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DJ Porkchop

(635 posts)
4. I should amend that.
Wed Jul 10, 2024, 07:46 PM
Jul 2024

The media will not vote for Joe Biden.

Quiet competence does not make news companies money.

Flagging debate performances do, so follow the money. Spirited NATO speeches don't, so nah...

The MSM is not your friend, friend.

Gore1FL

(22,981 posts)
6. That's likely true. I do have to wonder about the people who are ilstenig to them, though. nt
Wed Jul 10, 2024, 07:49 PM
Jul 2024

GaYellowDawg

(5,112 posts)
7. And in the process of publicly doubting him
Wed Jul 10, 2024, 07:49 PM
Jul 2024

They'll ensure their votes won't matter.

Would you like some help off the ground?

Alice B.

(742 posts)
9. The public doubt thing...
Wed Jul 10, 2024, 07:56 PM
Jul 2024

That's what I worry about.

It's not the votes from 'voters who are gonna vote' that I'm worried about.
It's about what a public dumpster fire looks like to low-information undecided voters.
"If those people can't manage their own house, how are they going to manage a country?"

If I'm understanding the question and some answers correctly.
If I'm not, never mind. I'll go back to my fetal position.

DJ Porkchop

(635 posts)
8. Somebody is using George Clooney's mouth.
Wed Jul 10, 2024, 07:49 PM
Jul 2024

Those aren't his dollars talking. That's someone who pays him.

Celerity

(54,870 posts)
13. and the weakly attached/marginal voters, which is a massive group as well, and a key to 'enthusiasm' calculations
Thu Jul 11, 2024, 12:00 AM
Jul 2024

Martin Eden

(15,876 posts)
11. Is it possible that some people believe the Democratic Party would descend into chaos
Wed Jul 10, 2024, 10:53 PM
Jul 2024

If Biden stepped down or was forced out, and Trump would be more likely to win?

If someone believes that and still wants Biden out, it means they want Trump to win.

And have no intention to vote for the Democratic nominee, regardless who it is.

pat_k

(13,841 posts)
12. The lack of enthusiasm about Biden will have a chilling effect on turnout.
Wed Jul 10, 2024, 11:57 PM
Jul 2024

Tragically, the lack of enthusiasm about Biden will have a chilling effect on turnout.

To make matters worse, right now he (and his surrogates) are saying FU to the 25 to 30% of the party who are legitimately concerned. We are being branded "elite bedwetters." We are the enemy, trying to "push him out."

Telling so many of your own voters to just STFU is not a great campaign strategy. And some -- particularly among those who turned 18 since the last election -- are feeling so disheartened by it all they simply won't vote at all.

Biden's problem pre-dates the debate. Before he announced his intention to run, a significant segment of Democrats were praying he wouldn't. But he announced, and the party followed the tradition of rallying behind the incumbent. From day one, enthusiasm was muted. Biden the president accomplished so much against the winds of opposition. But somehow, that record didn't translate to enthusiasm about Biden the candidate. I believe the main reason for the lack of enthusiasm is that Biden the candidate was looking so much more frail than he had four years ago.

Our votes in the primary weren't votes for Biden in preference to other legitimate candidates. Our votes were a rubber stamp on a "done deal."

Yes. He will get the anti-trump vote. But to win, we need more than that. We need real excitement and high turnout.

You worry about "chaos"? On that, I agree with George Clooney's op ed:

Let’s hear from Wes Moore and Kamala Harris and Gretchen Whitmer and Gavin Newsom and Andy Beshear and J.B. Pritzker and others. Let’s agree that the candidates not attack one another but, in the short time we have, focus on what will make this country soar. Then we could go into the Democratic convention next month and figure it out.

Would it be messy? Yes. Democracy is messy. But would it enliven our party and wake up voters who, long before the June debate, had already checked out? It sure would. The short ramp to Election Day would be a benefit for us, not a danger. It would give us the chance to showcase the future without so much opposition research and negative campaigning that comes with these ridiculously long and expensive election seasons. This can be an exciting time for democracy, as we’ve just seen with the 200 or so French candidates who stepped aside and put their personal ambitions on hold to save their democracy from the far right.


I'm sure I'll be hearing calls from other DUers to STFU in response to this. Have at it. I don't think anything Biden or his surrogates have said since the debate has changed a single mind. Attempts to bully and silence won't work here either.

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