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madville

(7,413 posts)
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 11:30 AM Jan 2024

Citing Crime, In-N-Out announces closure of Oakland location

In-N-Out said Sunday it will close its only Oakland restaurant in March over crime and safety concerns for its customers and employees.

The location is at 8300 Oakport Street, near the Oakland International Airport. In-N-Out Burger follows a long line of businesses that has shut down in the last year citing crime as the driving factor.

The San Francisco Chronicle reported since 2019, police have recorded 1,335 incidents in and around the fast food restaurant, more than any other location in Oakland. Most of the reported incidents were car break-ins targeting visitors coming through Oakland International Airport.

A Starbucks store in the same lot shut down late last year. Raising Cane's is doing drive thru only to prevent car break-ins. In-N-Out said it's last day will be on March 24th.


https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/sanfrancisco/news/citing-crime-in-n-out-announces-closure-oakland-restaurant/


I lived and worked nearby on Alameda Island for several years. Many visitors would always wanted to go straight to In-N-Out so we would warn everyone we knew flying into Oakland to not go to that location when they left the airport, to drive a few more minutes on over to the Alameda location. One group that came in went to the Oakland location, their rental van had the windows busted and all luggage and electronics stolen within 10 minutes.

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Citing Crime, In-N-Out announces closure of Oakland location (Original Post) madville Jan 2024 OP
Criminals in that area know there are no consequences. dalton99a Jan 2024 #1
Doesn't say much about law enforcement in the area. LiberalFighter Jan 2024 #2
Can't blame the police madville Jan 2024 #3
Blaming the victims. former9thward Jan 2024 #47
Crime is at all time lows Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #4
And why does a big evil company need an excuse to close a store or restaurant? brooklynite Jan 2024 #5
They don't want to be seen as just closing branches in poor areas Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #6
Are national stats a firm predicter for individual locations? ripcord Jan 2024 #7
Oh sure Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #9
That should be a boom for small business Lurker Deluxe Jan 2024 #11
Was in San Fran a few years back Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #12
Most likely it is your news source Lurker Deluxe Jan 2024 #18
Well, crime is down in Houston Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #19
That is great, happy for whomever. Lurker Deluxe Jan 2024 #21
Thank you, you add anecdotal evidence to the post up thread Dave says Jan 2024 #26
In 2020, Texas and California were about tied for violent crime. LeftInTX Jan 2024 #42
?? Lurker Deluxe Jan 2024 #58
Your community isn't reporting and keeping track of shootings, thefts, and robberies? W_HAMILTON Jan 2024 #30
I have, truthfully, no idea Lurker Deluxe Jan 2024 #57
If you know what is going on with your local community because you participate in your local community... W_HAMILTON Jan 2024 #61
When did DC become red? MichMan Jan 2024 #46
Of course, property crime is down if it is not prosecuted. former9thward Jan 2024 #48
"As far as this store location's neighborhood, who knows" TwilightZone Jan 2024 #14
Is it? Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #16
Police also want to be treated as Gods DBoon Jan 2024 #28
"As far as this store location's neighborhood, who knows" mahatmakanejeeves Jan 2024 #36
Maybe, but there is enough evidence both macro and micro that the narrative is bullshit. W_HAMILTON Jan 2024 #29
I live about 10 miles between various socioeconomic areas. LeftInTX Jan 2024 #10
Yes--it's a very localized thing. I was just in a Walgreens in Santa Fe, NM Wingus Dingus Jan 2024 #59
One reason they are doing this is to get laws passed that dsc Jan 2024 #8
Perception Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #15
Nextdoor is a joke. Our neighborhood has porch pirates, auto thefts and a few break ins. LeftInTX Jan 2024 #25
Next door people are nuts "why is this woman walking past my house?" Stuff Demovictory9 Jan 2024 #33
Pretty much! LeftInTX Jan 2024 #38
True. In my rube red area posters add, "Gonna shoot her if she walks by again." Silent Type Jan 2024 #51
Porch pirates Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #39
Yep! And they blame it on Biden too! LeftInTX Jan 2024 #40
Theft *should* be treated *MUCH* more harshly The Mouth Jan 2024 #63
Why would a burger joint want to get laws passed that treat theft more harshly? hardluck Jan 2024 #64
You might as well be asking "why does a big evil company need a PR department?" W_HAMILTON Jan 2024 #31
Crime elsewhere is irrelevant. TwilightZone Jan 2024 #13
Crime is not evenly distributed TheProle Jan 2024 #23
Murders are at a low Polybius Jan 2024 #27
Property crime like this is the lowest since 1961 Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #41
I don't believe that for one bit Polybius Jan 2024 #43
FBI keeps stats Johnny2X2X Jan 2024 #44
"Additionally, this location remains a busy and profitable one for the company ..." mahatmakanejeeves Jan 2024 #34
This message was self-deleted by its author MichMan Jan 2024 #45
Crime seems to be thriving in that particular neighborhood The Contrarian Jan 2024 #62
I've eaten there many times. Shame. Sympthsical Jan 2024 #17
And all the sports teams have left or leaving madville Jan 2024 #20
Yep, it's going to get worse, then bought up Sympthsical Jan 2024 #22
Had a coworker move to Lake Merritt madville Jan 2024 #24
You are blaming that on crime and not the community there being unwilling to pay the asking price to keep them? W_HAMILTON Jan 2024 #35
It's really the same thing madville Jan 2024 #53
No, it's absolutely not the same. W_HAMILTON Jan 2024 #54
Did you go to games there? madville Jan 2024 #56
And it doesn't matter. W_HAMILTON Jan 2024 #60
So a place known to be ripe with unattended cars filled with stuff Demovictory9 Jan 2024 #32
Why would it matter unless there is a criminal presence? MichMan Jan 2024 #49
Sounds like victim blaming. Ace Rothstein Jan 2024 #50
Not me. Just getting an understanding of what's happening at this location Demovictory9 Jan 2024 #52
This is the closest In n Out to the Oakland airport. Always a line 20+ cars deep in the drive-thru from open to close. MenloParque Jan 2024 #37
Being next door neighbors to an abandoned WalMart Supercenter doesn't help. hunter Jan 2024 #55

madville

(7,413 posts)
3. Can't blame the police
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 12:00 PM
Jan 2024

Even if they arrest the perpetrators they’ll be released that same day with no bail and never prosecuted. There aren’t any consequences.

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
4. Crime is at all time lows
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 12:37 PM
Jan 2024

These places close chains because those chains aren't as profitable as they'd like and then blame it on crime.

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
6. They don't want to be seen as just closing branches in poor areas
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 12:47 PM
Jan 2024

We're seeing it with Walmarts too, who actually have more shoplifting in their branches that are in richer neighborhoods, but they close ones in poor neighborhoods that are not as profitable.

Crimes is down. Both violent and property. Retail crime is down too. Asset loss (shoplifting, fraud, employee theft) is down since 2019 as a % of revenue, the only metric that is meaningful in retail.

These stories are just trying to get people to buy into the out of control crime wave that Conservatives are selling. Crime is lower now than in 2020, the last Trump year. It's at or near 50 year lows in every category.

 

ripcord

(5,553 posts)
7. Are national stats a firm predicter for individual locations?
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 01:02 PM
Jan 2024

Just because crime is down nationwide doesn't it doesn't mean every micro area in the country has lower crime.

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
9. Oh sure
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 01:19 PM
Jan 2024

There are always areas where crime is going down, or crime is going up. But in the Bay area, property crime is going down, even though they're seeing a slight uptick in violent crime which is bucking the national trend.

As far as this store location's neighborhood, who knows, but we do know that corporations have been using the false excuse of crime to close stores in recent years. And we do know that the media covers crime in a way that misportrays it as out of control.

And when I say crime is way down long term, I really mean it. I don't mean down from 450 to 440 over time, but down by more than half. The vilolent crime rate in the US was 758 per 100,000 people yearly in 1991, it was at 340 per 100,000 people in 2023, the lowest in the US since the early 1960s. And proprty crime too, was at 5140 property crimes per 100,000 people yearly in 1991 and in 2023 fell to about 1850 property crimes per 100,000 people, the lowest number recorded since 1961. That's a 65% drop in property crimes.

And another thing people should realize too, is that technology has skewed these numbers in modern time, they're probably exaggerrated now. It's easier to report crimes today than it was 20 and 30 years ago. You can report property crimes without even having to talk to the police now, you can report them online.

Lurker Deluxe

(1,041 posts)
11. That should be a boom for small business
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 01:46 PM
Jan 2024

In the newly vacated store front from any of the big boys when they move out of an area, not because of anything other than "not profitable enough", surely others are snatching up the opportunity to move in.

When one of the big boys builds out a location they spare little expense; electrical, HVAC, lighting, doors, windows, and various other things that are heavy costs to opening up a business. When they move out they take very little of that infrastructure with them, costs a lot to remove it just as it does to put it in.

So, these areas that the big boys are fleeing from must have plentiful new small business moving right in.

Correct?

Been downtown SanFran in a minute? Wonder why that is just not true there ...

Oakland is booming, right? Or is it just the same ... everyone is just to greedy to do business there as they will not make "enough".

Sounds a little ... fishy.

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
12. Was in San Fran a few years back
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 01:56 PM
Jan 2024

Seemed like I remember it, but I didn't see the whole city or anything.

I do know that new business startups are at all time highs under Biden nationally, not sure about the Bay Area though.

To see areas really impacted by high crime, you mostly have to go to red states who make up most of the high crime states in the country. California has the 17th highest crime rate. But the top 10 is DC, Alaska, NM, TN, AR, LA, MO, SC, SD, and AZ.

Texas has higher crime rates than California, why don't we see all these stories about Texas and crime like we see them in the national media about California?

Lurker Deluxe

(1,041 posts)
18. Most likely it is your news source
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 02:27 PM
Jan 2024

I live in Houston, TX ... my address says so, but truthfully I live in Champions Forest. Champions Forest is a small community to the North/North East of Houston by a couple of few miles. We can not vote for Mayor and are not policed by Houston Police Department, but the address is what it is.

I certainly see the rise in crime in my area, been here since 2008, and notice the vacancies piling up in the strip centers close to where I live. There are entire strip centers where there were once thriving business that sit vacant and vandalized. I know some of these small business owners who moved, some by just a few miles, to get off 1960 after being broken into multiple times. Was that an economic move? Yes it cost money to repair after damage is done and a small business, no matter what some think, is on a fairly small margin.

I hear about it on the news, daily. I read about it in the local paper, The Houston Conical, daily.

Do I believe it is untrue, no. Do I think that some business move because of it, yes. Do I think it will get worse in this area, yes.

That is the reason for the plans to leave the area and move farther north, past The Woodlands to flee it. My truck was stolen from my home last September, certainly insured ... but it was still a pretty big hit. My taxes, property, continue to rise for both the value of the property and the rate of taxation.

I am not alone.

To think that every story of a major chain moving because it is greed instead of need is, I dunno, kind of naive. But I could be mistaken, you could live in one of the large city areas that is truly getting better. Maybe ....

I dunno. Certainly not the case where I live.

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
19. Well, crime is down in Houston
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 02:39 PM
Jan 2024

Not sure about your suburb, but the data on Houston crime is pretty easy to find. Houston does have a high crime rate than the national average though. Homicides in Houston decreased 8.5% in 2023 and non violent crime went down by 2.1%. Most major cities are seeing crime decrease right now. That's what's contributing to the lowest crime rates in the country overall in the last 60+ years.

Do you have data for your neighborhood for crime? Most cities provide crime maps that you can sort through by year and determine if it's rising or falling.

Lurker Deluxe

(1,041 posts)
21. That is great, happy for whomever.
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 03:04 PM
Jan 2024

I see, with my own eyes, what is happening.

In order of things way to close to home:

Two shootings in the parking lot of a local bar, one red light east. Last year. '

My truck was stolen, from a gated community, September.

My credit union was robbed, at gun point, December.

Maybe the stats do not show that. I do not give a fuck, this is where I live.

I will not go to the Shell at the corner of 1960/Wunderlich, due to several people being robbed in the parking lot while getting gas. Vagrants hanging out panhandling in that very place, walking up to people while pumping gas.

I know my neighbors, they know me. You can site all the stats you want to cite ... good for you.

I see it, it effects me. I will be moving in the next couple of years. I am not alone.

I see the armed security in the Randell's parking lot where there used to be none. I see the small business closing and no one else moving in. I drive past strip centers which are vacant and vandalized, all the windows broken out and grafted. They are there.

Cite some more stats, I am sure this is all just an illusion because ... I dunno, seems fun.



Dave says

(4,694 posts)
26. Thank you, you add anecdotal evidence to the post up thread
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 05:57 PM
Jan 2024
You add evidence that crime runs rampant in red states. Why?

Statistically, crime rates are falling. In some instances, by a great deal. However, in your red city in your red state crime is (by implication) rising. Great. Why? Maybe you should write your esteemed governor about it. Live the illusion!

(Not dissing you, but the question up thread was why the national media focuses on California when it has falling crime rates (compared to decades ago) and land 17th in a list of states with high crime. Texas is in the top 10, I believe.)

LeftInTX

(26,313 posts)
42. In 2020, Texas and California were about tied for violent crime.
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 08:02 PM
Jan 2024

In 2022, California had somewhat higher property crime than Texas. New Hampshire and Idaho have the lowest property crime. 1010 and 926




Lurker Deluxe

(1,041 posts)
58. ??
Tue Jan 23, 2024, 12:08 PM
Jan 2024

Houston is a red city?

Who knew. Guess not me, who lives here.

And, again, you get the news you deserve. I am pretty sure I see much more Texas bashing here on DU, than California bashing. Why is that?

If you are reading right leaning news you will see right leaning stuff. The right does not like California, or for that matter New York.

*shrug

Overall crime is most likely staying about the same, it just moves in fairly predictable patterns. In my case it is, simply, that the multi-family structures about 4-8 miles east are now, built in the early 80s, lower rent properties because they are not well maintained. This brings a different class of people who have different values. I live on the eastern edge of Champions Forest and those just 2 miles west are not experiencing the same issues as they are policed better due to home values. The $750,000+ homes on the golf course do not face the same issues as those in $250,000 homes just a couple miles away.

Lurker Deluxe

(1,041 posts)
57. I have, truthfully, no idea
Tue Jan 23, 2024, 11:52 AM
Jan 2024

I really do not look at some website to make decisions about, well, anything.

As Abraham Lincoln once said, "Half of the things you read on the internet are untrue".

I walked into the credit union and there was a sign that said, "No face coverings allowed, including masks and hoodies" and I made a comment that was ironic as just a couple of years ago you could not get into this building without a mask.

I did that because I knew the person whom I was speaking to and we chuckled. Inquiring further I found out the place was recently robbed at gunpoint. I did not immediately run home, or snatch up my phone, to see if some random app somewhere had it listed.

When my truck was stolen, the people at the subdivision meeting knew about it because I told them about it when I attended the monthly meeting to discuss local issues. I did not check to see if some random app had logged the incident.

I know what is going on in my local community because I participate in my local community, not because I read about it on a website.

W_HAMILTON

(7,928 posts)
61. If you know what is going on with your local community because you participate in your local community...
Tue Jan 23, 2024, 07:30 PM
Jan 2024

...then it would stand to reason that you should know whether this increase in crime that you claim to see with your own eyes is actually being borne out by the criminal reporting/statistics from your community, yes?

former9thward

(32,402 posts)
48. Of course, property crime is down if it is not prosecuted.
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 10:54 PM
Jan 2024

Stores don't report because they know nothing will be done about it.

TwilightZone

(25,694 posts)
14. "As far as this store location's neighborhood, who knows"
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 02:02 PM
Jan 2024

Unless one bothers to actually read the article, in which it's clearly noted that crime in the area is quite high.

Crime elsewhere is irrelevant.

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
16. Is it?
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 02:13 PM
Jan 2024

"The San Francisco Chronicle reported since 2019, police have recorded 1,335 incidents in and around the fast food restaurant, more than any other location in Oakland.The San Francisco Chronicle reported since 2019, police have recorded 1,335 incidents in and around the fast food restaurant, more than any other location in Oakland." Is 1335 high? Is it higher than 3 years ago? Is crime going up or down right there? Why only go back to 2019? Was 2018 lower or higher? The article doesn't say. In and around the restaurant?
That's also intentionally vague, are they saying 1335 breakins in the restaurant and it's parking lot, or in the area around it in the last 5 years? How big is this area? 100 yard radius or a 10 mile radius? Seems pretty selective and intentionally fact free. Why couldn't they report some solid stats to support this story?

I find listening to the police spin things is often misleading. Police want budgets to increase, they're always playing up crime.

Was at a friend's house and he described their neighborhood meeting with the police, he lives in an affluent neighborhood that recently saw a shooting, so it was shocking. I wasn't surprised when he told me what the police chief told them. Police cheif told them several lies. FIrst off told him "the city has doubled in size in the last 30 years, but have less police now than we did then." Both were lies, our city has actually seen a small population decrease in the last 30 years, and the police force is bigger today than it was 30 years ago. Police Chief also told him that "crime is so high because they don't have staff." Pointed out above, they have more staff now, and crime was way higher here 30 years ago. The the police chief also told them they can't recruit officers anymore because of Black Lives Matter.

Police chiefs want bigger budgets and more officers, that's their primary want on a day to day basis. Historically low crime rates don't help them.

DBoon

(22,521 posts)
28. Police also want to be treated as Gods
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 06:08 PM
Jan 2024

They can't stand Black lives Matter because it implies that police must be held to a standard they cannot control

W_HAMILTON

(7,928 posts)
29. Maybe, but there is enough evidence both macro and micro that the narrative is bullshit.
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 06:15 PM
Jan 2024

From a macro perspective:

Retail theft has caught the attention of the masses in recent years, from startling smash-and-grab videos during the depths of the Covid pandemic to corporate earnings calls where retailers like Target and Foot Locker are discussing losses from organized retail crime more than they ever have.

But the effect of theft on retailers’ bottom lines is about the same as it has been for years, according to the latest data released Tuesday in the widely used industry survey conducted by the National Retail Federation.


Taken from: https://www.cnbc.com/2023/09/26/organized-retail-crime-and-theft-not-increasing-much-nrf-study-finds.html

And from a micro perspective, a big company (Target) caught in a lie:

On Sept. 26, Target set off a national firestorm when it said it would close nine stores in four states because theft and organized retail crime had made them too dangerous to run.

On its face, Target’s announcement was evidence that retail crime was preventing one of the country’s most prominent retailers from operating stores profitably and safely. It challenged skeptics who believed that retailers had exaggerated the impact of organized retail crime and used it as an excuse for poor financial performance.

There was just one problem with the explanation Target gave for closing stores: The locations it shuttered generally saw fewer reported crimes than others it chose to keep open nearby, a monthslong CNBC investigation has found.


Taken from: https://www.cnbc.com/2023/12/19/target-store-closures-theft-and-crime-higher-nearby.html

LeftInTX

(26,313 posts)
10. I live about 10 miles between various socioeconomic areas.
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 01:30 PM
Jan 2024

There are much more shoplifting protocols in the lower income areas.

More products are locked.

I go into Walgreens about 4 miles south of me and all the make up is locked. (One of my main reason for going to Walgreens)
It isn't locked in my neighborhood except for a few products.



Wingus Dingus

(8,063 posts)
59. Yes--it's a very localized thing. I was just in a Walgreens in Santa Fe, NM
Tue Jan 23, 2024, 12:24 PM
Jan 2024

on Cerrillos Road (their main commercial strip) and was surprised at how entire aisles were locked up, and the shelves in other parts of the store had very little stock. The shelving configuration was all pushed together in a weird way. The store looked like it was going out of business. It was terrible. Where I live in Colorado, it's just a normal Walgreens. I'm pretty sure these businesses understand what they need to do to survive in their area.

dsc

(52,211 posts)
8. One reason they are doing this is to get laws passed that
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 01:06 PM
Jan 2024

treat theft (not wage theft of course) more harshly. Target and CVS have both been caught lying about reasons for closing locations in CA.

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
15. Perception
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 02:04 PM
Jan 2024

I am constantly battling the perception of crime right now on social media. I posted the facts above. I think this idea we have crime and it's not safe is being pushed by the media, and being taken advantage of by corporations.

It's ridiculous on apps like Nextdoor. just completely divorced from reality. I have lived in my subdivision for 7 years, you can follow our city's crime maps app and look at every reported crime in your area over any time period. My subdivision has literally not had a single crime reported in the 7 years I;ve lived here. Not a break in, not a car theft, not even a drunk driver or a deomestic case. Zero crime in 7 years. That still doesn't stop people I know who live in my exact subdivision of 60 or 70 houses complaining about how terible crime is in their neighborhood now. Our neighborhood hasn't seen a single crime in years and people are still being brainwashed into thinking it's a huge issue here.

I do think ring doorbells and cameras in retail spaces have contributed to it all. People never saw crime before like they do now. My house growing up, ou cars all got broken into, never was it on camera, and heck, we didn't even report it sometimes. But because now people can see crime on video, it's created this perception that isn't supported by the actual statistics.

LeftInTX

(26,313 posts)
25. Nextdoor is a joke. Our neighborhood has porch pirates, auto thefts and a few break ins.
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 05:51 PM
Jan 2024

Still it's safe. Most break ins happen when no one is home.

I've never had anything stolen.

People get all worked up over stuff.

Someone had posted a weird video and everyone came up with criminal conspiracy theories. It turns out that the person in the ring camera had some health issues.

LeftInTX

(26,313 posts)
38. Pretty much!
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 06:56 PM
Jan 2024

In one case, a group went to a house and asked if they house was for sale. The whole ND got suspicious. Then, they found out that group was driving a care with Disabled Vet plates. "They stole the car!" LOL

Then there was an incident involving some rif-raff at a park or some public place. "Please don't tell me those are DV plates". The person wasn't committing a "crime", just some sort of mischief. (dumping or something like that)

They are crazy. Don't get me started on the ND pit bull lovers. "Rehoming a dog is worse than murder". Gosh...

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
39. Porch pirates
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 07:29 PM
Jan 2024

I’ve seen people post, “this porch pirate stuff almost never happened 20 and 30 years ago.” Yeah? No shit, 20 or 30 years ago online shopping didn’t exist and the amount of packages getting left in people’s porches was like 1/100th as much as today. Everyone gets hundreds of packages delivered to their homes now, before online shopping is get mail order stuff a few times a year.

And that’s not to mention that 20 or 30 years ago virtually no one had cameras on their porches to capture this and there was no where to share those videos if they did. 30 years ago porch pirate events were just called lost in the mail.

The Mouth

(3,193 posts)
63. Theft *should* be treated *MUCH* more harshly
Thu Jan 25, 2024, 08:26 PM
Jan 2024

We need minimum sentencing guidelines, and long ones.

I hate thieves.

hardluck

(658 posts)
64. Why would a burger joint want to get laws passed that treat theft more harshly?
Thu Jan 25, 2024, 09:23 PM
Jan 2024

That doesn't make sense.

TwilightZone

(25,694 posts)
13. Crime elsewhere is irrelevant.
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 01:59 PM
Jan 2024

As clearly noted in the article, crime in the area has been quite high.

TheProle

(2,279 posts)
23. Crime is not evenly distributed
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 03:10 PM
Jan 2024

This particular area is plagued by multiple crimes every day and that has to be traumatizing for people who live and work near there.

It's dismissive to just throw out "crime is down" bumper-sticker talking points as if it's some uniform situation.

Polybius

(15,745 posts)
27. Murders are at a low
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 05:59 PM
Jan 2024

Crime like this is another story. Plus we keep letting them out at rates we didn't do in the past.

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
41. Property crime like this is the lowest since 1961
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 07:35 PM
Jan 2024

So stuff like this is more rare than at any time in the US in 63 years.

Johnny2X2X

(19,718 posts)
44. FBI keeps stats
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 09:13 PM
Jan 2024

“FBI data, which compare crime rates in the third quarter of 2023 to the same period last year, found that violent crime dropped 8%, while property crime fell 6.3% to what would be its lowest level since 1961“

https://www.ncja.org/crimeandjusticenews/public-tells-gallup-crime-is-rising-federal-reports-disagree#:~:text=FBI%20data%2C%20which%20compare%20crime,who%20analyzed%20the%20FBI%20numbers.

And don’t forget that property crimes are more likely to be reported today because some of them can be reported online e without talking to an officer.

mahatmakanejeeves

(58,371 posts)
34. "Additionally, this location remains a busy and profitable one for the company ..."
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 06:37 PM
Jan 2024
In-N-Out in Oakland to close over increase in crime, company says

By Dion Lim and ABC7 Bay Area Digital Staff KGO logo
Monday, January 22, 2024 7:38AM

OAKLAND, Calif. (KGO) -- In-N-Out Burger is closing its Oakland location in a few weeks due to crime, according to Chief Operating Officer Denny Warnick. ... The company confirmed to ABC7's Dion Lim the closure of the restaurant located at 8300 Oakport St., which has been open for nearly two decades.

MORE: Kelly-Moore Paints abruptly ends operations after 78 years, closes all stores including Bay Area

In a statement, Warnick detailed the type of crime that customers would frequently witness and be subject to. ... "Despite taking repeated steps to create safer conditions, our Customers and Associates are regularly victimized by car break-ins, property damage, theft, and armed robberies," Warnick wrote.



"We are grateful for the local community, which has supported us for over 18 years, and we recognize that this closure negatively impacts our Associates and their families. Additionally, this location remains a busy and profitable one for the company, but our top priority must be the safety and wellbeing of our Customers and Associates - we cannot ask them to visit or work in an unsafe environment," he continued.

https://cdn.abcotvs.com/dip/images/5435199_080119-kgo-in-n-out-img_Image_06-26-17,04.jpg
Undated photo of the exterior of In-N-Out Burger

Warnick said employees will be transferred or can receive a severance package. Its last day in operation is Sunday, March 24.

FOOD

Oakland's only In-N-Out to permanently close

By Amanda Bartlett
Jan 21, 2024


The Oakland In-N-Out is seen in 2019.
Bobby Y./Yelp

Oakland’s only In-N-Out will serve its last double-double on March 24 after more than 18 years in operation at 8300 Oakport Street, the burger restaurant’s chief operating officer Denny Warnick confirmed with SFGATE in an emailed statement Sunday.

Warnick described the store as “busy and profitable” for the company, and drive-thru lines during the dinner rush often stretched all the way out into neighboring parking lots. However, he cited “ongoing issues with crime” as the reason for the closure.

“Despite taking repeated steps to create safer conditions, our Customers and Associates are regularly victimized by car break-ins, property damage, theft, and armed robberies,” Warnick wrote in the statement, which was first reported by KGO. “...Our top priority must be the safety and well-being of our Customers and Associates – we cannot ask them to visit or work in an unsafe environment.”

The restaurant is just over two miles away from Oakland International Airport, where rental car companies have recently cautioned customers returning vehicles to watch their belongings and avoid filling up on gas at stations in the immediate vicinity. Last week, Oakland police told SFGATE that 271 auto burglaries occurred at the Shell gas station on 285 Hegenberger Road in 2023 along with 15 robberies and five instances of vehicle theft.

Security guards for Allied Universal and Brosnan Risk Consultants also recently told the San Francisco Standard that they had taken more theft reports at In-N-Out than at any other location they patrol, seeing as many as five break-ins there per day. Sandwich boards stationed near the front doors of the popular burger chain warned customers not to leave valuables in their cars and to lock their vehicles.

{snip}

Response to Johnny2X2X (Reply #4)

Sympthsical

(9,238 posts)
17. I've eaten there many times. Shame.
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 02:20 PM
Jan 2024

But it's not a safe neighborhood unfortunately.

Oakland has a lot of problems. But, people keep running defense for the situation and insisting everything's fine. I strongly caution my nieces and nephews, who are AAPI, from being caught alone there at night. It's not safe for them.

Nothing will be done. Not sure it really matters. It seems like it's going to get gentrified to hell in the next decade or so. Which will bring other problems. And then we'll get "Why wasn't something done?!" from the same people who are currently sitting on their hands and pretending nothing's wrong.

madville

(7,413 posts)
20. And all the sports teams have left or leaving
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 02:58 PM
Jan 2024

I used to go to A’s games but the last few only when they were midday. Lots of coworkers were raiders fans but they didn’t want to take their families anymore, that area with the two stadiums had gotten so bad.

Sympthsical

(9,238 posts)
22. Yep, it's going to get worse, then bought up
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 03:10 PM
Jan 2024

I remember the last A's game I went to, also midday, where it was maybe a fifth of the stadium being used. They actually had roped off half of the place, because no one bought any tickets.

One time, some years back, I had to go to my work HQ when my car was being repaired. I thought, "Oh, I'll just take my bike onto BART and get off at Coliseum!" Biked through that area, and it was like a bomb had gone off. It was noon, and none of it seemed very safe. By my work HQ, in the foothills of East Oakland, you could sit outside and eat lunch while just watching crime. Like dinner theater.

It's been a minute, but the last time I was around Coliseum about three years ago, that area was getting heavily into gated townhouse new construction. Little enclaves of tech people. And West Oakland is seeing similar. I know people in tech who started buying up dilapidated houses there and doing complete renovations on them.

The real shame is Lake Merritt. That should be the jewel of the city. Even five years ago, I'd walk through, find a table, and feed the squirrels while having lunch. You couldn't pay me to go there now.

madville

(7,413 posts)
24. Had a coworker move to Lake Merritt
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 05:22 PM
Jan 2024

About 2019, she said Alameda was too boring. After her car was broken into for the third time and a guy sleeping in it she had to just leave it parked in the gated lot at the office and she Uber’d or biked to work until her lease was up.

W_HAMILTON

(7,928 posts)
35. You are blaming that on crime and not the community there being unwilling to pay the asking price to keep them?
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 06:39 PM
Jan 2024

Bless your heart.

If the community was willing to offer more public assistance than Las Vegas offered, they would still be in Oakland -- crime or no crime.

madville

(7,413 posts)
53. It's really the same thing
Tue Jan 23, 2024, 02:06 AM
Jan 2024

The community didn’t support it anymore because it’s too dangerous to be in that area. Where the teams went doesn’t matter.

W_HAMILTON

(7,928 posts)
54. No, it's absolutely not the same.
Tue Jan 23, 2024, 04:23 AM
Jan 2024

The community didn't want to spend hundreds of millions of dollars investing in something that would primarily benefit an already wealthy group of individuals. At least not at the level that other communities were offering.

If crime was the driving force here, the owners wouldn't have moved to another high crime city like Las Vegas (to compare, Oakland is rated "F" in terms of crime and Las Vegas is rated "D" on https://www.areavibes.com/).

They moved there because Las Vegas/Nevada offered them sweetheart deals to move.

madville

(7,413 posts)
56. Did you go to games there?
Tue Jan 23, 2024, 11:14 AM
Jan 2024

Last edited Tue Jan 23, 2024, 10:21 PM - Edit history (1)

In the last 5 years? I did. The square miles surrounding the coliseum/baseball stadium look like a dystopian nightmare out of a movie, thousands of people living in tents, old campers, vans and cars and the entire area reeks of an odor that can best be described as a mixture or urine, body odor, feces and weed.

Building new stadiums in those areas (because there’s no where else to place them) wouldn’t have fixed the attendance and safety problems.

W_HAMILTON

(7,928 posts)
60. And it doesn't matter.
Tue Jan 23, 2024, 07:24 PM
Jan 2024

Neither does it matter whether I attended a game there or not.

If the community there would have offered a better package, they would still be there.

As this thread indicates, organizations love blaming crime on the reason why they close up shop, regardless of whether or not it actually applies. And we know the reasons why those teams left Oakland from contemporaneous reporting at the time. Back then, it wasn't as chic to blame crime on everyday business decisions they would be making regardless, so it's not surprising that they didn't blame crime -- the way you are now doing for them, after the fact -- as their reason for leaving.

Just a reality check here: do you think the teams that relocated would have still done so had they been offered the same or better deal from the Oakland community that they got from Las Vegas/Nevada?

MenloParque

(517 posts)
37. This is the closest In n Out to the Oakland airport. Always a line 20+ cars deep in the drive-thru from open to close.
Mon Jan 22, 2024, 06:48 PM
Jan 2024

hunter

(38,481 posts)
55. Being next door neighbors to an abandoned WalMart Supercenter doesn't help.
Tue Jan 23, 2024, 10:55 AM
Jan 2024

That entire parcel, the empty WalMart, In-N-out, Panda Express... is ripe for redevelopment.

These small time criminals are the unpaid shock troops of the oligarchs.

Someday this property will be covered with five story "upscale" apartment and condominium buildings.

It's just like the game of Monopoly.






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