I always ask my devout Christian friends to explain to me...

[Pototan]

...how they reconcile this passage in the Bible with their support of Trump and his immigration policies with their Christianity? I am not a religious person, however, I have read the Bible. I thought that this passage would be good for any political discussion around the Christmas dinner table. Mathew 25 verses 31 to 46

The Sheep and the Goats

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne.
32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.
34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’
37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’
40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’
41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’
44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’
45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

[keithbvadu2]

1. Melania verse 1

[CurtEastPoint]

13. Yep. Shortest book in the Wholly Bobble!

[NJCher]

2. I think I'd rather

Clean out my storage sheds on Christmas than have a conversation with a trumper.

[Ocelot II]

3. It is impossible to reconcile Matthew 25 with Trumpism or most GOP policies.

Last edited Sat Dec 23, 2023, 02:19 AM - Edit history (1)

Altruism and compassion are core values of Christianity (whether or not Jesus really was God). Trumper "Christians" have rejected those values because political power has become more important to them than the principles of what they claim their religion to be. They have been made to believe that they are the persecuted victims of the evil, demonic liberals who are causing them harm because they (liberals) don't think the government should be in the religion business, who think "lesser" people should have equal rights and opportunities; who don't think there's anything wrong with being gay or trans, and who recognize the value of immigrants. - and nothing stirs people up more than the belief that they are being unfairly victimized. Feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, healing the sick, welcoming the stranger, when the government does it, means these "Christians" are being victimized by the government because they just don't want to give anything to those people and resent having to do it.

[NowISeetheLight]

12. 100% Correct

For the Trumpers and the ultra-Evangelicals it's always been about POWER. Compare some of the antics of these prosperity preachers and their selective Bible adherence to someone like President Carter.

[keithbvadu2]

14. Politics and religion use each other to gain power and wealth.

The "prosperity gospel" pastors/collectors seem to do much better in the prosperity than the investors/donors.

[Hotler]

16. Correct, and why do they want this power? To be mean and cruel towards others, especially us Dems & Libs. nt

[edisdead]

18. I could almost tolerate the christians when they just wanted money

When they went all hellbent to make people miserable -Ir rather when I was old enough to realize that was part of the business model is when I started to be really disgusted by it.

I was raised Christian and for the most part I believed. Then I realized I was being sold something. I was being sold comfort. Ok. Sure some people have fears in life and need comfort so whatever fine, if religion gets them through the day and they want to give to this comfort co-op who am I to judge? But then as I kept getting older I realized that wasn’t enough for their business model.Nope. They needed to create more things for people to fear. The other. So I realized how religion demonizes others and ramps up that fear. And that requires more comfort. But nothing gets peoples attention like anger. And so people give more and cling to their faith. But anger and hatred isn’t a christian value so people need comfort and forgiveness for their hatred and anger (sins) so they cling to their religion even more….

It is a sick sick vicious circle.

Are all christian churches like this. Probably not but this is where religion has gone from what I have observed. It is predatory and a cancer on society.

[Hotler]

15. Selfishness is their cornerstone. nt

[Maraya1969]

4. I use that one too. Never got a response back so far.

[TSExile]

5. Apparently...

...they don't grasp the meaning of "My Kingdom is not of this world", either. Good grief.

[RussellCattle]

6. Nor do they get the "eternal punishment" thing either, or they just hope that they have extra....

…..points for being so sanctimonious.

[Skittles]

7. how do they reconcile their support of Trump as human beings

the man is just utterly VILE in every way

[TeamProg]

8. It's a LOT quicker to just ask them:

How old is the earth?
How old is the universe?
How long has God been around?

Then what the hell was God doing in all that time?!

See, we aren't THAT special.

[JT45242]

9. Looking after the poor and oppressed is what God wants

Two things to consider here.

First, Jesus is a prophet in the Isaiah tradition. He is preaching about social justice and the duty that the society has to the poor, the orphaned, and the widow. For example, it is important that his first adult preaching in the temple is based on a reading from Isaiah about these things.

Further, the Isaiah tradition from chapter 10 verses 1-3 have a similar admonition.
Wow to those who make unjust laws, to those who make unjust decrees, who deprive the poor of their rights and withhold justice from the oppressed of my people, making widows their prey and robbing the fatherless.
What will you do on the day of reckoning, when disaster comes from afar? To whom will you run for help? Where will you leave your riches?
Nothing will remain but to cringe among the captives or fall among the slain.

So, this text which is echoed in several gospels parallels earlier teaching about corruption or greed. It's bad and God had condemned it through the prophets.

Second, put this in context. This whole part of Matthew which includes the 'woe to you...' passages that condemn the Pharisees and other Jewish leaders for claiming to be godly, but not living up to the obligations of Isaiah. This discussion with the disciples, probably not just the twelve but less than a huge crowd, immediately follows that exchange during the last week before Jesus is killed.

Jesus, like Jeremiah and Isaiah before him, is telling the people that God wants them to take care of the poor and oppressed.
It's not about me, me, me... it's about we, we, we.

This is in strong contrast to the prosperity gospel heresy of Olsteen and the Christian nationalists who don't preach take care of the weak.

Not sure if anyone has ever drawn the actual biblical comparison to Sodom and Gomorrow to this passage for you. The real reason those cities were destroyed was because they oppressed foreigner and stranger. Talk to your Jewish friends and they will be shocked at why modern Christianity somehow made it about homosexuality (of course, it was hypocritical leaders who pulled verses out of context).

So...Jesus was preaching against corruption and greed in the style of earlier prophets.and like earlier and later prophets, speaking truth to power got him killed.

People of all the Abrahamic faiths, Judaism, Christianity, and Islam should follow those teachings about the poor, stranger, etc. But, as with the religious leaders of Jesus time, it is easier to follow greed and self interest all too often.

If you want a better explanation, please listen or read the Rev. Dr. Barber of the poor people's campaign and the moral Monday movement.

[Pototan]

10. Well, I'm really a Secularist with no belief in a "Supreme Being"

However, I am steeped in history and what kind of historian would not be familiar with the only book read for over a thousand years.

I find the Old Testament, well, old. It is more akin to Aesop's Fables.

I am more drawn to Jesus the Philosopher than to any of the miracles and other fantastic stories. I like to think I live my life through his teachings and I discount the whole "Son of God" thing. I'm not saying I have all the answers. What I am saying is I enjoy living with what I'm comfortable with.

[Mysterian]

17. Religion is just about money and power

These fuckers don't care what their holy books say. They only care about scamming gullible rubes into giving them money and power, just like their role model trump. Anyone who believes in gods without evidence is susceptible to being scammed and that's what it's all about.

[Karadeniz]

19. Jesus is recognizing soul quality demonstrated by earthly actions. The eternal punishment

does not accord with Jesus's teachings hidden in the parables, namely karma and reincarnation. Hell could be construed to having been sent back to earth to undergo another experience filled with suffering and hardship. However, the eternal part doesn't fit. I suspect some hard ass Orthodox fiddled with the passage, as has often happened.