I owe George Clooney and his wonderful Amal an apology.

[Eliot Rosewater]

I was angry at them when they talked about Joe stepping down and revealing more than I thought they had to, and I even suspected they had ulterior motives having to do with Joe's unwillingness to see NitwitNetay boy arrested.

But I was wrong on all accounts.

And I just heard the story of how he gave all of his close friends a check for a million dollars and paid the tax on it (I think if you give money you have to pay the tax as the giver, that is how it works.)

Anyway, my bad!

[SocialDemocrat61]

1. Has he endorsed Harris yet?

[Eliot Rosewater]

2. Seems so

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/video/george-clooney-endorses-kamala-harris-after-calling-biden-drop-out-2024-race/

[Irish_Dem]

3. I disagree.

He made a very difficult situation worse with his comments.
He appeared high handed, intrusive and having a hidden agenda.

If Pelosi asked him to make the statement, it was the only mistake in
a flawless plan.

If she didn't ask him to make the statement, he spoke out of turn
and was inappropriate in an ego driven way.

Pelosi was dealing with extremely difficult, sensitive, complicated plans
and she didn't need people jumping in just to get attention.

[Skittles]

5. I think it was the time factor

it needed to be done quickly and it was indeed the right decision - I'm betting Pelosi did not ask him but she did know about it.....

[Irish_Dem]

7. Yes Pelosi make the right decision and time was of the essence.

I agree, I don't think Pelosi asked Clooney to make the statement.

I don't know if she appreciated the support or if she thought things
were getting out of control.

[Skittles]

9. I think there was simply a lot of resistance from Biden

people keep talking about bravery but I think he was cornered

[Irish_Dem]

13. Exactly.

Pelosi had a flawless Plan B in place.
Planned to the smallest detail.
Everything lined up.

Biden was the fly in the ointment and took longer to get onboard.

Pelosi was the last person Biden talked to before he made the announcement.
Oh to be a fly on the wall.

Whatever she said, he knew then it was over.

PS. Skittles how long do you think Nancy and the rest of her team
had the plan in place? I am not sure about the timeline.

[Skittles]

19. I don't think there was any long-term plan

Last edited Sat Aug 17, 2024, 04:30 PM - Edit history (1)

I think think there was concern and the debate performance was the last straw.

[Irish_Dem]

21. The plan roll out was flawless.

So there had to be a plan.

So many obvious facts point to a plan.

Kamala hit the ground running.
Was a lackluster speaker and then was pure magic.
There was some prep there and warning of what was to come.

I estimate at least six months lead up time.

Oh yes the concern had to be there prior to the debate.
You don't oust a sitting president from your own party on a whim
or one bad performance.

And you don't oust him without a good plan in place.
Or you are just making things much worse.

[LisaL]

22. And they could have made it worse.

I don't think they had a "master" plan. But if it makes people think so to feel better, so be it.

[brush]

51. There must have been a worse-scenario, back-up plan that had to be put...

into effect after the disastrous debate. Speaker Emerita Pelosi, who thinks of everything, initiated the plan and VP Harris did a splendid job and was prepared to roll it out flawlessly.

Think what a president Ms Pelosi would've made. She was ahead of her time, as being even a senator of governor, much less the president, was not a pathway women could pursue when she started her political career. Hell, she started late after raising her family, when being Congresswoman was a huge accomplishment.

[Skittles]

25. she had to be ready

if only simply because of his age

[Irish_Dem]

32. Assuming the office is one thing.

Running a make it or break it presidential campaign is an entirely different kettle of fish.

Nancy Pelosi is a true political genius, beyond anything we have seen in our lifetime.

I knew she was good, but did not fully appreciate her acumen until recently when
it became apparent she was the architect of what we are now seeing on a daily basis.

It is simply astounding.

None of it is an accident or happenstance.

[LisaL]

34. And Nancy wasn't advocating for Harris to take over.

And certainly wasn't preparing Harris how to take over. You give Nancy credit for something she didn't do.

[Skittles]

39. I'm not saying there were NO plans

it simply ridiculous, the long-term nth dimensional chess game some people are imagining

*edited previous comment to specify long-term

[LisaL]

41. I think it was Joe's (and Kamala's) plan to have Kamala take over if things

(like the debate) didn't go well for Joe.
Given Joe's age, having a plan B seems to make sense.

[malaise]

57. THIS

She was able to,pull,this off because she herself stepped down for a yoinger generation. The party is always bigger than any personality.

[Tadpole Raisin]

27. I'm guessing there was concern prior to the debate and that the only

plan was to offer a debate before the convention. If Biden aced it people could relax a little bit.

If he did poorly, it would be time to have a talk and the option of stepping back would be available.

If they had scheduled a debate after the convention (isn’t that the norm?) and he did poorly there wouldn’t be much they could do. The states would already have the nominees and no changes could be made that wouldn’t cause chaos and lawsuits.

So I think the only ‘plan’ was to have an early debate and adjust accordingly.

[Irish_Dem]

35. I disagree.

Even a rookie politician knows you cannot ask a sitting president from your own party
to resign unless you have a plan B in place.

To do this without a plan is pure madness and stupidity.

And I assure you, Pelosi, Schumer, Raskin, Schiff are not stupid or crazy.

Yes of course, the early debate was part of the plan.

[Tadpole Raisin]

42. I think we mostly agree - they would have to roughly play out

scenarios if the debate went south as it did, but given the timeframe between the debate and his making an announcement there was probably a lot of jockeying going on as to how to move forward.

And if there was a desire to have an open convention to try to nominate someone else I’d be hard pressed to believe Biden wouldn’t have had a say in it, resisting the idea and supporting Kamala instead.

Oh to be a fly on the wall for those discussions! I only hope when the book comes out I’m still alive to read it!

For now, all I know for sure is we have a killer team and Biden has been one of the best presidents I have had, doing more in 4 years with a wreck of an economy handed to him. With an experienced and steady hand he brought the country back to be the best in the world post Covid.

Sheesh I’m starting to sound like a tv ad.

[jrthin]

49. Their plan B was an open convention.

[emulatorloo]

70. And a chaotic 'mini-primary.' Hat tip to Joe Biden for immediately throwing his weight behind Harris.

Endorsing her the minute he withdrew.

[LisaL]

20. Pelosi was the last person to talk to Biden before the announcement?

That's news to me. If you listen to her, she claims she called no one.

[jrthin]

26. As I understand it Nancy wanted an open convention, she did not want

Kamala. Biden bargained for Kamala. If Nancy's plan had worked we would be screwed. There wouldn't be a candidate until the convention. Let's not make a full hero out of Nancy.

[LisaL]

29. That's my understanding as well.

If that plan worked, we would still have no candidate, since I don't think we could have an open convention via zoom.
We would have missed OH deadline and wouldn't even be on the ballot in OH. New candidate would have to start from scratch (no access to Biden/Harris campaign money) with very little time till the election. That doesn't sound like a brilliant plan to me.

[BannonsLiver]

46. It's okay to take the L sometimes.

No shame in it. We’re all wrong about something at some point.

[Irish_Dem]

40. I disagree.

Biden was bargaining for himself until the end.

Pelosi would never have asked Biden to step down without his replacement
firmy selected.

Kamala looks to me to have known at least several months in advance.

You simply cannot ask a sitting president from your own party to step down
without a plan in place. Otherwise it is sheer madness.

Pelosi, Schumer, Raskin, Schiff are neither foolish nor crazy.

I think people cannot wrap their heads around how this went down.

It was brilliant and the right move.

Pelosi is the best kind of hero. Makes it all happen behind the scenes.
Gets no glory but a lot of heat and punches.
Takes all the grief because she knows she is doing what is best for the country.

I never realized how smart and heroic she is, and what guts she has.

[LisaL]

44. I haven't seen any evidence to support these ideas.

None. They (people you are mentioning in your post) were asking Biden to step down, but were not saying Harris is an obvious choice to replace him.
I don't see the need to re-write history.
If Harris was an obvious choice in their minds, they could have simply said so.

[emulatorloo]

68. ++++++

[emulatorloo]

69. We have Kamala because Joe immediately endorsed her.

Pelosi et al seemed to want a mini-primary/open convention.

We have Joe and Kamala to thank for this smooth transition.

[MLAA]

60. I bet you are right.

[CTyankee]

6. who said "Politics Ain't Beanball"?

Sharp elbows everywhere...and Hollywood, well...

[EastBayGuy]

8. and I agree with you. I despise the rich, white, and elite when they tell the government what to do and that we

must listen to what they think. Only we the voters have that right.

[Irish_Dem]

11. Yes voters and information from high level Dem elected officials.

We needed to hear from Pelosi, Schumer, Raskin, Schiff.

And we did hear from them, one by one.

Comments from the Hollywood Peanut Gallery were not appreciated.

[Kaleva]

23. You think Biden should have stayed in?

The voters did weigh in. Public support for Biden was tepid at best. Compare that to what we see today. Surge in small donors, thousands volunteering, long lines to get in to packed venues.

In the primates, we loyal Democrats didn't have many options to choose from.

[displacedvermoter]

28. The results could have been much different

if the "mini primaries" idea had come to fruition. "Loyal Democrats" could have spilled blood all over the TV screens to the delight of the media and the GOP.

And the results of the sctual primaries, where the voters did actually "weigh in" indicated overwhelming, not tepid, support for the President.

Things have turned out well, but not because of anything George Clooney did, though to give credit he helped raise a shit ton of money, for President Biden, who was clearly attracting a large amount of donor dollars not that long ago.

[Kaleva]

52. Biden ran essentially unopposed

[displacedvermoter]

61. Incumbents usually do

[Kaleva]

67. So just one choice in the ballot doesn't indicate overwhelming support

Look at the difference in enthusiasm for Harris compared to Biden

[tanyev]

14. Yes. Just because it appears to have turned out well doesn't mean it was well done.

There was significant risk of it turning out very badly.

[Irish_Dem]

17. We can see the plan roll out was almost flawless.

It could not have been more perfect except for one problem which worked out OK in the end.

This could only have been done with an excellent plan in place.

But yes of course there was risk involved.

Apparently Pelosi thought the risk was worth it.
The stakes could not be higher and she had no choice.

[Kaleva]

24. It wasn't looking good before that

I had resigned myself to the possibility that Trump had a very good chance of winning and that was before the debate

[moonscape]

50. I hadn't resigned, but was

distraught, depressed, fearful I would live out my remaining years under fascism. My hope was that the debate would energize, the Menace take a tumble, and was excited to watch it I was so convinced.

Turned it off after 5 minutes because it was too painful. I was staunchly behind Joe because apart from loving him as our president, believing he was not too old to govern only to campaign effectively, I thought it insanity to try and change horses so late in the game.

Boy was I wrong, and never happier to be.

[Kaleva]

53. +1

[democratsruletheday]

45. Tend to agree with you I_D....

it was a selfish, grand standing move and the thing is.....unnecessary too. Don't hate the guy but he overstepped there

[Tarheel_Dem]

47. I couldn't agree more. F**k him & his spouse. And that goes for the Disney lady as well. n/t

[ecstatic]

55. His comments were part of the perfect storm that was needed for us to change

That 3 week period that began after the debate was an emotional and chaotic time but all of the events that occurred during that time radically shifted our perceptions and ideas about what was possible.

Before July 1, many of us were concerned that a woman probably could not win the election. Especially a black woman.

I think that the defections from Clooney and others that many here considered horrible at the time is what was needed to bring us to the point of sheer panic and terror, which also had the effect of opening our minds and uniting us as soon as a way forward was presented.

Had the situation unfolded in any other way, I don't think we'd be here right now.

[MLAA]

4. I was hard on him also. They were right. I wish it had been a far more private approach, but we are here in

an excellent position. So I was wrong as well. President Biden is still the best president in my adulthood by far.

[displacedvermoter]

12. You weren't wrong, though it has turned out well because serious

people, and not movie stars, took over the situation. The popular idea in the Carville circle of a made-for-TV mini primary didn't happen. That would have been a divisive disaster.

People like AOC pointed out immediately that folks who wanted Biden gone were also none-to-pleased with Harris, and the notion of dumping her galvanized her support among women, the black and brown communities, and progressive labor. And in the end, the VP turned out to be a natural to step into the President's very large shoes.

If the original people -- like Clooney apparently -- behind the movement to replace President Biden had gone with their original plan, things would have or certainly could have gone much differently.

So keep that in mind as time passes and certain people try to revise events.

[LisaL]

16. Yep.

Many of these people wanted to replace the whole ticket. We could still be without the candidate if their plan actually worked.

[SharonClark]

54. How do you know that there weren't

multiple attempts to talk with Biden in private?

I heard a report on PBS last week that said Biden did not see himself as slowing down and being a weak compaigner. His inability to assess his situation accurately and honestly was part of the problem. His staff propping him up was another problem.

That said, I’m so grateful for the timing of Joe’s decision, the unity behind Kamala, Kamala’s successful rollout, and the selection of Walz. They are winners all.

[DontBelieveEastisEas]

10. I love him for it, and would have not have had the character to do it myself. nt

[Johonny]

15. Screw him.

Rich bastard forcing his candidate on the people. He's everything wrong with this country. College drop out with money cam boss us around. Disgusting.

[GoCubsGo]

36. Yup, he's dead to me.

And, I used to love the guy. Not any more.

[newdeal2]

18. He took some low blows

He basically hinted that Biden had some sort of medical condition. Both untrue and very damaging - imagine walking that back if Biden was the nominee?

[displacedvermoter]

30. It would have been the kind of thing the Trump

campaign would have regurgitated endlessly till November. And folks like Clooney could then smuggly say, "we told you so!" come Election Day.

[macwriter]

37. Totally Agree

The behind the scenes story about Joe being out of it at a fund raiser was really low. To quote the Coach: he should have minded his own business.
And that has certainly contributed to the narrative that continues that Joe has dementia that many talking heads say as an aside as they praise Kamala. They don't have to tear him down while they praise her. Remarks like, "Well he wasn't capable enough to serve another term," etc. really irk me. He stepped aside, he didn't say he couldn't serve.

She can be a winner without him being diminished. He's great, she's great. Both can be true.

[MerrilyMerrily]

38. Exactly

Clooney scheduled the fundraiser so that Biden would have to fly directly to California from Italy following the last events of the summit. The California event began at 4:45 AM Rome time. To send the NYT an op-ed lamenting that Biden was worn-out, frail, dazed - I was SO angry.

Moderator Jimmy Kimmel, co-host Julia Roberts, and attendee Stephanie Miller all thought Biden seemed fine despite the ridiculously long hard day. Don't they count?

If Biden needed Obama's arm to leave the stage, maybe ten hours on a plane and the fact that it was 8 AM Rome time by then explains that? Please. I'd be beyond exhausted and stiff as a board myself, and I don't suffer from numbness in one foot.

Let's not rewrite history because Clooney's asshole-ishness did not cause permanent destruction after all. It could have, and he should be ashamed. So should anyone who encouraged him to do it hoping to push Biden out.

[ecstatic]

58. That makes me think everything was coordinated

You're not going to critically wound the only person standing in between the White House and tRump.

[Sewa]

31. George Clooney is an American hero

He put country first, above his professional and personal interests. What a MAN!

[LisaL]

33. Hah?

[BannonsLiver]

43. Good post. Seems like some others still have some hurt feels.

[SharonClark]

56. And misplaced anger.

[rickford66]

48. And paying the tax is a gift.

There's no tax for less than a million (this may have changed since I looked it up). The giver keeps tract of gifts given to each person until a million is reached and then pays the tax on the accumulated gifts for a particular person when the total is greater than one million. I've had arguments about this a few times and won. Most people haven't read the code.

[Mosby]

59. How did he pay the tax, when the gift was cash?

In a suitcase?

Whole thing seems a little urban legendly.

[rickford66]

63. You can pay the IRS with check, credit or debit. I'm pretty sure cash won't be accepted.

In the past irate taxpayers tried to pay with cents. I believe the courts ruled that coins over a certain amount may not be accepted to pay a debt. I'm not sure about bills.

[Mosby]

64. He paid his friends with a suitcase filled with cash.

How does he pay the tax on that? Did they all leave their accountants name and number with his personal assistant?

[Srkdqltr]

62. I think ... this was all setup. A risk? Of course. Biden and all (whoever all were) played it well.

I think he knew he should not continue, the oomph was not there.
He had to know that a younger person was needed.
Fortunately he had Harris, and she had Walz. They drew it out and pulled the pin at the right time.
There will be a movie 🎬 or documentary at some time in the near future.
They all were in on it and did their parts perfectly.
Think about the debate, how badly he did then and was awesome the next day.
Maybe not exactly but close. Hopefully good to the end.
And they were NEVER going to let on to all the folks who are still hurt now.
Get over it or not. Fingers crossed until November.

[Eliot Rosewater]

65. I say do WHATEVER it takes to stop fascism.

[Srkdqltr]

66. whatever it takes.

[vanlassie]

72. Do you think they held off until Trump

cemented himself with Vance?

[Srkdqltr]

73. Could be. More likely timed before the convention but not too far before.

I have absolutely no inside information, just makes a certain sense.

[LiberalFighter]

71. He should have kept his mouth shut

and let the DNC committee handle it