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madaboutharry

(40,281 posts)
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:20 PM Feb 2024

Obviously, I am not a black person but if I were I would be more than offended.

I really don't know how to explain this but I am going to try. I am getting this uncomfortable vibe of an old racist trope were these hostile white attorneys have tried to portray Mr. Wade and Ms. Willis as oversexed black people. It really is rather glaring and disturbing.
Why these attorneys have taken this approach is obvious. It isn't for the benefit of Judge McAfee. I am certain he is above this. It is for the benefit of Trump and the MAGA haters watching this.

It really is upsetting.

86 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Obviously, I am not a black person but if I were I would be more than offended. (Original Post) madaboutharry Feb 2024 OP
I concur DaBronx Feb 2024 #1
Fani Willis is being very strong. LiberalFighter Feb 2024 #3
I agree. I think someone else made that opinion either here or elsewhere. LiberalFighter Feb 2024 #2
Trump enjoys humiliating and denigrating people as much as possible. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #4
It's sickening. TSExile Feb 2024 #13
Trump: rich powerful white GOP male. Justice system cowers at his feet. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #14
Technically, he's orange, but yeah. TSExile Feb 2024 #17
He buys the orange by the bucket. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #18
He slathers it on with a trowel. TSExile Feb 2024 #20
He fancies himself as quite handsome. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #23
I just have one thing to say on behalf of the majority of the female populace... TSExile Feb 2024 #25
I know, he is so disgusting isn't he. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #30
I second that MorbidButterflyTat Feb 2024 #55
Well then just for you TSExile ;-) jfz9580m Feb 2024 #73
I'll go a step further and say Melania has had to put a lock on her panties drawer RVN VET71 Feb 2024 #82
Nothing would surprise me when it comes to Trump. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #83
'cause he is actually ghostly gray. quaint Feb 2024 #35
The more bronzer he uses, I think the worse he must look underneath. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #49
If he wore make-up that matched his skin tone Danascot Feb 2024 #81
I stay out of the sun, too. Aristus Feb 2024 #58
Hell, he even scares the mirror...... lastlib Feb 2024 #40
I have seen a few pics of him without the makeup. ShazzieB Feb 2024 #42
Yes he looks quite different without his make-up. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #50
Yup. Mr. Evil Feb 2024 #61
Magas enjoy the ridicule and suffering of others oldmanlynn Feb 2024 #39
As people keep saying, cruelty is the point. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #51
Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2024 #5
I believe they are messing with the WRONG woman. nolabear Feb 2024 #6
Yes, she is. Fani is on fire 🔥 iluvtennis Feb 2024 #10
It's the Scarlett Letter all over again dlk Feb 2024 #7
That + doing to Fani what they did to Miss Ruby & Shae. Mob character hit on women who did their job. Attilatheblond Feb 2024 #32
Not just women, black women. ShazzieB Feb 2024 #48
Yep. Was hoping SOMEBODY around here would notice TSF's bad habit of going after black women in particular Attilatheblond Feb 2024 #63
so proud of her et tu Feb 2024 #8
Old racist tendencies..... SergeStorms Feb 2024 #9
This is sickening. And its on EVERY channel. IcyPeas Feb 2024 #11
FWIW, both Wade and Willis are... capechacon Feb 2024 #12
That second sentence really gave me a lift -- I flashed back to that scene in "A Civil Action" in which ... eppur_se_muova Feb 2024 #44
I love Fani Willis. mtngirl47 Feb 2024 #15
1000% agreed. I can't believe the judge isnt also getting more than a whiff of that. Arazi Feb 2024 #16
Like the Mayorkas impeachment and the Hunter Biden investigations. Fishing. Hekate Feb 2024 #28
White males, such as myself, enigmania Feb 2024 #19
Agree wholeheartedly. I think every one of us should spend some time walking in others shoes. erronis Feb 2024 #33
I think Atlanta in particular is growing them that way lostnfound Feb 2024 #77
It's a "high tech lynching" thomhartmann Feb 2024 #21
Yes it is -- the real thing Hekate Feb 2024 #26
That is close to what Ginny Thomas's husband said during confirmation erronis Feb 2024 #34
Oh yes this is a warning to all the other prosecutors and attorneys. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #53
Racist AND sexist spooky3 Feb 2024 #22
I turned off the tv. As a human being, this offends the hell out of me. As a woman, you bet it does. Hekate Feb 2024 #24
Destroying people is their specialty. They enjoy it. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #54
I couldn't watch all of it, but from what I saw her relationship with Mr. Wade ihaveaquestion Feb 2024 #27
What would we expect from a man who paid $100000 for spooky3 Feb 2024 #31
Yes they assume everyone is a sociopath like they are. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #56
1 NIGHT stand? It was a 90 SECOND stand! oldsoftie Feb 2024 #67
IMHO, she wasn't "attracted." She wanted money. She saw him as a mark. nt spooky3 Feb 2024 #68
But she got nothing out of it. It was 2006. And it was HIS idea to pay her during the campaign oldsoftie Feb 2024 #75
It truly is sickening shanti Feb 2024 #29
They sure did spend a lot of time trying to explore the in's and out's of calimary Feb 2024 #36
yep. Remember, drump initially accused her of sleeping with a gang member ecstatic Feb 2024 #37
Well, as a black person may I add BaronChocula Feb 2024 #38
Yes, that goes without saying. madaboutharry Feb 2024 #41
When it is Team Rapist that is incompetent and unethical. Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #57
oversexed? hem what about the former prez? AllaN01Bear Feb 2024 #43
The one who has to hire hookers or rapes women? Irish_Dem Feb 2024 #59
hehe . thanks AllaN01Bear Feb 2024 #60
Yes Sir, Yes Maa'm. Fuck that shit. I'm pissed seeing these professionals demeaned Gym Jordan style. Evolve Dammit Feb 2024 #45
In thinking about the original post of this thread DaBronx Feb 2024 #46
I agree. madaboutharry Feb 2024 #47
Especially Merchant Aviation Pro Feb 2024 #52
I absolutely agree with this. ShazzieB Feb 2024 #62
Got pretty sick last night... supper didn't agree with me, slightlv Feb 2024 #64
I felt physically sick at their treatment of her and FemDemERA Feb 2024 #65
Agreed Evolve Dammit Feb 2024 #66
Your points are well taken and valid. I just wish you hadn't felt the need to use the word "obvious" in your headline. Martin68 Feb 2024 #69
It's a common thing people say out of habit. madaboutharry Feb 2024 #71
Well, obviously life is short. It's also obvious that words have meaning. But, obviously you will continue to use the Martin68 Feb 2024 #84
It's for the purpose of distracting from the defendants being guilty as hell AdamGG Feb 2024 #70
Why 'obviously not a black person'?? Other than saying so... DemocraticPatriot Feb 2024 #72
I was thinking about members here who have known me for nearly 20 years. madaboutharry Feb 2024 #74
I am a black woman JustAnotherGen Feb 2024 #76
I'm a young black man fightvision81 Feb 2024 #78
This entire thing is... Think. Again. Feb 2024 #79
You nailed it malaise Feb 2024 #80
Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2024 #85
Post removed Post removed Feb 2024 #86

LiberalFighter

(52,081 posts)
2. I agree. I think someone else made that opinion either here or elsewhere.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:22 PM
Feb 2024

That needs to be brought up more in the media.

Irish_Dem

(50,207 posts)
4. Trump enjoys humiliating and denigrating people as much as possible.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:23 PM
Feb 2024

He is a sadist and gets off on it.

He is a ruthless, brutal sociopath who will try to destroy his enemies by any means possible.

ETA Trump is also racist.

TSExile

(3,092 posts)
13. It's sickening.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:51 PM
Feb 2024

Because he is Caucasian and born male, he can rape, kill, steal with impunity. She's Black, female and Democrat, so SHE'S the enemy!!

Irish_Dem

(50,207 posts)
14. Trump: rich powerful white GOP male. Justice system cowers at his feet.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:54 PM
Feb 2024

Black female Democrat thrown under the bus and humiliated.
Because she tried to prosecute Trump crimes.

TSExile

(3,092 posts)
17. Technically, he's orange, but yeah.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:57 PM
Feb 2024

Just the "R" after the name is the ticket. 🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬

Irish_Dem

(50,207 posts)
18. He buys the orange by the bucket.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:59 PM
Feb 2024

My guess is that underneath it, he is ghost white.
Even scares himself when he looks in the mirror.

TSExile

(3,092 posts)
20. He slathers it on with a trowel.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:03 PM
Feb 2024

I don't get why he sees it so bad to be ghostly white. I'm pasty white myself!!

Irish_Dem

(50,207 posts)
23. He fancies himself as quite handsome.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:05 PM
Feb 2024

He thinks he is gorgeous.
I wouldn't be surprised to hear he has worn make up for years.

RVN VET71

(2,713 posts)
82. I'll go a step further and say Melania has had to put a lock on her panties drawer
Fri Feb 16, 2024, 12:47 PM
Feb 2024

She'd out Fat Donnie for pilfering her underthings but her marital NDA (in lieu of vows) forbids it.

Irish_Dem

(50,207 posts)
49. The more bronzer he uses, I think the worse he must look underneath.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:09 PM
Feb 2024

He is covering up that he hs gone from white/white to gray white, like a ghost.

Aristus

(66,790 posts)
58. I stay out of the sun, too.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:22 PM
Feb 2024

And I still have my boyish good looks at fifty-five.

My late mother-in-law was a sun-worshipper, and she got a face-lift every year or so because of her crepey, sun-damaged skin.

lastlib

(23,590 posts)
40. Hell, he even scares the mirror......
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:43 PM
Feb 2024

I'd be surprised if his mirror didn't crack when he looks into it.

ShazzieB

(16,937 posts)
42. I have seen a few pics of him without the makeup.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:50 PM
Feb 2024

Taken when he was out on the golf course, where he evidently doesn't bother with it. I don’t want to post them, but you can see them at this link: https://www.newsweek.com/trump-makeup-photo-liv-gold-bedminster-1728985

He does look very pale, and blotchy.

oldmanlynn

(119 posts)
39. Magas enjoy the ridicule and suffering of others
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:42 PM
Feb 2024

Its not just trump. Trump does this because his base of magas love this

Irish_Dem

(50,207 posts)
51. As people keep saying, cruelty is the point.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:12 PM
Feb 2024

Actually control and cruelty.

Yes a very sadistic bunch.

Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Attilatheblond

(2,457 posts)
32. That + doing to Fani what they did to Miss Ruby & Shae. Mob character hit on women who did their job.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:22 PM
Feb 2024

Part of that RETRIBUTION TSF is always threatening. This is why the white guys are so afraid of him.

Anyone who stands for the rule of law, for fair voting, against mobster Trump will be attacked any way that sick fuck can talk a lawyer into doing. What I don't get is why ANY lawyer would do any of this for TSF.

ShazzieB

(16,937 posts)
48. Not just women, black women.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:08 PM
Feb 2024

Fani, Ruby, and Shaye all committed the same multiple sins of being (1) African American (2) women (3) doing jobs TSF does not approve of. In his disordered racist mind, that makes them the perfect targets and scapegoats for his narcissistic rage.

To paraphrase AL Franken, Trump is a LOSING LOSER who LOSES and then looks around for someone else to blame and punish for his failures. Since he is a raging racist and misogynist who surrounds himself with likeminded people, black people and women are always in his crosshairs, and black women doubly so.

Attilatheblond

(2,457 posts)
63. Yep. Was hoping SOMEBODY around here would notice TSF's bad habit of going after black women in particular
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:40 PM
Feb 2024

TY

et tu

(1,113 posts)
8. so proud of her
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:41 PM
Feb 2024

maga projects their values (?) on others-
it's just not the same as theirs and they
are lacking~

SergeStorms

(19,217 posts)
9. Old racist tendencies.....
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:48 PM
Feb 2024

die hard in the south. They like to take them out, dust them off, and display them every now and then, along with their old slave tags, cat-o-nine-tails, and confederate swords, and such. It's their "heritage" you see. 🤨

 

capechacon

(91 posts)
12. FWIW, both Wade and Willis are...
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:50 PM
Feb 2024

....making absolute monkeys out of Trump's (so-called) attorneys that are trying to make them look as if something illicit went on.
Trump's attorneys are asking questions about which they clearly don't know the answers to ahead of time.

It is apparent that neither Willis nor Wade did anything particularly shady.

eppur_se_muova

(36,357 posts)
44. That second sentence really gave me a lift -- I flashed back to that scene in "A Civil Action" in which ...
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:04 PM
Feb 2024

Robert Duvall, playing the role of the companies' defense attorney, is explaining to a classroom full of law students how to be a good lawyer. The scene cuts back and forth to the current trial where the plaintiff's attorney, played by John Travolta, is questioning witnesses to try to prove the company liable. Duvall tells his class

Jerome Facher: [to his class] And one last thing: if you don't know what the answer is going to be, never ask a witness "why". Ever.

In the current trial scene, Travolta does exactly that, and blow the case.

Arazi

(6,829 posts)
16. 1000% agreed. I can't believe the judge isnt also getting more than a whiff of that.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 04:55 PM
Feb 2024

There doesn’t seem to be anything “there” and smells like a massive fishing expedition

enigmania

(122 posts)
19. White males, such as myself,
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:03 PM
Feb 2024

could learn a lot from Black women. The rednecks know this too, so they demean and objectify them in an attempt to steal their agency.

erronis

(15,776 posts)
33. Agree wholeheartedly. I think every one of us should spend some time walking in others shoes.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:27 PM
Feb 2024

I don't know how to make that happen, but there should be a boot-camp early in life where we switch places with several other people from different backgrounds. I would have been much improved by understanding other viewpoints and experiences.

lostnfound

(16,238 posts)
77. I think Atlanta in particular is growing them that way
Fri Feb 16, 2024, 08:49 AM
Feb 2024

Something about that city. Feels like a place where i can glimpse unfettered black power flourishing. I feel more optimistic there than anywhere.

thomhartmann

(3,980 posts)
21. It's a "high tech lynching"
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:03 PM
Feb 2024

right out in the open for all to see. The message from the Trump lawyers is simple:

"If you try to challenge white billionaires like Trump, we will destroy your life."

And they want to make sure that every lawyer — particularly those who are Black and/or female — get the message loud and clear.

erronis

(15,776 posts)
34. That is close to what Ginny Thomas's husband said during confirmation
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:30 PM
Feb 2024

The SCOTUS guy who has been shown to be more corrupt than even Alito and Scalia. (Can't delve back further - my memory banks are being unplugged....)

Irish_Dem

(50,207 posts)
53. Oh yes this is a warning to all the other prosecutors and attorneys.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:15 PM
Feb 2024

This is what we will do to you.

Destroy you.

spooky3

(34,687 posts)
22. Racist AND sexist
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:04 PM
Feb 2024

Women aren’t supposed to have sex and of course, the man always pays for dates, even when the woman has a high paying professional job.



Hekate

(91,579 posts)
24. I turned off the tv. As a human being, this offends the hell out of me. As a woman, you bet it does.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:09 PM
Feb 2024

Our enemies (and yes they are our enemies) have gotten awfully good at this.


ihaveaquestion

(2,680 posts)
27. I couldn't watch all of it, but from what I saw her relationship with Mr. Wade
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:13 PM
Feb 2024

mirrors the relationship with my husband. We never went on cruises, but shared expenses whenever we could and we still do. We still take turns paying for meals at restaurants. Sometimes he's ahead and sometimes I am. It all evens out.

This is normal mature adult behavior and shame on the Trump lawyers for trying to make something disgraceful out of it.

spooky3

(34,687 posts)
31. What would we expect from a man who paid $100000 for
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:19 PM
Feb 2024

A one night stand and who knows how much for a trophy wife? Their side does not understand relationships among equals, as opposed to transactions where one party has something the other wants and must trick or pay them into giving it up.

Irish_Dem

(50,207 posts)
56. Yes they assume everyone is a sociopath like they are.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:20 PM
Feb 2024

Everything is a con or attempt to make money.

oldsoftie

(12,831 posts)
67. 1 NIGHT stand? It was a 90 SECOND stand!
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 09:43 PM
Feb 2024

Although I still dont understand the attraction some women have to men with power. At the time, Stormy Daniels could have had pretty much any man she wanted; WHY on earth did she go with trump? Even before he became orange and fat he wasnt attractive.

oldsoftie

(12,831 posts)
75. But she got nothing out of it. It was 2006. And it was HIS idea to pay her during the campaign
Fri Feb 16, 2024, 08:44 AM
Feb 2024

Maybe back in '06 she WAS thinking about money but after actually BEING with him she just couldn't stomach the thought!!
But then there's the playmate he actually had an longer affair with at the same time; Karen McDougal. Another VERY attractive woman.

calimary

(81,939 posts)
36. They sure did spend a lot of time trying to explore the in's and out's of
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:36 PM
Feb 2024

Last edited Thu Feb 15, 2024, 07:07 PM - Edit history (1)

some “relationship” somewhere on the side.

I felt insulted, too. I kept wondering “would they be treating any male witness like this?”

And I think it was Brianna Keillor on CNN who started out measuring the lining of Fani Willis’s coffin before things got started in the courtroom. Bias much? Whose side were you on, Brianna? Did somebody on donald’s team try to slip you an “inducement”?

BaronChocula

(1,729 posts)
38. Well, as a black person may I add
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 05:42 PM
Feb 2024

Team Rapist is also attempting portray Willis and Wade as incompetent and unethical, a stereotype they know lands well with the type of people they're trying to impress.

Irish_Dem

(50,207 posts)
59. The one who has to hire hookers or rapes women?
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:23 PM
Feb 2024

And has to import hooker wives from Russia?

There, I said it for you.

DaBronx

(312 posts)
46. In thinking about the original post of this thread
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:05 PM
Feb 2024

I would further say that one does not have to be black to be offended. I think every single one of us, no matter what shade or belief or whatever should be horrified at the treatment of Ms. Willis and Mr. Wade. Full stop.
The racism is on display, a bunch of white dudes and the token woman.
Let’s call it what it is.

ShazzieB

(16,937 posts)
62. I absolutely agree with this.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 06:36 PM
Feb 2024

The racist trope of black people being lacivious and oversexed goes back a very long way:

The belief that black people are sexually lewd predates the institution of slavery in America. European travelers to Africa found scantily clad natives. This semi nudity was misinterpreted as lewdness. White Europeans, locked into the racial ethnocentrism of the 17th century, saw African polygamy and tribal dances as proof of the African's uncontrolled sexual lust. Europeans were fascinated by African sexuality. William Bosman described the black women on the coast of Guinea as "fiery" and "warm" and "so much hotter than the men." William Smith described African women as "hot constitution'd Ladies" who "are continually contriving stratagems how to gain a lover" (White, 1999, p. 29). The genesis of anti-black sexual archetypes emerged from the writings of these and other Europeans: the black male as brute and potential rapist; the black woman, as Jezebel whore.

More here: https://jimcrowmuseum.ferris.edu/jezebel/index.htm

I don't think Fani Willis would be in this position if she and Nathan Wade were both white.

***Warning: If you go to the above link, prepare to be both educated and horrified.

slightlv

(3,075 posts)
64. Got pretty sick last night... supper didn't agree with me,
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 07:07 PM
Feb 2024

so I'm playing catch up right now. I'm horrified by what I'm reading, but not really surprised. Black women have two strikes against them - they're black, and they're women. Neither one can they have any control over, neither one do they apologize for. Neither one do the Magats ever forgive. All women, btw, will eventually pay the price... black women will end up paying the higher price, racial animus being what it is.

I've heard that this judge is smart, above all the chaos thrown at him by the magas, and I expect will rule accordingly. Whether or not Willis had an office romance has not one thing to do with the Rico case. And, if it did, magas would lose many of their own lawyers on this case.

I'm trying to keep my blood pressure down by writing what I feel in a dull way... but hope you guys know I'm actually screaming my head off internally! How dare they! I am so proud of Fani Willis. I hope she ends up being the first one who puts rump in prison. It would be a small bit of karma rectified.

FemDemERA

(242 posts)
65. I felt physically sick at their treatment of her and
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 07:10 PM
Feb 2024

after listening to those lawyers attack her again and again, I felt very sympathetic to her and angry at THEM. Because yes, it felt VERY racist, VERY misogynistic. Hopefully their treatment of her backfires on them.

Martin68

(23,358 posts)
69. Your points are well taken and valid. I just wish you hadn't felt the need to use the word "obvious" in your headline.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 10:44 PM
Feb 2024

It’s neither obvious to us, since wee can’t see you, nor is it relevant. I am tired of people using the word “obvious” for things that aren’t.

madaboutharry

(40,281 posts)
71. It's a common thing people say out of habit.
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 11:26 PM
Feb 2024

I do get your point. Personally, I try to let other people’s grammatical mistakes and annoying use of vocabulary words slide. Life is short.

Martin68

(23,358 posts)
84. Well, obviously life is short. It's also obvious that words have meaning. But, obviously you will continue to use the
Fri Feb 16, 2024, 01:31 PM
Feb 2024

word whether or not it adds anything relevant to the point you are trying to make. Obviously I should ignore poor word usage. Obviously my years as an English teacher have made me prone to try to help others with word usage and good writing. Obviously that’s just an irritating habit, so obviously I should stop. Obviously I’m sorry.

AdamGG

(1,318 posts)
70. It's for the purpose of distracting from the defendants being guilty as hell
Thu Feb 15, 2024, 10:48 PM
Feb 2024

If they were innocent, they could simply argue the facts.

DemocraticPatriot

(4,645 posts)
72. Why 'obviously not a black person'?? Other than saying so...
Fri Feb 16, 2024, 01:00 AM
Feb 2024

As for the rest, I do not disagree....


I have an odd perception on message boards and blogs....

As a white man, I "assume" ("assume and you make an ass of you and me" or however it goes),

I ASSUME that everyone posting is like me..... unless told otherwise.

Of course that is stupid, and not the result of any logic,
it is just some sort of assumption--- I don't even stop to think it over, really....

Fonts don't identify race or sex, and maybe that is good, I don't know....

???



fightvision81

(9 posts)
78. I'm a young black man
Fri Feb 16, 2024, 08:59 AM
Feb 2024

Last edited Fri Feb 16, 2024, 09:34 AM - Edit history (2)

And I have reached a point of not wanting to look ahead at stuff like this because I'm already suffering from outrage fatigue.. The former guy has 91 counts of criminality that he's going to 4 or 5 different court cases to be judged for and the attention is on the prosecutor? It's an outrage and an abuse of our judicial system that only the former guy gets to take advantage of.

Think. Again.

(9,942 posts)
79. This entire thing is...
Fri Feb 16, 2024, 09:14 AM
Feb 2024

....just a sleazy attempt by trump's sleazy shysters to smear and slander the prosecution.

It doesn't deserve the attention we're giving it.

Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

Response to madaboutharry (Original post)

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