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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsAn unbelievable comment from Netanyahu's spokesperson
This is rather surprising and what I'd consider to be illustrative why support for Israel has dropped so much. It's like watching the W administration defend their actions after we invaded Iraq.
Link to tweet
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)So you may have to clarify your point, if in fact you have one.
RainWalker
(605 posts)And why not stick to the topic at hand instead of venturing off it?
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)Outrageous statements from spokespeople for parties at war?
muriel_volestrangler
(106,153 posts)Since you bring it up. That's a pretty low bar.
RainWalker
(605 posts)Netanyahu's spokesperson making outrageous statements.
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)I have a fresh cup of coffee.
It is my view that what spokespeople from parties to a war say to journalists is worth slightly less than the north end of a southbound rat.
lapucelle
(21,052 posts)Mark Regev, Senior Advisor to Israel Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and the former Israeli Ambassador to the UK, discusses US diplomacy, Israels military strategy for victory, and the importance of escorting Palestinian civilians to safety. Regev spoke with Bloombergs Caroline Hepker and Anna Edwards on Bloomberg Radio.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/audio/2023-10-17/israel-senior-advisor-talks-israel-hamas-war-diplomacy
Response to The Magistrate (Reply #4)
Post removed
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)'Duckspeak' is my very favorite word of newspeak.
I am in your debt for this doubleplusgood example of it.
marble falls
(71,859 posts)... both sides are criminal in their separate murdering rampages.
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)One thing is worth settling at the outset: there really is no such thing as international law. There is no neutral arbiter with powers of enforcement. Therefore it is enforced only against the weak, and when it is in the interests of powerful states to do so. It is, like the fabled Pirate's Code, more a list of suggestions than actual rules, serving for no more than a rhetorical bludgeon in times of conflict. What no one likes to admit is that, in the absence of a neutral arbiter able to enforce a judgement, retaliation is the sole means available either for punishment or deterrence of anyone showing great disregard for the list of suggestions. One need not approve of reality to acknowledge it.
On October 7th, Hamas broke an existing 'peace' of day by day routine most were at least inured to, and did so, quite literally, in an orgy of sadistic murder. The entire reason for the state of Israel is to secure a place where Jews never have to worry someone will come kill them just because they are Jews. That state will now vindicate its purpose, to its utmost strength, and by the best means it knows. I do not expect perfection in military operations, and I certainly do not expect sainthood. I do expect people to refrain from disturbing the peace by an orgy of sadistic murder, one planned for years and aimed, to be blunt, at demonstrating, by whom it was wreaked on, that in the minds of the sadistic murderers there is no such thing as a 'good' Jew. They oughtn't to have done that.
marble falls
(71,859 posts)In 1987, after the outbreak of the First Intifada against Israel, Hamas was founded by Palestinian imam and activist Ahmed Yassin. It emerged out of his Mujama al-Islamiya (Islamic Centre), which had been established in Gaza in 1973 as an Islamic charity involved with the Egypt-based Muslim Brotherhood.[22] Hamas became increasingly involved in the IsraeliPalestinian conflict by the late 1990s;[63] it opposed the IsraelPLO Letters of Mutual Recognition as well as the Oslo Accords, which saw Fatah renounce "the use of terrorism and other acts of violence" and recognize Israel in pursuit of a two-state solution. Hamas continued to advocate Palestinian armed resistance, won the 2006 Palestinian legislative election,[64] gaining a majority in the Palestinian Legislative Council,[65] and took control of the Gaza Strip from Fatah following a civil war in 2007.[66][67] Since then, it has run Gaza as a de facto autocratic and one-party state.[68][69][70]
While historically seeking an Islamic Palestinian state over the combined territory of Israel, the West Bank, and the Gaza Strip,[71][72] Hamas began accepting the 1967 borders in the agreements it signed with Fatah in 2005, 2006 and 2007.[73] In 2017, Hamas released a new charter that supported a transitional Palestinian state within the 1967 borders without recognizing Israel.[74][75][76][77][78] Hamas's repeated offers of a truce (for a period of 10100 years[79]) based on the 1967 borders are seen by many as being consistent with a two-state solution,[80][81][82][83] while others state that Hamas retains the long-term objective of establishing one state in former Mandatory Palestine.[84][85] Under the ideological principles of Islamism, Hamas promotes Palestinian nationalism in an Islamic context; it has pursued a policy of jihad (armed struggle) against Israel.[c] It has a social service wing, Dawah, and a military wing, the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades.[d][e] Since the mid-1990s,[22] Hamas has gained widespread popularity within Palestinian society for its anti-Israeli stance.[89][90] The group's attacks, including suicide bombings against civilian targets and indiscriminate rocket attacks, have been described by academics as acts of terrorism[61] and has led many countries to designate Hamas a terrorist organization.[91][92][52] A 2018 attempt to condemn Hamas for "acts of terror" at the United Nations failed.[f]
Blame Netanyahu for driving the PLO out of Gaza and putting Hamas in charge.
There's plenty of blame to go around. Too bad Bibi loathed Yassir Arafat.
https://www.timesofisrael.com liveblog_entry netanyahu-brandishes-map-of-israel-that-includes-west-bank-and-gaza-at-un-speech
Netanyahu brandishes map of Israel that includes ... - The Times of Israel
Sep 22, 2023Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu uses a red marker on a map of 'The New Middle East' as he addresses the 78th session of the United Nations General Assembly, September 22, 2023.
https://www.jpost.com israel-news politics-and-diplomacy article-760189
Netanyahu under fire for using Greater Land of Israel map at UN
Sep 22, 2023Netanyahu under fire for using Greater Land of Israel map at UN Netanyahu used the map to illustrate a new era of peace in the Middle East that would include the Palestinians, but critics say he ...
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com 20200428-greater-israel-is-the-objective-as-netanyahu-plans-to-wipe-palestine-off-the-map
Greater Israel is the objective as Netanyahu plans to wipe Palestine ...
US President Donald Trump and Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu participate in a joint statement in the East Room of the White House on 28 January 2020 in Washington, DC.
If the Israelis drive all Palestinians from Gaza, shouldn't Gaza revert to Egypt?
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)Unless abhorrence of sadistic murder sprees counts as taking a side in some question of whether sadistic murder is a thing which might possibly be applauded rather than condemned.
I did not engage with how Israel came into being, merely noted the purpose for which it was brought into being. I did not engage with how matters came to their present pass, or with the origin of Hamas, or any of that. I did not engage with whether one party or the other has justice on its side over the whole course of the conflict, nor whether both do, or neither does. None of it matters, not at present.
All that matters at present is that sadistic murder on a grand scale was carried out by people styling themselves the armed representatives of God and Palestine, and the offended state is coming in force to liquidate even the possibility such sadistic murder of its citizenry could occur again. Nothing will constrain its actions but its own capacity for self-restraint, and its pragmatic concern for what may be tolerated by larger powers. The most important of these seems inclined to indulgence, at least for the moment.
"'Boys,' said the Colonel, 'I don't want to see you taking anything out of that house.' Then he turned his back and lit a cigar."
Army Brat
(151 posts)This country is supporting Israel because they are supposedly operating from higher moral ground. We wouldn't expect them to sound like Hamas, would we?
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)A man ought not stoop so low as to be even near it.
dalton99a
(94,084 posts)Prairie Gates
(8,108 posts)The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)What is called 'gaslighting' requires it to be at least conceivable the statement is true rather than a lie, for it must be believed to have the intended effect. I doubt even the man himself thinks this could be true.
Rather than 'gaslighting', I would class it as a display of insolence, of utter unconcern whether one is believed or not, a thing often indulged in by people who feel their superiority to those they address is both self-evident and in dire need of reinforcement.
At bottom, it's a pre-schooler found in close proximity to a weeping sibling who when confronted yells you don't know I bit him, anybody could have....
malaise
(295,796 posts)That is all
AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)Nothing says he is an official spokesperson. But you probably knew that already.
I also like how Mehdi puts up IDF and Hamas' casualty numbers and says they match when they're 10-20% off.
Another disengenous post - but after trying to insinuate that American gun owners are worse than Hamas last night, not really surprising.
RainWalker
(605 posts)So don't blame the messenger here and focus on the content please. What I said in a previous post is irrelevant to the topic at hand and current discussion so let's focus on this.
I think it's a pretty bad look to say what this person is saying. I think a vast majority of us would likely agree too and I hope you would as well.
AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)And your previous posts are absolutely relevant because they show a pattern of bad comparisons attempting to show terrorists in a positive light.
What does this say?
Have a nice day.
I try to be positive and avoid arguing with people on the Internet because it's akin to clapping with 1 hand. I don't do toxicity. I find it works wonders for one's mental health ❤️

AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)muriel_volestrangler
(106,153 posts)And CNN:
https://edition.cnn.com/audio/podcasts/amanpour/episodes/c69879a0-4c13-11ee-9cab-6390e4a44e8b
And CTV:
and ...
This "a simple, uncontested, googlable fact was said by someone with whom I disagree, so I'll waste people's time contesting it" nonsense is pathetic.
AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)Keep trying, I'm sure you can find the word "spokesperson" somewhere, why else would you call him that?
muriel_volestrangler
(106,153 posts)A spokesperson just presents other people's decisions. An adviser helps make them.
He was a simple spokesperson, before he was promoted to ambassador. Then he became an adviser.
Really, I am amazed to find this kind of shit on DU. Regev has been the person sent by the Israeli government for the past month to do interviews for them on English speaking media all over the world, and you think you're making a point about anyone apart from yourself by fixating on the word "spokesman" in a DU thread title? Wow.
AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)And when the poster uses disingenuously - that makes the poster less credible.
muriel_volestrangler
(106,153 posts)There are two wars being waged from the upper floors of Israels Ministry of Defence in downtown Tel Aviv. The first is an old-fashioned ground war, already on the verge of routing Hamas from Gaza barely six weeks after the incursion began.
The second is a PR war, one that cannot be settled with tanks and weapons. Its a shadow campaign for hearts and minds taking place in lounge rooms across Britain, the US and even Australia, led in part by Mark Regev, a diplomat whos spent more than 15 years serving as a bulwark for the Jewish state in times of calamity.
Born in Melbourne, hes been a familiar sight on television during all manner of skirmishes and sorties with Hamas, whose formidable propaganda machine is often run unchecked, he says, by news organisations covering the conflicts. Hamas gets a free ride because of their ability, through coercion, to control the message coming out of Gaza, Mr Regev told The Australian.
...
On the morning of October 7, he was enjoying time away from public life as the head of a think-tank specialising in foreign relations and diplomacy. Israels darkest day had just started in the countrys south when the phone rang with a call from the Prime Ministers office. It wasnt Mr Netanyahu, but someone speaking on his behalf was asking Mr Regev to return to his old job as Israels loudspeaker to the foreign media an offer he could hardly refuse in a time of war.
https://archive.is/CicYb#selection-245.5-254.0
But his title is now "senior adviser", not just "spokesman".
yardwork
(69,307 posts)Because that's what the OP says happened.
muriel_volestrangler
(106,153 posts)https://www.inss.org.il/publication/hasbara/
The Public Diplomacy Directorate coordinates the activities of the Prime Minister and the Prime Ministers Office on the one side, and the media. This work includes routine activity as well as events and tours. The Prime Ministers Media Advisor heads the Directorate.
The main activities of the Public Diplomacy Directorate and Media Advisor to the Prime Minister include:
Communicating the policies and decisions of the government and the Prime Minister.
Planning, administering and implementing the State of Israels public diplomacy campaign vis-à-vis media outlets in Israel and abroad.
Providing media advice, both day-to-day and in times of emergency, and managing media crises.
Formulating and analyzing current situation reports regarding the media-related agenda.
Advising the Prime Minister and the various bodies in the Prime Ministers Office on media-related affairs.
Responsibility to publicize ceremonies, visits to various locations and attend various national events.
https://www.gov.il/en/departments/about/about_pm_office
I think calling him Netanyahu's spokesperson is probably the most accurate thing in this entire thread. Certainly more accurate than what Regev said.
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)To continue in a course of reason, I expect what occurred was the fellow making a clumsy beginning to a speech about Hamas killing their own in flight, and that it is Hamas who kills the children by concealing its positions among them. Both these things are true enough, but meaningless if cited in an attempt to wave away responsibilities which do fall on the person who pulls the trigger. Each strike represents a decision that military advantage gained outweighs the harm to civilians likely. When you are deciding that destroying some facility or depot is worth killing and maiming people who just happen to be in the way, that has to be owned up to.
inthewind21
(4,616 posts)statement.
AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)Don't be coy.
TubbersUK
(1,517 posts)yardwork
(69,307 posts)Now I read that this person is a self-declared "advisor?"
He's not an official spokesperson. The Magistrate is correct.
Correct your subject line.
AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)He's far more polite than I tend to be....
yardwork
(69,307 posts)The Magistrate responded to this thread in some posts above. He's not polite at all this morning!
And good morning to you! Thank you for pointing out that this "spokesman" dude is a fake.
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)I apologize for any lack of clarity.
I intended saying I do not attach any weight to what is said to journalists by people parties to a war.
This particular statement is bush-league blather, of no better quality then the tripe shoveled recently and regularly by his opposite numbers. Whatever he's paid exceeds his worth by far.
yardwork
(69,307 posts)As I noted down-thread, it's not at all surprising that one of Netanyahu's cronies, advisors, whatever, said something stupid.
However, this person was not making an official statement announcing the government's position on anything.
The OP's framing is disingenuous.
The Magistrate
(96,043 posts)elias7
(4,229 posts)if we want to micromanage the minute to minute, blow by blow, we can see this as a war like no other. I see a conflict that is under the magnifying glass of social media and an Islamic PR machine that is trouncing the Israeli PR machine, because, well, facts.
This guy is slippery and obfuscative and a bad spokesperson for Israel. But compare...
RainWalker
(605 posts)I fully agree with.
yardwork
(69,307 posts)Correct your subject line in the OP.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Is not going to operate the old way. I've seen here many times the comment Hamas does not want peace and that they want Gazans to die. Doesn't make a lot of sense, as what they are going to get out of that does not seem obvious.
But it does seem unlikely that the Hamas leadership is going to ask for peace. They started it, after all. Their chance of reaching their stated goal of destroying Israel was nil from the beginning, and if that is their goal, they can't be negotiated with - that claim has been made many times.
That Hamas is destroyed is the Israeli goal, and when is that goal met? This is why it would be better to treat terrorism as a criminal act rather than consider the terrorist group a party to a war.
Chainfire
(17,757 posts)yardwork
(69,307 posts)Apparently he's a former member of the administration.
treestar
(82,383 posts)No one is getting killed in these bombings, because we have no way of knowing a death toll, since the information comes from a source that cannot be believed. Anyone killed could have died in some other way than from being bombed.
RainWalker
(605 posts)It's a truly odd statement to make.
yardwork
(69,307 posts)Therefore, your whole argument falls apart.
OneBlueDotS-Carolina
(1,487 posts)I really doubt Regev is freelancing....
yardwork
(69,307 posts)Stupid things he says to the media are his own stupid comments, not official Israeli positions.
Is it astounding and amazing that members of Netanyahu's circle say stupid things? No it is not. It is business as usual for this stupid administration that has caused immeasurable harm.
So what is the point of this thread? To observe that one of Netanyahu's cronies has again said a stupid thing? That's a daily occurrence.
What it's not - as the OP is trying to imply - is an official statement by the Israeli government.
OneBlueDotS-Carolina
(1,487 posts)This is how Bibi operates.
yardwork
(69,307 posts)My point is that this is not new news. It's not surprising or odd or anything new. It's just more stupid stuff being said by a stupid administration.
Nanjeanne
(6,574 posts)Ill leave this just because
We will not learn how to live together in peace by killing each other's children. Jimmy Carter.
RainWalker
(605 posts)It seems anytime someone posts something critical of Israel there's a select few who like to pile out. I'm not about that and refuse to be baited into arguments. That's not what I joined for but rather actual discussion.
And while I understand people are passionate about things, I much prefer logical and rational discussions over ones based in emotions.
There's many dead innocent people on both sides. All of them matter. These were people who had lives, families, loved ones, and children. Many are in fact kids. I find the means testing of who died absolutely repulsive. Death doesn't pick a side. Sadly, many are doing just that ....
AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)Interesting choice of words, where have I heard that before?
obamanut2012
(29,346 posts)This is not a "both sides" thing like you are saying. All the deaths of civilians count, and the fact you are saying poeple saying those deaths matter are "whataboutists" is appalling.
AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)I questioned the use of a racist dogwhistle.
SouthernDem4ever
(6,619 posts)Sorry about that.
RainWalker
(605 posts)---Plato
SouthernDem4ever
(6,619 posts)I hope it always works for you.
RainWalker
(605 posts)I just hate violence.
I've lost several family and friends to it. Mostly all from guns. Life is incredibly prescious and I truly feel we should respect it much more than we do. Sadly, I don't know if that will ever happen....
BannonsLiver
(20,552 posts)RainWalker
(605 posts)This is quite strange. I've lurked for some time but recently decided to join because I don't have any social interaction as I'm sick and in a nursing home and I thought being around like minded people would be good for me.
Why are you saying this to me?
yardwork
(69,307 posts)Here's a hug.
Nanjeanne
(6,574 posts)believe, as Albert Einstein said - We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them are accused of many things.
I am Jewish on all sides - French, Swedish, Hungarian and Russian. I lost two uncles who fought in the French Resistance. I have cousins in Tel Aviv who knew Vivian Silver, the peace activist murdered by Hamas. They worked for peace with her organization, Arab-Jewish Center for Equality, Empowerment and Cooperation.
And yet I have been accused of being pro Hamas, naive, blindly believing terrorists etc.
Its understandable that people will react emotionally. Its sadder when rational thought and research are dismissed outright. I only know this to be true: What Hamas did was horrific and wrong. What Netanyahu is now doing to innocent civilians in Gaza is horrific and wrong. Where we go from here, I dont know. But Ill refer back to the Einstein quote.
FHRRK
(1,410 posts)Hamas deserves to be crushed, almost everyone agrees with that. There just seems to be a lack of logic, that is by blowing up everything, with some innocents killed, is equal to crushing Hamas. Many here argue that it is all due to Hamas because the innocent are being used as human shields by Hamas to facilitate Arab hate against Israel.
So the argument seems to be Hamas is forcing us to do something that Hamas wants us to do! FUCKING MIND BOGGLING!
Nanjeanne
(6,574 posts)Deuxcents
(26,785 posts)roamer65
(37,945 posts)Rational discussions are a rare bird nowadays.
SouthernDem4ever
(6,619 posts)W took us to Iraq under false pretenses. This isn't the case in Gaza.
yardwork
(69,307 posts)It's a highly inapt comparison dropped into comments in an apparent effort to appeal to our emotions.
RainWalker
(605 posts)It reminded me greatly of the daily press briefings that Rumnsfeld (remember that guy? Awful person) would get on national TV and keep repeating how there were WMD's despite overwhelming evidence there wasn't or how we heard the excuses made for troops committing torture at that prison who's name escapes me.
Hope that helps.
SouthernDem4ever
(6,619 posts)The two situations aren't alike.
RainWalker
(605 posts)If we all thought alike life would be like a giant bowl of vanilla ice cream 🍦
I'll take Ben & Jerry's Chunky Monkey any day 🙂
SouthernDem4ever
(6,619 posts)lol
RainWalker
(605 posts)So other things are getting clogged 😂
yardwork
(69,307 posts)His name was Rumsfeld (I'm sure that was an inadvertent typo).
David__77
(24,661 posts)SouthernDem4ever
(6,619 posts)RainWalker
(605 posts)Hamas is so smart they could lock themselves inside a grocery store and starve to death.
AZSkiffyGeek
(12,744 posts)Into thinking they're no worse than American gun owners.
Mossfern
(4,710 posts)because Netanyahu was losing popularity and Israelis were protesting against him.
Hamas took their chance that he could not get cooperation for a meaningful response to
the October 7th massacre.
SouthernDem4ever
(6,619 posts)Mossfern
(4,710 posts)Yes, unprovoked, but well planned.
AndyJaque
(65 posts)Hang in there.
RainWalker
(605 posts)Have a great Friday over there
claudette
(5,455 posts)it. Any rep of Nuttyahoo is as crazy as he is.
Voltaire2
(15,377 posts)RainWalker
(605 posts)Crowman2009
(3,521 posts)Because they're BS is so easily debunkable.
RainWalker
(605 posts)republianmushroom
(22,297 posts)Just a political hack saying what he is paid to say. They lie a lot.
gulliver
(13,952 posts)What's your take on that theory?
Nanjeanne
(6,574 posts)Link to tweet
?s=61&t=_R0eaN5XDTx3hnl2jyXBTA]
All the preoccupation with whether or not there is internet in Gaza shows that we have learned nothing. We are too humane. Burn Gaza now no less!