Judge Loose Cannon declares Trump NOT GUILTY

[AverageOldGuy]

I'm watching Lawrence, someone else may have the details, however -- Judge Loose Cannon has released an item that she plans to include in the jury instructions. She will tell the jury that a President has full authority to declare any document to be "personal material" and is therefore allowed to keep it.

She has released to Jack Smith and the defense her proposed jury instructions, they have until April 2 to reply.

I'll try to find the full wording, if anyone else has it, post it.

It's time for Jack Smith to haul her dumb ass before the 11th Circuit and have her removed from the case.

[oasis]

1. She's paid off. Gotta be.

[B.See]

35. No, just another fkn magat crackpot

[StarryNite]

42. It could be both...

A paid off fkn magat crackpot.

[woodsprite]

52. I thought Trump said he'd appoint her to SCOTUS

“When” he gets back in the White House.

And I thought her daddy was high up in the Federalist Society.

[lindysalsagal]

2. Some day we'll find out what he's threatening her with.

I assume it's enough to get her fired, but I have no proof.

[ITAL]

4. Nah

She's a true believer, no threats necessary.

[magicarpet]

13. If Agent Tangerine makes it back into the White House,...

..... she gets elevated to the Suprene Court for a lifetime appointment if she gums up the espionage case and gets it tossed for the Orange Messiah.

Quid pro quo.

[dchill]

29. This. Just this!

[The Wizard]

34. He has dirt on all of his appointments.

They're all compromised. It's his M O.

[FarPoint]

3. I am hearing this now with Lawrence O' Donnald

on MSNBC ...

[WarGamer]

5. Title doesn't exactly match the news... here's the link

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/03/18/trump-judge-cannon-jury-instructions-pra/

[triron]

8. What is your agenda?

[WarGamer]

10. reality... plz read my sig.

In the WaPo link, nowhere does it say "Judge Cannon declares Trdump not guilty"

If I missed it... lmk

[Ocelot II]

12. Accuracy. The article doesn't say what the OP says it says.

[H2O Man]

15. Thanks.

I had noted the same thing at about the exact time you did. I wish people would post accurately.

[WarGamer]

18. Interesting OP titles lately...

[H2O Man]

21. We are seeing

what is known as catastrophizing. It is not a strength.

[TwilightZone]

31. Good word for it.

It's increased significantly of late.

[H2O Man]

40. That's the term

used for this in psychology. Perhaps I'll write a brief essay discussing it in more depth.

[lakercub]

39. It's all over the place

I go to the MeidasTouch Network, Brian Tyler Cohen, and David Pakman's YouTube channels, but their headlines have almost made me stop...everything is disaster this, catastrophe that, Trump gets DESTROYED, RW losing their minds, etc. The actual videos are usually pretty good, but the headlines are over the top nonsense. This crap has to stop. Clickbaiting is dishonest too.

[H2O Man]

43. Right.

I'm nor sure it is always clickbaiting, though that happens. But it isn't a good thing in a normal political campaign, much less a historic struggle.

[Lucky Luciano]

44. I never click on their sensationalist nonsense.

[canetoad]

23. This is lifted from the article

Exact words. We need more accuracy and a lot less knee-jerk made up headlines.

Her two-page order, however, also suggests an openness to some of the defense’s claims that the Presidential Records Act allows Trump or other presidents to declare highly classified documents to be their own personal property. National security law experts say that is not what the law says, or how it has been interpreted over decades by the courts, particularly given the other laws that govern national security secrets.

[Silent Type]

22. Read the article. You are right. Don't think this is as nefarious as folks will believe.

Cannon is asking for text to add to the instructions. She’s not saying take it or leave it.

Now if she rejects prosecutors recommendations and presides at trial as if the MFer can do anything, there’s a problem.

[alfredo]

36. Paywalled

I can’t get access

[intheflow]

55. Freebie link down-thread.

✌🏼

[sakabatou]

6. If true that she will instruct that

a President has full authority to declare any document to be "personal material" and is therefore allowed to keep it, I... how the fuck?!

[canetoad]

24. Did you read the article?

You should, and not take things read on the internet, even on DU at face value.

[sakabatou]

45. The WaPo article? I don't have a subscription

[canetoad]

50. Here ya go

No paywall link at internet archive.

https://archive.md/I0PSu

[sheshe2]

51. Thank you!

[triron]

7. Yes past time. She is doing malevolence.

Evil.

[TexasDem69]

17. How is she evil?

That seems extreme. Hitler and Stalin were evil. So too Jeffrey Dahmer.

[BOSSHOG]

9. As a wonderfully brilliant Debate Instructor in High School

Pounded into our heads more than 50 years ago, IF YOU ASSERT, YOU MUST PROVE.

To wit, what is the honorable judge citing to back her assertions? I suggest disbarment, then Aileen can choose another Major. If she wants to help trump maybe she can study real estate.

[H2O Man]

11. Not accurate.

She gave both the prosecutors and defense two theories to take positions on before they get to jury instructions. The sky is not falling.

[Cha]

14. Thanks..

[H2O Man]

20. While I'm no fan

of the judge, I will venture the forum benefits from accurate information, and is damaged by inaccurate reports.

[Cha]

25. Of course and it immediately

made me feel better.

When there's bad news I look for a 2nd opinion. Reading threads is invaluable.

[Disaffected]

30. As it has been repeatedly.

Plus the seemingly all too frequent click-bait post titles.

[getagrip_already]

16. Sounds like great news....

Finally an appealable decision.

But haven't seen or heard anything beyond this post, so tentatively hopeful.

Let's pretend this is a question from an appeals court.

So if a president visits an air force base and is shown a nuclear missile, he can just say it's personal property and take it home?

[Silent3]

19. Removed? That might *look* too political! Can't do that!

While Trump and his sycophants and enablers blaze forward with blatantly political, naked abuse of the legal system, we must bend over backwards to avoid the slightest hint of a suggestion of a possibility of the slightest impropriety.

[PurgedVoter]

26. The Archivist must sign off on any deviations.

Honestly the court case should be pretty simple. Without the archivist approving it, TFG had and has no right whatsoever to keep or destroy any document from the period, let alone secret documents. Declaring them not secret in no way shape or form allows a former president to keep any of these documents.

[NoMoreRepugs]

27. Nothingburger. Loose Cannon can't rewrite the law.

[kimbutgar]

28. Too bad they don't have pictures of them together at Mara a lago or a record of their telephone calls.

Since the discovery occurred in this case.

[alfredo]

38. They do, but

They are pornographic. Nobody wants to see that, well maybe Lyndsey Graham. Such a freaky boy.

[ancianita]

32. Bradley Moss explained the best way the 11th Circuit will deal with her without a writ of Mandamus.

[ancianita]

33. Here are Cannon's "Preliminary Proposed Jury Instructions and Verdict Forms on Counts 1-32 Only"

https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/67490069/407/united-states-v-trump/

With respect to the proposed language pertinent to the issue of “unauthorized possession” specifically, the

parties must engage with the following competing scenarios and offer alternative draft text that assumes each

scenario to be a correct formulation of the law to be issued to the jury, while reserving counterarguments.

(a) In a prosecution of a former president for allegedly retaining documents in violation of 18

U.S.C. § 793(e), a jury is permitted to examine a record retained by a former president in

his/her personal possession at the end of his/her presidency and make a factual finding as

to whether the government has proven beyond a reasonable doubt that it is personal or

presidential using the definitions set forth in the Presidential Records Act (PRA).3

(b) A president has sole authority under the PRA to categorize records as personal or

presidential during his/her presidency. Neither a court nor a jury is permitted to make or

review such a categorization decision. Although there is no formal means in the PRA by

which a president is to make that categorization, an outgoing president’s decision to

exclude what he/she considers to be personal records from presidential records transmitted

to the National Archives and Records Administration constitutes a president’s

categorization of those records as personal under the PRA.

The whole thing as much as tells the jury what their only verdict can be -- Dismiss -- which throws out all the other counts and the whole indictment. Luckily, Jack Smith is a few chess moves ahead of this judge.

[Diraven]

46. Since when do juries interpret laws?

I don't think that has been the legal standard for a while.

[ancianita]

47. Exactly! But Bradley Moss says Jack Smith will quickly explain that to her, as he always has to, apparently,

while getting his Writ of Mandamus ready for the 11th Circuit.

[Joinfortmill]

37. Yup.

[Bluethroughu]

41. She should be removed immediately.

[Aussie105]

48. There is no confusion.

Any tools you use in your employment remains the property of your employer once you leave their employment.

This includes internal paperwork, even if you have penned it yourself as part of your job.

In short, you can't walk off with the office stapler, blank letterheads or paperwork related to the inner workings of your ex-employer.
Trump did the last thing.
And there should be no confusion on that point.

Went through this myself when I retired.
Years of teaching materials - I didn't need them anymore, no one was interested in taking any, I asked around.
Fed them into the school's skip bin.

[rampartc]

57. i had to leave a lifetime of work including patents and copyeights

and this guy can just pick up the blueprints for a submarine?

if that is true the law MUST be changed.

[TeamProg]

49. The Chaos Club continues. nt

[elleng]

53. SUCH a loser, and they think she thinks tmp will name her to the Sup Ct?!

[Kaleva]

54. Title of OP isn't even remotely accurate and should be edited

Despite being false, OP had 50 recs which IMHO, is an indication of why this country is in the shape it is in .

[AverageOldGuy]

56. She is providing Trump an out

From the WashPost article -- which seems to be everyone's favorite.

Her two-page order, however, also suggests an openness to some of the defense’s claims that the Presidential Records Act allows Trump or other presidents to declare highly classified documents to be their own personal property. National security law experts say that is not what the law says, or how it has been interpreted over decades by the courts, particularly given the other laws that govern national security secrets.

The Presidential Records Act does no such thing and does not even suggest such a thing.

Classified material -- "highly classified" or common everyday classified material -- is not and can never be personal property.

I served 28 years in the Army, retiring in 1995. As a result of wounds in Vietnam, I was not able to continue in the infantry and transferred into intel. I worked with highly classified, special access SIGINT, IMINT, and HUMINT programs both as an operator and a manager. POTUS cannot order something to be declassified -- he can direct declass but the material must go through a process and in most cases the POTUS request is denied.

By even suggesting this Judge Cannon provides Trump an out. The judge runs the trial and her brain farts have a way of becoming fact. This judge has ignored EVERY SINGLE ONE OF JACK SMITH'S FACT-BASED ARGUMENTS. Smith needs to ask the 11th Circuit to slap the shit out of Cannon, emove her from the case, and put a real judge in charge.

The idea that classified material becomes the former President's personal property is not supported by law, fact, precedence, or anything but Trump's fantasies.

Anyone commenting that this move by Judge Cannon is nothing to worry about, it's just a trial balloon is fooling themselves.

Judge Cannon is not too bright. She was appointed by Trump and she owes him. She was a local MAGISTRATE JUDGE -- hearing speeding ticket, unleashed dog, and noisy neighbor cases when Trump lifted her out of a dead-end job and put her on the federal bench.

[Think. Again.]

58. You've got a good point...

...if this move of jury instructions based on false premises works, she is essentially declaring trump not guilty.

Well said.

[no_hypocrisy]

59. As a judge, you can't change the law in jury instructions.

Especially when an acquittal can't be appealed.

If the Cannon jury instruction stays in, the jury has just one option: to ignore it and perform jury nullification, which can't be appealed.

[Emile]

60. Who in the hell is she to judge anything. Egads

[Prairie_Seagull]

61. Sounds to me like Cannon is giving someone

a second bite at the apple.

File a motion, not up to snuff. Clean up your argument and lets see.