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Message auto-removed (Original Post) Name removed Nov 2023 OP
We are prone to magical thinking, you know clap your hands and wish real hard and it'll happen Walleye Nov 2023 #1
If you watch Jordan Klepper's pieces at Trump rallies, you know that... NCIndie Nov 2023 #2
Or just this ITAL Nov 2023 #3
The resurgence of fascism is a global phenomena. Voltaire2 Nov 2023 #4
I liked this guy's take redqueen Nov 2023 #7
Reich was part of the intellectual circle around the frankfurt institute for social research Voltaire2 Nov 2023 #9
Yes and no. harumph Nov 2023 #15
'Many' is an overstatement. Voltaire2 Nov 2023 #21
Fascism is filling a void n/t leftstreet Nov 2023 #18
And Lacan enters the dialogue. Voltaire2 Nov 2023 #19
LOL leftstreet Nov 2023 #20
Fascism, a new perfume Celerity Nov 2023 #30
Because racism is the bedrock foundation of the United States John Shaft Nov 2023 #5
Most People aren't smart. I'm sorry. They're just not. Funtatlaguy Nov 2023 #6
And/Or inthewind21 Nov 2023 #25
I cannot name a more gullible group of people than Evangelical Christians CanonRay Nov 2023 #8
This is not a uniquely American phenomenon redqueen Nov 2023 #10
And, by the way Beatlelvr Nov 2023 #11
Civics are taught in the vast majority of schools Cosmocat Nov 2023 #24
This is a lie, and one that's long been debunked ExWhoDoesntCare Nov 2023 #27
I Sub In 20 Schools ProfessorGAC Nov 2023 #35
Classic inthewind21 Nov 2023 #37
Read Rachel Maddow's "Prequel" Happy Hoosier Nov 2023 #12
Never underestimate the number of stupid people who surround you Simeon Salus Nov 2023 #13
People are not self aware of their own biases and prejudices. Yavin4 Nov 2023 #14
fixed it harumph Nov 2023 #17
Economic Anxiety silly!!! LOL. 617Blue Nov 2023 #16
It didn't take many people to put Trump in office leftstreet Nov 2023 #22
Source isolation, just like in Russia uponit7771 Nov 2023 #23
Because they're stupid ExWhoDoesntCare Nov 2023 #26
Don't discount consumerism here underpants Nov 2023 #28
He had them at MOMFUDSKI Nov 2023 #29
This quote says it all: Dulcinea Nov 2023 #31
The American culture warmonger scam defies parody. Marcuse Nov 2023 #32
George Carlin said it best Cuthbert Allgood Nov 2023 #33
For the same reasons they consider a velvet Elvis as art, McDonalds as food, The Bachelor as entertainment and yonder Nov 2023 #34
Because we're a nation of morons BannonsLiver Nov 2023 #36
Rupert Murdoch dickthegrouch Nov 2023 #38

Walleye

(44,760 posts)
1. We are prone to magical thinking, you know clap your hands and wish real hard and it'll happen
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 10:59 AM
Nov 2023

NCIndie

(556 posts)
2. If you watch Jordan Klepper's pieces at Trump rallies, you know that...
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:02 AM
Nov 2023

... Trump's supporters believe anything that is consistent with their preconceived notions. Even after getting ripped off, they are convinced the fault belongs elsewhere.

ITAL

(1,317 posts)
3. Or just this
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:02 AM
Nov 2023

“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” ― H.L. Mencken

Voltaire2

(15,377 posts)
4. The resurgence of fascism is a global phenomena.
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:21 AM
Nov 2023

Trump is just riding the wave. A better question is why is fascism resurgent?

redqueen

(115,186 posts)
7. I liked this guy's take
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:34 AM
Nov 2023

Emphasis mine

(snip)

William Reich was among the first to consider the inherent conditions in society as the basis for the growth of fascism. His central insight was that widespread support for fascist movements arose from the “mass psychology of fascism.” This innate tendency which inclines people towards an authoritarian ideology came from the authoritarian and patriarchal roots of a society, he argued.

Reich’s pioneering study was first published in 1933, when the Nazi regime had just acquired state power in Germany. The revised edition, published in 1942, amplified his point with a greater understanding of the Nazi regime.

“Fascist mentality is the mentality of the subjugated “little man” who craves authority and rebels against it at the same time. It is not an accident that all fascist dictators stem from the milieu of the little reactionary man.” (Reich 1942: 11)

[Honour and duty] while important to their moral compass were not necessarily required in actual practice.
The social milieu he described was that of a class of petty traders, independent craftsmen, and the petty bourgeoisie in Germany in the aftermath of the First World War. This class had come of age in an authoritarian monarchy which was conservative and intensely patriarchal.

(More at link)

https://www.theindiaforum.in/society/why-fascism-rise-world-over

Voltaire2

(15,377 posts)
9. Reich was part of the intellectual circle around the frankfurt institute for social research
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:45 AM
Nov 2023

They are a remarkable group of people, Theodore Adorno, Walter Benjamin, Herbert Marcuse, Max Horkheimer, Eric Fromm, the list goes on and the institute continues to this day. Their focus was on the problem of fascism and the failures of classical marxist theory to predict the evolution of 'late stage capitalism' or whatever one wants to call the global system that emerged after WW1 and WW2.

Two years ago I asked myself 'what is critical theory and why are the fascists so upset about it?'. Two years, and about 10 very difficult books later I am just beginning my attempt to answer that question. Reich is on the list.

harumph

(3,260 posts)
15. Yes and no.
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:05 PM
Nov 2023

Many of the petty bourgeoisie post WWI were Jewish as well with no authoritarian tendencies.

Voltaire2

(15,377 posts)
21. 'Many' is an overstatement.
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:35 PM
Nov 2023

Jews in Germany were a very small minority. Also the German Jewish middle class was not opposed to authoritarian regimes- they were fine with the Kaiser, and until the Nazis rose to power thought they were Germans first and Jewish second.

leftstreet

(40,589 posts)
18. Fascism is filling a void n/t
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:09 PM
Nov 2023

Voltaire2

(15,377 posts)
19. And Lacan enters the dialogue.
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:26 PM
Nov 2023

leftstreet

(40,589 posts)
20. LOL
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:33 PM
Nov 2023

That made me laugh!

But seriously if Free Market Fantasy had its own Bible, it'd be used at every swear-in ceremony

Celerity

(54,365 posts)
30. Fascism, a new perfume
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:40 PM
Nov 2023


https://www.thelacanianreviews.com/fascism-a-new-perfume/

April 3rd, 2019

Election Ad: Fascism By Ayelet Shaked



We are close to the new parliamentary elections in Israel. Among the new political parties there is the NEW RIGHT party, led by Ayelet Shaked, the current minister of Justice, and Nafthaly Benet, currently the minister of education.', It was very surprising to see this new party’s “fantastic” propaganda clip, which presents a new type of connection between politics and capitalism.




At a conference in Milan in 1972, Lacan spoked about a “fifth discourse” based on that of the master, in fact substituting for the master discourse. This change is produced by a small inversion between the element situated in the master discourse in the position of agent and the other element situated at the place of the truth. In other words, an inversion between the master signifier and the divided subject. Lacan said about this discourse that it is “follement astucieux” [‘madly’ or ‘devilishly’ astute]. He says : « Ça marche comme sur des roulettes, ça ne peut pas marcher mieux, mais justement ça marche trop vite, ça se consomme, ça se consomme si bien que ça se consume. [“It runs like clockwork, it couldn’t go better, but it just goes too fast, it is consumed, it is consumed so well that it consumes itself”].

The propaganda clip that takes the form of an ad responds to this description, it offers something to consume – the perfume, the fragrance. Ayelet Shaked appears as a model or an actress advertising a new perfume called “Fascism”. Interesting and alarming. The little video, only 44 seconds long, shot in black and white to reinforce the visual impact, presents the characteristics of this perfume. While Shaked is grooming herself and moving through an esthetic space, a woman-narrator’s whispering voice in the background recites one by one the phrases: “judicial revolution”, “reduction of activism”, “appointment of judges”, governance, “separating of authorities”, and “restraint of the Supreme Court of Justice”.

Finally, as Shaked spritzes herself with the perfume, she says in her irritating and uncolored voice, “To me, it smells like democracy”. Fascism as Democracy, which leads to an inversion – what the so called “left-wing” regards as signs of fascism, is presented here as real democracy. This ad imposes subliminally a master discourse which tries to hypnotize by the esthetic image and cover the atrocity under the pretense of freedom of speech. Politics here uses ideas from capitalistic discourse, especially in order to encourage consumption, thereby reinforcing the addictive power at the place of a symbolic identification with an Ideal. Lacan teaches us about the ascension of the little object a to the social zenith. Indeed, it is the object which determines the subject and his will: the magnificent perfume “Fascism” as the supreme social value. This clip introduces a powerful way of resisting the other, creating a new product in the market of ideas, a fragrance, smelling only of segregation. It is a condensate of explosive Hate, which can lead to the worst.
 

John Shaft

(808 posts)
5. Because racism is the bedrock foundation of the United States
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:24 AM
Nov 2023

I reckon. Same as it ever was.

Funtatlaguy

(11,878 posts)
6. Most People aren't smart. I'm sorry. They're just not.
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:33 AM
Nov 2023
 

inthewind21

(4,616 posts)
25. And/Or
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:02 PM
Nov 2023

Just to lazy to think for themselves and look to the media to tell them what to do and think. When I'm having a political discussion and the person I am talking to says "do they think we're stupid" my response is ALWAYS YES, they don't think it, they KNOW it. And their counting on it!

CanonRay

(16,169 posts)
8. I cannot name a more gullible group of people than Evangelical Christians
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:42 AM
Nov 2023

and they are most of his base. They've spent their whole lives being bullshitted.

redqueen

(115,186 posts)
10. This is not a uniquely American phenomenon
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:49 AM
Nov 2023

Fascism and authoritarianism is comforting for ignorant, patriarchal, powerless people.

Beatlelvr

(801 posts)
11. And, by the way
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:52 AM
Nov 2023

We aren't teaching basic Civics in school anymore! Like cursive writing, it has been removed from the curriculum across the country.
Ridiculous.

Cosmocat

(15,418 posts)
24. Civics are taught in the vast majority of schools
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:52 PM
Nov 2023

even more so than what I was in school many decades ago.

 

ExWhoDoesntCare

(4,741 posts)
27. This is a lie, and one that's long been debunked
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:08 PM
Nov 2023

40 States require at least a semester of civics to graduate.

Of those that don't, many of them have a requirement to teach civics as part of a social-studies curriculum.

https://circle.tufts.edu/latest-research/state-laws-standards-and-requirements-k-12-civics

It's always best to check the veracity of all claims, no matter where you got them from.

ProfessorGAC

(76,673 posts)
35. I Sub In 20 Schools
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 02:01 PM
Nov 2023

Of course they're all in one state, but EVERY one of them has 8th graders learning civics, government, the Constitution, and so on.
There's a test the kids have to take.
Obviously, we're one of the 40 states you mentioned.
The "we don't teach civics anymore" is the myth that won't die.

 

inthewind21

(4,616 posts)
37. Classic
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 02:09 PM
Nov 2023

example of people taking as fact based merely on what they heard.

Happy Hoosier

(9,531 posts)
12. Read Rachel Maddow's "Prequel"
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:55 AM
Nov 2023

Americans have long been vulnerable to conmen pedaling hate.

Simeon Salus

(1,635 posts)
13. Never underestimate the number of stupid people who surround you
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:55 AM
Nov 2023

Way more than most would be willing to admit. Most are mere consumers of culture.

 

Yavin4

(37,182 posts)
14. People are not self aware of their own biases and prejudices.
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 11:59 AM
Nov 2023

Look at Vivek Ramaswamy. Look at how he made his fortune. He became what wealthy people think of when they think of a smart person. Well educated at the most expensive, exclusive schools. Speaks well, etc. He played on their biases. Even though the data didn't support his claim of a miracle drug, that didn't matter.

harumph

(3,260 posts)
17. fixed it
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:08 PM
Nov 2023

"He became what wealthy stupid people think of when they think of a smart person."

617Blue

(2,469 posts)
16. Economic Anxiety silly!!! LOL.
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:07 PM
Nov 2023

leftstreet

(40,589 posts)
22. It didn't take many people to put Trump in office
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:37 PM
Nov 2023

Almost half the eligible voters in the US don't vote

Of those who did, Hillary Clinton won the popular vote

But a bizarre electoral system meant a handful of people in a handful of states gave us Trump

Doesn't say much about how most Americans think

uponit7771

(93,532 posts)
23. Source isolation, just like in Russia
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 12:40 PM
Nov 2023
 

ExWhoDoesntCare

(4,741 posts)
26. Because they're stupid
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:03 PM
Nov 2023

This has been another edition of Simple Answers to Simple Questions.

underpants

(196,453 posts)
28. Don't discount consumerism here
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:18 PM
Nov 2023

We are constantly bombarded with advertisements to get money out of our pockets or, specific to the MAGA crowd, adopt a lifestyle even an identity. That’s the key with MAGA, they are so far in that any reversal would be an acknowledgment of their stupidity.

 

MOMFUDSKI

(7,080 posts)
29. He had them at
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:23 PM
Nov 2023

brown-skinned people were bad to the bone. That is their religion. He said it out loud to give them the freedom to say it out loud. He hit my previous friend’s racism right in the sweet spot.

Dulcinea

(10,072 posts)
31. This quote says it all:
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:47 PM
Nov 2023

“Yeah,” I said, “I heard the speech. But they don’t give a damn about that. Hell, make ‘em cry, make ‘em laugh, make ‘em think you’re their weak erring pal, or make ‘em think you’re God-Almighty. Or make ‘em mad. Even mad at you. Just stir ‘em up, it doesn’t matter how or why, and they’ll love you and come back for more. Pinch ‘em in the soft place. They aren’t alive, most of ‘em, and haven’t been alive in twenty years. Hell, their wives have lost their teeth and their shape, and likker won’t set on their stomachs, and they don’t believe in god, so it’s up to you to give ‘em something to stir ‘em up and make ‘em feel alive again. Just for half an hour. That’s what they come for. Tell ‘em anything. But for Sweet Jesus’ sake don’t try to improve their minds.”

--Robert Penn Warren, "All the King's Men"

Marcuse

(8,998 posts)
32. The American culture warmonger scam defies parody.
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:54 PM
Nov 2023
?si=aKgInjHoE75bRKji

Cuthbert Allgood

(5,339 posts)
33. George Carlin said it best
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:55 PM
Nov 2023

yonder

(10,290 posts)
34. For the same reasons they consider a velvet Elvis as art, McDonalds as food, The Bachelor as entertainment and
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 01:57 PM
Nov 2023

an F350 4x4 necessary for routine errands or the occasional camping/fishing trip.

We are all victims of mass media manipulation and not enough of us have the critical thinking skills to suss out the differences between leading, following, wants, needs or actually realizing that because of coordinated media suggestion, those differences even exist.

BannonsLiver

(20,570 posts)
36. Because we're a nation of morons
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 02:03 PM
Nov 2023

Go back and watch man on the street interviews from the 80s vs now. Easy to find on YouTube. I watched an old clip of the premiere of Return of the Jedi from 1982 or 1983. I was blown away at how differently people spoke. Today people can barely speak in complete sentences. It was jarring to watch.

dickthegrouch

(4,507 posts)
38. Rupert Murdoch
Fri Nov 10, 2023, 03:26 PM
Nov 2023

And the press aided and abetted him.

The entire absence of personal integrity of anyone in the current GOP, and majority of SCROTUS, added fuel to the flames.

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