It was not some grand plan, it was a massive failure.

[jg10003]

The party should have defended Joe from the start. They should have said that a few senior moments augmented by a lifetime stutter does not indicate cognitive impairment. They should have stuck by Joe like the repubs stick to tfg. Instead they bought into the media narrative of Biden being too old. It wasn't strategy, it was mass hysteria. It was Democrats once again failing to fight back.

[macwriter]

1. so true! nt

[Omnipresent]

105. Yet big donors weren't coming forth with campaign checks.

That was a huge part of joe leaving the race.

[edisdead]

118. that is the heart of the problem

we will have a reckoning with this at some point. And the longer we put it off the worse it will be.

[rampartc]

131. true

but first trump, and his movement must be defeated.

[Blue Full Moon]

161. Yep

That money would be better put to use increasing the quality of life. Money for perks. Throw some crumbs so we will vote.

[Klarkashton]

2. I guess you know more than Biden about this.

[stopdiggin]

20. I think it is/was EXTREMELY clear, that Biden wanted to continue

Last edited Mon Jul 22, 2024, 10:46 AM - Edit history (1)

And he was brow beaten into withdrawing.
So - I think it's fairly safe to say that Joe's 'instincts' here - were ultimately turned aside.

Next.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

[brooklynite]

57. The most powerful person in the world was "brow-beaten"

Perhaps I have more respect for his political acumen than you do.

[stopdiggin]

67. I think Joe Biden made this decision himself

But it quite obviously followed weeks of agonizing and completely disheartening arm twisting by allies and intimates on all sides. If you don't care for the term brow beaten - feel free to select another. And, if you completely reject that that is what took place here ... Then feel free to do that as well.

[Cha]

90. I think Pres Biden Bowed Out For Unity and Democracy.. There were So Many Excellent

Leaders who supported him... and I'll take Those Leaders Over the ones who didn't Any Day.

But he saw the Division and knows we Need Unity to Save Our Democracy and beat the fucking Fascist.

That's the way I see it.

[CincyDem]

92. While Trump crows about his "taking a bullet" for the country...

Joe actually has “taken a [political] bullet” for the sake of the country. Sad that it was fired by our own “donor class” but here we are.

[Cha]

93. Yeah, We had some pretty Wonderful Stay Donors..

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100219190483


So many Leaders and Regular People wanted Biden to Carry on but he did take one for the TEAM.. and Shut Dwon the Divisiveness in one Fell Swoop.. Brilliantly!

Actually that guy who sat behind him took the bullet for TSF.. but of course its' all about him and his GD ear.

Mahalo,CincyDem

[stopdiggin]

121. and I would not disagree with any of that

Biden 'took one for the team' - as is so very characteristic of the man we know.
But I think he was persuaded against his own instincts - (which was to 'wade into the fray', bullets or no .. )

[Ocelot II]

3. But they didn't, and we are in a different situation now.

I'm sad that Biden is out and deeply disappointed in some Democratic congresspeople, but Trump has to be defeated regardless of who runs against him. I will be excited to vote for Kamala Harris and I'd vote for any Democrat who could fog up a mirror.

[BWdem4life]

7. Joe Manchin wants to run as a Democrat

Would you vote for him?

I wouldn't.

[Ocelot II]

12. If the alternative was Trump, I would.

[BWdem4life]

16. I guess it's a good thing repigs have a bad enough candidate that we would have to settle for the likes of Manchin.

[Ocelot II]

18. As I have said before, I'd vote for any Democrat who could fog up a mirror

if the GOP candidate is Trump.

[emulatorloo]

44. Of course, Blue No Matter Who...

But we don’t have to worry about Manchin IMHO, as I told your questioner…

[emulatorloo]

43. Manchin doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell of getting the Dem nomination.

So I not going to worry about shit that isn’t going to happen. YMMV.

[ImNotGod]

61. this is true but msm and maddow are pushing the story so it must happen

[emulatorloo]

64. 😃 Happily I have no problem tuning them out!

Love yr post

[griffi94]

152. Right. We have enough real problems, without worrying about hypothetical problems.

Voter suppression, the impending GOP smear on whoever our nominee is, rightward slant of the media. Those are real issues
that we're facing. The fallout of tantrum by an outgoing senator doesn't make the cut.

[chicoescuela]

13. Hell no

[Pisces]

14. He's not a Democrat

[Ocelot II]

17. Reportedly, he was considering re-registering as a Democrat.

[Pisces]

167. Turn coats need not apply

[stopdiggin]

27. back up ... you're actually articulating that you would NOT vote

for a Democratic candidate - with the alternative being Trump?
Just want to be real clear here.

[BWdem4life]

32. Context

I do not live in a swing state. I have the luxury of voting (or not voting) my conscience. Others don't, but I guarantee you there would be enough people who would not vote for him in swing states, we would get tRump as the result.

Save your purity test for someone in a swing state. My vote doesn't count for much, thanks to the slave-era EC.

[stopdiggin]

38. not my kind of Democrat

but I'll credit you with a straightforward and honest answer.

[relayerbob]

54. I want to be Emperor of the Planet Zongo

Doesn't mean there's a chance in Hell of it happening.

[chillfactor]

4. My feelings exactly.............n/t

[Prairie Gates]

5. I'm glad somebody is saying it

I feel like I'm in the Twilight Zone.

[LAS14]

166. That's how I've felt for the last few weeks. nt

[Sky Jewels]

6. No. People saw the debate.

You can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. Or, to use another metaphor, the effect was like helium leaving a balloon that was already flying a bit low. You can't force enthusiasm. And enthusiasm is what it takes to win a campaign.

[Skittles]

15. THANK YOU

you NAIL it

[displacedvermoter]

22. But you are telling us we have to be enthused, even if we are not currently, because of the way the President

was so shabbily treated. So which is it? Can you force enthusiasm or not?

[Sky Jewels]

45. My enthusiasm is entirely aimed at defeating Trump.

It was looking very clear like Biden was not going to be able to do that this time. I felt like I was in a slo mo train wreck, heading for certain authoritarian fascism. Now, at least, there is a spark, and excitement, and enthusiasm, and people are uniting, and donations are flooding Act Blue, and young people are tuning back in. In retrospect, this was definitely the right call.

[displacedvermoter]

72. My enthusiasm was aimed at a second Biden/Harris administration

which you are telling me was doomed by the lack of enthusiasm you got from the debate. I am telling you right now that I haven't got that spark you -- and admittedly many other folks -- have gotten from bouncing our President. And you all seem convinced that Vice President Harris is now a shoo-in for the nomination, which the double-dealing I have seen from party leaders over the last few weeks leads me to have doubts about, further dampening (curbing?) my enthusiasm.

I guess I am saying that I am withholding enthusiasm until I see that I am not going to be further "disillusioned", a word I know bugs the hell out of another poster here, by party officials who say one thing in public, and do another behind closed doors.

And, by the way, it is also very early in the process to be talking about "retrospect", considering we have no idea how any of this is going to turn out.

[StarryNite]

25. Dump didn't exactly shine during the debate.

My goodness, the orange POS is a convicted felon and rapist. He can't tell the truth. Wanders off into his own little world during his speeches. Thinks he's the next Jesus. And on and on but they aren't calling for him to step down. This was about the billionaire donors holding back their donations to key Democrats.

[Skittles]

26. newsflash

TRUMP if low fucking bar indeed - Dems EXPECT BETTER

Biden should have been able to EASILY wipe the floor with the lying POS Putin puppet Trump in the debate - IT DIDN'T HAPPEN

LET'S MOVE ON

[Sky Jewels]

49. Skittles, you are the best!

[lees1975]

65. So should Hillary Clinton. And she lost to him.

So move on.

[Skittles]

68. I DID MOVE ON

I can acknowledge someone fucking cheated and STILL MOVE THE FUCK *ON*

[Tweedy]

91. Whoa there

If our felonious abusive ex exec was so easy to defeat in the debating beauty contest, one of the republicans would have done it in 2016.

Another fact you appear to have forgotten is Secretary Clinton thumped Mr Trump in their debates and the electoral college still selected him.

Move on by all means.
Don’t claim the freak out over one debate justified tanking our candidate.

May God bless Joe Biden for trying to find a way through the swamp some of our friends got us stuck in because they got lost in chicken little land. I hope it works.

[Cha]

95. Mahalo! Rec.

[Kaleva]

98. "Winning" the debate doesn't guarantee election victory

But performing as poorly as Biden did can cause irreparable damage as we have seen.

These debates are all about presentation. That's how Trump won the Republican debates in 2016. His personality outshone the others.

No one can deny that Biden presented himself as a very old man .

In the next debate, the differences in ages between Harris and Trump will be stark and Harris has the reputation for being quick on her toes so if she does that, that will also help her.

[Tweedy]

110. Nah

I remember President Obama’s stone gargoyle first debate against Senator Romney. He still won. Ronald Reagan stumbled through his first debate too. We did not get President Mondale.

This was a pile on. Most of our media jumped all over our president because they are lemmings and too many democrats gave in to their inner chicken little. That is why we are here.

We are losing incalculable experience because of this nonsense.

I do respect Kamala Harris. She is ready for the job. She can win it.

[Wicked Blue]

112. The media piled on because the owners ordered them to do so

The ones that gave President Biden the push would have pounced on anything as a rationale. If the debate had gone well, it would have been something else. They had a pre-planned agenda.

[Kaleva]

120. I wouldn't put Obama's and Reagan's performance in the same category

[Tweedy]

122. There are more to add

Presidents typically have a difficult time with their first debate while seeking a second term. There was no other intention to compare the two men. Mr Reagan opened his campaign in Mississippi burning country — the dog whistle of all dog whistles. I was not born yesterday.

Obviously, republicans did not admit Reagan utterly blew his debate.

[Jk23]

126. As poorly as Obama or Reagan or even Gore in that one debate

Did none of them presented as somebody who could not become president and do the job for the next 4 years

I felt it was cruel for Biden's people to put him out in public in that state I felt bad for him. That is something very different than checking your watch or sighing loudly while your opponent is talking.

I'm amazed but not surprised at the length some people have gone to avoid admitting the obvious.

[Tweedy]

160. Ad hominem is never supposed to win any argument

And then his orange turpitude arrived and everybody seemed to get amnesia about debate rules.

Debate 101

Lying is disqualifying. Failing to answer a single question is too. There are microphones for soft voices. A soft voice is not disqualifying. Moderators take the debaters to task for twisting facts much less fabricating them out of whole cloth.

Reagan

President Reagan actually had Alzheimer’s, not the made up kind some wanted to suggest President Biden had. Yes. He was much worse. He was incomprehensible. Joe was disjointed; nonetheless, he answered every question.

This Time

This pile on just robbed my country of one of the most experienced and seasoned hands we have and the chaos agents and chicken littles did it with the excuse of a bad first debate. I can remember some true humdingers from presidents in their first debates. I can remember much worse than President Biden’s performance in that very night from Mr. Trump.

Used to be common wisdom

Presidents have problems with first debates used to be one of those things the press called common wisdom. The MSM was very hard on Barack Obama for it. Absurdly critical the press was imho

Republican Earworms

This time a republican earworm worked its way into a lot of heads and caused us harm. If you don’t like those, check your own narrative. See how much it overlaps.

Joe Biden has rescued us from a mess he did not create

Our president has given us an opportunity to dig out of this morass caused by people stuck inside of the Republican frame by rallying around his VP quickly.

Let’s accept his offer

I suggest we take the lifeboat he has offered us gratefully and stop attacking him. This small act of gratitude might be the very least we can do to thank him for bringing us the best economic conditions most of us have ever seen.

[DontBelieveEastisEas]

37. This was about the fact that the overwhelming majority of everyday Dems wanted Biden to step aside. nt

[Wicked Blue]

123. I refuse to believe that

polls are useless

[GoreWon2000]

128. Is that why 14 million dems voted for him?

This is about blatant disenfranchisement by a few privileged mostly white anglo men wanting to get their faces on tv and their 15 minutes of fame. They've now acted just like the GOP SCOTUS in 2000.

[Sky Jewels]

47. The Democratic base was just not energized enough to defeat Trump.

Now, perhaps, it is.

[Desert grandma]

76. Maybe not.

Voting against the felon is one thing. That is a given. Being enthusiastic about it due to the way our primary nominee was treated, maybe not so much.

[Sky Jewels]

80. No, there is a spark and an energy and a fire now that didn't exist 24 hours ago.

It was definitely the thing that needed to be done if we are to have any chance of beating Donnie Fucko.

[Rstrstx]

97. Agree 100%

I love Joe and was hoping he could pull out of the spiral but the writing was on the wall, especially after the covid diagnosis. The campaign was killing him physically and his prospects of winning were dimming by the day. Every one of my friends and family who vote Democratic are wayyyyy relieved. One of them had even grown irate, borderline furious at Biden for staying in, saying he had no business running for President and that Trump was a shoe-in. They ALL breathed a sigh of relief after the news broke, and I admit I did too.

I think a few people are holding back 100% from endorsing Kamala right now just to make sure she shows us that she is up to the huge task at hand and can handle the incoming that has already started from the right. From what I’ve seen from her lately I see this certain swagger and confidence that she has found in herself and is more at ease, her time as VP has served her well and she seems to be vastly better as a candidate than she was in 2020. One or two good interviews with Rachel or on The View, someone who won’t try a hit job on her and she’s good. It’s not quite a coronation, more like a final interview, an “ok just show us you’re up for this and don’t buckle under pressure” and she’s got the job.

Plan B is going as planned, there is a big burst of enthusiasm that our side desperately needed, and if one of our own tries to sabotage it they had better have a DAMN good reason or forever face exile. She would have to stumble really badly before the convention and I don’t see that happening.

[GoreWon2000]

130. I totally disagree!

This election is a matter of life and death for women.

[Sky Jewels]

150. Well, of course it is!

Which is why we first and foremost need to make sure we WIN. Letting Trump win means death and suffering for all, but especially women and children. It was becoming ever more clear that Biden wasn't going to get us the W. I don't know why the threat of a Trump presidency wasn't enough to energize the base enough but it just wasn't this time. Kamala can harness the fury we women have about Roe and channel it into pro-choice victories up and down the ballot.

[Zambero]

62. The expectations were set very high for Joe

He would shine, hand Trump his ass, and put the age issue behind him once and for all.

It was a very hard fall. Ironically, Joe's poor performance was likely brought on by having worked his ass off in diplomatic circles for weeks, followed by exhaustive debate prep and an unfortunate viral infection.

We can be very grateful that President Biden thwarted Trump's re-election in 2020, then went on to enact key elements of an ambitious legislative agenda, Manchin and Sinema notwithstanding.

[Sky Jewels]

63. Yes.

I'm not saying any of this is fair. I'm just saying perception is everything when it comes to U.S. elections.

[Cha]

86. So Pres Biden had one Bad Debate and he Rallied the Next Day..

Last edited Mon Jul 22, 2024, 02:17 PM - Edit history (2)

So Many leaders Stood by the President Including AOC, Sen Sanders, , Hakeem Jeffie's, Gov Wes Moore, Gov Newsom, Gov Whitmer, Gov Hochul, Gov Josh Green, Jasmine Crockett, the Black Caucus, the Hispanic Caucus.

Sheila Jackson Lee on her last Day on Earth..

Link to tweet

Sec Pete Buttigieg stood by Pres Biden..

Pete Buttigieg went on national television and perfectly explained why Joe Biden should be the next president.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100219198079#top

And the Stay in mega Donors...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100219190483

Pres Biden isn't a tube of GD toothpaste.

I think he bowed out For Unity and Democracy. he's the Hero.

[Oopsie Daisy]

99. You explained it perfectly. Also...

I don't understand the grave-dancing that I keep seeing online and elsewhere. I'm obviously disappointed in these developments, but I'm ready to accept reality and move on and support our party's eventual nominee.

Still the presence of the "in your face" and "ha-haaa" (Nelson Muntz) taunts and trollish behavior of folks that I'd always presumed to be Democrats and allies, is disturbing and confusing to me. Why pour salt in the wounds? Why do/say things to create further division and ill-will? It's here, there, everywhere. Some of it is likely from troll farms, and bots. But there are others with names and presences and reputations that I've known/seen for quite a while... and their words and attitudes are a shock to me.

Whatever it is that they think they're doing, I can tell you that it's NOT helping matters.

[we can do it]

107. I absolutely hate the way our president was treated by some people here, but apparently that's ok.

Completely lacking respect for someone who has devoted his life to making our country a better place for all. I hate how those of us who continued to support him were told to instantly get over it. It doesn’t mean we don’t support Kamala, it means we care deeply about a kind person who has always been there for us and put us first who never deserved the backstabbing.

Biden wasn’t my first or second choice in 2020 primaries, it was both of the female senators who stood by him to the end. So don’t sit back there and those of us we need to get on board. We’ve been on board for a long time.

[Oopsie Daisy]

108. Amen!

[AkFemDem]

103. Just how much is President Biden supposed to give anyway??

He's already given almost the entirety of his life to this country. He was CLEARLY tired, his health has been declining as it does for everyone as they age- the man is 81 years old!! I'm gonna take this at face value, he said he was CHOOSING to drop out for the good of the country. Don't you think there is a part of him that's also CHOOSING to finally retire and enjoy a few years with his family while he still can?? He never wanted to run back in 2019 to begin with but was persuaded to jump in to save the country. He did his duty and it came at great personal expense. He was willing to stick around and give 4 more years- quite possibly his last 4 years on this planet, when he thought he was the best way to stave off the Trump agenda. Once it became clear this was going to be a much rougher race, he realized another candidate was appropriate and he decided to finally embrace the retirement he so richly deserves. It's selfish, imo, to insist he just keep working at the hardest job on the planet. Someone else will have to save the world this time, Joe needs a freaking break.

[PortTack]

141. Agree... if things were coming together where it appeared he could win, the Irish in him would have kept

Fighting. His political savvy would have weathered the storm against those that were publicly asking him to step down and it wouldn’t have mattered in the end.

I believe that ultimately this was his decision, and looking at the entire picture he decided as he said for the good of his country and party, he would not seek reelection because he believed he was not going to be able to secure a victory.

Why… all this time he has been nothing but straight forward and truthful to us, would he suddenly decide not to be?! Come on

[Wicked Blue]

158. It would sit better with me if Democratic leaders hadn't spent the past 3 weeks

trashing him.

[Voltaire2]

96. This.

[Jk23]

125. Everyone was angry with Jon Stewart on his comeback show

I thought he was wrong unfortunately after watching the debate I realized he wasn't.

I know there's people on here that argue if you read the transcripts of the debate Biden did fine but that's really not living in reality.

[displacedvermoter]

159. Thank God for the wisdom of Jon Stewart

And we also had Bill Maher for counsel, as well!

[Skittles]

165. yeah OK

[onecaliberal]

129. I hope you are never judged in your professional life based on one negative thing you did.

That historic economy Biden built was nothing….
Those 30 years of service, meant nothing.
You better hope no one uses your own measure of success against you.

[Yorkist]

8. To be fair...

…..the media just reported - as they should - on the major upheaval behind the scenes that the CNN debate triggered. There was no keeping a lid on it.

[LexVegas]

9. I'm ecstatic. Sorry you are so upset. nt

[GoreWon2000]

133. It's concerning that

you apparently favor the disenfranchisement of 14 million dem primary voters.

[Skittles]

10. how long will disillusionment posts be allowed

because they are doing us no favors

[BlueInPhilly]

24. This

Thanks Skittles.

[Self Esteem]

31. Stop it. It hasn't even been a full day since the backstabbers got their way and forced out Biden.

[Skittles]

33. DOES NOT MATTER

this boo hooing serves no useful purpose AT ALL

WE ARE FIGHTING FASCISM

[Self Esteem]

39. Your tone isn't helpful.

Dismissing people's emotions is not the smart play here, my friend. People have a right to be angry with how a lot of the elites treated Biden. Frustration won't just evaporate overnight and demanding we shut up won't win you favors, either.

[emulatorloo]

55. Priority One now is defeating Trump. We can do post game analysis after we kick Trump's ass to the curb.

[Self Esteem]

56. Yeah and telling people their frustration DOES NOT MATTER isn't helping do that.

[emulatorloo]

60. I'm very frustrated too. But I have more important stuff to do right now - DEFEATING TRUMP

We’ll deal w it later after we put Trump in the dumpster.

[Self Esteem]

77. What exactly are you doing at this moment to defeat Trump?

I'm not asking what you've done or plan to do tomorrow. What are you doing at this exact moment to defeat Trump? Posting on DU? Okay - well guess what? Dismissing peoples' feelings not even 24 hours after a pretty emotional event ain't going to help you defeat Trump.

If you want to defeat Trump, don't alienate those who are rightfully angry at this time. Give them a chance to vent and compartmentalize this ordeal. Yeesh.

[emulatorloo]

89. Do what you need to do at your own pace. And a slightly belated welcome to DU!

I think you’ll end up really liking it here.

[crimycarny]

142. +100

Agree completely! Just because people are hurt and angry over how Biden was treated (as I am) doesn't mean we're being "Debby Downers"--it's barely been 24 hours!

Joe Biden's WH reached out to me after the death of my son to suicide. I wrote to the WH pouring my heart out. That is the Joe Biden I'm thinking of right now. This had to have broken his heart.

I'm relieved for President Biden that he will no longer have to fight with one hand tied behind his back and his own party is some of those throwing those punches.

I can be upset at seeing a kind, decent, honorable human being who has already suffered so much loss in his life having to suffer another heartbreak. President Biden will pick himself up, but I know that he must be suffering right now.

[Skittles]

69. *I* do not expect to be coddled

we are FIGHTING FASCISM - ENOUGH ALREADY

[Self Esteem]

74. And you will need as many allies as possible.

Dismissing peoples' emotions out of hand is not going to win you jack shit.

[Skittles]

75. once again, we are FIGHTING FASCISM

PUT YOUR FEELINGS ASIDE

*DONE HERE*

[Self Esteem]

78. And your attitude isn't helping.

So, good luck.

[PortTack]

144. Exactly..and thank you for voicing the truth of things.

[Cha]

88. Exactly.. Not "helpful" at all. Just the Opposite.

[displacedvermoter]

79. Are you for real?

People are still coming to grips with an historic moment in US history -- the forced decision by a sitting US President to abandon a run for reelection, with the necessary delegate count in hand for the nomination -- and less than twelve hours later you are talking about loyal party members "boo hooing". I really don't know if you believe this will convince people to overlook what many feel is a betrayal, or if you are another person on the site who just doesn't give a shit about the human feelings of the people you want to go out and fight fascism with you.

At least another poster on the site was gracious enough to offer those of us who are really pissed off a day to vent -- I countered that perhaps two days might be nice as the Biden bashers had three weeks to fling poo -- as opposed to you who want a ban on disillusionment starting right now.

The floggings will continue until morale improves...

[PortTack]

145. Why are you overlooking the fact that President Biden ultimately made this decision because he felt he couldn't win?

So he dropped out, as he said…for the good of the country and his party.

We are all sad..enough!

[DontBelieveEastisEas]

40. Calling it "backstabbers" is not fair. nt

[Self Esteem]

41. I agree. It's much worse than that but I don't want to get banned.

[GoreWon2000]

135. Sorry but it's fair because these

backstabbers have now disenfranchised 14 million dem party primary voters with their copying of 2000 GOP SCOTUS.

[newdayneeded]

111. Maybe you can consider

the option of Biden himself realized he doesn't have the strength. Do you really think he himself didn't know he was getting weaker, and seriously worried about 4 1/2 more years of presidency? Please stop pretending Joe could jog up stairs like 4 years ago. Even he knew it was hard for him to board air force 1.

[lees1975]

53. Cut off legitimate expressions of grief and disgust with the way things were done just like the votes of the people

were cut off and trashed.

No favors were done by the rich oligarchs who kept pushing for this and manipulated it until it happened. There's going to be huge disillusionment around here on November 6th, if this manner of doing things doesn't get resolved pretty quickly. If you have any interest at all in getting this party to the point where it might be possible to win, then stop complaining about people who have a different opinion than you.

[Skittles]

87. yeah WE GET IT

we are also aware WE ARE FIGHTING FASCISM

ENOUGH ALREADY

[displacedvermoter]

100. What do you get?

Could you articulate it in something like a thoughtful way, perhaps without using caps?

[Wicked Blue]

113. I agree, we are fighting the nightmare of fascism

and that's the overwhelming issue. VP Harris will get my vote, without question.

Frankly I will vote for anyone with a D after their name - even a yellow dog - before I'd vote for a Republican, especially the convicted felon.

However I also dislike the potential of a system run by the wealthy riding roughshod over ordinary people. That's what got my back up over this. I hate when big donors with big money get together and decide that they know better than the millions of loyal Democrats who voted for President Biden in the primaries. If that debate had gone perfectly, they would have pounced on some other misstep as a rationale.

Maybe President Biden couldn't have handled the rigor of the campaign. I am not his physician. I can't predict the future. But it was wrong, and mean, for some party leaders and the media to drag him down in public in recent weeks. He deserves better. And I feel they now owe it to him to do something to make up for their ill-treatment. Because he is still our president, and will be our president until next January. And because he is the best, the greatest president in my lifetime.

[Skittles]

163. the Supreme Court decided that big money will run elections

and until we get the votes and the dynamic to change the Supreme Court, THAT is how it is

[Cha]

94. Don't you just love anyone telling you what to do

on Political Discussion board like they have any idea what others are going through?

[Wicked Blue]

114. ...

[Cha]

157. Aww

Mahalo, Wicked Blue

I may have needed that.

Aloha

[PortTack]

143. I'm asking the same thing. President Biden felt he couldn't win...why are so many fighting that? Sad indeed,

But the right move on his part. Let’s honor that!

[lapfog_1]

153. This!

[BannonsLiver]

11. ...

[usonian]

19. Typing fast to beat the post removal.

Joe will make out great. Better than taking abuse from scum and trolls. So will we.

Venceremos

[angrychair]

21. I get it. I understand

That said it just something we have to just put behind us and move forward to help VP Harris. All that matters is defeating TSF.

[BluenFLA]

23. They should remember what happened with Trump in 2016

Remember when the Access Hollywood tape came out a month or so before the election? Everyone thought this was it for him. Some Reps withdrew their endorsements while others called for him to drop out.

The polls were bad for him too and it looked like Hillary had it in the bag.

But that monster refused to step aside and the Reps were determined to beat Hillary and stuck with him and he wound up beating her.

Maybe the same thing would have happened with Biden and he had the advantage of time compared to Trump's situation in '16. We'll never know. Let's hope Harris is able to beat Trump.

[Skittles]

29. Comey talked nonsense about Hillary's emails

knowing full well Trump was under investigation for his ties to Russia

and Hillary STILL got three million more votes

SHE WAS CHEATED

that is what Trump does - he LIES, HE CHEATS, HE STEALS

[Deminpenn]

81. Sorry, but she ran a terrible campaign

I saw it right here in Pennsylvania. I went to her post-convention rally in Pgh. Fetterman. mayor of Braddock at the time, Mark Cuban and few others tried hard to rile up the crowd for her, but it was kind of a muted event probably because she arrived quite a bit past the advertized starting time and she's not really a good campaign stump speaker.

Her campaign assumed if she just ran a lot of TV ads and won big in Allegheny county and in Phila/SE Pa, she'd win. She did no campaigning in the wide swath of red Pennsylvania. She just ceded the narrative to Trump. Had she gone to a few of the larger red counties and held a series of small group meetings, where she really shines, she might have won over voters who would have given their friends and neighbors a glowing report about her. She might have won our state instead of losing it.

[Skittles]

85. if she ran a bad campaign

she would have lost the popular vote too

OVER AND OUT

[Deminpenn]

101. She ran a bad campaign in Pennsylvania

whether you want to believe it or not. If she'd run a smarter campaign here, she'd have won. We don't elect presidents based on the national population vote so that argument is irrelevant.

[Jk23]

138. The popular vote doesn't matter

The football game is not won by the team with the most yards it's one by the team with the most points.

It's not like Hillary's team was unaware of the rules.

[Jk23]

137. Trump is a cheater and a liar

But Hillary lost that one all on her own.

[Self Esteem]

35. I've thought about this.

Had Republicans who initially called for Trump to stand down gotten their way, they probably lose the 2016 election. No chance does Pence inspire confidence and rally the troops. It would have been a Clinton romp. The only reason Republicans managed to win was because Trump weathered the storm - and did so with a chunk of the party behind him.

The only difference is that at least there's time and a convention to rally everyone around Harris.

[planj07]

28. It's about the voters

Many aren’t thinking about it much deeper than “this guy is old” and take their opinion from TikTok or YouTube clips that show him looking lost or mixing up names.

[Sky Jewels]

52. Exactly.

It reminds me of the 2000 election, and all the morons who wanted to "have a beer" with Dubya. Tens and tens and tens of millions of Americans are just abjectly fucking stupid, religious, ignorant, and uninformed. Sad but true. That's just the reality we're dealing with.

[Jk23]

139. You're not wrong especially about young voters

But the debate had really good ratings and very few people came away from that debate thinking Biden was good for another 4 years despite how horrible his opponent it might be.

[pwb]

30. I thought your lead in was about trump and 2025. I think

this could have been planed all along. Joe knows how to do things.IMO.

[Skittles]

71. and that's another thing that needs to stop

seriously, no, this wasn't some fucking CHESS GAME

[regnaD kciN]

34. It was absolutely a massive failure on our party's part...

The fact is, Biden could have weathered the poor debate performance easily, except for the drip...drip...drip of Congresscritters and celebrities calling for him to step down. When that becomes a news story every day, you have no chance.

But that was then, and this was now. The only way we can prevent that massive failure from turning into a final catastrophic one is by uniting behind Kamala Harris and defeating Trump once and for all.

[meadowlander]

36. They tried that and no amount of gaslighting people that they didn't see what they saw at the debates

and subsequent interviews was going to move the needle with voters in the swing states. They'd already been saying for months that they thought he was too old and they just wanted another option. The debate was supposed to assuage concerns that were already resulting in Joe trailing despite running against the weakest candidate in the history of candidates.

You can have the greatest marketing campaign in the world but if people just don't like the taste of New Coke, then they aren't going to buy it.

If there was a failure, it was in not having a robust primary process in the first place but even if we had, circumstances change and we need to be able to be responsive to them. A year ago, it seemed like Joe was up for it. The presidency ages people fast and the majority of people post-debate didn't think he was up for it. There's no way to turn that around because Joe isn't getting younger and clearly wasn't up to the kind of round the clock, four rallies a day in different states campaigning necessary. No more meetings after 8pm? Come on.

[Silent Type]

42. Remember hoping to watch Biden smoke TSF in debate, or at least hold his own. He tried, he was right, trump lied, but

the optics were horrible and in my estimation devastating to campaign. I was in shock.

Give Biden kudos for getting up the next day going to rallies, scheduling interviews, press conferences, etc. He upped the game. But I think he was struggling. I’m almost his age, and it’s painful to say that.

But by golly, I think he saved his best for today. And he’ll still be there during campaign, through January 2025, and afterwards. I’m extremely hopeful and appreciative for Biden. Looking forward to memoirs.

[Wicked Blue]

115. He also had a cold, or possibly the beginnings of Covid

I'm not going to write our greatest president off as a tired old geezer just because of that debate. I feel the continuing drumbeat of too old, too feeble is a huge disservice.

[still-prayin4rain]

46. Biden is a smart, tremendous leader and he is behind Harris for President. nt

[PortTack]

149. And this is what really matters!

[BootinUp]

50. Unfortunately true. nt

[emulatorloo]

51. It is what it is. Time to help VP Harris defeat Trump. Number one priority right now.

We can do post game analysis once Trump’s vanquished.

[RockRaven]

58. Yeah. Leave the grand plan stuff to Alex Jones, et al.

[relayerbob]

59. He was indeed forced out, and we will remember

But for now, we need to win, or there won't be any point to "remembering".

I have very mixed emotions, pissed off at what they did to Joe, admiration for all he's achieved, but ecstatic at the response that Kamala has gotten so far. Let the past be the past, and let's move forward. Come 2026 and going forward, we'll know who to forcibly retire from office.

[valleyrogue]

66. Egged on by certain individuals who have "pull" with donors.

This is one of the most shameful displays of betrayal, not just of our president, but of the voters, that I have ever seen.

[spanone]

70. Doesn't matter now. Joe's not running.

[Metaphorical]

73. There were several key extenuating circumstances here

1. I think there were very few people on our side that wanted Biden to drop out for ulterior reasons, but enough people who came into regular contact with him were uneasy about his growing frailness and the more consistent senior moments. I remember seeing him in an interview with the UK Labour PM, and he looked frail then.
2. I think that Biden did not want to make a decision until after the RNC Convention. Note that his decision was not to resign the presidency, but rather to drop out of the race. This was a hard decision, but I think the main concern was that he didn't have the energy to consistently both BE president and RUN FOR president.
3. Also keep in mind that he wanted Trump to commit to a platform, and there was a lot of hope that Vance would be the VP nominee. This meant that Biden had to keep the possibility that he would continue to run in Trump's mind. (I have no doubt that Biden's strategic sense is still finely tuned).

Could they have handled it better? Arguably, yes, especially at the Democratic leadership level, and no, this outcome is far from ideal, but that's politics.

[GoreWon2000]

82. Too many Congressional dems a disaster just like in 2000 by

putting their self interests ahead of defending voting rights.

[IbogaProject]

83. I was a vigorous supoorter, however now...

We have to put this armchair quarterbaking aside and get our candidate elected! Let's just focus on assembling our ticket, Harris + __________, and then campaigning.

[Eyeball_Kid]

84. Silk purse/sow's ear. n/t

[ColinC]

102. As far as "failures" go, this could have turned out much worse

FWIW

[Doodley]

106. I get what you are saying.

[displacedvermoter]

162. I guess we will know how much worse (or hopefully better) it gets come November

I am hoping that the Harris/? ticket does as advertised. It certainly has generated campaign donations, which according to many here is the be all and end all of the exercise.

[Doodley]

104. Beating fascism is more important than any one person. We are in a stronger position now. We have to move forward.

[JCMach1]

109. It had gone well behind stuttering and 'senior' moments

To what sounds like a very real speech aphasia (can be a number of causes).

However, it looks extremely bad when communicating, especially on video. Video is hard enough when you are 110% focused on nailing it.

[Wicked Blue]

124. Okay, so the next time you're exhausted and have a bad cold

should you be armchair-diagnosed as over the hill?

[JCMach1]

151. My point is the cause really wasn't important here...

Aphasia is bad in a media dominated environment.

Moot point now anyways as Biden found it significant enough to bow out as well.

[Wicked Blue]

154. I'm sorry, but I must have missed that diagnosis

Who was the physician that officially diagnosed Presiden Biden with aphasia?

[JCMach1]

155. Not a doctor, but what has been described since he stepped down

Is classic aphasia.

Once again multiple reports from those people he has been around and worked with in recent months.

[Zeitghost]

116. Thge massive failure

Was him deciding to run for re-election in the first place. Now instead of a candidate coming out of the primaries, were forced to go through this mess. The writing has been on the wall for a long, long time. This was inevitable and could have been dealt with easily.

[edisdead]

117. Yep.

People here screaming “It was his decision” are super insulting. As though I am supposed to completely ignore what took place for three weeks (and linger in some cases).

We are beholden to money and people here are applauding it.

[PortTack]

148. It was his decision...he as much as said so when he said for the good of the country and his party

The Irish in him would have never let him quit if he felt he could deliver a victory…he obviously didn’t think he could.

Call it insulting if you want. I highly doubt your president would agree with you.

[Sky Jewels]

156. The number one motivator? Defeating Trump.

Preventing that motherfucker from setting foot in the White House ever again is the alpha and the omega.

It became clear over the last month that Biden wasn't on track to do that. Yeah, it's a shame, but that was the reality. We were headed for a shellacking with him at the top of the ticket.

That has now changed drastically.

[Goodheart]

119. Time for unity. Time to stop publicly crying that Biden is not our candidate.

It's KAMALA time!

[Sympthsical]

136. It was neither planned nor a failure

The cat herding skills on display in the last 24 hours is just . . . is this my Democratic Party? We're usually so all over the place, but the past day was so streamlined, organized, and efficient, German automakers somewhere are studying it.

I hate the penchant people have to see "plans" in various things. If things work out, "There was a secret plan! Look at all these chess moves!"

I think it undersells what people with skills and talent can accomplish when the unexpected or unwanted occur. When circumstances change or chaos threatens to break out, watching someone adjust on their feet with agility, flexibility, and snap-judgement skills can be a beautiful thing to behold.

The situation was a mess, and leadership (and many others, no doubt) just pulled the loveliest rabbit out of a hat.

That was an insanely hard job, one that they so far seem to have pulled off. They deserve a lot of credit, because being willing to understand adjustments need to be made, courses changed, and conditions finessed takes a lot of skill. It's difficult to see how this wasn't a success. And hopefully we can put that judgement concretely to bed in November.

[somaticexperiencing]

127. when i personally find myself in the shoulda, coulda, woulda in anything about myself, about life, what

i like to say is...

do it now!

now is the only time we really have, isn't it?
the past is gone.
the future not guaranteed and a mystery.

could we devote ourselves to the things that really matter right now?

not to say that mourning and so forth is not also a process of taking the past and processing it.

wishing you peace over this
wishing us victory in the Fall.
may we all come together to celebrate and grieve and fight together.

my heart does go out to you and I have had and been having the same feelings as you.
and for now I'm personally devoted to seeing that we win in the Fall
no matter what!

[claudette]

132. To be honest

President Biden lately has seemed so weak. With COVID creeping up too. I was afraid he would collapse. That’s how scared I was. I’m kind of relieved that he will have the time to relax and get well 100%.

I love ❤️ President Biden. And I hope this post does not get removed.

[PortTack]

146. Same....As much as I didn't want to see it...very sad

[claudette]

147. I know

It actually hurt me physically to see him struggle. I ❤️ him. Reminds me of my Dad.

[tavernier]

134. Whatever.

It’s over now. We vote for the name in blue.

[Chakaconcarne]

140. Unless you're a DC insider, I don't think you really know, do you?

I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that discussions were happening a few months ago..

Perhaps Joe is relieved?

If it were a massive failure, we wouldn't be $eeing the rally around Harris... She has stolen media attention away from the RNC and TSF... She will invigorate the younger vote and rally women on both sides...independents.... TSF won't debate her and any VP she chooses will get a refusal to debate from Vance.... From here til November, the media would have been hammering on Joe's age every which way 'til Sunday... And we would be on the defensive.

As unfortunate as this is... we will be in a better place. There is absolutely no doubt about that. I think we will find in a month months that this was the best decision...and we might understand everything we witnessed leading up to it.

[D23MIURG23]

164. The mass public pants-shitting over a bad debate was terrible form.

Harris has some advantages - it's nice that Trump is now the older candidate by far, and she's close enough to Biden that we might still get some incumbency advantage.

What isn't advantageous is the validation of RW talking points about Biden being unfit for office, and the fact that all of this came about (seemingly) over a relatively minor debate fail.

I think we can win with Harris, but we definitely won't win if all of her surrogates drop a load in their pants the first time she has a gaffe and start frantically looking for a replacement. Nobody is perfect. The right WILL find effective lines of attack against her, and the party will have to close ranks and fight back next time.

We've been fortunate that this is mostly being framed in our favor... Joe Biden makes a huge sacrifice in an unassailable act of patriotism, and a next generation politician takes the field against Trump.

But what lead up to it looked to me like an awful display of cowardice and disunity, and the fact that it was rewarded gives me pause.