The New York Times walks back flawed Gaza hospital coverage, but other media outlets remain silent

[sl8]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/24/media/gaza-hospital-coverage-walk-back/index.html

The New York Times walks back flawed Gaza hospital coverage, but other media outlets remain silent

Analysis by Oliver Darcy
5 minute read
Published 2:02 PM EDT, Tue October 24, 2023


Editor’s Note: A version of this article first appeared in the “Reliable Sources” newsletter. Sign up for the daily digest chronicling the evolving media landscape here.

CNN — Most news organizations seem eager to sweep last week’s negligent coverage of the Gaza hospital explosion under the rug, moving on from the low moment covering the Israel-Hamas war without admitting any mistakes.

While The New York Times and BBC — both of which faced enormous scrutiny for their coverage of the blast — have in recent days issued mea culpas, the rest of the press has remained mum, declining to explain to their audiences how they initially got an important story of such great magnitude so wrong.

On Monday, I contacted the major news organizations that amplified Hamas’ claims, which immediately assigned blame to Israel for the blast that it said had left hundreds dead. Those organizations included CNN, the Associated Press, Reuters, Al Jazeera, and The Wall Street Journal.

Did these outlets stand by their initial reporting? Was there any regret repeating claims from the terrorist group? Since the explosion, one week ago Tuesday, Israel and the U.S. have assessed that the rocket originated in Gaza, not Israel. Additional analysis from independent forensic experts, including those contacted by CNN, have indicated that the available evidence from the blast was inconsistent with the damage one would expect to see from an Israeli strike.

[...]

[T_A]

1. Likely Because

a scientist came forward and pointed out that sound on the video has a doppler shift indicating whatever it was came from the OPPOSITE direction than what the IDF claims.

He was on NPR yesterday, but I was driving through traffic and didn't quite get all of it, but his point was there are problems with both scenarios.

[Cha]

2. No

Additional analysis from independent forensic experts, including those contacted by CNN, have indicated that the available evidence from the blast was inconsistent with the damage one would expect to see from an Israeli[/excerpt]

[T_A]

3. He Addressed That

Look, it's not my theory. You'd have to hear the case out.

BTW, it might have been on 'The Daily', after the Marketplace.

[Cha]

7. Israel Didn't bomb that Hospital.. Hamas'

FAILED rocket did. Hamas clams it was Israel.. I don't believe the fucking Butchers of Hamas.

U.S. intel indicates Israel didn’t bomb Gaza hospital

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/national-security-daily/2023/10/18/u-s-intel-indicates-israel-didnt-bomb-gaza-hospital-00122197

[T_A]

83. Once AGAIN

they DID NOT take the Doppler Shift effect into consideration.

Incomplete analysis.

[lapucelle]

78. The scientist from Earshot didn't "address that", so basically it is your theory.

Here's what Lawrence Abu Hamden, the scientist from Earshot, actually did say on NPR.

We're saying that [the acoustic analysis] reduces the probability that this is coming from the West. It's rocket science, after all, so we can't completely rule it out.

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/23/1208061552/what-new-analysis-shows-about-the-gaza-hospital-explosion

[Lovie777]

5. Pretty much.............

[lapucelle]

52. That talking point is making the rounds, Cha

You can read about it here.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=18395005

[Cha]

59. Mahalo for the link, lapucelle..

[eShirl]

23. dupe, sorry

pre- coffee dupe

[lapucelle]

76. There's a transcript. No scientist came forward on NPR and said that "there were problems with both scenarios".

Here's what Lawrence Abu Hamden, the scientist from Earshot, actually did say on NPR.

We're saying that [the acoustic analysis] reduces the probability that this is coming from the West. It's rocket science, after all, so we can't completely rule it out.

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/23/1208061552/what-new-analysis-shows-about-the-gaza-hospital-explosion

[Cha]

84. Mahalo, lapucelle.. I'm not

engaging anyone who is dead set on Blaming this on Israel.

The Terrorist Org HAMAS did this and LIED that Israel did it.

Not sure why any9one would belever the Butchers of HAMAS.

[T_A]

4. Found It!

Here ya go:

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/23/1208061552/what-new-analysis-shows-about-the-gaza-hospital-explosion

[BlueCheeseAgain]

10. I looked up Earshot.

A look at their previous studies and partners indicates they come to things with a strong initial bias.

[maxsolomon]

51. So, they're lying?

They know the Doppler Shift came from the West, but they're strongly biased to Hamas so they straight-up lied on NPR?

[lapucelle]

62. Here's what Earshot actually told NPR.

LAWRENCE ABU HAMDAN: We're saying that [the acoustic analysis] reduces the probability that this is coming from the West. It's rocket science, after all, so we can't completely rule it out.

The concerned speculation came from the NPR reporter, not from Earshot.

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/23/1208061552/what-new-analysis-shows-about-the-gaza-hospital-explosion

[lapucelle]

61. There's lots of nonsense coming out of reddit and twitter. There's a transcript of the NPR report.

People should read it.

----------------------------------------------------

Here's some information about Earshot.

Earshot is the worlds’ first not-for-profit organisation producing audio investigations for human rights and environmental advocacy.

Using cutting-edge audio forensic analysis techniques, we add a crucial but often overlooked dimension to open-source investigations. While image and spatial analysis have become widespread over the last few years, until now half of the story has remained untold on the soundtrack.

At Earshot, we draw on more than a decade of experience of audio analysis, bringing justice to crimes that lie beyond the cameras' frame.

=============================================================

The NPR reporter:

So let's start with the Hamas claim of an airstrike. Pretty much everyone agrees - all the experts I've spoken to so far - that the visual evidence doesn't support a standard airstrike. There's no big crater. There's not a lot of shrapnel or structural damage to the hospital, and there's no pieces of shrapnel found at the site. That would be pretty unusual.

But, you know, the Israeli claim that it was a failed rocket - there's a problem there, too.

Israel says rockets came from the West, and independent video supports that. But the video closest to the blast - you can hear the sound of something whizzing by. That's called a Doppler shift. It's that rise and fall and pitch of something passing you like a car that goes vroom. An NGO called Earshot analyzed that sound.

==================================

Here's what Earshot's spokesman actually told NPR:

We're saying that [the sound analysis] reduces the probability that this is coming from the West. It's rocket science, after all, so we can't completely rule it out.

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/23/1208061552/what-new-analysis-shows-about-the-gaza-hospital-explosion

===================================

Here's what CNN's report says about the same video:

A leading US acoustic expert, who did not have permission to speak publicly from their university, analyzed the sound waveform from the video and concluded that, while there were changes in the sound frequency, indicating that the object was in motion, there was no directional information that could be gleaned from it.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/21/middleeast/cnn-investigates-forensic-analysis-gaza-hospital-blast/index.html

----------------------------------------------


So to recap, there is no Doppler effect evidence that "proves" anything.

One spokesman for a private audio analysis company said the sound "reduces the probability" that the rocket came from the West.

A leading acoustics expert worked on CNN's investigation and concluded that "no directional evidence can be gleaned from from the recording".

====================================

And from this, reddit sleuths who fancy themselves to be acoustics experts are making misinformed, ridiculous claims.

[lapucelle]

77. Here ya go! This is what the expert from Earshot said according to the transcript you posted.

LAWRENCE ABU HAMDAN: We're saying that [the analysis] reduces the probability that this is coming from the West. It's rocket science, after all, so we can't completely rule it out.

And here's what the expert from "CNN Investigates: Forensic analysis of images and videos suggests rocket caused Gaza hospital blast, not Israeli airstrike" had to say about the same video

A leading US acoustic expert, who did not have permission to speak publicly from their university, analyzed the sound waveform from the video and concluded that, while there were changes in the sound frequency, indicating that the object was in motion, there was no directional information that could be gleaned from it.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/21/middleeast/cnn-investigates-forensic-analysis-gaza-hospital-blast/index.html

[totodeinhere]

6. CNN has reported that it is likely that the explosion at the hospital

did not come from an Israeli strike.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/21/middleeast/cnn-investigates-forensic-analysis-gaza-hospital-blast/index.html

That article seems to suggest that CNN has been accepting the Hamas version of events, but not so.

[sl8]

9. He does point out CNN's updated coverage and that forensic analysis.

He even provides the same link that you did.

I don't think his problem is with them not updating their coverage, he acknowleges that they did, but rather with their apparent lack of contrition , given how bad their initial reporting was.

[boston bean]

8. They all fucked over a chance fir Biden's trip to make some headway.

[Maru Kitteh]

18. How depressing, just so they could promote the lies of terrorists.

[BlueCheeseAgain]

11. At this point anyone claiming that Israel is behind the hospital explosion...

... is full-on engaged in motivated reasoning.

[EX500rider]

14. Or being paid by Hamas or a big fan

[T_A]

12. So

according to the IDF, the rockets fired by the Islamic Jihad came from the West, but whatever it was in the video that the IDF claims hit the hospital, came from the East.

The only remaining possibility is that the IDF didn't utilize the standard air-to-ground missile launched from a jet fighter, but something else, which came from the East.

[EX500rider]

13. Yeah, no

US intelligence findings
“Two of the cameras captured the flight of the projectile, and when we assess those videos, our judgment is that the rocket was launched from within the Gaza Strip, and traveled to the northeast. About 10 seconds after the launch, our conclusion is that the motor combustion became unstable. We can tell that in part based on the fluctuating intensity of the rocket’s plume. About five seconds after that, there is a flash in the video, and our assessment is that that is the rocket motor failing, and about five seconds later, one object hits the ground followed about two seconds later by a second. Our judgment is that the first object that hits the ground was likely the motor from the rocket, and the second shortly thereafter was the warhead," the official said.
"Given the sequence of events we can see in the videos and the geolocation of the launch based on those videos, our conclusion is that there was a catastrophic motor failure that likely occurred, which separated the motor and the warhead. The warhead landed in the hospital compound, and that was the second explosion and the much bigger one," the official said.

https://www.cnn.com/middleeast/live-news/israel-hamas-war-gaza-news-10-24-23/index.html

[T_A]

20. YES

“Two of the cameras captured the flight of the projectile, and when we assess those videos, our judgment is that the rocket was launched from within the Gaza Strip, and traveled to the northeast.

FROM the West.

That rules out the rockets launched by the Islamic Jihad.

[EX500rider]

30. Except every intelligence agency says they came from the Northeast

The British, the French, the US and the news organizations who have reviewed it, BBC, CNN etc but you managed to find one Hamas fan boy so gosh it must be right.

[T_A]

31. I'm Afraid You're Confused

From you earlier post:

the rocket was launched from within the Gaza Strip, and traveled to the northeast.

~

From my post:

There is INDEPENDENT video documenting that the rockets launched by the Islamic Jihad came from the West of the hospital.

You're conflating TO and FROM, which are opposites.

[EX500rider]

33. They all agree it was launched from within Gaza

[T_A]

35. BUT

they didn't include the Doppler Shift evidence in their calculations.

[EX500rider]

40. Mostly because I don't think there is any

Cell phone video and portable news cameras aren't going to have widely spaced enough microphones to get any stereo triangulation

[T_A]

42. That Is Not Required

You don't need 'stereo triangulation' when a train goes by, and the 'Doppler Shift' in the video is quite pronounced.

[EX500rider]

44. Nonsense with a mono recording you can't tell the direction

All you know is you have Doppler shift not the heading

[T_A]

45. Eh

the Doppler Shift IS THE HEADING.

The Doppler Shift is either rising or falling. You don't need stereo for that. It's like a light. It's either on or off.

Simple.

[EX500rider]

46. You do to get a heading from the noise

But I think the rest of us rather trust all the Western intelligence agencies plus the independent investigations done by CNN Etc then some random dude you found

[T_A]

49. You Continue To Be Very Confused

It has absolutely nothing to due with "trust" or "some random dude".

It's all about the frequency.

If the object is moving away, the frequency declines, or the opposite.

Hence the Doppler Shift.

It's not dependent upon stereo, the quality of the video, or any of the other extraneous hoops you've come up with.

Just simple science.

[EX500rider]

47. You mean the sound recording from the videos that all showed it coming from Gaza

Based on the buildings in the background

[T_A]

50. Both Sides Were In Gaza

The Islamic Jihad was to the West of the hospital, with INDEPENDENT video documenting them firing rockets Eastward.

The Doppler Shift proves the projectile came from the East.

End of story.

[EX500rider]

53. Again Doppler effect will not give you directions

It tell you if it's coming towards you or away from you but since it's coming from video it's a lot easier just to look at the video and tell that.
And multiple independent agencies have established it was fired from within Gaza.

[T_A]

54. Of Course

it was fired from within Gaza.

BOTH SIDES WERE IN GAZA.

Except the rockets the Islamic Jihad fired are ruled-out by simple science.

[EX500rider]

57. The only groups firing rockets from within Gaza are terrorist groups, Hamas, IJ, etc

[T_A]

64. Once Again

There is INDEPENDENT video documenting that the rockets launched by the Islamic Jihad came from the West of the hospital.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

74. You keep saying there's an independent video of this,

yet, when asked to provide a link, all we hear are crickets.
If you say there is an independent video, then post a link to it.

[T_A]

82. You're Confused AGAIN

Israel says rockets came from the West, and independent video supports that.

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/23/1208061552/what-new-analysis-shows-about-the-gaza-hospital-explosion

[BannonsLiver]

48. Gotta watch that 'ol Doppler shift.

🙄

[lapucelle]

63. It's a reddit talking point.

Here's what the Earshot analyst actually told NPR:

We're saying that [acoustic analysis] reduces the probability that this is coming from the West. It's rocket science, after all, so we can't completely rule it out.

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/23/1208061552/what-new-analysis-shows-about-the-gaza-hospital-

Here's what CNN's independent forensic analyst reported:

A leading US acoustic expert, who did not have permission to speak publicly from their university, analyzed the sound waveform from the video and concluded that, while there were changes in the sound frequency, indicating that the object was in motion, there was no directional information that could be gleaned from it.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/21/middleeast/cnn-investigates-forensic-analysis-gaza-hospital-blast/index.html

-----------------------------------------

Some guy thought he heard something on NPR that wasn't actually said.

He posts it in reddit or on twitter as "proof" of something that it doesn't actually prove.

And for some reason, it makes it's way here.

[EX500rider]

41. The video evidence is compelling enough on its own

They Geo located the buildings in the background and they can tell the direction the rocket is heading

[T_A]

43. Yes

East to West.

[BlueCheeseAgain]

16. I think you should consider the evident biases in the sources you cite.

At this point numerous experts, including several who have opposed Israel's current military campaign, have said that it is extremely unlikely that Israel was responsible for this explosion. The only ones saying otherwise are longstanding critics of Israel who likely had their conclusions before they began any analysis.

Why is it so important to believe that this particular explosion was not caused by a Palestinian-launched rocket? If you want to criticize Israel for hitting civilian targets, there are plenty of airstrikes you can choose.

[T_A]

21. Where Is The Bias In The Doppler Shift?

This is REALLY simple.

You have a train going by you with the whistle on. If it's approaching you and goes by you there is a Doppler Shift. If it's going away from you there is the opposite Doppler Shift.

There is NOTHING OPEN TO INTERPRETATION.

There is NOTHING OPEN TO BIAS.

It's either a Doppler Shift in one direction, or it's a Doppler Shift in the other direction.

[lapucelle]

71. He linked to this website to back up his claims.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

17. It didn't come from the east,

it was launched within Gaza and traveled NE and broke up about 10 seconds into it's flight time.

The only remaining possibility is that the IDF didn't utilize the standard air-to-ground missile launched from a jet fighter, but something else, which came from the East.

Why do you keep blaming Israel for this explosion?
What is the agenda here?

[BlueCheeseAgain]

19. I don't get it either.

It's not like there aren't other instances of Israeli airstrikes hitting civilians.

[T_A]

22. Sorry

but it could ONLY have come from the East, otherwise the Doppler Shift would have been the opposite, which it's not.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

25. No, it didn't.

You seem to be doing all you can to blame Israel and vindicate Hamas, why is that?

Very curious.

[T_A]

27. I'm Not Presenting My Opinion

just the facts. No blaming involved.

Scientifically, it could ONLY have come from the East.

Sorry that your blind allegiance prevents you from accepting the facts.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

26. Oh, BTW,

I'll trust US intelligence over an anonymous person on the internet.

[T_A]

28. Except

they DID NOT take into consideration the Doppler Shift.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

29. Ok, whatever you say.

I'm pretty sure of your agenda here and I'll just leave it at that.
Have a great Wed.

[SoFlaBro]

55. I've already fucking looked into the doppler shift and the fact that the shit missile was tumbling throws it off.

fuck

[T_A]

56. No

"tumbling" or not, is irrelevant.

Has no effect in regards to the Doppler Shift.

This is very simple, basic, science folks.

[SoFlaBro]

66. Tumbling is relevant due to the direction of the acoustics of the rocket nozzle.

fse

[T_A]

67. Nope

"tumbling" is immaterial to the Doppler Shift.

[Maru Kitteh]

15. Better to apologize very late for being STUPIDLY wrong and taking the word of TERRORISTS first

than never? Poor excuse for "journalism."

[T_A]

24. What We KNOW + Remaining Questions

1) There is INDEPENDENT video documenting that the rockets launched by the Islamic Jihad came from the West of the hospital.

The separate video, which the IDF stated shows the projectile which struck the hospital, contains the Doppler Shift which PROVES the projectile came from the East.

That rules out the rockets launched by the Islamic Jihad.

2) Citing the lack of pieces of shrapnel found at the site and more, that rules out the typical air-to-ground missile fired from a fighter jet. That doesn't rule out the IDF, it merely rules out an air-to-ground missile.

The IDF could have utilized another form of munition, which would have come from the East.

[BootinUp]

32. I do not think you are looking at the most recent

new york times report:

A Close Look at Some Key Evidence in the Gaza Hospital Blast
A widely cited missile video does not shed light on what happened, a Times analysis concludes.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/24/world/middleeast/gaza-hospital-israel-hamas-video.html

[T_A]

36. They

didn't consider the Doppler Shift evidence.

Behind the curve.

[T_A]

79. Except

they didn't take into consideration the Doppler Shift effect.

Meaningless.

[lapucelle]

58. What "independent video"? N/T

[lapucelle]

70. Where did you read about the independent video documenting purported claims that

no expert, analyst, or scientist is actually making? Do you have a link?

Where did the talking point come from?

[GuppyGal]

34. If Israel meant to hit that hospital...then they would of HIT IT. End of fucking story.

[T_A]

37. It Was Hit

and from the EAST.

[GuppyGal]

38. OK if you say so !!

[T_A]

39. No

SCIENCE, as in the Doppler Shift says so.

[lapucelle]

60. The science doesn't say that. Do you have a link? N/T

[T_A]

65. Of Course It Says That

https://imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov/features/yba/M31_velocity/spectrum/doppler_more.html

There's a gazillion more.

[lapucelle]

68. The science doesn't "prove" that the rocket came from the east, and no scientist is saying that the audio is "proof".

Where is that talking point coming from?

---------------------------------------------------------

It's certainly not coming from the Earshot analysis. Here's what Earshot told NPR:

We're saying that [the analysis] reduces the probability that this is coming from the West. It's rocket science, after all, so we can't completely rule it out.

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/23/1208061552/what-new-analysis-shows-about-the-gaza-hospital-explosion

And here's what the expert from "CNN Investigates: Forensic analysis of images and videos suggests rocket caused Gaza hospital blast, not Israeli airstrike" had to say about the same video

A leading US acoustic expert, who did not have permission to speak publicly from their university, analyzed the sound waveform from the video and concluded that, while there were changes in the sound frequency, indicating that the object was in motion, there was no directional information that could be gleaned from it.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/21/middleeast/cnn-investigates-forensic-analysis-gaza-hospital-blast/index.html

----------------------------------------------------------------------

So where exactly is the talking point that the sound analysis "proves something" coming from? It's not coming scientists.

[T_A]

69. Sez You

[MarineCombatEngineer]

73. Is that the best you can do?

I can't figure out why you are so bent on denying the truth and you want to blame Israel for this, what is your agenda here?

[T_A]

80. No Agenda

Just science.

Stop acting like it's my opinion. It's juvenile.

[The Magistrate]

87. Honey, It's Not Just Your Opinion

It's what you want badly to be true, for reasons you probably do well to keep concealed....

[T_A]

88. Sorry

but that's delusional.

[The Magistrate]

89. No Need To Apologize

I do not expect better. Was 'delusional' your word for the day on some 'build your vocabulary' site?


"Enquiring minds want to know!"

[T_A]

90. No Apology

Just a statement of fact.

[lapucelle]

72. A gazillion more what? Coloring pages?

Your link goes to this website.

[T_A]

81. Not

the page linked.

You look silly.

[lapucelle]

85. That's the website you linked to.

He's what's on the page you linked to.



===============================================

https://imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov/features/yba/M31_velocity/spectrum/doppler.mp3

[lapucelle]

91. The acoustic scientist who spoke to NPR disagrees with your theory

that the acoustic analysis "proves" something.

May someone should send him your link to try to persuade him that his analysis is wrong.

----------------------------------------------------------

Here's what Lawrence Abu Hamden, the scientist from Earshot, actually told NPR.

We're saying that [the acoustic analysis] reduces the probability that this is coming from the West. It's rocket science, after all, so we can't completely rule it out.

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/23/1208061552/what-new-analysis-shows-about-the-gaza-hospital-explosion

[Cha]

75. And, Yet Tlaib's Tweet Blaming Israel is Still UP and her latest tweet is a rude brush off to Manu Raju..

Link to tweet