Palestinian health ministry says 200-300 people may have been killed in Israeli strike on hospital

[Donkees]

From Abeer Salman

Preliminary estimates indicate between 200 to 300 people were killed in an Israeli strike on a hospital in the center of Gaza City, the Palestinian Health Ministry in Gaza said in a statement Tuesday, noting many people still remained beneath the rubble.

The Palestinian government in Gaza said in an earlier statement that the strike on the Al-Ahli Arabi Hospital resulted in dozens of deaths.

“A new war crime committed by the occupation in the bombing of Al-Ahli Arabi Hospital in the center of Gaza City, resulting in the arrival of dozens of martyrs and injured at Al-Shifa Medical Complex due to the bombing. It should be noted that the hospital housed hundreds of patients, wounded, and displaced people from their homes forcibly due to the airstrikes,” the government statement said.

CNN has asked the IDF for comment on the claims.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

1. This is genocide.

[malaise]

5. Yes

That is what it is

[bdamomma]

7. Isn't

this the same thing Putin did to Ukrainians??? Bomb a kindergarten, maternity hospitals,power grid, etc stinks of Putin.

This is a GENOCIDE.

[malaise]

11. Yes

But up is down and in is out.
I give up on humanity

[BlueCheeseAgain]

10. A little caution is needed.

We don't even know who is responsible yet. If it was an Israeli attack, and done on purpose, then yes, it was a heinous act and the people responsible must answer to justice.

Also, calling this genocide really trivializes the word.

[JCMach1]

75. People need to not believe every piece.of propaganda from either side in a war.zone

Seriously...

[yagotme]

2. Hmmmm. A few things stand out.

“A new war crime", "by the occupation", "martyrs and injured". Hamas is known to hide behind hospitals and schools. Was a rocket attack fired from there/near there? If you use human shields for your armor, then you're going to have more "martyrs". Israel wouldn't be bombing you if you hadn't attacked Israel. If Israel bombed this hospital in error, then that's their "bad". But, Hamas, YOU'RE the one that started all this recent stuff.

[obamanut2012]

14. Seriously?

[yagotme]

32. Yes?

What part are you taking issue with, the fact that Hamas hides behind civilians, using them as shields, or that Hamas militants invaded Israel, killed/tortured/raped innocent civilians, boasted about it, called for a "day of rage", had support worldwide for their actions, and blamed the country they invaded for all of it. Seriously?

And as for the words they used, words mean things. "Pro-me, anti-them".

[LiberaBlueDem]

39. Yes, what Hamas did was a crime

But just 2% of Gaza likes Hamas, so why punish the 98%?

Did that hospital's nurses invade Israel? NO.

So why even come close to blowing it to pieces? Is it revenge? Will it make Gaza safe and peaceful? NO. So why bomb the hospital? It makes no sense.

[yagotme]

49. I don't know where you get 2%, it's much higher, I'm sure.

40,000 active militants (2% of pop., 4% of males, +/-) were reported in one spot, across the border from Israel, the other day. That's not counting missile guys, patrollers around Gaza, command and control. And, I imagine, if the husband supports Hamas, the rest of the family does, also. So add in several thousand more, to that.

As for the hospital, I don't "know" why it was hit, but there are guesses:

1. Pilot error
2. Intelligence error.
3. Hamas using hospital as cover for nefarious activities (command, missile launch, etc.)

ALL are possible, as Hamas has been known to use hosp and schools for cover.

[LiberaBlueDem]

54. Heard all that many times

Like in 1968: "We had to destroy the village to save it"

But this "ERROR" stuff? Well that's new to me. But yes, war is an error and we need to stop doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

I stand by the 2% like Hamas. 98% are being hurt for a few. That is cruelty.

[yagotme]

70. Well, we'll have to disagree on numbers, then.

I see 2% in one spot, therefore, numbers must be higher than 2. Missed a guess on previous post, too

4. Hamas hits their own hospital, due to error, or on purpose.

As far as "error", history is full of human error. Especially during combat, fog of war, etc. Nothing new.

[LiberaBlueDem]

76. Nothing new

Yes because some idiots still think war is the answer

You don't think war is the answer, do you?

[yagotme]

77. "The" answer, no.

Sometimes, though, one is not even offered the question. Should Ukraine be engaged in war right now???

[LiberaBlueDem]

78. Ukraine is in defense of its lands

Same could be said of the Palestinians.

[yagotme]

81. Same could be said about Israel. nt

[obamanut2012]

61. Oh boy

[yagotme]

74. If you have a disagreement with something I've said, then say so.

We can hash it out, and maybe get a better understanding of each other's viewpoint. "Oh boy" doesn't give much of an idea of what you're trying to say.

[sarisataka]

48. Seriously

More reports coming out that indicate the initial claims may be wrong.

[AntivaxHunters]

3. CNN is reporting on this right now

This is bad.... really really bad.....

[AntivaxHunters]

69. What are you even talking about?

CNN was literally reporting on this live as I typed this.
I didn't say anything other than that. Unsure what's up with what you said but what I said certainly shouldn't upset you. And yes it's gross it happened.

[yagotme]

71. Now reports are that it was Hamas missiles, not Israeli. nt

[AntivaxHunters]

72. IDF spoke person said "Islamic Jihad" not Hamas

Quite the head spinner

[yagotme]

73. An "assistant" of Hamas, perhaps?

"Come to Palestine. See Jews across the Gaza border. And hurl rockets at them."

[leftstreet]

4. DURec

[Dorian Gray]

6. This is devastating

for the patients in the hospital. For the doctors, nurses, support staff in the hospital. For every person in the area.

[bdamomma]

9. They are

killing everyone, in a Hospital??? This needs worldwide attention can't the ICC do something?????

[DetroitLegalBeagle]

19. Israel, like the US, is not a party to the Rome Statute

And does not recognize the ICC.

[bdamomma]

38. crap

nt

[mcar]

8. Hamas is claiming this

I will wait for confirmation before I condemn anyone for this act. It could have been Hamas who did it and are blaming Israel.

[Voltaire2]

18. It is being widely reported by reputable media.

I think it’s confirmed.

[mcar]

23. Not by CNN as such

[Happy Hoosier]

52. What is confirmed?

That the deaths occurred, or that Israel did it?

From what i’ve heard there is no confirmation as to cause.

[Bonx]

12. Possibly caused by Hamas rockets

#BREAKING: Reports suggest that the mass casualty event at the Baptist Hospital in Gaza City was the result of a misfired rocket launch by Hamas.

No IDF air activity was reported at the time and the timing coincided with a salvo of rockets launched at Israel.

Reminder: 30-40% of Hamas' rockets misfire and land short in the Gaza Strip.
1:55 PM · Oct 17, 2023

[BlueCheeseAgain]

16. Please give your source for this.

Thanks.

[muriel_volestrangler]

17. That comes from "IsraelWarRoom" on Twitter

which does not claim to be on that continent, but in the United States. So no better than a YoTube comment, or freeper.

[inthewind21]

35. A twitter

report. Doo we really wonder how we got to where we are?

[Happy Hoosier]

55. Israel claims "multiple sources"

Although Israel is saying it was a failed rocket launch by the group “Islamic Jihad.“

I’d like the US IC to evaluate this.

[inthewind21]

36. Seriously

You post "Breaking from effing Twitter! How about Facebook, what do their posters have to say that warrant "BREAKING" ?

[Bonx]

44. See #34

[GuppyGal]

13. This doesn't smell right...thats for damn sure. "Palestinian govt in Gaza" oh those SCUMBAGS

YEAH let me just believe that shit. Like Israel blew up an evacuation route.

NEWSFLASH we are not Russia we don't do this shit on purpose.

[Voltaire2]

20. 'We' do that rather frequently

For all values of ‘we’ I can think of here.

[inthewind21]

37. Shame on

anybody gullible enough to believe "we don't do this shit on purpose"

[Lonestarblue]

15. The NYT is reporting 500 dead from the attack. No definite attribution to Israel yet, but the Times

reported that Israel has been bombing Gaza on a daily basis, including in the south where it told a million Palestinians to go. It was my fear when Israel issued the warning that they would then bomb the south as well, with Palestinians being so crowded that they have no place to hide. Israel has already killed over 3,000 Palestinians and seriously wondered thousands more. They have gone far beyond an eye for an eye.

[Voltaire2]

21. NYT is well known for its anti Israel bias

said nobody seriously ever.

[LiberaBlueDem]

45. Do you hear yourself?

I hear myself when I demand peace.

And when I say 2% of Gaza likes Hamas and that the 98% should not be punished for the acts of a few crazy people

[GuppyGal]

46. I wasn't talking to you. Have a nice day

[LiberaBlueDem]

50. Oh, well, excuse me for reading your words?

When I did it made my day not so nice.

[GuppyGal]

51. I'm sorry I didn't mean that in a nasty way

I'm deleting all my recent posts anyway ... have a nice day (and I do really mean that LOL)

[EX500rider]

83. "I say 2% of Gaza likes Hamas and that the 98%"

And that figure comes from where exactly?

[demmiblue]

22. A retweet by Josh Marshall (fwiw):

For what it’s worth, this doesn’t look or sound quite like an air strike using the typical IAF 1000lb or 2000lb JDAM/Mk80 series to me. Incoming projectile sounds like it’s under power and the explosion frames visible look like largely propellant fire rather than HE detonation…

Link to tweet

[Takket]

25. Not sure how they can make that claim (the first tweeter)

It’s pitch black and the explosion doesn’t even happen on camera. How can he make any claim about not seeing soil thrown up???

[BlueCheeseAgain]

33. It's hard to tell much from that video.

And in the next tweet, the original tweeter (Justin Bronk) says, "Obviously, however, it’s difficult to tell with any certainty based on a single camera angle at night with low resolution."

While I'd very much like to believe that Israel wouldn't do something like this, I'm trying to apply as much scrutiny to info I want to be true as info I want to be false.

[Tomconroy]

24. Make a note of who rushed to condemn Israel.

[GuppyGal]

28. +1000

[demmiblue]

31. Oh, good lawd.

[obamanut2012]

64. Starting DU oppo lists? Seriously?

[Donkees]

26. ''The IDF says it is still investigating whether its forces were responsible for the strike''

The IDF says it is still investigating whether its forces were responsible for the strike, or whether it was the result of a failed rocket launch or other cause.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog-october-17-2023/

[Tomconroy]

29. Not definitive since we don't even know if the video

Is real. But this guy knows his ordinance:

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

[BlueCheeseAgain]

34. IDF denies hospital was a target.

From NBC News: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/live-blog/israel-hamas-war-live-updates-rcna120747/rcrd21846?canonicalCard=true

The way I read that is that Israel is denying they targeted the hospital. But they don't seem to be yet ruling out that it may have been accidental.

[Bonx]

40. Gaza hospital hit by failed Islamic Jihad rocket, says IDF

"The IDF said that an operative analysis found that a rocket fired by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad terrorist movement appeared to have caused the explosion at the Ahli Arab Hospital in Gaza City in which dozens of people were reported killed by the Hamas-run Gaza Health Ministry.

The explosion was reported at the same time that the Islamic Jihad announced that it had launched a barrage of rockets from the Strip toward Israel.

"An analysis of IDF operational systems indicates that a barrage of rockets was fired by terrorists in Gaza, passing in close proximity to the Al Ahli hospital in Gaza at the time it was hit," the IDF Spokesperson's Unit said."

More at:
https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-768879

[BlueCheeseAgain]

41. Thank you. Yes, I made a thread about that a few minutes ago.

[Voltaire2]

68. According to the NYT this would be the 5th hospital blown up so far

during the Israeli siege. Their map is behind a pay wall, but: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/10/07/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-maps.html

[mcar]

47. Appears to be a Hamas misfire

Link to tweet

?s=20

#BREAKING: An impact at the Al Ahly Hospital, center Gaza City is being checked by some reports as a premature rocket detonation from a nearby launching site.

[inthewind21]

56. Yet

the tweet says nothing about a Hamas misfire.

[Tomconroy]

57. I've seen video which I think is real.

Most of the hospital appears to be intact. Lights are on. More consistent with a small missile than with an Israeli heavy bomb which can take out a whole building complex.
There are clearly casualties but I wonder if it is anything like the numbers Hamas is throwing around.

[pinkstarburst]

58. I think this is all a bunch of Hamas BS to derail Biden's visit

The timing is suspect. If Israel wanted to take out a populated hospital, they could have done so a week ago. Israel is not shelling carelessly and they are not trying to hurt civilians. They are in fact going out of their way to minimize and avoid civilian casualties and so Hamas making this claim, right before Biden's trip to the middle east, knowing it will derail his talks, should be treated with great scrutiny.

Hamas is losing the PR war and needs to do something to change the course of things. Faking a hospital bombing would be just about perfect...

[EX500rider]

60. I wouldn't put it beyond terrorists to actually set off an explosion in the hospital

They need World opinion to put pressure on the IDF to stop the bombing as soon as they can so they don't get crushed

[Tomconroy]

65. Enormous propaganda value for hamas, for sure.

So they have a motive.

[Tomconroy]

62. I'm not an expert but from what I'm reading and seeing

I lean to the view it was a Hamas rocket. And initial reports on the number of casualties is exaggerated.

[Donkees]

63. The cancer ward of this hospital was damaged a few days ago, from a previous strike ...

It seems this hospital is a 'ministry of the Episcopal Diocese of Jerusalem' and is run by Hamas:

Al Ahli Arab Hospital, a ministry of the Episcopal Diocese of Jerusalem that serves patients in Gaza, was hit Oct. 17 by an apparent airstrike, adding to an already volatile situation in the Palestinian territory as Israeli soldiers prepare for an expected ground assault on the militant group Hamas.

The Palestinian Health Ministry put the initial death toll at 500 or more people, though it wasn’t clear how it reached that estimate. The ministry is run by Hamas, which has controlled the territory since 2007.

https://www.episcopalnewsservice.org/2023/10/17/airstrike-reportedly-hits-anglican-run-ahli-hospital-in-gaza-raising-fear-of-casualties/

Video that The Associated Press confirmed was from the hospital showed fire engulfing the building and the hospital’s grounds strewn with torn bodies, many of them young children. Around them in the grass were blankets, school backpacks and other belongings.

https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-gaza-hamas-war-biden-rafah-e062825a375d9eb62e95509cab95b80c

[Bonx]

59. Video of Hamas rocket launch and subsequent hospital explosion

https://streamable.com/odu9f9

[Tomconroy]

66. Gotta be careful about video from twitter. A lot is fake in one way or another.

[boston bean]

80. It aired live on Al Jazeera.

[Tomconroy]

82. It's an IDF video from a security Camera It's on their website. So it's authentic.

[boston bean]

79. It wasn't an Israeli strike. Correct the post or at the least edit

the OP with correct information.

[SoFlaBro]

84. Where are all of the Hamas apologists talking about Israeli genocide on Palestine now?

:rolleyes: