"10 POINTS & VIDEO FOR ALL YOU NEWLY MINTED PALESTINE/HAMAS ALLIES"

[mzmolly]

Link to tweet

The video is graphic. Be warned. 😞

[Chainfire]

1. The OP title infers that all Palestinians are Hamas and that there are those among us that support Hamas terrorists.

The title alone has the smell of bullshit.

[calguy]

5. The title, in my opinion, is right on point

The ten points Nance makes are nothing but the truth. Mr. Nance knows far more about the region than any of us keyboard warriors ever will.

[obamanut2012]

33. The title equates Palestinians with Hamas/terrorists

I am very sad for you that you also think this is fine.

[mzmolly]

7. I believe his point is that people who know little about the area

are suddenly self-professed experts.

He’s noting that people who are advocating for innocent Palestinians, rightly so, often misunderstand Hamas strategy.

[AntiFascist]

43. You don't have to be a "self-professed expert" to see that Israel is playing right into the hands of Iran...

every day that civilians, including children, are shown being killed or injured, Israel (and by virtue of its sponsorship, the US) are losing more and more respect in the eyes of the world. Meanwhile, more and more Gazans are probably becoming radicalized, feeding the terroristic goals of Iran.

I'm one who believes that Hamas needs to be eliminated, but it needs to be done with 'intelligence' and that should mean using Israeli intelligence to persuade moderate Palestinians to turn against Hamas. Of course, Netanyahu just wants continual war so that he can remain in power. In essence, Netanyahu and Iran are working toward the same goal.

[MorbidButterflyTat]

54. What an absolute mess

Seems to me Nuttyahoo (borrowed from someone else) was voted out a while ago. I don't know why he's a thing again.

None of this would be happening if someone(s) weren't making a shit ton of money off it, IMO. Oh, I just thought of something: if millions in support for Palestine is being intercepted by/funneled to Hamas, where is the millions donated to Israel going? If Nuttyahoo is supporting/encouraging Hamas as well?

Sorry if I'm totally off track here. It's all such a clusterfvck to me.

[lapucelle]

85. You think that Netanyahu is "supporting/encouraging Hamas"?

[Oopsie Daisy]

86. LOL!

[lapucelle]

89. ...

"Hey just spitballing here... Could it be that Netanyahu is supporting or encouraging Hamas? And where are donations to Israel actually going?"

[Chautauquas]

11. +1

[yardwork]

13. "Those among us?" Who is us?

Malcolm Nance isn't talking to DU. He's talking to everybody in the world. There are plenty of "newly minted" allies of Palestine in the world who don't know what they're talking about. They're woefully ignorant of facts and running around making wild accusations and some of them are committing violent, criminal acts. They're in the news every day.

[Chainfire]

16. People who don't nesessasarily understand the politics can still view photos and make conclusions based

upon what they see. The conclusion they draw may be right or wrong, but things like photos of shot-up ambulances, burned out neighborhoods, and bombed refugee camps do have very bad optics regardless of the facts of the individual cases.

[Hekate]

26. Then I suggest you read what Nance said & become an ambassador for the truth

I put all of Malcolm Nance’s “10 Points” into a post for those who don’t like clicking on X.

By the way, he is considered an informed and reliable source at DU.

[WA-03 Democrat]

2. Mr Nance is awesome

[Maru Kitteh]

75. I've long been a great fan of M. Nance. He's amazing. I could listen to him

for hours.

[calguy]

3. Chilling video to watch

[leftstreet]

4. Hamas has allies at DU?

This I didn't know

[calguy]

6. Some of the posts I've read seem to imply it

Everyone means well, but many are too naive to see what's actually going on.

[Chainfire]

17. How about linking us to post to back up your claim.

Some people seem to think that if you don't back Israel, 100%, unconditionally, regardless of their actions, then you are a Hamas supporter.
I don't back my own government, my own friends or my own family like that. I am not a Hamas supporter, but I don't wear blinders either.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

20. Not sure

But I don’t think we’re supposed to call our individual posters, but there is a post that that referred to Hamas as fighting for human rights I believe it was a new member though, so could be a troll.

I do agree that questioning Israel’s methods (which I 100% support) does not make one a Hamas sympathizer.

[MorbidButterflyTat]

59. That post was taken totally wrong, IMO, deliberately, to stoke outrage.

and imagining a poorly written sentence means the poster is a troll. SMDH.

The post did NOT say Hamas was fighting for human rights, JFC!

[SickOfTheOnePct]

61. Then why didn't the poster

clarify?

“…but they are not fighting for human rights, like Hamas…”

This was called out by numerous subsequent posters, but I didn’t see that it was explained or retracted.

[questionseverything]

65. I think they got a hide so of course they can't explain

[sarisataka]

70. Nope, they didn't nt

[Cha]

74. What made you post that? It's not true.

[Cha]

73. That's the question.. I wrote a couple of

scathing posts to her about it and got crickets.

And, NO I didn't fucking deliberately misinterpret it like the accusation goes.

And, I haven't seen anyone else get a reply addressing it the last I looked.

[Patton French]

82. The post says exactly what it says

And is very clear. The defense of it is almost as absurd.

[lapucelle]

87. And then there's this: "Where is [sic] the millions donated to Israel going?"

and the curious speculation that Netanyahu is supporting and/or encouraging Hamas.

=====================================



=====================================

[yagotme]

27. There's a few posts here that have the feel of backing Hamas:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100218424220

#20 stands out, mostly.

ETA: And here, #25
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100218425016#post25

[Chainfire]

29. Thank you for the link. I just read the post and I do not agree with you.

[yagotme]

37. Added 2d link, more pronounced. nt

[obamanut2012]

35. Lol try again

[yagotme]

38. I did. 2d link is more pronounced. nt

[Think. Again.]

42. #20 is obviously belittling hamas...

...but as for #25, I have never heard of hamas being a group that's "fighting for human rights" before. Is that somethng that they are claiming? Hard sell, that.

In any case, the automatic assumption in the title of "American/maga Allies" OOPS, I mean, "Palestinian/hamas Allies", has immediately shut down any chance that I would read the thing.

I try to avoid exposing myself to anything that I know is not going to be presenting truth.

Palestinian doesn't equal hamas.
American doesn't equal maga.
Mexican doesn't equal rapist.
Trans doesn't equal groomer.
I could go on but you get the picture.

[yagotme]

44. Yes, #20 was on the weak side, even scrolling up and down for further context.

That's why I added link #2. Just took me awhile to find it.

The "human rights" was brought up to support the claim that there are Hamas supporters on this board. Some have stated there are none, but with a comment like that, it kinda seems so.

And, I get the picture. You assume some post is going to offend you, so you don't read it. OK.

[Think. Again.]

46. Thank you....

...and yes, when a writing of any kind starts out with implying rascist conflation, such as the title of the Nance piece, I try to avoid it.

[yagotme]

47. You're welcome.

I always try to bite down when reading a title. Sometimes gems appear downthread.

[yagotme]

94. Worded clumsily, not restated/edited, or intent clarified.

Seems poster didn't care if misinterpreted.

[calguy]

45. Too many posts to link

I'm not a tit-for-tat kind of guy. I've read dozens of posts, and this is my observation.

Feel free to disagree.... This is DU, where opinions are free to be expressed.

[Think. Again.]

48. Just to clarify...

...are you saying that you have seen "too many posts to link" that show hamas has allies here on DU?

[calguy]

60. Just to clarify...

I'm saying everyone has their own opinion. Many conversations here about both sides of the issue, and I don't have the motivation to have one with you.
Enjoy your weekend.

[lapucelle]

88. Just to clarify, there appears to be a poster here speculating that Netanyahu is supporting Hamas.

"Hey just spitballing here... Could it be that Netanyahu is supporting or encouraging Hamas? And where is the money to Israel actually going?"

[Patton French]

81. Well, one post claims Hamas is fighting for human rights.

So there’s that.

[Chainfire]

31. So, do you think that if you are not in lock step with Israel that you are supporting Hamas?

[Cha]

39. NO.. I think if you say "Hamas is fighting for human rightts"

Oct 7 Attack on Innocent Jewish Babies, Children, Women, aand Men they are HAMAS Apologists.

[Cha]

92. Why hasn't the poster responded to me and

others who called her out on it, then?

ETA.. Since it was "scrambled" as you say.. it's no one's fault that they misinterpreted it..as someone keeps accusing.

[wnylib]

77. Malcolm Nance's point is that many people with good intentions,

but no knowledge of the 100 year old backdrop affecting I/P today, are inadvertently and naively supporting Hamas with uninformed statements about the current war.

He's right, IMO.

[obamanut2012]

34. Wrong, you are spreading misinformation

It is also beyond condescending that you equaye anyone not agreeing with you as "naive."

Hysterical.

[calguy]

63. Where'd you get your foreign policy degree?

Trump University?

[Turbineguy]

8. Allies is probably too strong. More like

useful idiots.

[Cha]

36. Yes.

[sarisataka]

28. Yes nt

[Butterflylady]

84. Oh yes, anyone that calls for a ceasefire.

[TubbersUK]

9. His headline is pretty unhelpful in my opinion n/t

[PCIntern]

10. Yes because it's an "unfortunate" truth

I didn’t see much weeping for the dead Israelis and others killed on 10/7 from the Palestinian side. I didn’t hear any blanket condemnations of these actions by any of the organizations. All I heard was a mealy-mouthed “unfortunate circumstances led to this”. Nance understand.

[mzmolly]

12. I understand.

I think Nance has had his fill. Twitter is a cesspool.

[Chainfire]

14. I contend that neither party in this present war is all right or all wrong.

If that means that both sides revile me, so be it.

[mzmolly]

15. Right.

It appears Israel is playing into the hands of Hamas, in a way. But they have little choice at the moment.

There is a good discussion on Twitter (Nance's feed) about the ordeal if you're interested.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

18. I'm asking this sincerely

You say neither party in this present war is all right or all wrong.

The two parties are Israel and Hamas. While I can agree that Israel is not all right ( in a historical context), I do think Hamas is all wrong. I see nothing right about them.

Do you see anything right about Hamas?

[mzmolly]

19. That's a good

question.

[Chainfire]

25. It may be that the difference is us is that while I do know what Hamas does and has done is evil, and I certainly do

not approve as I despise attacks on civilians; I don't like war among armies, but I hate terrorism. I will never sanciton the murder of innocent people, any time, any where by anyone. That said, and sincerely so, I have some understanding as to why Hamas does it. To answer you question more directly, No, I do not think that Hamas is 100% bad any more than I think that Israel is 100% good. Is that the answer you were looking for?

[SickOfTheOnePct]

32. I wasn't looking for any particular answer

We’ll just agree to disagree on whether or not Hamas is 100% bad.

But I do appreciate you answering.

[Hekate]

21. Malcolm Nance's 10 points, from Xitter

Malcolm Nance, generally considered a reliable knowledgeable source by DU.
I copied this from the link in the OP.

10 POINTS & VIDEO FOR ALL YOU NEWLY MINTED PALESTINE/HAMAS ALLIES:

1) Since 2019 Israel & HAMAS had an Egyptian brokered ceasefire w/Israel. From that moment HAMAS worked with Iran & planned & prepared for a full scale invasion of Israel. MISSION: Mass murder any and all the Jews they could find.

2) 06:30 on 10-7 HAMAS prepared and fired 10,000 rockets into Israel and blitzed S. Israel cities with1,500 terrorist attackers.

3) The terrorists hand massacred 1,400 Israelis from 52 countries ONE BY ONE BY ONE. Man, woman and child

4) HAMAS PLANNED TWO YEARS AGO FOR AN AERIAL BLITZ & LAND INVASION. IT WAS NOT JUST EXPECTED, IT WAS NECESSARY FOR THEIR STRATEGY TO GAIN ARAB ALLIES BY BROADCASTING DEAD CIVILIANS.

5) HAMAS built 300 miles (500km) of concrete lined tunnels and NO DEFENSES FOR CIVILIANS. Not one concrete bus shelter for the population. Not. Fucking. One.

6) HAMAS Strategy was to let Civilian concrete buildings to ABSORB Israeli airstrikes. People were to be used as HUMAN SPONGES of Israeli fire, NOT HUMAN SHIELDS. They did not care about the population above ground at all.

7) Your new found outrage over their strategy is now their best weapon. They placed tunnels & bases under apartments, next to hospitals and show every child killed by the war they brought to Gaza. They admit they "need the blood" of civilians to motivate them to fight in the streets.

8) IF YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND WHY THIS CRISIS IS HAPPENING LOOK AT THE VIDEO BELOW. IT IS THE PRECIPITATING EVENT. THEY WERE KILLED ONE BY ONE.

9) If you say Israel brought the 10-7 slaughter on themselves by their past history, then you just hate jews. Really. Who cares about just ONE set of babies ... admit it.

10) If you're mad at ME for telling you how fucked up YOUR UNINFORMED NEWLY FORGED UNSHAKABLE OPINION IS? You don't really care about any of the victims. This is well over 100 years in the making and you're 3 weeks into it.

[Cha]

40. Rec.. TY for that Hekate.. that would

be informative on that Hamas apologist thread.

[Hekate]

22. Golda Meir said: We can forgive them for killing our children. We cannot forgive them from...

…forcing us to kill their children. We will only have peace with them when they love their children more than they hate us.

[mzmolly]

23. Beautifully

Last edited Sat Nov 4, 2023, 04:21 PM - Edit history (1)

stated.

[claudette]

52. Except

that no one is FORCING the Israeli government to kill Palestinian children. It's not always an accident. It's a conscious choice or they would not do it.

[Hekate]

53. Try reading Malcolm Nance's "10 Points" and get back to me

[claudette]

55. I don't

want to read anything Nance writes

[calguy]

64. A closed mind keeps you in the dark

[claudette]

66. Nope

I only read the writings of people I admire and trust

[calguy]

67. lol

Thanks for proving my point

[Autumn_Angler]

71. No one is forcing you to be a Hamas apologist n/t

[claudette]

72. Good. Because I'm not a Hamas apologist

Seems many here who make statement like that about a me just lack the skill of reading comprehension. Bye

[edhopper]

24. K&R

[sarisataka]

30. Hamas explains-

"Everything we do is justified."

"No civilians were killed"

"We must teach Israel a lesson, and we will do this again and again. "

[Cha]

41. Lying Terrorist ASSHOLES.

Are those exact quotes? TY

[sarisataka]

49. At least two of those are direct quotes

From Hamas spokesman Ghazi Hamad. I am not sure if it was him or another who said "No civilians were killed; only on and off-duty military personnel."

[Cha]

57. Whether Hamas denies it or not.. It's been Verified..

Israel/Palestine: Videos of Hamas-Led Attacks Verified

(Jerusalem, October 18, 2023) – Human Rights Watch has verified four videos from the October 7, 2023 attacks by Hamas-led gunmen, showing three incidents of deliberate killings, and presents this analysis in a video published today. The attacks should be investigated as war crimes.

On the morning of October 7, 2023, heavily armed men breached the fences separating Israel and Gaza and entered southern Israel. At least 1,400 people were killed, many of them civilians, including children, according to Israeli officials. Human Rights Watch continues to investigate these incidents, as well as others, as war crimes.

https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/10/18/israel/palestine-videos-hamas-led-attacks-verified

Link to tweet

[MorbidButterflyTat]

50. I don't care for him

I regret buying a book of his years ago, and was really put off by the typos and poor editing. How hard is it to proofread before printing? Very unprofessional, IMO.

He's too melodramatic and hyperbolic for me.

SHOUTY CAPS LOCK, like Slobby.

[claudette]

51. And then

America supplied money and weapons to Israel to defeat them. What Hamas did on 10/7 was HORRIFIC and is NOT condoned at all. The collective punishment by the Israel government in Gaza is just as horrific with thousands more innocents dying there.

Who cares what Nance says? I don't think like him.

[roamer65]

58. [phone]

[mzmolly]

62. It's not my title. It's Malcom

Nance's. Read the ten points?

[Tomconroy]

68. The first Palestinian terrorist that I became aware of

Was Sirhan Sirhan.
He wasn't the last one though.

[dalton99a]

69. People should see what the fucking animals did to innocent civilians in Israel

[aeromanKC]

76. Palestinians are to Hamas as Americans are to Trump

[Basic LA]

78. This looks like the turning point...

...when people of the world align themselves between Pro Occupation and Anti Occupation.

Once before there was a realignment and that was between pro Vietnam war and anti Vietnam war. It was cultural, world-wide, unstoppable. Suddenly the tide turned. I feel that shift now. All we need is the music.

[ExciteBike66]

79. Hamas is bad, so is bombing kids...

There will always be crazies who don't know what hamas is. That doesn't man we should be killing thousands of kids in response. But since the casualty numbers come from hamas I'm sure they are completely false and zero kids have been killed by Israel...

[Willto]

80. Well

since the casualty numbers come from hamas I'm sure they are completely false and zero kids have been killed by Israel...

I have no idea what the accurate numbers are. Neither do you by the way. But I can tell you this with absolute certainty. I'd trust a crack addicted kleptomaniac with my wallet before I'd believed any statistics coming from Hamas.

[mzmolly]

83. I agree. Israel has asked why people didn't

Last edited Sun Nov 5, 2023, 11:50 AM - Edit history (1)

take their children and leave given they had forewarning. Some have suggested Hamas will not allow it? Palestinian officials have indicated Hamas kills Palestinian children, blaming Israel for PR purposes. Others have said the refugee camps held mainly Hamas militants, which is why many of the survivors of bombings are fully grown men. Perhaps some of the militants have families who become casualties?

Horrific situation all around - regardless. No child deserves to be victimized by war. But I wouldn’t say with certainty that Israel is responsible for all civilian deaths under the circumstances.