The Economy Is Great. Why Are Americans in Such a Rotten Mood?

[usonian]

WSJ via MSN
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/the-economy-is-great-why-are-americans-in-such-a-rotten-mood/ar-AA1jcp1p

YADDA YADDA

Let's skip to the end (like I do with novels)


Lame-ass excuse: ( "I suspect" )
I suspect a lot of pessimism about the economy is “referred pain.” Just as part of your body can hurt because of injury to another, pessimism about the economy may reflect dissatisfaction with the country as a whole. Lately, there has been a lot to be dissatisfied about: intensifying political and cultural conflict and intolerance, the pandemic, the border, mass shootings, crime, war in Ukraine and now the war in the Middle East.

Why? Because this is all you see in the MSM and "social" media.
They control the message.

What matters:
The good news for Biden, if you want to cal it that, is that people may not be as upset about the economy as they tell pollsters. The bad news is, they are pretty upset about everything else.

MESSAGING, MESSAGING.

[Calculating]

1. In what way is the economy great?

Super high inflation, nobody can afford a home anymore, and my stock account has zero progress over three years.

[maxsolomon]

4. It's not "super high". It's been largely tamed.

Dropping all over the world, and lowest here, almost within the Fed's 2% target.

But the shock of the post-pandemic price surge hasn't worn off.

[usonian]

5. The article, like most, spends most of its time on polls, and little on factual data. Here's a little

Workers are getting more time off and more flexibility, which is why the Conference Board finds job satisfaction is also quite high. Federal pandemic relief means household finances are stronger, even now, than before the pandemic. Meanwhile, high housing and stock prices lifted the median household’s wealth after inflation by 37%

Yes, with inflation, home values rise. I have almost accidentally made a lot of money in homes, and if I were smart, should cash out now and rent with the interest on the money, if I can lock in the high rate. Could downsize again. I hate cleaning and maintaining the home. Especially the part about the 13 foot extension ladder.

Depends on what game you're playing.

[Chainfire]

6. I just looked at my quarterly report from my state retirement, the last three quarters I have gone backwards.

Thank Dog I don't depend on that for groceries.

However, that aside, as I believe the market will come back. People are afraid of the economy because the right wants them to be afraid. If Trump were relelected with identical numbers, it would be the greatest economy ever...

[Johnny2X2X]

25. That's crazy

Last 3 quarters I am up slightly, but the last 4 quarters I am up 20%.

[Rebl2]

63. Same here

[Happy Hoosier]

17. Inflation is about 3.8% right now.....

Not ideal, but hardly "super high." And yes, the market has been stagnant. That's largely because rising interests rates means that the market isn't the only place to make money right now, and the cost of borrowing is no longer basically free.

[Johnny2X2X]

40. "nobody can afford a home anymore?"

If nobody could afford a home anymore, home prices would come down precipitously.

[Calculating]

47. Corporations are buying them

..

[Rebl2]

64. Yep

Then selling them at higher price

[NoRethugFriends]

58. Inflation not that high, somepeople are buying homes

And I think you are not investing wisely.
If you are unhappy with the stocks, but CDs at 5.75%

[comradebillyboy]

2. Well mortgage rate are almost as high as they were

under Regan and rental rates continue to rise because high interest rate discourage new construction. Reducing inflation comes with increased lending costs so we have a ways to go before folks will be happy with the economy.

Plus the Democratic Party and the Biden Administration seem to do a really poor job of touting their excellent achievements.

[llmart]

8. Bought my second house in 1985.

The interest rate was 17%. My interest rate in 1974 when I bought my first house was 9%.

[HAB911]

13. YEP, bought mine in 1981, 14%

[honest.abe]

15. Its not just the interest rate, its also the high cost of a house that makes it so bad now.

Housing prices in 99% of U.S. counties are more unaffordable than ever for the average American earner, according to a new report from the real estate data site Attom.

Median-priced single-family homes and condos are “less affordable in the third quarter of 2023 compared to historical averages in 99% of counties around the nation” out of the 578 counties included in the report with enough data to analyze, Attom stated in a news release last week on its latest U.S. Home Affordability Report.

“The latest trend continues a two-year pattern of home ownership getting more and more difficult for average U.S. wage earners,” Attom reported.

https://news.yahoo.com/housing-market-prices-more-unaffordable-220237060.html

[Happy Hoosier]

18. Yeah, folks have gotten very used to very low rates. NT

[edisdead]

10. Ummm no they aren't and this type of thing is why people think the economy is bad

[MOMFUDSKI]

3. Been in a rotten mood since

raygun broke unions and wages have been held down dramatically since then. Time and money that can never be recouped.

[Chainfire]

7. Oh, you have to have faith, baby! That money is going to come trickling back down on us any minute.

Just like we were promised. It will fall like the rains of the Sahara. Pernaps if we give the rich a few more breaks it will speed things along.
I don't think we should tax any income from any source that is over 250K per year....Let the people who have never had money to lose foot the bills, they won't miss it.

[honest.abe]

9. I think it's mostly related to cost of housing.. renting or buying.

It’s about as bad as it’s ever been.

[TheRealNorth]

22. Food and housing (rent)

I don't have the numbers, but my impression is that they have gone up faster than the aggregate inflation number. And if you not making a whole lot of extra money, it hurts more.

[LightBright]

11. In my area, people have been priced out of their normal standard of living.

I'm talking about lower and middle income folk.

The economy does have a lot of really positive indicators right now.

What has happened in my area of Florida isn't minor. Lifestyles have been "downsized."

There is a good portion of staunch democrats who will believe their lying eyes. Their lying eyes are telling them they have had to downsize, change their shopping habits, skimp on family vacations, etc.

There has also been a boom in high end car sales in my area. Really high end.

[llmart]

12. I rarely go shopping much any more except for groceries and drug items.

But this past weekend I had to go shopping for birthday gifts and went to stores I don't ordinarily frequent except I did stop in Target for a couple items. The line in Target was all the way back from the registers to the middle of the store. I walked by and people had loads of stuff in their carts and arms. Went to Home Goods and it was the same. It was almost like Black Friday usually is. I was really quite shocked. I wanted to yell out, "I thought the economy was bad?" There didn't seem to be anybody worried about their pocketbooks.

I attribute it more to the fact that there are plenty of jobs out there and anyone that wants one can have one. If you have a job and you're comfortable with knowing you can keep it, then that gives you more confidence in purchasing.

[usonian]

14. I think that job creation has been a big part of Bidemonics.

Doesn't affect me, being retired.
But I'm a Dad.

Those shoppers probably have new jobs, and are boosting the economy, instead of tying up their money in yachts and overseas mansions.

Hope you benefit! Me, too.
Celebrate your 15,000th post, real soon.

[jimfields33]

84. Credit cards are being used a lot by Americans now.

The bills will be ugly.

[llmart]

94. Americans have always used credit cards a lot, at least for the last few decades.

That is nothing new.

[Sympthsical]

16. Because inflation stuck and housing sucks

Yes, the rate of inflation came down, but the price increases that came during the year long spike have stayed.

Inflation coming down doesn't mean prices come down along with it. Middle and lower incomes feel these pinches. As of September, 62% of Americans say they are living paycheck to paycheck. When you're scraping, any living expense increase shows up in your life, be that food, rent, insurance, etc.

What can help create optimism is prospects. If you're a Millennial, for example, you're around late 20s to early 40s, maybe hoping to get your own home some day. Welp, that's not happening any time soon. So continue to enjoy renting. Oh, and that's going to increase, too. So now it's even harder to save for that house you're never going to get.

It creates a pessimism that feeds into itself. You have to give people hope for the future, and a lot of people simply don't feel that with current conditions. Statistics do not defeat lived experience when it comes to how people feel. And people do not like being told they're not experiencing or feeling what they feel. I see messaging like, "The economy's great! You're hallucinating all this!"

That's . . . not a message that is going to work. I don't know why people think it is.

We need to tackle the housing crisis, and we need to figure out a way so that NIMBYism when it comes to building new housing doesn't factor in. Part of the problem is the local politicians are held hostage by the assholes among us, so they never want to approve new housing. We need to, perhaps, take it out of local hands to some degree. We need to immunize somewhat the people implementing housing development from the screaming of my asshole neighbors.

The current approach isn't working.

[honest.abe]

19. +1

Well stated.

[usonian]

20. Pretty soon, young people will be inheriting enormous wealth.

I'm not waiting to do so, so I helped my daughter buy her first home.

But she will own two more homes. Mom's and Dad's, as far into the future as we can push that.

She's obviously not looking forward to that.

But yes, housing is a big-ass problem. California is taking steps at the state level to deal with NIMBYism.
Better than nothing, but it's a start.

I posted about the new possibility of strip malls being capable of up-zoning to new housing. And there are others.

[Sympthsical]

26. That's a tricky circumstance to depend upon

Tricky, because Boomers are hanging in there. Upper Millennials are already in their 40s. When that wealth finally trickles down to people already in their 50s, that's not really solving the problem for younger generations. Zoomers and Alpha are just going through what Millennials have. Maybe worse, because school and housing ain't getting any cheaper.

With that wealth transfer, you could very easily end up with just another older generation owning a bunch of property and driving up prices and rents. We could be initiating a cycle in all this. Older generation lives longer, hoards wealth, and that wealth just gets passed into the next older generation. Meanwhile, if you're under 40, enjoy the economy we've created for you.

And we just can't expect generations to keep going through that. If history teaches us anything, you get a discontented youth for long enough, and your country will go through some shit.

I sometimes think people think Millennials are young still. I'm an older Millennial/Xennial. I am middle-aged. There is no talking around that. I am in my 40s and exhausted. I just got my first house four years ago. My friends' parents are 60s, early 70s. No one's seeing anything until they themselves are in their 50s or even 60s.

I think one of the unspokens is increased lifespan and the effects this is having on wealth concentration. You can't take it with you, but damn, some people are out there trying.

[usonian]

31. I'm "counting" on increased life span. Taking vitamins and exercising.

That’s why I took out some of my savings to help my daughter buy a home. (Gift, not loan)

I ain’t waiting to do some good. It’s great to do it now, and see the results.

I’m no fool.

[Sympthsical]

36. And you're one of the good ones for it

The world needs more Dolly Levi.

"Money is like manure. It should be spread around to encourage young things to grow."

[usonian]

38. Thank you.

It makes me happy every day.

[Avalon Sparks]

81. What I'm seeing

Majority of my peers are seeing their older parents assets disappearing quickly due to healthcare costs, primary long term care. Out of pocket costs until Medicare kicks in are HUGE. $10,000 to $15,000 a month goes fast. Most have nothing to inherit, it’s all going to private equity firms that have gobbled up majority of long term health facilities.

[honest.abe]

27. I wonder what percent of young people will actually inherit high value homes from parents.

I dont think its a high as we might think and certainly not something we should count on to solve the problem.

[questionseverything]

33. A very small percentage of young people inherit enormous wealth

That’s why their parents are 1%ers

[Dirty Socialist]

44. Being back tax incentives for housing

We used to be able to write off home loan interest on our taxes. I believe Trump took that away. Is that right? Bring back the ability to write them off

[MichMan]

49. Mortgage interest deductions never went away

The standard deduction was increased in 2017 making itemizing less attractive to most tax filers.

[Rebl2]

65. Still can

Used to be able interest rates on cars way back when. Seems crazy now when I think about that.

[leftstreet]

21. Why are they saying the economy is great if Americans say otherwise?

Do they really think they can control the narrative on this?

[usonian]

23. Mostly jobs, I think. nt

[leftstreet]

24. Have they wondered if maybe the jobs don't pay enough? n/t

[MichMan]

74. The only people who have a personal interest in the unemployment rate are those who are looking for jobs

If you aren't looking for one, it really doesn't matter to the majority of people

[LiberalFighter]

28. I consider it the fault of businesses for higher prices.

[usonian]

29. Imagine how much better the world would be without the insane concentration of wealth. Nt

[walkingman]

41. I think price gouging is absolutely the reason for higher prices.

The inflationary reaction to higher prices is demand for higher wages and for those on fixed incomes and lower incomes it is really dramatic. It is a vicious cycle.

I blame the FED for keeping interest rates so low for so long. They knew damn well it would have negative consequences but bowed to political pressure and here we are.

[walkingman]

30. Although I am pretty fortunate in terms of economics, I am in a pessimistic mood

because I see our Democracy crumbling before my eyes and very little is being done to stop it.

I'm not talking about just the last few years (although it has taken quite a hit) but over the last 4-5 decades. WIth the election of Reagan I think you can easily see a shift from the working class to corporate control of almost everything.

I worry for the young people and the world my generation has left them. I always had the intent to leave a better world for those that come after me.

Maybe for those that don't have a long-term perspective (are not old) then today's world is normal but for someone like myself, I find it bizarre.

[usonian]

32. The harder we have to work.

We saved Democracy from ruin, and Bidenomics is a revolution happening in real time, overthrowing old economic theory. We’ve got to keep the ball rolling.

We have the numbers if we work our asses off to get out the vote.

This kind of battle is so much better than wars. Ballots, not bullets.

[DestinyIsles]

34. Let's be honest the economy is not great

high inflation people can hardly afford the necessities anymore. Politicians should stop telling us its great when people when it's not is quite insulting.

[W_HAMILTON]

43. If people could hardly afford the necessities anymore, inflation wouldn't be what it is.

Because no one would be buying products at these increased prices, which would drive prices down.

As someone once said, "the solution to higher prices is ... higher prices."

As long as consumers continue to pay these higher prices, prices will remain high. And the reason why consumers are able to pay these higher prices is because the economy is doing great. The best job market the best wage growth in decades. Yes, inflation sucks and everyone would prefer to pay lower prices rather than higher prices, but the fact that they are continuing to pay these higher prices is only because the economy is doing so well.

[MichMan]

51. People can just decide that groceries, rent, and gas are optional?

[W_HAMILTON]

85. No, instead, they make cuts to their "wants" so they can pay for their "needs," but...

...they are not doing that, which is why very consumer demand is still very strong across the board -- including the main driver behind last quarter's incredibly high GDP growth rate-- and those "wants" are still being purchased, even at higher prices, which is one of the reasons those high prices still exist.

[barbaraann]

35. I believe that it is because the economy is measured by GDP instead of by factors that affect ordinary people.

GDP Is the Wrong Tool for Measuring What Matters
It’s time to replace gross domestic product with real metrics of well-being and sustainability
By Joseph E. Stiglitz

Since World War II, most countries around the world have come to use gross domestic product, or GDP, as the core metric for prosperity. The GDP measures market output: the monetary value of all the goods and services produced in an economy during a given period, usually a year. Governments can fail if this number falls—and so, not surprisingly, governments strive to make it climb. But striving to grow GDP is not the same as ensuring the well-being of a society.
...
These documents have helped crystallize a global movement toward improved measures of social and economic health. The OECD has adopted the approach in its Better Life Initiative, which recommends 11 indicators—and provides citizens with a way to weigh these for their own country, relative to others, to generate an index that measures their performance on the things they care about. The World Bank and the International Monetary Fund (IMF), traditionally strong advocates of GDP thinking, are now also paying attention to environment, inequality and sustainability of the economy.
...
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/gdp-is-the-wrong-tool-for-measuring-what-matters/

[sanatanadharma]

37. Rotten neighbors, even if one agrees with some ...

... the pressure of living among rotten Americans is taking its toll. Too much trash talk, internet trolling, street-corner gun-celebrations, destruction of the commons.
One's world view is warped when emotions trump truth.
The simply presence of too many talking to at least two others about how bad things are results in bad vibes for everyone.

America has caught malignant aggravated gastric-acid syndrome. It is a maga problem.
It comes from spitting too many poorly masticated words out of one's mouth.

People should sit silent chewing on their words and thoughts and concepts and feelings about what is, before telling others what is.
No one is free of their own filters, veils, un-and poorly investigated presumptions.
It is true that the asserted knowledge known to some has more validity than does the claimed knowledge known by others.

However, everyone (within self) is equally certain of the validity of their own knowledge.
For some, claiming to "know" means happiness that the learning is over.
For others, claiming to "know" means happiness that they know how to learn.

[usonian]

46. Outside of DU :-) I am at peace

I live in the woods (say what you want, moving here was cheap) and am in contact with nature all day. Photography keeps me on my feet. Last night’s sunset was spectacular.

I also have my dharma 🪷 (practice and study) and sangha, albeit mostly via zoom.

And I have music all day long. Should spend more time with it, since I recently had a mental breakthrough, so now my sight reading at the piano is so much better and the hobby exploded in value and satisfaction.

So, my daughter just called that she got a new job. Must be all that positive karma!

[bedazzled]

80. We are definitely concentrating on bad things

Thanks for the reminder

[Shermann]

39. We may be in another decade of malaise

The 2020's got off to a lousy start with a worldwide pandemic.

The MAGA remnants are fomenting unrest and creating misery for supporters and non-supporters alike.

Record inflation is creating far more losers than winners.

We have arrived at the age of consequences from climate change, with most being either willfully indifferent to or hopelessly pessimistic about.

We now have two unwinnable wars raging.

[ClimateHawk]

45. There is no "record inflation".

Inflation peaked in June 2022 at 9.1% and is currently 3.7%. That's not record breaking.

[Shermann]

50. The point is that there is malaise over inflation

And you knew that.

But if we're "going there", I'll define the record as the 1-year rolling average for the past 40 years.

[MichMan]

53. It was at its highest levels in 40 years though

[Autumn]

88. Inflation is down but prices aren't. nt

[mike_c]

42. the politics of grievance overshadow real satisfaction

Grievance is addictive, as is perceived persecution. They become part of our identities.

[betsuni]

73. Yes. Americans used to be known for their optimism...

[Initech]

48. Because they go home and watch Sean Hannity for four hours and he scrambles their brains.

Fox News is feeding America negative energy 24 hours a day every day. We should be celebrating our progress since the Great Shutdown. Instead, the MAGA fuckheads are rolling back progress and trying to overturn the 2020 election. Ugh we really do live in the stupid timeline.

[Conjuay]

52. A rotten mood?

because we have just realized that nearly half the people in this country

really

truly

suck.

any other questions?

[SWBTATTReg]

54. The bills are getting higher and higher too. Sure, wages have gone up, but so has everything else. So the net

result (higher wages less higher bills is less than before).

[MerryBlooms]

56. I have been going to the food bank once

A week for a client, since spring. The folks in line has easily tripled in that time frame. I go a half hour after opening, so I'm not even there at the opening rush. At the beginning, there were maybe 10 of us, now there are at least 30+, and some come walking up as I leave. So, the economy is great for some, not so great for others, as always.

People here are renting rooms for $700+ a month. Housing is difficult. We own our mobile home, space rent is up to $900 a month, plus utilities. Luckily, our place is paid off, no car payments. The new mobiles in our park are selling for $225,00 - $265,000. Our park lost 2/3 of the homes in the Almeda fire, including clubhouse such, so there is still rebuilding, and non stop machinery noise. During all this, our space rental still went up. Even though there was no clubhouse, pool was closed, security, etc... But we were charged as if it was.

[brush]

57. The advent of the internet and its easy spread of disinformation...

by political opponents accounts for a big part of it. When there were three networks with responsible journalist as anchors we didn't see this.

Even when FOX news ad Limbaugh began, it still wasn't as bad. Now people are bombarded constantly with propaganda and everyone doesn't have enough critical thinking skills to filter out the bs..

[Persondem]

59. How about because, in general, Americans are spoiled AF. nt

[msongs]

60. been to a grocery store lately? nt

[usonian]

62. Going shortly, to get a mini-cake.

Daughter phoned to say that she got a new job offer. Jobs seem to be the biggest part of this.

Rising tide raises all boats. Red tide buys mega-yachts and kills marine life.

[Chakaconcarne]

61. Humans aren't equipped to handle this much information/input...

Let alone try and parse out what is true or not true..

Social media and up to the minute news is the cause...

50 years ago we wouldn't have been privy to every little gory detail/atrocity happening in a conflict... now we are, and everyone has a differing opinion and not many are willing to accept those differing opinions.

[JCMach1]

66. Housing has been turned into investment class assets

And consumer prices have only stabilized at high levels.

Energy is still a mess. Compare that to gasoline under $1 when the economy was coming back under CLINTON in the 1990's.

[usonian]

67. "With a little help from my enemies"

[doc03]

68. The economy is great for who? I grew up in the 1950s and 1960s, most families lived

on one income from a union job back then. Today both parents have to work and many more than one job to
get 40 hours pay. The price of a home or a new car is out of reach for half the people in the country now. In the last 3 years food prices have doubled, electric bills have gone up 25%, a tank of heating oil is $1000. Since I retired in 2010
my pension check has lost 1/3 of its buying power. The balance in my IRA has never recovered from the crash in 2020, if you consider the inflation, it has probably lost 20% of its buying power. The GDP and the unemployment numbers mean absolutely nothing to me, the inflation is killing me. If you have a job and a steady income the GDP and unemployment don't affect you but inflation hurts everyone.

[GuppyGal]

69. Corporate America pushing for a recession

they want it so badly ...

[hunter]

70. I've met my most basic self. He's a dumpster diving mentally ill homeless guy.

The few times I was in a "rotten mood" then it certainly didn't have anything to do with "The Economy."

I figure everyone deserves a safe place to sleep, a healthy diet, and basic medical care.

Anything you've got beyond that count your blessings.

It's sad that we live in a nation that can't even guarantee to all humans the basic necessities of life. That's what's rotten.

[Aepps22]

71. What can we do?

The economy for regular people isn't great but what can be done? This isn't a Joe created problem but he will be blamed. I think his standing with the autoworkers will be big. Part of this is a world problem but telling people that won't help. Given the gridlock in Congress and Manchin messing up the IRA and other legislation, what can we do to help mitigate this? The pandemic really did a number on the economy and delayed a lot of the effects that we're feeling today. Part of me believes that without the pandemic things wouldn't be as bad. When interest rates were low and the government was sending out checks, people felt like the economy was better when in reality things were being masked to keep the world economy from falling off of a cliff.

[Xolodno]

72. Just because the aggregate numbers are good doesn't mean...

...everyone is doing well. Those numbers could be hiding a lot of details.

It's also how a lot of recessions start, trusting the aggerate numbers too much and ignoring the dam is about to break.

[WarGamer]

75. Easier answer. The definition of "Great Economy" differs from person to person.

If you're on a fixed income and a pack of Thomas bagels is $5 and a tub of cream cheese is $7...

If you're turning your A?C up to 82 to keep your power bill the same...

The economy isn't great.

If you're a professional, you've seen your salary grow 25% in the last 5 years while your home is now doubled its value.

If you're an ECON professor you'll clap your flippers like a circus seal because low interest rates were actually "unhealthy"

If you're a politician, you'll say the economy is great because everyone has a job... or two.

[usonian]

79. I'm retired, and not thinking of making money with a craft, or consulting.

My home is worth almost twice what I bought it for 8 years ago.

I could cash out and rent on the interest and IRA’s I have to drain.

Or could still downsize (it’s possible even in CA).

Actually three bedrooms for a single person is a bit much, but was available at a decent price.

I’ve been through inflation before. Money has been poured into a black hole, a bonanza for the rich who got billions and put it into yachts and overseas estates and mansions.

That is extremely inflationary. It is winding down, but now the money is going into real infrastructure projects, job upgrades from coal mining, and so on. These constitute the rising tide, not scylla and charybdis. (sp?)

New era for the economy with Bidenomics.

[GreenWave]

76. If we only had honest objective news...

If only...

[Aussie105]

77. I'm grumpy. I blame a general feeling of insecurity.

The covid years show me that life and financial security aren't things that are stable and predictable.

You can shout that the economy is doing great, but that has no effect on the vague feeling of doom and gloom and insecurity.

Even if inflation stabilised at a lower point, and my income/expense relationship stayed balanced as they are now, I'd still be left with a general feeling of insecurity.

I'm stuck with it. So grumpy is the order of the day.
Still taking care of business, but negative and grumpy with it.

[bucolic_frolic]

78. People are agitated by a lifestyle of peak everything

Stress, civil strife, peak junk in their lives. Too little relaxation while they try to pay for it all. It will settle down.

[SalamanderSleeps]

82. I live in the land of Kroger. And Kroger is gouging massively.

And no one is calling them on it.

Prices have not retreated from pandemic levels.

"Kroger's annual sales topped $148 billion last year as the Cincinnati-based grocer navigated cost-conscious shoppers squeezed by inflation. Kroger's profit also topped $2.2 billion, up 35.6% from 2021, outpacing the 7.5% sales growth for the year." as per Alexander Coolidge - Cincinnati Enquirer

I can attest to the fact that not being able to feed people the way that you would like makes one feel lost and angry. My parents never had this much trouble keeping decent food on the table.

Kroger does their pricing on a store by store basis. The store I'm closest to is adjacent to a large population of really poor folks and college kids. Everyone in the valley knows that this particular location is the most expensive. I drive out of my way to go to stores that are not as expensive. But, poor folks and college kids don't always have that as an option.

Adam Smith wrote two books. One was the "Theory of Moral Sentiment" and the other was the "Wealth of Nations." I'll give everybody one good Goddamned guess about which of these books the leadership of Kroger have either never read, or totally ignored.

But, who cares anyway as long as Kroger makes a fuck-ton of money by stealing from their customers all the right people will be happy.

[usonian]

83. Why I'm so old ....

I remember when WalMart and others were first moving into towns, no doubt with tax breaks, and wiping out Mom and Pop businesses. Seen any lately? They are like Norman Rockwell paintings, nostalgia.

No doubt, local politicians got a little fatter in the process of big retailers setting up monopolies in their towns.

I switched my propane to a local outfit. The big-ass conglomerate (starts with A) bought up the local Mom and Pop outfit I initially signed on with, and quality of service (and cost) were the worst.

[MichMan]

86. You believe a 1.5% profit margin is proof of massive gouging ?

Profits of $2.2 billion on sales of $148 billion is 1.5% profit. 1.5% !

[SalamanderSleeps]

90. After they pay their shareholders 1.5% is what they have left in the pot

If you noticed that your monthly grocery bills from Kroger have been more expensive than usual, it’s not just you. According to Cheapism blog, some products have gone up by 90% so far, and the company said it will continue to pass on higher costs to consumers through the end of the year. In fact, higher prices may become the new normal for the grocer, retail experts say. In recent months, customers have been reporting price hikes on several items at Kroger stores, for that reason, we decided to analyze what’s truly driving those increases – and what we discovered may come as a shock for many people out there.

A report published by retail and grocery news blog Cheapism compared current prices on 35 Kroger items with prices obtained on the very same products one year ago, and it found that only two items saw price drops, nine items remained unchanged, and the other 24 items had some eye-popping price increases. On Twitter, thousands of Kroger customers have been venting their frustration with the rising prices. One of them asked: “Why are groceries so expensive at Kroger right now ?” To what another responded “Kroger profits are at record highs. Its stock is up 36% in a year. Its CEO got a 45% raise to $22 million. Meanwhile, 75% of its workers are food insecure. 63% can't pay their bills. Many are on food stamps,” he wrote attaching a link to an exposé released earlier this year by The New York Times.

On December 2, Chief Financial Officer Gary Millerchip said Kroger was passing along higher costs to the consumer in several categories, “where it makes sense to do so," he said. The executive also noted that Kroger is paying more to its suppliers due to challenges that have been affecting the whole industry. But while consumers are forced to spend more at its stores, the company keeps recording extraordinary profits. In fact, over the past quarter, Kroger’s net income rose to $566 million just after hiking prices on consumers. Kroger’s Chairman and CEO Rodney McMullen said the company enjoyed “record performance” in the past couple of years. Meanwhile, the grocery chain spent a staggering $2.2 billion on shareholder handouts last year after it previously admitted it was letting customers absorb higher supply costs.

Essentially, Kroger did have to spend more money to ensure supplies, but while they are raising prices under the guise of increasing supplier costs, they’re also adding a little extra on top of that. Believe it or not – Kroger’s and Albertsons’ CEOs have explicitly admitted that they expect to benefit from rising prices.
“Our business operates the best when inflation is higher” Kroger CEO Rodney McMullen said during an earnings call with analysts. “A little bit of inflation is always good in our business.” “Kroger would have its customers believe they marked up prices just to keep up with outside costs – but the half billion in net income last quarter and whopping $2.2 billion worth of shareholder rewards the grocery giant doled out last year alone suggests otherwise,” wrote Kyle Herrig, president of Accountable.US. “The sooner corporations stop using this as an excuse to demand more from consumers while their profits soar, the sooner we’ll see costs stabilize for working families,” he emphasized.

The prices you’re seeing right now at Kroger stores are probably as low as they will ever be. The era of affordable food prices is over, and from now on, we will probably be forced to get used to some painful grocery bills.

Epic Economist - Dec 12, 2022

[MichMan]

92. Annual dividend of a whole whopping $1.16 per share

Last edited Fri Nov 3, 2023, 12:56 PM - Edit history (1)

or 2.5 % 0f the price of a share.

https://stockanalysis.com/stocks/kr/dividend/

Your definition of massive gouging is a lot different than mine if 1.5% profit margin fits the criteria.

[SalamanderSleeps]

93. If their share is underperforming that's really their problem.

Perhaps it might have something to do with the 1.2 Billion dollar fine they just got hit with.

"The grocery chain Kroger said on Friday that it had agreed to pay about $1.2 billion to states, local governments and Native American tribes to settle claims that its retail pharmacies played a role in fueling the opioid crisis." NYT - Sep 8, 2023

Their CEO makes 19 Million dollars a year.
Is anyone really worth that much?
How much gold can you eat?

Greed is a mental health issue and these folks need to get some help with that.

[Johnny2X2X]

87. Wage growth has exceeded inflation for several months running right now

People are getting ahead.

One issue is only negative makes the news. Remember the energy prices panic going into last Winter? Well, energy prices are way down going into this Winter, but you're not going to find any articles about it.

[Aristus]

89. There is an entire billion-dollar industry devoted to making Americans angry, afraid, depressed, and despairing.

And they're getting their money's worth.

One of the many, many things I hate about right-wingers: they have robbed the American people of our vaunted optimism. That no matter how bad things can get, the American people, with grit, determination, and a clear-eyed vision of a better tomorrow, can fix the problems facing us.

Republican politicians and right-wing hate radio have destroyed all of that.

[pwb]

91. The economy is hard on red minimum wage states. $7.25 an hour in 2023?

They should blame their Governors and Legislatures for allowing such paltry wages. Raise up your people......