, today's divisions, which are very strong, remain civil and even productive without causing DUers to abandon the community. We all owe a great deal to the DU leaders. They have kept our community both strong and safe.

Thank you EarlG and Elad (and Skinner)!!!

[edhopper]

19. Very true

[druidity33]

24. Hear Here everybody! True true. K&R, nt

[LiberaBlueDem]

20. I can't believe

Can't believe so many with war lust on this site

Reminds me of the Iraq invasion when war lust overcame the nation

[COL Mustard]

22. I don't think I've seen war lust

I believe, as a lot of people do, that Israel has the right to defend itself. What Hamas did is barbaric. There’s no other word for it.

What I’m not in favor of is Hamas using hostages (and other civilians) as human shields. That’s also barbaric. I think, and I hope, that the Israeli Army will conduct itself with respect for the law of land warfare.

[Arazi]

23. +1

Good points.

What’s also weird to me is how so many aren’t interested in addressing Hamas’ continuous assaults on Israel.

Hamas. Hasn’t. Stopped. Trying. To. Kill. Israeli. Civilians

Ever.

Even today the rockets and incursions continue.

Sooner or later that had to be stopped. The massacres last weekend have hardened Israeli resolve that the time is now.

[womanofthehills]

31. Agree - and now everything is escalating FAST

Iran is warning Israel -pro Palestine rallies are happening with billions of people all over the world. How safe are we now? Our own CIA got the intel but missed the big picture. That’s very worrisome for us too?

US intelligence warned of the potential for violence days before ... - CNN
2 days agoAn October 5 wire from the CIA warned generally of the increasing possibility of violence by Hamas. . https://duckduckgo.com/?q=cia+had+intel&ia=web

[LiberaBlueDem]

32. Israel did not do well defending its people

And for that failure the defense forces will take it out on Gaza

Look, Hamas must be destroyed for peace. But also there has to be a change in the way Israel treats Gaza. Otherwise the circular cycle of violence only grows.

[panfluteman]

21. Perhaps the Most Predictable Thing Was That There Would Be

Another war between Israel and Hamas. That one of our two major political parties would have proven itself totally incapable of governing as well as being a real and present danger to our democracy, on the other hand, was not predictable twenty to thirty years ago. Who would have imagined it?

[wryter2000]

25. Weren't you here during the Hillary/Obama primaries?

Skinner had to create GD Primaries so we could avoid it. I don't want to live through that again.

[PatrickforB]

26. Although I have been glibly dismissed as coming up with the old 'cui bono' schtick around

this despicable attack by Hamas terrorists, I am going to persist in asking the meta question:

If we feel divided, there must be people who want us to feel that way.

Who are those people?

What are their interests in keeping us divided?

For example, kids on a number of college campuses are demonstrating in favor of Hamas. Why? Who benefits from ginning up this thoughtlessness among our young left? Hint: think about the current movement on the left favoring identity politics (intersectional oppression) versus the more traditional policies on the left stressing economic oppression. This has been co-opted by Wall Street and the capitalists into a multi-billion dollar DEI industry. Goldman Sachs has literally put millions into the effort. Why? Because it shifts the dialog away from economic justice to social justice. However, if you think it through achieving social justice leaves capitalism and its current legal doctrine of shareholder primacy very much intact. No risk to shareholder profits.

Just saying. Policies affect me. They affect you. And they certainly affect everyone who is not a capitalist (and by that I mean if you have to trade your labor for money to buy essentials you are NOT a capitalist - you are a worker.)

This is why I am always talking about shareholder profits being held above worker interests, consumer interests, and the environment itself.

I was watching MSNBC when the horrible Hamas terrorist attack happened and they had a guy on there talking about the economic consequences of the despicable attack. Very revealing who stands to make money off that.

So again, when we are tempted to divide against one another over an issue, it is always good to engage in the 'old schtick'.

CUI BONO?

[DontBelieveEastisEas]

27. "I think the Mods have done a good job of letting us go at each other over this"

Why are we allowed to take any side other than the one the current administration is taking?

I have not been able to discuss immigration.

[Lunabell]

28. On this, I definitely have my opinions.

But have chosen to keep them to myself. My only comment about this is that the industrial military complex and arms dealers are laughing all the way to the bank on their luxury yachts while innocent people die.

[treestar]

30. It's why there is a special forum

and only when something is current can it be in GD.

[Behind the Aegis]

33. ANYTIME Israel is in the equation, this is what happens.

As far as being divided, c'mon now....LOL! Sanders/Clinton wars, past I/P exceptions allowed to fester in the main rooms (big difference this time, many of the anti-Semites and anti-Israel bigots are gone), "Biden is too old" has been really nuts, trans issues, gay issues, and a few other topics come to mind. There are definitely flashpoints.