Why I support media criticism on DU

[senseandsensibility]

Last edited Thu Nov 9, 2023, 06:28 PM - Edit history (1)

There are many threads today on DU about the rightwing coverage of the corporate media, both print and television. Most of us notice it even if we are not glued to it 24/7. It is becoming too difficult to ignore, and seems to get worse daily. Many examples of the bias against President Biden have been given, and I have seen no real contradiction of what we are all seeing before our eyes.

Many say we are complaining, but what is the recourse? We must call them out the best we can. DU is one place for us to do that, social media such as twitter or other sites may reach bigger audiences, and we can always contact the media directly.

The alternative is silence, and I suppose that is good for ones' mental health. But I am not in the mood for that anymore, and neither are many of us.

So all we ask is that we are not nagged and criticized for calling attention to the media's attempt to give the election to cheato. You're not interested in discussing it? Fine. Don't click on the threads. I've never had any trouble avoiding threads I find irritating on DU.

In closing, I will paraphrase a Frederick Douglass quote I heard from Fran Drescher this morning about the SAG union victory: Power never concedes unless demands are made.

Let's make some demands for fair coverage of Joe Biden and his accomplishments!

[DestinyIsles]

1. But But But

according to some people here we should sit here and take it when the news media try to gaslight us.

[senseandsensibility]

2. I know

I have to admit it's not a pleasant topic, but ignoring it is not the answer.

[sheshe2]

20. Who here said this?

I have never seen that stated here.

[ShazzieB]

25. I havent seen that, either!

[sheshe2]

28. Thanks, thought I may have missed that gem.

I stopped watching CNN over a year ago. Now I seldom even turn on MSNBC I just don’t watch the news anymore nor do I listen to any polls that are out.
I get my News from reliable sources on the Internet and always read more than one to make sure it is correct.

[Sympthsical]

3. People need to stop watching

Hate watching is still ratings. Media do not care if you like or hate their content. They just want to know if you're engaging it. You know what kills them? Indifference. To what they say to what they show to their perception of themselves as figures of authority.

I don't watch cable news. It's not any part of my life. But I could tell you exactly what is going on every single day just by visiting DU and one or two other places I frequent.

It's like declaring the pizza awful as you wolf down four more slices and order a second.

No one's going to disapprove them out of business. But you can forget something out of business.

[senseandsensibility]

4. I agree to a certain point and I am certainly

reducing my consumption of cable news. However, the average person is greatly influenced by this propaganda. Remaining silent about it is not constructive.

[Sympthsical]

13. The average person is not watching at all.

People here consume a great deal of cable news and other media, because the people who congregate here are by and large political junkies in an older demographic. Staring at political media all day is just kind of what a lot of people here seem to do.

If you look at cable news ratings, no one's really watching. I think the highest ratings right now is 2-3 million in prime time. And it's Fox, as it ever is. I've said it before, but I'll say it again. I watch ASMR artists on YouTube with higher viewership than a lot of these cable news shows. And those are channels where people are actively trying to fall asleep.

For October:

In total day, Fox News averaged 1.36 million, down 8%, followed by MSNBC with 895,000, up 19%, and CNN with 600,000, an increase of 12%. In the adults 25-54 demo, Fox News averaged 174,000, down 15%, while CNN posted 124,000, up 17%, and MSNBC was at 98,000, up 23%.

Check out those 25-54 demographics. That's brutal when we've 340 million people bouncing around this country. 98,000 viewers is a podcast about bacon recipes. Actually, no. The bacon recipes would get better numbers.

The real problem, IMO, is how insular the media are. It's an entire industry where politicians, lobbyists, and media figures all talk at one another (and oftentimes pay one another), and echo what the other is talking about. They create a little system of repetition amongst themselves. And, of course, we political junkies notice it. A lot of the time when we complain about what "the media" are doing, we're referring to this vanishingly small group of people who are just jabbering at each other all day. And then we (and our opponents) spread around what this tiny group of people are saying to other political sites.

But they don't have a reach if we don't give them a reach. The problem is, we're addicted to it and spread it around. It goes back to my first point. I would have zero idea what is going on with cable news channels that garner ratings similar to live-streaming an ant farm if people didn't make it their second job to tell me all about it.

[Abolishinist]

45. Once again, spot on.

And to some extent, I admit to overwatching CNN/MSNBC et al. But in the end, it's nothing more than a soap opera. I live in CA, my vote doesn't count. We give money to those who we think will make a difference, so there's that, but we give a helluva lot more to animal and cultural organizations.

I do want to add, and hopefully not to your embarrassment, that you are one of my favorite posters. You're just that good!

[ExWhoDoesntCare]

50. Your vote counts

Or you wouldn't have a state that's so very blue, with officials who carry out very blue policies.

You want a vote that doesn't count? Try being a Democrat in a deep red state.

It's not only silly to say your vote doesn't count--it's downright insulting to people whose votes never result in policies they favor.

[Abolishinist]

53. I vote in every election, always have, always will.

And even though I can vote by mail, I prefer going to the polling place, both for the experience and picking up one of those "I Voted" stickers, which I display on our parrot's cage (she's a Birdie Sanders fan).

And I get satisfaction out of increasing the winner's margin. But here's the thing, I don't live in a swing state. So as a practical matter, which is all I meant, my one vote will not decide an election. Unlike, say, Boebert's last election, where she won by less than 600 votes with tens of thousands of registered D's not taking the time to do so. THOSE are votes that would have truly counted.

And yeah, it's got to be frustraing to live in a deep red state.

[tiredtoo]

35. Sorry about jumping in here but

Your pizza comment brought in a memory. My wife and I were at a bar with another couple, we ordered a pizza and found it to be bad. We told the waitress and she said she would take care of it. While we were waiting the other guy was eating the pizza and complaining. His wife said to him. Well you're eating all the evidence.

[Sympthsical]

36. LOL!

That's fantastic. I have never encountered inedible pizza.

I'm originally from Chicago, so I'm all about Lou Malnati's or Giordano's or whatever and can be a little snobbish with these things.

However, next week, our Costco down the street is finally - FINALLY - going to offer pizza after doing renovations on their food court.

I swear to god, we've marked it on our calendars and are practically planning a party. Vast quantities of cheap and mid pizza? Yep! The excitement in my house is palpable.

[Silent Type]

5. I'll bet money if you go on a white wing site, they'll be criticizing the same media reports criticized here.

The media doesn’t have to preface every comment with “trump is a POS, and here’s further proof.” Everyone knows he’s a POS, 45% or so just don’t care.

[NCIndie]

7. +1

[ExWhoDoesntCare]

51. I'd be happy if the traitor media

Wouldn't give credence to, and certainly not amplify every moronic and dishonest 'scandal' from the right wing, like Whitewater, Troopergate, Travelgate, Filegate, Swift Boating, Gore's sighing and 'inventing the Internet,' Obama being born in Kenya, his tan suit, the mustard he puts on his burger, Hillary's emails, Benghazi, Clinton Cash, Hunter Biden's laptop, Joe Biden's age--

Name one time that the press has given remotely as much coverage to negative *facts* about the traitor thugs as they have to those outright lies about Democrats.

I'll wait.

Because the promotion of lies about one party while ignoring the negative facts about their traitorous opponents looks very much the same as being collaborators with traitors.

When you carry media water for traitors, you are traitor media.

QEbloodyD.

[NCIndie]

6. Some of the pushback is related to the framing of the criticism.

Demanding better coverage of Biden's accomplishments is great.

Claiming certain medial outlets are "rightwing mouthpieces" takes the criticism to a different level.

Telling those who push back that they "must be getting paid" is not great.

[brooklynite]

8. You're welcome to complain about the media all you want...

...but I'll criticize the "of course the media is intentionally skewing the news to damage Biden's chances" conspiracy theory all I want.

[ShazzieB]

26. Yeah, i dont agree with that conspiracy theory, either.

Yesterday, I posted in another thread about this topic that I think a lot of the media outlets are just hungry for drama and trying to stir some up.

It's primary sesson, and there's no real suspense on either side as to who the two major party candidates are going to be. I think the media is frustrated that there are no real horse races to cover, and they're overcompensating by pretending to find drama where there really isn't any.

That's my theory, fwiw.

[TheProle]

41. Bingo.

[betsuni]

47. Agree.

[Midwestern Democrat]

49. Agreed. The OP seems to be demanding that DU be a safe space where people can slander the nation's major news outlets

as being right wing conspirators without anyone disagreeing with them.

[RKP5637]

9. Media will push anything that makes them money. n/t

[redqueen]

10. This didn't used to be a controversial topic

Remember the video that showed all the different talking heads on the news using the exact same phrases? That shit doesn't happen by accident.

Really sad to see how much this place has changed.

[senseandsensibility]

43. Yeah, I don't get the "controversy"

either.

[gab13by13]

11. I will argue issues till the cows come home

I will not give a platform to flat out lies.

What is going on with Hunter and Joe Biden is a joke, is bullshit. Multi-year investigations have produced nothing. I choose not to click on lies about the Biden’s, I don’t need to to defend the Biden’s with lengthy arguments.
People viewing right wing sites have been programmed to confusing a wall with a fence.

Magats lie, Magats are the fascist Nazis not Democrats. I know all of this without watching lies on TV. Saying Biden is too old is a joke and is propaganda. Should I watch Russian state TV so that I can rebut it? Magat politicians push Putin talking points, that’s how I respond.

[Sogo]

12. "Let's make some demands for fair coverage of Joe Biden and his accomplishments!"

[Moostache]

14. My complaints with the media coverage of EVERYTHING is that is all complete pap now...

EVERYTHING is formulaic, flavorless or utterly predictable and to make it WORSE, its all on a continual loop now as well...take CNN or MSNBC or even Fox as examples...there shows ALL have a similar rhythm and cadence that once you start noticing it makes them all equally unwatchable.

But even more frustrating than the obligatory "Big Board" segments with Kornacki or King, the coverage of issues and scandals and actual proposals to make being an American a better life for anyone not already making $250,000 or more annually is non-existent. These programs are all regurgitating the same stupid, inane and mindless pap ad nauseum from one hour to the next to the next and then in repeats for the next 3 hour block of time. It seems all networks are infected by it.

The only worthy sources of information left are NPR's radio shows and sometimes BBC World News and PBS News Hour. Beyond that, I can't stomach 95% of the "news" coverage because it is all entertainment and ratings-seeking nonsense. Horse-race election cycle coverage - with meaningless and trite polls that get discussed for a solid 18 minutes between "Big Board" and "Panel", in-between are the obligatory commercial breaks and half-hour resets for an hour long show to simply talk about it all again or a 1/2 hour show to wrap up until the next repeat airing...

The American people are the most advertised to and beaten down in the world. Everywhere we turn, our eyes, ears and sense are assaulted with sex-driven and envy-inducing advertising - showing everyone else having more sex, better vacations and toys and more of everything we don't need but are convinced we want. Our political coverage, even the semi-worthwhile stuff, is hideously uninformed and banal. There is no nuance or discussion, its all ideology and nonsense.

I used to wonder why Trump was ever popular at all...no more. He is custom made from central casting to play this role - ring leader of the circus. What better way to illustrate the bankruptcy of our times than to raise a modern day W.C Fields or P.T. Barnum knock-off to the highest stations of governance? If you CARE, it makes zero sense to EVER vote for such an insanely unfit asshole. When you no longer care at all, and its all about the next endorphin release from your fucking phone, well, then order up the fat ass Orange blob from central casting and tune in for another 30 minute non-summary and non-expert analysis until the dopamine gets tickled...

[senseandsensibility]

15. Tell us how you really feel!

You make some very good points, and I agree that the quality of the journalism is atrocious. But it is also slanted to the right, and that is important.

[Moostache]

18. Some is slanted right - more than the amount to the left

However, the real issue is not so much right-left to me, though it is a part...

The real issue is money and its corrosive effect on all of it. Enough cash is thrown around on advertising and on contracts for these panel show "experts" to opine about nothing of any real import, that were it repurposed, we could retire the national debt, fund Social Security for another decade plus and reduce our planetary ecological disaster by 50%!!! (*numbers are fact checked the exact same way as network opinion pieces - not at all!!!).

[spanone]

16. K&R

[SCantiGOP]

17. I agree 100%

What I do disagree with are the people who say they boycott CNN or the DC and NY newspapers because they are anti-Biden or right wing. They are all fact-based media with a center to center-left orientation.
I have even seen people say they are upset about MSNBC coverage. Progressives and Democrats don’t need a leftist version of FOX News, and I am not concerned about encountering viewpoints with which I may disagree.

[ShazzieB]

32. I get tired of way some people lump all the different media outlets together as if theyre all the same.

Gripe all you want: all I ask is that the gripes be aimed at those who truly deserve them.

MSNBC, for example, isn't t perfect, but it's the closest thing we have to a leftwing cable news network in this country. I guess a lot of people might call them center-left, but whatever you want to call it, their coverage skews more left than most. It's left for me, and I really enjoy it. I also learn a lot from the shows I watch.

It's true that if you watch one MSNBC show after another after another, etc., they will cover a lot of the same topics and hit a lot of the same talking points. That's because whatever's in the news each day is what they're going to cover, and a lot of the same points are bound to come up. There's not much the hosts can do about that. But I strongly disagree that all the hosts and all of their guests say the same things over and over, like they're all carbon copies of each other. The hosts aren't all equally good, but the ones I watch regularly all seem very well informed to me, and I think most of them do a pretty good job of bringing on guest panelists who are even more well-informed on their individual areas of expertise and contribute a lot to the discussion.

I especially enjoy hearing the legal analysts dissect everything from Supreme Court cases to 45's latest trial antics. Without people like Neil Katyal, Dahlia Lithwick, Joyce Vance, and others, I would be completely lost trying to make sense out of that stuff. And that's just a small sampling of the people on these shows who explain stuff that would go over my head without their expert guidance.

I don't watch any of the other cable news channels enough to make good comparisons, but I know that if I try to watch CNN, for instance, for any amount of time, it starts getting on my nerves in a way that MSNBC never does. That alone tells me that there's a difference.

I guess what I'm trying to say is it doesn't bother me when people criticize individual media outlets. Lumping them all together and complaining about "the media," as if it's all one homogeneous entity is what gets on my nerves.

[gab13by13]

19. Question for cable news, newspaper viewers

From watching cable news, do you understand why FDR put a cap on SS deductions, why LBJ left a 20% hole in Medicare?

Turn off cable and watch Thom Hartmann or Nicolle Wallace for the answers.

Example: Fox says Biden beats his wife,
CNN says it needs more information,
MSNBC says no he doesn’t.

All 3 are still talking about Biden beating his wife.

[ancianita]

29. I read lots of Hartmann, and he says it was Bush & GOP who left the 20% hole in Medicare in 2003.

Fixed that for you, and got your overall excellent point.

[vanlassie]

52. To watch Nicolle Wallace, I turn on cable TV.

And cable news is current events, not The History Channel. Although, the high quality expert guests on MSNBC DO share historical perspectives, when appropriate.

[Roy Rolling]

21. This first

Explain to me your definition of media.

And there is the problem—criticism of “the media” is too broad to be taken seriously.

Unless it’s mean to mean every method of communication collectively, criticizing “the media” is meaningless.we might as well criticize the air for carrying bad sounds.

[ancianita]

30. Which is why, when I criticize, I specify "corporate media."

Which is no small part of media overall, since it has more reach and scope than informative media.

Media isn't a monolith; that said, corporate media itself is as close to monolithic as any citizen has to deal with.

[senseandsensibility]

31. I used the term in my OP as well

[ancianita]

37. I knew that!

[Think. Again.]

22. It might be a good idea...

...for Biden's campaign to stop relying on the for-profit media to get their message out and to just go around the corporate media.

I would see nothing wrong with a full-fledged, constant and consistent publicity campaign utilizing all available media resources such as paid ads, paid-for spots on any all entertainment media, paid pages in all print media, and most importantly, the hiring of a young, dynamic media team pulling this all together with excitement and energy, using their youth and vibrancy by making the round of any spot they can get themselves on and saturating every social media platform with non-stop talk, memes, vids, etc. And focusing only on the past accomplishments and future promise of this administration.

No debating rightwing influencers, no appearances on mixed cable news panels, just positive, positive, positive, everywhere they can.

Non-stop. Everywhere. From now until November '24

[senseandsensibility]

23. They need to hire you

NOW!!! Seriously, great ideas!

[Think. Again.]

27. Nope, not me...

...Young, vibrant, savvy, diverse, positive folks who are excited to be shouting and singing the praises of the only candidate who actually cares about their future.

[Butterflylady]

33. Call Senator Fettermans media team

He had the best media team working for him.

[mountain grammy]

24. I've emailed different news programs

about their coverage and reports..rarely get a response but I keep on doing it. I know I'm not alone and they need to know we see them.

[Think. Again.]

34. They will...

...only respond to whether or not they can keep an audience for their advertisers.

That is literally all they care about.

[ancianita]

39. Me, too.

I'd like to think that one time I emailed MSNBC, which was about to not renew Lawrence O'Donnell's contract, that my threat to tell everyone I know to stop watching had some impact.

[mcar]

38. Thank you for this

I posted this earlier today amidst the "don't blame the media" hum and it sank like a stone.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100218441725

[senseandsensibility]

42. Gave it a little kick!

[mcar]

44. Appreciate you!

[redqueen]

46. I honestly cannot believe this is now a controversial topic on du

[mcar]

48. Right?

[SocialDemocrat61]

40. Very well said

Some forget this is ‘Democratic Underground’ and think it is‘Corporate Media Underground’.