I believe in being willing to be open to other

[BlueKota]

view points, but not when those view points, include treating , people of other races, genders, religious beliefs, or sexual preferences, as lesser beings. Let's be honest here, bigotry, money, guns, and weapons of war are the only things that the Republicans stand for anymore.

I could see as reasonable their old guard stances on being tougher on crime, and reducing the budget even though I didn't always agree. Now it's different.The majority of those type Republicans have either passed on, retired, resigned, or turned onto Magats.

They have no more reasonable points of view to offer, and what they do offer now is so abhorrent, the only thing I can possibly feel towards them is pure disgust.

They hold people in contempt mostly for what those people are born. My feelings towards magats are based solely on what they have willingly chosen to be.

[Walleye]

1. Agree, I can't be tolerant of rapist, cheats, liars racist and misogynists

And I can’t understand why reasonable people expect us to be accepting of this man.

[BlueKota]

4. I don't get that either

[MutantAndProud]

2. There is more of that coming from everywhere

These days I’m seeing a lot of people from unexpected areas dehumanize each other for convenience. Not just in the MAGA v normals or MAGA v Democrats.

[BlueKota]

5. Very true.

[SARose]

3. Totally agree with you

May I add we are not the same nation we were in 2020 and light years from 2016. The pandemic changed us in many ways like Pearl Harbor, JFKs assassination, and 9/11.

Republicans are still talking about stuff that doesn’t matter one iota to most Americans. Their vision of a conservative Utopia isn’t what we want for our children and grandchildren.

During those dark days of 2020/2021 we found what is most important to us - faith, family, community, service, love. Basically what Republicans said they were for since Eisenhower.

Well my, my, my…

[BlueKota]

6. Excellent analysis

They're also openly embracing criminals when they used to say the stood for law and order. It seems the majority of them are now more than willing to commit crimes themselves.

[SARose]

9. Thanks Blue

Democrats must provide a clear vision for an America. Number one in that vision should be your post. Well done!

[Diamond_Dog]

7. This is a good thread. Explains a lot of what I've been feeling, too.

[BlueKota]

8. Thank you

[SARose]

11. I agree

I think this thread shows who we are as Democrats.

We still believe in the New Deal, to ask not what our country can do for us…, the Great Society, we haven’t stopped thinking about tomorrow and we are fired up and ready to go!

Phew what a bunch of cliches 😉

[TSExile]

10. The Democratic Party isn't perfect...BUT...

...I have never heard Democrats brag that they are the party of law and order, of family values, blah blah blah. If the Republicans had any collective sense of shame...but they don't. Call them the Double Down party.

[Hotler]

12. I gave up playing nice with the repugs years ago. "Fuck your feelings." can work both ways. Don't forget, the driving

force behind the repugs are the Christian Taliban (dominionist). They're our real enemy.

[Martin Eden]

13. Rethugs also stand for unfettered greed and fascist theocracy

The list could go on.

Decades ago I looked for reasons to vote for Republicans, but I couldn't get past their policy positions on the environment and the struggle between labor and corporate greed.

Those differences are still very important, but now the survival of our representative democracy is at stake.

[Diamond_Dog]

14. I agree with all that,

Plus it’s hard for me to get past the bigotry and misogyny. I had relatives in the past (most are gone, now) who were so casual about bigotry in their conversations it just made me sick. I grew up in a family full of that attitude and I often wonder how I ever turned out to be a liberal Democrat.

[Martin Eden]

16. I was lucky. The adults in my family were in the labor movement and supported civil rights

Both my parents (WW2 Gen) worked, and my mom's older sister (born 1907) lived with us. She was the most caring empathetic person I've ever known. She wept when MLK was killed, while the parents of my classmates celebrated.

Aunt Kate went to work in Chicago factories at age 15. Her sense of fairness led her to the labor movement. Many years later not long before her death she was one of three elderly ladies featured in Union Maids, a documentary nominated for an Academy Award.

[electric_blue68]

30. Wow on your Aunt Kate 👍

[electric_blue68]

31. Very lucky my parents leaned Liberal Democrats, and lucky to live in NYC...

Where we could meet many different people

My folks welcomed my friends into our home whether White, Black, Chinese, Jewish...

I was a little too young to be watching the TV News when Bull Connor's violent attacks on peaceful Civil Rights protesters happened. Probably saw JFK's speech to The Nation.

But also importantly my mom in particular pointed out Northern racism to me.

[PatSeg]

15. Yes, I also understood their "old guard stances"

even though I didn't always agree with them. BUT they at least made sense and their positions did help to keep some kind of balance in government ( well according to my 10th grade social studies teacher).

I wonder now how many of them really believed what they said and how many of them just used the same old tired rhetoric to advance an agenda that was advantageous to themselves and their powerful donors. Yes, I do think some of them believed it, but now I'm inclined to think many of them were self-serving opportunists.

The one thing I find really disturbing is the total about-face on foreign affairs. It wasn't all that long ago that republicans in congress would have been very supportive of military aid to Ukraine and staunchly anti Russia. This new brand of republicans is terrifying.

[BlueKota]

24. I remember hearing America love it or leave it, or if

you think America is so bad, why don't you just move to Russia, you Commie.

They never understood that feeling compassion for the Russian people was not the same thing as supporting the Soviet Government or Communism.

They also didn't understand that some typed of criticisms are constructive and made because you do love your country and want it to be the best it possibly can be.

My how the tide has turned. Now they actually want the U.S. to become Putin's ally.

[PatSeg]

25. Oh yes AND now many of them talk about moving to Russia!

I remember the "Love it or leave it" days very well. They really can't entertain more than two positions in their minds. You're either for us or against us. Everything is black or white, good or bad, with absolutely no gray areas, no middle ground.

[ancianita]

17. Agree. You're completely justified. Thanks for your thoughts.

I'd like to add that they believe in a god of power. There is no such god.
They're power worshippers, Christian or otherwise. Mammon and power -- both corrupt both body and soul.

Power/Mammon worshippers never live and let live, and from that choice, they seek to both create & react to all human difference ("othering" ) with commodifying, greedy profiteering, fear/fearmongering, & political violence.
They are indifferent to other humans' suffering.

Theirs is a sickness of the soul, heart and mind. Sane humans who know love and democracy must drive them back into their dark hole, and keep them contained there so they may never infect the body politic again.

[Ocelot II]

18. You could have rational arguments with the "old" Republicans.

The arguments often had to do with the allocation of resources. Old-style Republicans generally agreed that some kinds of social welfare were acceptable, that people shouldn't be starving on the streets and that there were situations where it was appropriate for the government to provide assistance. The questions were whether, how much, for whom, and where the money would come from; Republicans generally thought government assistance should only be a last resort, but they didn't oppose the concept altogether. Taxation is another issue that used to be negotiable; these days the GOP seems to think that the wealthy and corporations shouldn't be taxed at all, or only minimally, and they won't budge. The top marginal tax rate is now 37% but during the Eisenhower administration it was 92%. Foreign policy for the GOP used to be based mainly on intense opposition to Communism and especially the Soviet Union. Now what's left of the USSR as a major power, Russia, is seen as an ally - for no apparent reason other than that Trump likes Putin. What was once a serious political party that you could argue with despite intense disagreements has become a cult, and you can't debate with a cult.

[electric_blue68]

33. Perhaps back then when there were the differences between Republicans and Conservatives?

Those who fought against FDR, Social Security, Medicare etc!

Back in NYC we had Liberal Republicans like John V Lindsey, and Rep Charles Goodell. The only 2 I ever volunteered for bc the Democrats were too socially conservative !

[Hope22]

19. Yes that sexism is festering!

Since the orange pustule, women in this country have been bombed back to the cave. Sitting at a table of boaters this weekend this guy walks up and talks the usual banter then flat out stops the conversation and says OK now I have a question for the men…..my engine won’t start even though bla bla bla. What in the absolute heck. Everyone there was a boater. How was he certain that there wasn’t a women there with the answer. I so wanted to say I hope you never get a woman pilot, surgeon, or professor! Three men walked off to conquer the problem of which none of them had the answer! 🤣😂😂 The women looked at each other and thought we wouldn’t give him the sweat off our balls! I sound angry….because I am. TSF has infected the young men and the old.

[birdographer]

20. Agree 100%

One time years ago, maybe as far back as 2017, I was with two acquaintances in a car going someplace. One of them was talking about her new boyfriend. I asked if he was a trump supporter. She said "Yes, he is. But I don't care about his politics." I went on a mini short rant about how it has NOTHING to do with politics, it has to do with morality and values. Fell on deaf ears. Liking trump, being a republican, supporting any of them, is a statement about morality and values, and I feel no obligation to be open to considering their opinions.

(The trump-supporting boyfriend, being fully aware that he was infected, gave her genital herpes. They broke up. I haven't seen or spoken to this woman for several years....)

[FakeNoose]

21. The problem with Repukes these days is that they shout down anyone who doesn't agree with them

They threaten and sometimes do violence to anyone who doesn't kowtow to Chump. That includes OTHER Repukes, and all Democrats.

They really cannot be reasoned with, not any more. It's a cult and none of us are in it.

[WarGamer]

22. You don't have to be open...

Back once upon a time... the Democratic Party was the beacon for First Amendment Rights.

The more repulsive the beliefs... the more they needed to be protected.

The ACLU even supported the rights of the "Unite the Right" troglodytes to march in C'Ville...

When one becomes opposed to free speech in any form... we're moving farther from our ideological roots.

[BlueKota]

23. I was taught by my political science professors

that freedom of speech is necessary for Democracy, but there are necessary limitations. Such as the tried and true you can't yell fire in a crowded theater, unless there is actually a fire. The right to extend your arm ends where other people's faces begin. Neither are real calls for people to use physical harm against others protected under free speech. Republicans are increasingly crossing the line in that matter. Their representatives also clearly do not have the right to codify into law restrictions on the rights of other people based solely on a persons, race, creed, or gender. Yet that is exactly what they are doing. Should we tolerate that?

Speaking of American ideals what happened to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness? What happened to the belief in equality and justice for all? Do you think that will be true in a nation run by fascists who want to take them away, and will take them away from anyone who isn't a white male, straight pseudo christian ? What do we say to the ones whose rights are taken away, oh sorry you need to be tolerant of the Republican view that you are lesser humans?

Should the rest of the world have just thrown up their hands and said well the German people voted in Hitler, so hey sorry to all you people that he's gassing to death, but we have to tolerate his views and behavior? I don't and will never think that should be tolerated or allowed period.

[Skittles]

26. thank you

I get tired of being told I need to "understand" Trump voters - I understand them all too well which is why I fucking DESPISE them.

[BlueKota]

27. Yes! It's the ones who don't understand who the Magats are,

who need to understand the danger Trump and his followers represent. They think life won't change for them or if it does, it won't be that bad, so there's no harm in letting Trump and his cult spread their violent rhetoric.

I wonder if they will still feel that way when Trump declares himself divine ruler, and he and his thugs start making good on their threats.
I mean just look at what Michael Flynn wrote to Former President Obama on X. A veiled threat is still a threat. Yes it's okay to be tolerant until someone starts adding calls for physical violence into the mix. There the line needs to be drawn, period.

[Skittles]

36. MAGATs are easily led sheep

they'll welcome a "divine ruler" as long as he hates the same people they do.....what they don't get, what they NEVER learn from history is that eventually EVERYONE becomes victims of authoritarians

[BlueKota]

37. Yup. Stalin had his own generals killed.

[Xavier Breath]

28. To a degree, we should all be open to diverse opinions and those that conflict with our own.

In the last decade or so though, the bar has really risen on what I'm now open to discussing and which opinions I'll consider. If you love the movie I didn't like, then by all means, let's have a talk. The college football team you root for is better than the one I root for? You're delusional, but ok, I'll hear you out. But if you're psyched about taking away other's rights, intimidating and punching down on others, or want to impose your religion on everyone, then kindly go fuck yourself.

Seems reasonable to me.

[BlueKota]

29. Exactly

They lost my tolerance of their "opinions," when they started talking about detainment camps for Muslim Americans, and conversion centers for LBGTQIA citizens. I have no problem with magats saying they personally believe this or that is a sin, but when they start talking about forcibly incarcerating people simply based on their religion or choice of a significant other, that's where my tolerance ends.

[ecstatic]

32. The worst magats are the elected officials who lie to the people

I caught a bit of Meet The Press this morning. Tom Cotton was on. Peter was challenging him pretty hard but Cotton was pretty skilled at lying and deflecting.

If it weren't for Romney exposing that his fellow gop senators do not like trump but they are trump stooges for their own safety, I would have walked away from that interview believing that Cotton was delusional and that he actually believed that trump was an unfortunate victim. But nope. He's just a selfish liar who will do and say anything to remain in office or get the VP slot.

It was stunning and depressing to watch.

[BlueKota]

34. Definitely

I mean some voters don't realize they are being duped. I agree with you that the politicians doing the duping and their media enablers are the main instigators.

[Poiuyt]

35. I'm willing to listen to other viewpoints, but they have to be based in reality

There are no such things as "alternative facts."

[BlueKota]

38. Good point.

Like the ones who still believe the earth is flat.