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[tenderfoot]

This message was self-deleted by its author (tenderfoot) on Sun Jul 7, 2024, 04:00 PM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

[LisaL]

1. I don't think they want Trump back in WH. But if they don't shut up, they will get Trump back in the WH.

NT

[iemanja]

8. This

[Patton French]

14. Yep. NT

[The Wandering Harper]

41. and drive away again

this former / disillusioned Democrat
for whom Biden is restoring some faith in the party

[Silent Type]

2. Thom Hartmann and others want trump in WH? Don't think so.

“. . . . . . It’s time for serious soul-searching. The Democratic Party is not without resources, and certainly has the ability to decide on a replacement for a candidate who’s done a wonderful job in his role as president but now needs to retire from the campaign with the gratitude of the nation.“

https://hartmannreport.com/p/should-the-democratic-party-reconsider-124

[DemocraticPatriot]

11. I think Thom Hartmann should take a "cognitive test"---

and quite probably a "US presidential election history test".

I have doubts over the results of both.... and I have liked Thom very much,
until now.

[Silent Type]

16. Not much on eating our own.

[DemocraticPatriot]

17. but Thom seems to have no problem with it

[Silent Type]

20. He wants to win, don't blame him.

[DemocraticPatriot]

22. And he believes that 'eating our own', as you put it, is the path to victory?

Got it.

I would never have suggested 'eating' Thom Hartmann,
had he not first publicly suggested 'eating' President Biden...

Since he has, it becomes a whole 'food chain' thing now...

[krawhitham]

36. Yep, that's why he should take a "cognitive test"

[C Moon]

39. He wanted to win in 2016, too.

[MistakenLamb]

42. Curious that Hartmann says there plenty of Democrats but doesn't say the VP should step up

Not accusing anyone of anything just saying

[Walleye]

44. You realize if Joe Biden were to "step aside" he would have to replace his whole cabinet?

[Liberal In Texas]

47. I'm disappointed he wrote that.

It looks like it was dashed off the day after the debate then he took off on a 2 week vacation. I would be curious to know how he feels about it now.

[Goodheart]

3. Get real.

[FarPoint]

4. Powerful wealthy interests are the the root of this smear campaign against Biden.

2 months ago, Biden was two months younger and won all his Primaries....so, nothing has changed folks...Just the massive bankroll of money filtered thru the media.....

The wealthy are pulling out all the stops to defeat Biden in a covert, slimy fashion.


Biden is staying in the race...He has my vote....

[iemanja]

31. What do you think changed?

It's not hard to figure out.

[FarPoint]

40. Monies from the filthy rich have left the building.

Last edited Sun Jul 7, 2024, 03:44 PM - Edit history (1)

Biden did NOT change....the media is shit stirring without regard for truth, facts but seek clicks/views resulting in corporate greed making a killing.

Stop playing to the music of greedy media...

Biden is good...the smear tactics are out in full force.

[iemanja]

48. I don't consume any broadcast media

So take that shit out on someone else. I asked a question designed to introduce some reality into the situation, which is obviously a lost cause. Okay, there was no debate. It never existed. Happy?

[FarPoint]

50. Ohhh...I'm not directing at you...answering question with clarification

I apologize if you took it that way....far from my goal.

I just explained how I see thing...for the general reader...

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

33. Mine too!!

[fishwax]

5. That's unlikely. And I don't see how the claim helps anything.

It does not hing but intensify divisions--divisions which will have to be sutured to help put Joe over the top in November.

[brooklynite]

6. I know plenty of people who don't want Trump elected...and think we need a new candidate.

And those are cold hard facts.

[LisaL]

9. If they insist on replacing Biden, they are going to accomplish opposite of what they want.

NT

[emulatorloo]

10. Recommended. Agreed many many people are acting in good faith.

Even though I don't agree with their logic or conclusions.

[LisaL]

13. Well, you know that the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

NT

[Walleye]

45. I'm sure the Jill Stein and Nader voters thought they were acting in good faith too. Take some time to think politics

[DemocraticPatriot]

18. so why don't you talk some sense to them???

Perhaps you have... but you leave that part out?

[brooklynite]

23. I've explained why I think its impractical and politically dangerous...

...but the fact that Biden isn't addressing his support issues adequately doesn't help.

[DemocraticPatriot]

25. I agree, he needs to do more...

Reportedly he has a full schedule ahead, so we'll see...

On the other hand, this may start to blow over, if enough Democrats will say
"Donald Trump is the one who needs to withdraw because (insert your favorite reasons here)"...

Thanks for your response, brooklynite I know you must be flooded lately, lol

[brooklynite]

26. Democrats aren't going to drive a message about Trump.

[DemocraticPatriot]

29. Well, they never will if they don't TRY.

[tenderfoot]

28. They want new candidates, yet never suggest anyone.

So who'd you like to see?

[iemanja]

7. No, they don't

They fear Biden can't win in November. Do you actually believe that scores of Democratic politicians suddenly want Trump to win? That makes exactly zero sense. What they do is differ from you and most here in the way to bring about a Democratic victory in November. Attributing false motives accomplishes nothing.

[wnylib]

15. Scores?? How many scores? 2? That would be 40

Dem politicians who want Biden to drop out of the race. 3 score, meaning 60 Dem politicians?

Using the plural of score means at least 40 individuals.

I think it might be closer to 10 or less.

[DemocraticPatriot]

19. I believe it is up to 5 weak-kneed Democratic house members

who have thus far been willing to publicly confess their problem with "night-time incontinence"...

but I can't name them now, since I never heard of any of them before

[iemanja]

27. I take your point

but I think it's more than 10.

[emulatorloo]

12. No I don't agree. It is not a monolith. Some are in a PANIC because they think Trump might win

unless Biden is replaced.

I don't agree with them, I think it would be a huge mistake. But I disagree with your OP.

[DemocraticPatriot]

21. but I think their primary concern is that THEY be returned

to the House....

Democracy and the White House come second....

[iemanja]

30. Well, to be fair

I think they are concerned about the coattails from the presidential race. But yes, they are worried about their own seats.

[Deek1935]

24. Yup!! The corporate media wants the tax cuts for the rich and wants to report on Trump's crazy shit. They love chaos.

[valleyrogue]

34. This is all because little Sulzberger didn't get access to Biden

All of this "concern" is total bullshit, and voters in general and Democrats in particular need to start taking names and then unleash a torrent of comments, emails, phone calls, and the like against these absolute TRAITORS to the Democratic Party and to democracy itself.

There is NO path to win the White House if Biden got forced out. THAT is a fact. To call for Biden to step aside IS to support Trump's return.

Biden, a far more seasoned politician than 99.9999 percent of his critics in his party, knows this, and that is why he is staying.

[Celerity]

35. No. (& I'm not one calling for him to be replaced). Are you going to call Dems who do traitors too, like another OP did?

[Silent3]

37. Many are deathly scared of Trump getting back in the WH, but don't understand the daunting logistics...

...of switching to another candidate.

I have a sister like that.

[DontBelieveEastisEas]

38. You are wrong. There are many that are pure of heart in that camp.

I think Celerity makes a point about the absurdity of calling others, with different viewpoints, traitors and such.
And, the ironic thing is that some of them are saying the same thing about you.

We should have more tolerance for other viewpoints, IMO.

[Walleye]

46. Unfortunately, being pure of heart doesn't win elections

[iemanja]

49. Nor does insulting every Democrat who disagrees with you

[onecaliberal]

51. No but it sure as fuck will win the last election in our lives after they hand it to fascists.

I’m sorry but there is just way too much riding for this stupid bullshit. Especially after we’ve see it 90 times. The stupid is burning us all.

[musicblind]

43. whether intended or not, this is post clearly ascribing a false motive.

most people in the media (and democrats responding to polls) do not want to see trump in office. the media as we know it will cease to exist if trump gets into office.

these people may be mistaken in the outcome of their opinions as to what would be the best way to keep trump out of office, but they do not want to see him in office.

ascribing false motives to an opinion is a fallacy (often an unintentional one) that shuts down conversations rather than contends with them. it doesn't change anyone's mind (the loftiest goal of having a conversation); it just makes the people who already believe the opposite of the positions they are ascribing incorrect motives to feel more righteous and justified in their own opinions.

if we want to win this debate and help biden succeed then we should refrain from appealing to our own emotions and stick to appealing to the facts that will best persuade other people to join us in our opinions.

[Blue Owl]

52. Calling for Biden to step down is a dangerous game

He's the #1 best option to beat tRump.

[Utley]

55. I agree, though I think there are others than can win

I don't see why the idiot freepers would want Biden to step down, it would cause chaos but they have no blueprint on how to beat Trump with someone else.

[lanlady]

57. No he is not

Biden on the ticket assures a Trump victory. I wish I was wrong but every fiber in my being is screaming that I’m right.

[farmboy]

53. BS! There is nothing factual about your statement, no matter how angry you are.

Calling long time Democrats who have legitimate concern after that debate, to the point of believing another candidate has a better chance of beating the rapist, serial liar, evil orange Hitler-wanna be, is itself just as likely to help Trump win. Discussing and advocating your OPINION, again NOT FACT, is not jumping ship. But attacking the motives of all who clearly want the orange man gone is no more helpful, and possibly more harmful, than anything else.

[lanlady]

54. Well that's presumptuous

I see Biden stepping aside as the ONLY way to keep Trump out of the White House. He should not be running. Age exacts a toll and there is nothing to be done but accept it. He risks blowing up his entire legacy due to his stubborn refusal to face the facts. Does he want to wake up the day after the election to the realization this his own pig-headedness condemned this country to another Trump term and the loss of our democracy? The straw that broke my back was when he told Stephanapoulos that if he lost to Trump he would make his peace with it. Sorry, Joe. You do NOT speak for any of us. We cannot make our peace with Project 2025, more right wing judges, pulling out of NATO, throwing Ukraine to the Russian wolves, the gutting of DOJ, EPA, and lord knows what else. It would be one thing if Biden was leading in the polls but he is not. He’s a horrible communicator. He WILL lose to Trump. Flame away at me if you want, I really don’t care. Denounce me to the moderators. I have thought long and hard about this and I cannot reach any conclusion other than Joe must cede his place on the ballot to a younger and more dynamic candidate. We cannot afford to indulge the old man’s ego.

[raccoon]

58. You got that right.

[The Magistrate]

60. Ot Doesn't Matter If They Want It, That's What They'll Get Proeeding On This Line

No matter what they may think they're doing, that is what will be the result of their efforts.


“Historians have a word for Germans who joined the Nazi party, not because they hated Jews, but out of a hope for restored patriotism, or a sense of economic anxiety, or a hope to preserve their religious values, or dislike of their opponents, or raw political opportunism, or convenience, or ignorance, or greed.

That word is "Nazi." Nobody cares about their motives anymore.”