From now on, I'm considering ALL negative posts and polls about President Biden as not supporting Democrats.

[Lunabell]

Yes, that's right, unless you are giving context as to why this fucking negative kkkrap is on DU.

For example: "This negative poll about President Biden makes me sick and I hate it!!" Or, "Take a look at this horrible poll, what can we do to make these numbers better for President Biden and the Democratic party?"

And furthermore, it's Democrat with a capital "D" and also it is not the democrat party. It's the Democratic party.

Rant over. But, forwarned is fairwarned.

[marble falls]

1. With you all the way.

[Think. Again.]

2. Could you clarify...

....if you feel that the 2 examples in your post are acceptable or not acceptable?

I personally feel that the 2 examples you gave are NOT acceptable as they are only ways to get the negative message posted while covering the poster's a**·

I agree that at this point in time, we here at DU should not be accepting of messaging that includes negative (and usually false) context about our candidates and our party. It's late in the game, we're passed the point of arguing in favor of candidates or picking at minor differences, and we are AT the point where what matters most is to strongly promote a massive BLUE wave in November.

[Lunabell]

4. It was self explanatory.

I said unless you are giving context as to why you are posting it. For example:

And I disagree that posters may just be covering their butts. There may really be a valid reason or concern.

Those were just two examples off the top of my head. I'm sure there are many other reasons to post negative polls, but to just post without giving a valid reason to spread negativity about President Biden or other legitimate Democratic candidates is not supporting Democrats. Oh, and this doesn't apply to indicted Democrats.

[Think. Again.]

7. I see....

...so you want people to be able to post negative propaganda as long as they claim they disagree with it.

[Lunabell]

14. Propaganda?

I'm not engaging. Have a great day.

[mopinko]

29. that's actually the rule.

u can post rw bullshit if u debunk it. we do need to see what the other side is up to.

[Think. Again.]

31. Debunking is great!...

...but the OP is looking for folks to post whatever as long as they add some kind of weak disclaimer on their feelings about it.

I personally believe that we should avoid amplifying all of the misinformation that's being put out there (and will only get worse) unless we can squash it completely and inarguably.

[mopinko]

33. well, you're free to alert on those posts.

but that is the rule.

[Think. Again.]

35. In keeping with the rules, I try to minimize the posts I alert on.

[mopinko]

36. there's no rule about that.

u might get in a little trouble for alert stalking, but only if u go nuts, and focus on individual posters.

[Think. Again.]

38. The last line in the alert box states:...

"Please use the alert function responsibly, or you could lose your alert privileges."

[mopinko]

40. and as long as u do that, you're fine.

if your alert r failing 0-7, yes, u may lose privileges. and if that is happening, u know the other members r not behind u.

[Think. Again.]

41. and so, as I mentioned, I try to minimize alerts.

[mopinko]

43. actually, we need ppl to alert.

i dont do it a whole lot. but if anything, members dont alert on enough of the bullshit that gets posted here.

[relayerbob]

77. Hardly. You are trolling what was an obvious post.

Many of us are sick and tired of the whining and the undermining our party.

[Think. Again.]

80. I am one of those who are sick and tired of the undermining of our party...

...as my post should make clear.

[gibraltar72]

3. !00% agree

Polling means nothing at this point. The tide is blue. Republicans are in disarray. It is going to get worse for them. Trump team will use RNC funds for legal fees and God knows what.

[muriel_volestrangler]

5. "Forwarned"? Are you saying that you're going to alert on any poll that doesn't look good for Biden?

I mean, why else would we need a "warning" about your feelings?

You shouldn't do that, if it's not clear. Reporting polls (and there'll be some that look bad, it's inevitable) is OK. It does not require editorialising.

[Lunabell]

8. I never said I'd alert.

That would be going against tos. And you're wrong. Posting without context as to why is spreading negative information about President Biden. If the poster has a concern about poll numbers, say so. Don't post negative kkkrap that we can all see, hear and read about on corporate media. Don't do their job for them.

[muriel_volestrangler]

16. So what is your warning about?

[Snarkoleptic]

6. Agree!

I'll be blocking any concern trolls as well.

[former9thward]

9. "Forewarned"?

Do you control what is posted on DU?

[Lunabell]

10. Where did I say that?

Huh? Where?

[former9thward]

11. You didn't say "forewarned"?

What does that mean?

[muriel_volestrangler]

17. Since you acknowledge that any DUer needn't give any fucks about another's opinion

why did you bother "warning" us about your opinion?

[Autumn]

20. Then one must ask if anyone needs to "give a fuck about" the opinion they posted?

Seems to be a self defeating OP.

Poll are going to be all over the place, no reason people can't discuss them. We are all adults here and I kind of like free speech.

[True Dough]

51. "I kind of like free speech."

[mopinko]

30. actually, we all do.

that’s what the jury system is there for.

[former9thward]

42. Yes and no.

The admins have a right to overrule a negative jury and have done so.

[mopinko]

44. i can promise u, it is damn rare.

[former9thward]

46. I don't know the statistics.

I do know they have done it with me on a number of occasions.

[Ms. Toad]

47. I've had a handful of hidden posts.

All but one or two have been restored on appeal. So it may not be as rare as you believe.

[Autumn]

13. Consider it to be whatever you want.

[Aristus]

15. I'm with you.

I absolutely cannot stand when the repukes do the whole ‘democrat party’ thing. It’s stupid and childish, and of course, that’s why they do it. Stupid and childish are kind of their brief.

[demmiblue]

18. Oh. n/t

[Chainfire]

19. I am not in the habit of bad-mouthing Biden or other Democrats, but I will keep my options open if the need arises.

Unless this warning involves curses or other hoodoo, I am not overly concerned about it.

[Johnny2X2X]

21. You're going to be skipping a lot of threads

Every other thread here is talking about how horrible the economy is under Biden.

[Emile]

22. I think the economy is great compared to

what it was under Trump. I don't see these threads?

[Johnny2X2X]

25. Objectively it is better now than at anytime under Trump

The data is clear on that.

But I see threads all day everyday lamenting inflation. Rental costs. Wage growth falling behind. Homelessness. And on and on.

People are emotionally invested in thinking everything is awful right now and 5 years ago everything was better. Trump said he built the “greatest economy ever”, so it must be true.

Real wages are up today since 2019, pre pandemic. That very clearly means people are in fact doing better today than they were before Covid. But very few here seem to be able to accept that because (insert anecdote here).

Wage growth exceeded inflation. More people are working than ever. More people have health insurance than ever. Less people are living paycheck to paycheck today than in 2019. The country is doing better.

Homelessness did spike, but I think the reasons for that are complicated.

[CrispyQ]

23. I think it was Jeff Teidrich who posted the other day,

that if you're not full on behind Biden at this point just put a fucking Maga hat on.

To which I say, Fuckin' A!!

[Silent3]

54. Teidrich did not say, however, that discussing bad news...

...and how other people in the world might not think of Biden as we do constitutes not being "full on behind Biden".

In fact, Jeff Teidrich strikes as very much NOT a "just happy thoughts, no bad news, all positive vibes!" kind of guy.

[CrispyQ]

58. I believe he was referring to the uncommitted movement, which is the stupidest fucking thing ever.

You never want the word uncommitted associated with your party or your voters. Whoever started that it was a bad move. The media is running with it too. Biden is now running against uncommitted. I've never taken a marketing class but even I know what a stupid move that was.

on edit 2: Shame on any dem candidate who use this.

[Silent3]

62. I definitely agree about the uncommitted movement

But the OP of this thread didn't seem to have anything to do with that issue at all, and was more about wanting to wear rose-colored glasses, practically accusing anyone posting anything on DU other than happy thoughts as being an enemy of the support-Biden cause.

[emulatorloo]

88. ' Fetterman to Democrats criticizing Biden: 'Get your MAGA hat'

Fetterman to Democrats criticizing Biden: ‘Get your MAGA hat’
https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4482892-fetterman-to-democrats-criticizing-biden-get-your-maga-hat/

[mcar]

24. I stand with you!

And President Biden and VP Harris.

[MOMFUDSKI]

26. Worry can translate to criticism.

We are all Dems here that will be voting for Joe. This next 7 months will be a shitshow. The stakes are the highest we have ever seen. A little leeway should be given to all. We will get through this.

[Think. Again.]

34. We might want to keep in mind that...

...we are not all Dems here who will be voting for Biden.

We know from past experience that rightwing trolls DO come here to disrupt and plant talking points, and we know that DU is open and available to be read by non-members all over the internet and even has a strong presence in google searches on topics we discuss here.

We should remember that a lot of people who are undecided or curious read a lot of what we write, and that there are a lot of 'lurkers' that use our discussions in a lot of different ways.

For example, as of this post, this thread has had 769 views and only 31 active replies.

[Turbineguy]

27. This is a discussion board.

[mopinko]

32. it's a discussion board w rules.

this isnt xitter.

[Think. Again.]

37. And the rules say this...

"...Do not post anything that could be construed as bashing, trashing, undermining, or depressing turnout for any Democratic general election candidate, and do not compare any Democratic general election candidate unfavorably to their general election opponent(s)."

[Ms. Toad]

53. Then we'd better not post anything saying Trump is going to lose

Or Biden is going to win, since that is exactly what happened in 2016. People didn't inconvenience themselves to go to the polls, because it was going to be such a landslide that a vote or two here or there didn't matter. We all know how that turned out.

[Think. Again.]

65. I think the polls saying that Clinton was going to win big in 2016...

...DID keep Democratic voters complacent, and also allowed some Democratic-leaning voters to feel comfortable in casting a third party protest vote.

That is definitely one of the dangers of pre-election polling, especially since it's so easy to manipulate the results of polls.

I personally believe all of our effort and discussion from here until November should be focussed on getting out the voters for Biden.

[msongs]

73. key phrase is general election candidate. nt

[msongs]

74. careful there, if u criticize twitter you may get a hide nt

[doc03]

28. I am not aware of the poll you are are talking

about.

[edisdead]

39. this is the way

[Blue_Adept]

45. Isn't this the kind of stuff we used to laugh at Freepers about?

Live long enough and you become the thing you hated.

[TeamProg]

49. Exactly.. nt

[Scrivener7]

56. Yep.

[riversedge]

59. +

[Raine]

63. Totally agree. nt

[TransitJohn]

71. Absolutely. n/t

[AkFemDem]

83. lol some of us still do!

[TeamProg]

48. Yes Luna! Because what WE say, submit, write, muse about, ponder, propagate or profuse is going to CHANGE THE

WORLD'S OPINION!

What we say is SO IMPORTANT!
We are so IMPORTANT!
I wake up EVERY DAY just thinking about HOW IMPORTANT MY OPNION IS so then I ASK MYSELF for a SECOND OPINION!

[ananda]

50. Me: they all go straight into the trash.

...

[Silent3]

52. I will forthwith imagine you with your fingers stuffed tightly in your ears, loudly chanting "LA LA LA LA LA..."

And imagining yourself bravely fighting the good fight for doing so.

[TeamProg]

60. This.

[ananda]

70. No, I just want to read news worth reading.

I get all the polling nonsense out of the way.

[Silent3]

72. You can skip over anything you like without getting judgmental, like the OP...

...that anyone who posts the stuff you want to skip over is "not supporting Democrats".

[Scrivener7]

55. That's nice.

[SarahD]

57. Or you could do this.

If you see a post about Biden's stammering, you could express admiration for someone who gives great speeches in spite of a speech impediment. If somebody says he's old, you might point out that he runs up the stairs. If he falls off a bicycle, at least he knows how to ride one. And so on.

[Lovie777]

61. GQP......................

put as many negative polls out there on Democrats, especially Pres Biden and his approval will go down by their numbers.

in 2022, that is exactly what they did on Democrats. They flooded them with negative polling against the Democrats and corporate media ran with it.

2024, same is happening now and corporate media is running with it along "Biden is old", et al.

[All Mixed Up]

64. This is dangerously close to just burying your head in the sand.

No one can talk about any poll that shows Biden trailing? Well that's pretty much all of them at this point. What I'm hearing is that we should just ignore the potential warning signs and expect it all to work out on election day.

And then what? People want to close their eyes and cover their ears to everything negative and block it out. I get it's hard to see Biden down in literally every poll. But closing yourself off to that doesn't change the reality. It just means come election day, you might find yourself in a massive shock if things don't go well because you spent the last 9 months pretending it wasn't happening.

I get you gotta do what you gotta do but some people like to stay informed.

If every poll is showing Biden losing right now... he might just be losing right now. Pointing that out doesn't mean you don't support him. It just means the reality of the race isn't favorable at the moment.

[Raine]

68. Agree, I don't want to be in shock the day after the election

because I was in denial before the election. It happened to me, I refused to hear anything that went against what I wanted. It wasn't pleasant (it was horrible) waking up to Newt's "contract on America". Never again do I want to be horrified like that from closing my eyes and ears!

[All Mixed Up]

69. That was me in 2004.

I truly thought Kerry was going to win and that it wouldn't be close. I thought he had Ohio and Florida in the bag. Why? I don't know. Probably because the only reports I had read were from positive, and in hindsight clearly bias, sources. The one that I remember the most was that Bush was under 50% in approval and therefore a lock to lose because if an incumbent is under 50%, they always lose reelection. What was ignored is that the examples of incumbents losing weren't just a couple points under 50% approval but well under it (polling in the 30s). Oddly, Republicans would latch onto that argument eight years later with Obama - he can't win because a majority does not approve of him and no incumbent has won with less than 50% approval! By that point, I knew better.

I also remember being told that undecided voters almost always break to the challenger in these races because if they haven't made up their mind by the week of the election, after having four years to decide if they were going to vote for the incumbent, they likely wouldn't pick him in the end. They said the same thing in 2012 with Obama vs Romney. Both times, though, the undecided voters actually broke for the incumbent in the end. Probably because they decided it was better to go with the candidate you knew over the guy you didn't.

After the election, I looked at the polls for the first time.

The average of polls in Ohio had Bush up 2. He won by 2. In fact, only one poll had Kerry winning Ohio. The rest were all Bush.

Had I actually looked at the polls, I wouldn't have been so certain Kerry would win. Maybe still hopeful but not utterly shocked when Bush won reelection. I was completely blindsided by that win. Way more than four years earlier.

[WarGamer]

66. I don't think that limiting DU to just "Happy News" is a good thing...

It's like being on a NY Yankees fan forum... it's NORMAL after a game to say the starting pitcher "was just off tonight, his fastball was 2-3mph off and his sinker didn't sink"...

Or: "The shortstop isn't playing well, let's bring up the rookie from the farm system.

I can't imagine people wanting to be involved in any discussion that was limited to "happy stories".

[Chainfire]

67. I don't really think that it matters how good Biden is (and he is good) or how bad Trump is (and he is awful).

There are two camps and the lines are drawn. If the truth be known, I doubt that 1% of American voters do not know who they will vote for in November and there is nothing that will shake them from their decisions. (short of a candidate not being available, of course) I don't think that tens of millions of dollars in advertising will make a difference. I don't think that Trump can act crazy enough to change his voters positions and I don't think that there is anything that Biden could do that would make me consider Trump.

I can promise you that this is true for me, I have not missed an election, of any kind for over 50 years, and if I am alive I will be voting for a Democrat on the first day of early voting. If I am dead, I won't care...

[FlyingPiggy]

75. I don't believe them. Trump doesn't have moderates, even a good portion of republicans support.

The media likes trump bc of ratings so I don’t believe the constant push for trump.

[SoFlaBro]

78. +1 rec. Magically, the polls will start to coalesce into the real number and safely inside the shitty MoE.

[relayerbob]

76. Thank you!!!!

[brooklynite]

79. And if you see one, you'll.......what?

Personally, I don't ge upset by stories I don't like.

[AkFemDem]

84. Spontaneously combust? Burn a curse candle? Have a conniption?

Say a bad word aloud? The hokey-pokey? The possibilities are endless!

[jcmaine72]

85. Good question

Does that person get a second fairwarning?

[AkFemDem]

81. Okay? You keep doing you, I guess?

[Abolishinist]

82. 'furthermore, it's Democrat with a capital "D" and also it is not the democrat party. It's the Democratic party'

It's the "Democratic party" Really? Capital "D", but lowercase "p" ???

Democrats.org disagrees with you... "We are the Democratic Party."
https://democrats.org/

As does Wikipedia... "The Democratic Party is one of the two major contemporary political parties in the United States"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Party_(United_States)

And in my home state... "The California Democratic Party will fight to defend and promote the rights, opportunities, and safety of all Californians."
"https://cadem.org/our-platform/

Sorry, you seem to be wrong. Try again.

[Raine]

86. You can consider them anything you want but that

doesn't make any post true in what you're assuming.

[pfitz59]

87. All political strategy requires an assessment of the 'negatives'

and plans to address and overcome concerns. Biden's age? Yes, he's old, but very fit and surrounded by a competent and effective team. The Biden economy? Inflation has slowed, unemployment is down and the stock market is reaching new records daily. Immigration? There is a problem. Biden had a plan which was derailed by Trump and the Republican House. Israel and Gaza? Kamala just today called for a cease fire. The Biden team is working to reach a settlement acceptable to all parties. The US has begun providing humanitarian aid. Ukraine? Look to Congress and the House and their intractability. And so much more. Please do not stifle dialog but do condemn pointless criticism.

[ecstatic]

89. I was going to post about a disturbing conversation today but opted not to

I don't want to discourage anyone but I am feeling really discouraged today. We have a huge problem that is not being addressed but I'll leave it at that.