Biden Forgave Billions in Student Debt. Poll Shows It's Not Enough For Gen Z

[brooklynite]

Bloomberg

President Joe Biden’s unprecedented actions to erase student-loan debt have fallen flat with the young voters in swing states he needs to win reelection, according to the latest Bloomberg News/Morning Consult poll.

The disconnect illustrates one of the core challenges of Biden’s campaign for a second term: He struggles to get credit from voters for policies intended to motivate them.

That’s left him trailing former President Donald Trump in a head-to-head matchup in each of the seven states in the poll — the first time the poll has shown Biden behind across the board.

A plurality of swing-state Generation Z voters — those born in 1997 or later — say Biden is not doing enough to address the burden of student loan payments, even after he has erased $127 billion in such debt in initiatives that are widely thought to be aimed at locking in that key demographic. A majority of this group approves of the relief his administration has already provided to borrowers — but they were also less likely to have heard about the debt cancellation than older voters.

[agingdem]

1. another "Biden is trailing" screed...OMG!

"Biden isn't doing enough" is bogus...how would Bloomberg know when Gen Z scoffs at polls and refuses to answer their phones if the caller isn't on their contact list? ...in truth, young voters detest Trump and the GOP platform of hate...they and their friends are multicultural, multiethnic, gay, trans, pro-choice, pro climate change..."woke"....and Gen Z is acutely aware the GOP is doing their damndest to suppress their vote...

[brooklynite]

5. What you're saying is: it's impossible to do accurate polling...

…because I can’t think of a way.

I can introduce you to 500 Democratic candidate (including President Biden) who disagree.

Also, I ‘ll remind you that Bloomberg is a Democrat who endorsed Biden in 2020.

[agingdem]

7. Bloomberg was a Democrat

Last edited Thu Dec 14, 2023, 06:25 PM - Edit history (2)

until 2001when he turned to the dark side and registered as a Republican...so Republican, in fact, he endorsed George W. Bush for re-election in 2004 and spoke at the Republican National Convention...but Bloomberg was not done shapeshifting..in 2007 he registered Independent and finally returned to the Democratic Party in 2018 when became a candidate for the presidency...

living and "dying" by the media's "we want a horse race" " polling is not an accurate harbinger...

[brooklynite]

8. Bloomberg is a Democrat TODAY

That’s what’s important.

[edisdead]

11. WRONG!

Bloomberg is whatever is important to HIM TODAY.

[SocialDemocrat61]

14. But what will he be tomorrow

Probably whatever makes him the most money. 😉

[brooklynite]

15. Supported Clinton in 2016...

Supported Biden in 2020.

Has committed millions to elect Democrats:

[SocialDemocrat61]

17. So what?

Trump supported democrats in New York for decades. Doesn't mean he or anyone deserves unending trust or support.

[ZonkerHarris]

25. Like saying a guy is "your boyfriend today" but he dated your worst enemy last week

and may go back to her at any moment

[brooklynite]

30. Absolutely no evidence that he'll "go back" at any moment

Bloomberg became a Republican as a flag of convenience to run for Mayor in 2001 (elected by NY Democrats three times). He's endorsed Clinton and Biden, and has invested a lot of money is electing downticket Democrats as well as fighting for gun regulations.

[shrike3]

12. I doubt Bloomberg has much to do with the day to day in any of his newsrooms.

Unless he's a very unusual mogul.

[JohnSJ]

31. He doesn't.

[shrike3]

37. I would hope not.

[standingtall]

57. You do realize that morning consult is a B- poll

Which is sufficient reason to doubt it's accuracy.

[BannonsLiver]

20. The tell is the Op was nowhere to be found in the post about positive polling for Biden last week.

Why? Because it doesn’t chum the waters like these do and when you’re simply trying to agitate that is KEY.

[agingdem]

22. nobody reads the small print...

every few weeks I'll see a blurb "Biden leading Trump in the key states", and within hours that disappears and is replaced with "Biden losing to Trump in the key states"...and it's obvious a Biden positive poll or Biden positive article does nothing for a network's bottomline but a "Trump is Hitler" shout is a real moneymaker...

[MyNameIsJonas]

34. Probably because there hasn't been many positive polls.

There was one positive poll last week that had Biden up four in a collection of swing states. It didn't tell us what his numbers were in specific states but rather a collection of swing states. That's pretty useless since we don't know exactly what states he was leading.

Since that poll, though, a handful of polls have come out and every single one has Biden losing - or at best tied with Trump nationally.

You can keep up on polls here:

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/

[BannonsLiver]

45. Yes, I know you are very worked up about all of that.

But my point stands. Are you new?

[standingtall]

53. Realclearpolitics is notoriously republican leaning

fivethirtyeight is a better option. You can actually see which polls have a republican or Democratic bias. Many of the recent batch of polls do have a republican bias like Rasmussen, Gallup and the Harvard Harris which is actually an online survey poll. The most recent Harvard Harris poll has Trump with a net favorability of +1 Trumps average net favorability is -11. Which makes it pretty obvious that the Harvard Harris poll has a pretty heavy oversampling of republicans.

[SocialDemocrat61]

2. Unfortunately many on the far left

or maybe I should say ‘purity left’ don’t like incremental change. They want everything now. They hate Biden and democrats more than Trump and republicans. They consider Jill Stein a hero and Bernie Sanders & AOC traitors. They are short sighted people who don’t see the big picture and refuse to accept any consequences for their actions. They are self righteous people who really don’t care about any issues. They just want to feel superior to everyone else.

[MOMFUDSKI]

3. The kids are not going to like the alternative.

Their votes will determine the world they will be living in. And they think they have it bad now. They may have to learn the hard way.

[Glitterx]

44. They're not gonna like anyone

They want to be able to complain.

[oasis]

46. Exactly. nt

[captain queeg]

4. Chasing polls. How much debt relief would these folks expect under a rethug administration?

There more I see of polls the less I like them. Not saying they should be ignored, just taken with a large helping of salt.

[LiberalFighter]

6. Nancy Cook, Jennah Haque, Gregory Korte, Denise Lu, Elena Meja - Didn't see any Biden positive stories by them.

[Happy Hoosier]

9. But they'll LOVE what Trump does for them! LOL

I do get frustrated with those that think Biden can wave a magic wand and do whatever he wants.

[triron]

10. Stupidity is independent of age I guess.

[ananda]

13. Yet another thread to trash.

...

[JHB]

16. "less likely to have heard about the debt cancellation than older voters"

Sounds like a "getting the message in front of them" problem.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

28. Yes, they need to be informed beyond the instant

Some of the trillions transferred to the 1% by trickle-down came from education and is reflected in these huge student loan debts. ( When I left college, it was with no outstanding student loan. My son had more than a decade's worth. )

At the least, they need to learn about "2 Santas"
https://www.salon.com/2018/02/12/thom-hartmann-how-the-gop-used-a-two-santa-clauses-tactic-to-con-america-for-nearly-40-years_partner/

[TheKentuckian]

40. Seemingly the even bigger issue is that most didn't get it

Getting the relief would be a strong statement.

Biden did make the attempt on the 10k, the Supreme Court snatched it away which probably should be the focus of messaging along with what was able to be done.

[WarGamer]

18. They don't have 20-25 years of loan payment history.

[Celerity]

32. yes, little of the student loan debt relief has went to Gen Z, as most (& many Millennials) simply do not qualify atm

https://www.axios.com/2023/12/16/student-loan-forgiveness-where-it-stands

[MichMan]

19. They want ALL their debt cancelled, not just $10k of it.

Someone owing $80k in student loan debt would still owe $70k afterwards. I'm not surprised they aren't embracing it.

[Polybius]

21. Who are they to be making demands?

My dept wasn't canceled for even a penny, and I didn't blame Bill Clinton or W Bush.

[meadowlander]

61. An electorate that was promised it on the campaign trail in 2019.

We can debate how realistic it was ever going to be to accomplish, but I don't think it's unreasonable for young people who voted for Joe Biden because they were promised $10K in cancellation of the principal (not extended relief from interest) to be put out that they didn't get what they were promised.

And I don't think gas-lighting them now is going to be an effective strategy. Better to acknowledge that it didn't happen because of a Republican appointed Supreme Court and point out what they can do about it (keep electing Dems).

[calguy]

26. In other words, they want someone else to pay for their education

After they already signed up for those loans and agreed to pay them back.
Get back to me when someone comes and cancels my mortgage payment, and we'll talk.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

29. Education should not be just for the rich and should not bankrupt a person.

[calguy]

42. I agree with that

What I don't agree with is someone knowing full-well what they are getting into with taking these loans, and now saying they shouldn't have to pay it back.

[brooklynite]

48. Should it always be free?

Should private colleges be free?

If so, should private secondary school be free?

[Hermit-The-Prog]

59. Private schools at any level are an option for those who choose to pay for them.

In my opinion, public education should be available to all, regardless of ability to pay.

[MichMan]

60. State supported colleges are nothing like public K-12 schools

Unlike K-12 public schools, the government does not own the colleges, the buildings, nor are the employees employed by the government.

In nearly all cases, state sponsored colleges are free to set their own tuition rates at whatever they choose, and those tuition costs can vary wildly from one school to another. For example, in my state, within close geographic vicinity are Washtenaw Community College, Eastern Michigan, and the University of Michigan. Washtenaw charges $169 per credit hour in tuition and fees, Eastern charges $600, and Univ of Michigan charges $700 per credit hour (in state) (and $2350 out of state !) All are public

If as a country, we decide college is "free", should students be given the choice to attend the college of their dreams regardless of cost?

Should a student from Illinois for example, who decides Univ. of Michigan is where they want to go, be able to attend there, with the taxpayers picking up $58k per year in costs ? If so, what is stopping Eastern from raising theirs to a similar amount ? For that matter, is there anything stopping Michigan from raising theirs to $75k? Students won't care because they aren't responsible for paying it. I don't see how we can have free college if the colleges are free to set their own prices.

Alternatively, we could always say that anyone getting free tuition had to attend "approved" colleges in their own state, or provide a stipend of let's say $15k per year, with the student having to make up the difference. Of course, in that scenario, the colleges could just jack up the tuition anyway to make up the difference. Or we could state that participating colleges would only be allowed to charge the same base amount, and the higher cost ones will have to figure how to slash costs in order to get there.

Regarding private colleges not being eligible, seems fine at face value for Ivy league colleges like Harvard or Yale, but that also means many well known HBCU like Howard, Morehouse, Spelman, Selma, & Tuskegee would also not be eligible. I doubt they would be able to survive charging tuition if everywhere else is free.

Everyone would like to see college more affordable, but how to get there isn't easy.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

63. Should students be free to attend the elementary school of their dreams?

How will all the private K-5 schools survive?

[Celerity]

35. I see RWers shoot this angle:

they want someone else to pay for their education

all the time when it comes to, for instance, all K-12 public education, as well as many other public goods and services.

Also, so many on DU (because the board is so disproportionately populated with much older people) have (or had) staggeringly lower debt loads for both their tertiary education and their owned homes than Millennials and Gen Z have and will have.

The costs for both tertiary education and housing (plus medical/pharma) have just exploded over the past 25 or so years.

I have seen people here go bonkers over 10-15 USD per month increases in costs (or similar small reductions in benefits), yet then turn around and slag off us younger folk, when we are facing hundreds of thousands of dollars more (over a million USD in many cases when interest is figured in) in total costs (certainly not made up for by increased inflation adjusted median earnings) for homes and uni education compared to what many older Americans paid for these things.

One of the surest ways for the system to collapse (including future-forward mandated transfer payments like Social Security and Medicare) is to so disincentivise tertiary education that massive amounts of current and future youthful generations say 'fuck it, I am not will to become a lifelong debt slave', thus massive eroding the US tax base, along with other guge negative knockon effects (systemic lack of cutting edge tech that will cripple competitiveness, huge gaps in STEM-related workforces, etc etc).

[TheKentuckian]

41. They didn't get the 10k either, that was throttled in the crib

by the unelected Mullahs in black robes.

[pinkstarburst]

23. I think what this reflects

is whether any voter (young people in this instance) feels frustrated and like they are in a bad place personally, within the four walls of their family, their housing situation, their finances. When that is the case, they tend to blame whomever is in charge at the time, feeling that they've had a chance to do something... and haven't (this may be fair or unfair.)

Biden has done good things with student debt (more than anyone else.) He took an impossible covid situation and a bad economic situation, both of which he inherited from 45, and steered the ship away from disaster. Even though not one of the drugs I take is on the list that was recently announced for price reductions in Medicare, I appreciate that what he is doing will help other people.

But there are definitely lots of people out there hurting. Housing costs have skyrocketed. Young people, middle class people, older people, are all finding it impossible to afford a home. Many also struggle to pay rent. Food costs have gone up. Young people are not having children--many just can't afford it when you add in housing costs, childcare costs, food costs, and everything else. Student debt is another big one and some industries are finding that hiring has slowed down. Healthcare costs continue to be a mess.

None of these are Biden's fault. But there is a reason that it's rare for one party to hold onto the white house for more than a few terms. When people are discontent, they blame whomever is in charge. Of course the alternative wouldn't be better. It would be infinitely worse. But we need to worry more about young people feeling unenthusiastic and just not showing up to vote. Biden needs to put in some big measures in the next 10 months that help young people, stuff to help fund childcare centers and bring costs down for parents, regulations to stop foreign investors from buying up all the housing stock, turning it into rentals and Airbnbs and driving the prices out of reach for young US homebuyers. Something. We need stuff that impacts families in their day to day lives.

[Calculating]

24. Legalizing cannabis would also help

Lots of young people are disappointed by the progress on that front.

[MichMan]

27. Given that half the states have already made recreational legal, it may not make a huge difference.

[TheKentuckian]

39. Half is pretty significant and the other half has

fallout from the wrongful scheduling.

[Calculating]

50. It fixes a ton of issues with the system

Allowing the industry to use banks, take proper tax deductions, etc.

[MichMan]

52. I don't disagree with any of that

Just don't think that legalizing it will unleash a whole bunch of voters, since for many, as far as they are concerned, it is already legal in their state. For states that still haven't legalized, it may have an effect.

I don't see very many, however, now deciding they are going to vote because of those banking and tax deduction concerns. Perhaps I'm wrong.

[pinkstarburst]

33. I am divided on that

At the moment, I think we have higher priority battles to fight than legalizing weed. I just don't feel that would play amazingly well to me as a voter (I'm not young, but as a young person... meh.) There are so many IMPORTANT issues that we need really big huge change on. Cost of housing. Cost of childcare. Abortion access and the fact that women cannot get safe medical care anymore in half the country. Cost of healthcare. Cost of food. Student loan debt.

If Biden does nothing about those, but makes pot legal... I dunno. To me that's kind of like, you can't afford to buy a house, and women aren't safe in half the country, but here's some pot as a consolation prize? I guess I would like to see him take aim for big ticket items like housing and healthcare and even more to tackle college and student loan debt costs. What he did with drug prices and Medicare was SO SO good. That is the sort of thing we need because it impacts lots of people across the board. We need a big win like that for young people.

[TheKentuckian]

38. The administration can change the schedule for marijuana

independently.

The other larger bore issues need Congress.

That means getting those measures magically through the Republican controlled House, the filibuster in the Senate, and the veto pens of the McConnell twins.

Refusing to do what you can in favor of what you cannot and will not makes little to no sense.

[Calculating]

49. It's because it's low hanging fruit

It's easier to do, and it's also another social justice issue. It needs to get done, having it federally banned while it's legal in most states is crazy

[MichMan]

36. I haven't seen any of the proposed student loan cancellation programs indicate how it would be paid for by any revenue

other than adding it to the current national debt.

Wouldn't that mean that Gen Z (and future generations) would just end up paying for it anyway?

[Johnny2X2X]

43. Biden solved student debt permanently

The SAVE program is a game changer. Very few can’t afford their loans now.

[MichMan]

47. So, no need to pursue debt forgiveness any more?

[Johnny2X2X]

51. Can't hurt.

But I don’t know if many people who can’t afford 5% of their income a year after a robust adjustment for expenses given.

I suppose some still could use forgiveness. But student loan payments have gone for another mortgage payment to another car payment under this new plan and a lot of borrowers with lower incomes have very low payments or none at all.

[lees1975]

54. Yep, another "bad poll"

that is complete fiction. This is becoming a theme, to see how the pollsters and the media can actually control voters choices. Check to see who finances this poll.

Yep.

Bet they can't.

[Autumn]

55. Those damn pesky kids.

[Bettie]

56. Oh NO! ALL IS LOST!

The oracle has told us again that we'll lose!

I remember when, in 2020, an expression of anxiety was roundly dismissed as doom and gloom, but now, posting daily about how we're obviously going to lose it all is just peachy.

Whatever. Apparently, some believe that pollsters are perfect...I guess we should all just give up now, since all is lost before a single vote has even been cast.

[madville]

58. What have you done for me lately

That’s the way it’s viewed, student loan debt is a last year issue. Young people can’t buy houses or can barely pay their rent now or buy a car, it’ll always be something else.

[Kaleva]

62. What percentage of Gen Z is burdened by student debt?

"Which generation has the most student loan debt?"

https://www.bankrate.com/loans/student-loans/student-loan-debt-by-generation/

[NowISeetheLight]

64. WTF

What does Gen Z think a TepubQcan administration will do for them? Totally eliminate Social Security and Medicare. Oh you can "build wealth" with savings, but they won't raise the minimum wage to something livable. Meanwhile they'll cut taxes for the super richh and the wealth gap will get even worse.