Muslim Americans moving to Jill Stein in potential blow to Kamala Harris

[Coventina]

WASHINGTON, Sept 19 (Reuters) - Arab-American and Muslim voters angry at U.S. support for Israel's offensive in Gaza are shunning Democrat Kamala Harris in the presidential race to back third-party candidate Jill Stein in numbers that could deny Harris victories in battleground states that will decide the Nov. 5 election.

A Council on American-Islamic Relations data released this month based on a late August poll showed that in Michigan, home to a large Arab American community, 40% of Muslim voters backed the Green Party's Stein. Republican candidate Donald Trump got 18% with Harris, who is President Joe Biden's vice president, trailing at 12%.

Stein also leads Harris among Muslims in Arizona and Wisconsin, battleground states with sizable Muslim populations where Biden defeated Trump in 2020 by slim margins.

Harris was the leading pick of Muslim voters in Georgia and Pennsylvania, while Trump prevailed in Nevada with 27%, just ahead of Harris' 26%, according to the CAIR poll of 1,155 Muslim voters nationwide. All are battleground states that have swung on narrow margins in recent elections.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/muslim-americans-moving-jill-stein-potential-blow-kamala-harris-2024-09-19/

**************************************************************************************************************

Do these fucking idiots realize that handing Trump the victory will be a disaster for their cause?

[leftstreet]

1. Not sure it helps suggesting it's just a "cause."

We should all be anti war and anti slaughter

You're right to question the method of getting there

[Demsrule86]

45. Helping Trump win is so much better. Fuck them. I dislike the protests which I think benefits Hamas

and prolongs the war. Please note that every politician save those in one state lost their primary if they supported attacks on Israel or supported Hamas carrying protest signs that praised Hamas.

[Walleye]

59. They have to believe they are "special"

[Demsrule86]

108. Trump will make them feel 'special' for sure. As he sends them out of the country after

revoking their citizenship.

[Walleye]

110. I guess they think if they just wish hard enough good things will happen

Third-party voters practice a lot of magical thinking

[FarPoint]

2. They just don't really understand how political democracy works

I don't know how to fix their stubborn thinking..mitcwill only hurt them having tRump/ Vance..

[paleotn]

3. That's idiotic

[Buckeyeblue]

4. Are Muslim Americans really Democrats?

It seems like they are very socially conservative.

[demosincebirth]

44. I don't think many of them know the difference between the two parties

[LiberalFighter]

58. Their past probably holds too much control over how they think right now

Likely to take at least a hundred years for them to assimilate

[getagrip_already]

52. Socially conservative is an understatement

Recently imigrated muslims are highly religious, and it is a very strict, didactic religion.

Women are second class citizens by design. Large families are the norm. They do not like liberal policies.

It takes generations to wear this down.

This isnt a criticism, just what ive seen. They are good people, just insular and very much traditional.

[carpetbagger]

84. Yes.

Biden took 90 percent of the Muslim vote in 2020. 90. They are less conservative than Protestants.

[underpants]

5. My daughter told me that some younger voters might do the same.

[Skittles]

8. that surprises me

I would have thought young folk, ESPECIALLY WOMEN, would be smarter than that. I mean come on, Stein is a bad joke.

[underpants]

11. They are doing it to send a message to the Dems

that they won’t be ignored.

[Skittles]

12. GOOD LAWD

DEMS ARE NOT THE ONES NEEDING A MESSAGE SENT!!!!!

[Volaris]

14. The BEST that will happen if Trump gets elected, is that theyll be ignored.

God help them, if he decided to pay attention to them...

[Lonestarblue]

41. Trump may ignore them here in the US because he doesn't care about them unless he can deport them.

Their vote for Stein helps elect Trump, who as president will sign the death warrants for their friends and family in Gaza, the West Bank, and East Jerusalem because Trump will hand Bibi whatever he wants to finally kill or push all Palestinians out of Palestine. Such a sad situation because while Harris supports Israel as a state, as do most Democrats, she also has said she supports a Palestinian state. I do not think she is as old school on this matter as Biden is, and she has seen first hand how Bibi has given the US government the middle finger over and over while demanding more bombs.

[Volaris]

43. I agree with ALL of that.

My guess would be that a Harris administration would push hard for a 2 state solution that benefits Isrealis by way of ensuring their safety, REGARDLESS of what Bibi and his cohort of right-wing loons think of it.

[LeftInTX]

20. How do we know their age..LOL?

You can tell some demographics by location, but age just ain't one of them!

[EllieBC]

22. Guess they never want to vote again?

I understand young people can be short sighted but this badly? Trump would destroy what’s left of women’s rights. And voting rights? Thing of the past.

[Irish_Dem]

34. Young people will have a steep learning curve.

The GOP will be sending them messages every day that they will not like.

[Happy Hoosier]

36. Ah yes....

Do what we want or we'll burn the building down. Great reason to take them seriously.

[thucythucy]

53. Kind of like voting for Nader

"sent a message" in 2000?

[underpants]

54. I know. I know. Just reporting what's going on. She's voting for Kamala

[thucythucy]

56. I didn't mean to criticise you,

only to point out to whom it may concern that we've seen this circus before.

My best wishes to you and your daughter.

[get the red out]

76. If Trump wins

It will be the last political message they will have the right to send. Idiots wanting to set a fire that will consume them.

[Demsrule86]

106. It will be ignored for four years if not more if Trump is elected...while he reverses

there citizenship and sends them 'home'.

[womanofthehills]

70. Younger voters get all their news online

They are very upset with the hundreds of videos they see daily of the war. We never witnessed the slaughter of innocents in real time as these kids are. Go on X (OMG - it’s horrific) - every day kids with no limps, pulling dead & live children from under the rubble - if this is giving our kids nightmares how must the young Muslin community feel. I’m with Bernie that we have to stop funding bombs for Israel. If we don’t stop this funding we could lose the election. Trump is sadly pushing ahead in many swing states again today. Shit - he’s up by 5 points again in Arizona today - NYT’s poll.

[Coventina]

73. I will never go on "X". I choose not to support that Nazi. n/t

[Cha]

9. Not the smart ones.

[LizBeth]

29. Especially the educated younger people. They are just really mad US sending money to Israel.

[underpants]

30. Yep even thought we've been doing it for years

1999, the US government signed a commitment to provide Israel with at least US$2.7 billion in military aid annually for ten years; in 2009 it was raised to $3 billion; and in 2019 raised to a minimum of US$3.8 billion.[3]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%E2%80%93United_States_relations

[LizBeth]

33. Now the money is being used to put bombs in devices whatever they are, flattening

Gaza killing thousands of children. I have never liked giving so much or stayed silent but not my issue, I have others. I hate what is going on now, but we have always and will always and other issues closer to home and havent liked a lot of things happening in world (my first I can remember was Bosnia) especially our participation BUT... the young people rightly have huge issue. I hear it often and as son says of course he will vote Dem, but this is huge for the younger generation. Just saying...

[Happy Hoosier]

37. "educated"

So "educated" that they're willing to thrown the rights of women and LGBTQ+ people under the bus.

I have no respect for these people. They're idiots.

[LizBeth]

46. I said the same in 2016

[Happy Hoosier]

47. And?

Not sure what we do with that. Knuckle under? These kinds of people won;t change their minds. They'll move the goalposts and blame us. They CANNOT be satisfied. They aren't making rational decisions.

[LizBeth]

48. And again, what I concluded in 2016 and we got Trump. Stupidest damn thing

lost us the SC

[Happy Hoosier]

49. You still haven't suggested a course of action. What do you want? NT

[LizBeth]

50. When did that become my job to find the answer? I begged, pleaded, educated in 2016.

But woman, HRC! Didn't care about no stinkin SC, their issue more important than all of women and girls. Meh... Why are you making demands of me?

[Happy Hoosier]

51. You seem to think the Harris campaign is doing asomething wrong. What, exactly?

If you're just lamenting the morons, well, I can relate. But if you think something shouold be done, let's hear it. Sounds like you have no idea.

[LizBeth]

61. I did nothing of the sort. Merely gave the opinion of the young I have listened to.

Just a flat out simple statement what I have been hearing. Lordy!

[Happy Hoosier]

62. okay.... I have no idea what your point is.... NT

[LizBeth]

63. wow

[Happy Hoosier]

64. I give up. You apparently don;t want to clarify?

If I misundersttod your intentions, fair enough. Now you're just being snarky.

[LizBeth]

65. Wow again... I am doing a whole lot of shit in your book that clearly I am not.

But man you want to interpret very very simple words as something much more. Hey... obviously you want the last word. All yours.

YOU have a peachy day.

[iemanja]

94. She pointed out to you that a lot of young people are upset about the US government funding Israel's war on Gaza

and now Lebanon. How is that so difficult to understand?

[Happy Hoosier]

95. I asked what she thinks we should do.

I thought that was pretty clear.

[iemanja]

98. And she told you she didn't have a position on that

That she was simply relaying what she had heard.

I can tell you what I think we should do: Cut off military aid to Israel until Netanyahu is removed from power and Israel stops bombing the entire region to oblivion. What we should not do is be sending troops to the region to help Israel execute WWIII.

[edisdead]

85. huh? Where did that poster do that?

[bdamomma]

75. and if that

felon steals the election count on him putting 2 right wing white fascist in the SC. Now that's another scary thought.

[womanofthehills]

67. Many have relatives killed & injured in Gaza

It’s very sad. The videos of limbless toddlers on Twitter is growing. And image after image of little kids with missing arms & legs - babies with no legs before they even got to walk.

More than 10 children losing legs in Gaza every day as dire health crisis grows, aid groups say

CNN
—
More than 10 children on average have lost one or both of their legs every day in Gaza since October 7, with many amputations performed without anesthesia, a charity said Sunday, underscoring the dire humanitarian situation in the Palestinian enclave following more than three months of Israeli bombardment.

In a statement citing United Nations statistics, Save the Children’s director for the occupied Palestinian territory, Jason Lee, said the “suffering of children in this conflict is unimaginable and even more so because it is unnecessary and completely avoidable.”

https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/08/middleeast/gaza-children-losing-legs-disease-intl-hnk/index.html

[Happy Hoosier]

68. So they support Trump? Make it make sense.

The problem with this movement is that it isn't one founded in rationality.

Those willing to not just withhold support from Harris but ENDORSING Trump are not honest interlocutors. And we shouldn't treat them as if they are. And yes, supporting Stein IS supporting Trump.

[iemanja]

97. If you had lost family members, would you vote for a party who helped fund the war

and supported a policy that ended their lives? It doesn't have anything to do with Trump for them. Trump isn't in charge now. The Democrats are, so they own the policy. For those connected to the region, it's about their families. I heard an interview with a man who had lost 13 family members. He was justifiably angry. You call that irrational. It is not. It is human. It would do you well to consider basic humanity before passing judgement on people.

Now for the rest of us, we see the alternative. We see Harris is much better, despite--for many of us--the very flawed nature of US policy toward Israel. Many DUers, however, are very supportive of the wars on Gaza and Lebanon. Many, but not all.

[dem4decades]

115. Please tell her Putin appreciates their votes.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

6. A vote for Stein is a vote for TFG and a muslin ban

[lindysalsagal]

39. I don't understand how helping tscf is helping muslims.

[Walleye]

60. There's no logic to it, they just need to go along with their peers

[LeftInTX]

7. I sure hope Kamala wins Michigan!

This is a stunt. If Trump wins Michigan, they will be emboldened and demanding, if Kamala wins the presidency.
If Trump wins the presidency, they will use this for future organizing.
If Kamala wins both, they will go back to the drawing board.

They're trying to exert power. "Show of force"

[BornADemocrat]

10. Lol.

We see stories like this every election cycle. Not buying it.

[sarisataka]

13. You don't have to buy it for it to be true

Gaza. On August 19, 2024, Abandon Biden became the Abandon Harris Campaign- a campaign now seeking to ensure the defeat of Kamala Harris at the ballot box. Across the nation, Americans have committed not to vote for Harris and to actively campaign against him. The Abandon Harris campaign’s goal is to ensure that Kamala Harris loses the swing states.

The Abandon Harris strategy is for people of conscience to punish Kamala Harris at the ballot box and then take the “blame”—or claim the credit—for his electoral defeat. Punishing the vice-president for her genocide would send a clear signal to the political landscape that genocide is not politically viable. It would create a political earthquake, soliciting a reckoning in the political parties.

https://abandonbiden24.com/about/

They don't care who wins, just so Harris loses. (I'll let you figure out the most likely winner of the election)

[Coexist]

15. "her genocide" these people seem naive and reactionary

this won't change anything

[Happy Hoosier]

38. I am beginning to detest thse people.... NT

[namahage]

18. Actively campaign for "his" defeat?

Obviously too lazy and/or stupid to be a major threat

[newdeal2]

19. Does not mean it's a popular movement

Look they haven’t even updated their website or social media handles from Abandon Biden to Harris

[Autumn]

26. If this happens the most likely winner of the election would be

Netanyahu.

[sarisataka]

31. Isn't it ironic

that is the pro-Palestinians were to succeed in "teaching Democrats a lesson" it would bring more harm to those they support than a Harris Presidency? Under trump there would be no "Ceasefire Now"

[Autumn]

40. Under Trump there will only be death and destruction. The same thing they are seeing now.

Some people still believe that they can get what they want from politicians and that politicians should be led by the people. For the people.

[uponit7771]

28. We do have to see perspective though and these articles rarely show it, mostly anecdotes

[lees1975]

16. Interesting. Muslims, voting in a bloc for a Jew.

Have we now discovered the moon is made of green cheese? Is the sun rising in the west in the morning? Has hell frozen over?

Any Muslim with an inkling of political reasoning knows that the only candidate running who will have the power to leverage a cease fire in Gaza and then get deeply involved in negotiations toward resolution is Kamala Harris. Stein won't even get close to what she got in votes in 2016. Trump will work to deport those Muslims, especially of Arabic descent, from the US regardless of their citizenship and will step back and let Netanyahu make sure he eliminates Hamas by leaving the Gaza strip flattened ruins.

This is America. Demanding we get out way doesn't work. This is just propaganda.

[Coventina]

17. A Jew working for Putin.

Really don't understand what the Muslims think they will get out of that.

Just ask the Chechnyans.

[LeftInTX]

21. Spread the news. Do they even know?

[bigtree]

23. doubt it

...moving in polls taken, maybe.

Makes no sense they're voting for the person who will help elect the man pledging to deport their family members and neighbors.

It's unlikely.

[BlueWavePsych]

24. A vote for Jill Stein is a vote for Trump.

Last edited Fri Sep 20, 2024, 10:24 AM - Edit history (1)

[kansasobama]

27. Why should Dems stick their necks out for their cause

If they help Trump.

You are becoming irrelevant in a hurry.

[Nixie]

32. Trump has said he would let Israel "finish the job"

They seem okay with that, so all the hullabaloo over Harris seems disingenuous.

[brush]

35. I don't know about this. There were supposed to be huge protest at the dNc...

last month but they never amounted to much.

Cooler head should prevail as Muslims/Arab Americans will fare better in a Harris admin that a trump one.

trhump and Netanyahu are known to be cozy and in constant contact, while the Biden/Harris admin has been pressuring Netanyahu/Likud to agree to a ceasefire since the Oct. 7 attack.

[Sogo]

42. They will reap what they sow....

Do they think TSF will be good for Muslims????

[Vinca]

55. Third party voters are enabling the worst candidate. They might as well flush their votes.

In this case, Donald "Muslim ban" Trump will tell Bebe to nuke Gaza and get it over with.

[LiberalFighter]

57. Yes they are idiots.

[ColinC]

66. To answer your question

I don’t think they are thinking beyond “My family is being hurt and in harms way in Lebanon and Gaza, and the US is giving weapons to the people who might hurt them”

I’m thinking the vast majority of these folks might be Dearborn, MI residents. As I’ve said previously, we could lose Michigan because of this, or it could be really really close. This is assuming there isn’t a massive change in policy before the election, of course.

[Coventina]

72. And they think Trump won't send weapons to Israel?

That's pretty stupid.

[Efilroft Sul]

69. Some people get what they got coming.

Last edited Mon Sep 23, 2024, 01:24 PM - Edit history (1)

Which party consistently stuck its neck out for the better treatment of Muslims in this country, whether we decried violence against Muslims in the wake of 9/11 to wanting to help Syrian refugees to protesting Trump's Muslim travel ban? That's right, the Democratic Party. Yes, the situation in Gaza and Lebanon is a touchy subject for everybody, but if Muslim Americans are going to hold their breath and not vote for Harris, or vote for Stein or Trump instead, that decision is not just malignantly stupid but also spiteful and more than ungrateful for the support Democrats have provided their community during times when it mattered most.

Should Muslim Americans enable a second Trump presidency, they had better be prepared to board boxcars to Texas camps by the end of March 2025. Maybe there they can watch TVs in the open-air holding pens to see how Trump enables Bibi to really get his slaughter on with the populations of Gaza and Lebanon. Except this time, the blood of all those slain Muslims will be on their hands as well.

[Miami Blue]

74. Ignorance is dangerous

Perhaps those Muslims who now deciding to vote for the Russian agent Jill Stein or Tyrant Trump are okay with Monster Trump's notorious raid and his
concentration camps across The USA.
(In Homestead, Miami we had one of them near Homestead Air Force Reserve Base.
These people forgot about Tyrant Trump’s mass deportations and his ban on the thousands of Muslims who wished to come to the USA in the past. Particularly when as we speak thousands of their compatriots Muslims are trying to escape from the horrors of wars in the Middle East to get to the USA to live a safer lifestyle.
I think that Tyrant Trump would love to put those Muslims in concentration camps to exploit them and exhibit to his MAGA Nazis what a strong man's power can do for them. Don't overlook the fact that Tyrant Trump did the same thing with thousands of impoverished Mexican immigrant parents and their children who came looking for legal asylum to our dangerous borders. Sadly thousands of those Hispanic kids have been lost across the USA and remain waiting to be reunited with their parents still.
This happened 8 long years ago under the Tyrant
Trump's regime. Presumably, those poor Hispanic kids won't be able to see their parents ever again.
As an ethical American who is always looking to improve the well-being of my fellow human beings, (especially the well-being of innocent children) this fact breaks my heart.

[LetMyPeopleVote]

77. A vote for Stein is a vote for TFG and for a Muslim ban and removing all restraints from Bibi in Gaza and the West Bank

Donald Trump has a message for voters who disapprove of President Joe Biden’s Israel/Gaza policy from the left: The Republican intends to be vastly worse.

Link to tweet

https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/maddowblog/trumps-hardline-position-us-policy-gaza-matters-rcna150391

In theory, Donald Trump might recognize the electoral opportunity and try to appeal to those who disapprove on the incumbent president’s Israel/Gaza policy from the left. In practice, the former president has an unsubtle message for Biden’s critics: If given the chance, the Republican intends to be vastly worse.

The Biden White House, for example, acknowledged this week that it is, as the Associated Press reported, “weighing measures to help Palestinians living in the United States who want to bring family from the war-torn region.”

Soon after, as Reuters reported, the presumptive GOP nominee shared his thoughts on the subject at a campaign rally.

“Your towns and villages will now be accepting people from Gaza and various other places,” Trump said, eliciting boos from the crowd. “Under no circumstances shall we bring thousands of refugees.” Last week, Trump described the pro-Palestinian protests as driven by “tremendous hate” while asserting that the violence at a 2017 white nationalist rally with some Trump supporters in Charlottesville, Virginia, when he was president was small by comparison.

Note, at one of his campaign events yesterday, Trump appeared to goad his followers in Wisconsin into booing Palestinian refugees.

Link to tweet

At the same event, the former president also vowed to restore and expand the Muslim ban he imposed during his first term......

The former president also endorsed ongoing Israeli military operations, saying, “We have to let Israel complete their war on terror. It’s a horrible thing, but they have to do it.” Trump added that Israel must “clean out the cancer.”

Let’s also not forget a New York Times report from March that said top members of Trump’s team want to expel Palestinians from Gaza.

It’s as if the Republican is going out of his way to alienate voters who, given their frustrations with Biden’s policy, might be inclined to give Trump a second look.

TFG will bring back the Muslim ban, give Bibi free reign to bomb and destroy Gaza and expel Palestinians from Gaza so that Jared can build his resorts.

[Cha]

79. TY for Steve Benen on Why those voting for Fucking J Stein will be SO Disappointed...

if they help get the Fascist Fuck in our WH Again.

Link to tweet

[Eko]

78. Quite a few Muslim Americans have friends and family

That have been effected by this conflict in Gaza. Killed, wounded, homeless, hungry, sick. Quite a few see how the US doesn't use its full diplomatic power to stop this. Telling them they are idiots handing dump victory is not the flex you think it is compared to what they are experiencing. By all means keep on doing it though, I'm sure it will convince them at some point. On the other hand you could try to understand where they are coming from and help advocate it to the Democratic party so that they feel their concerns are being addressed. Naw, just keep insulting them for being upset about what their friends and family are going through. I'm sure that will work out.

[Willto]

80. And what.....

....exactly could I or any other random citizen do that would sway such people? Other than point out the absurdity of hating the current vice president for a perceived shortcoming in efforts regarding Gaza. Never mind that she's not actually the president and therefore cannot set policy. Never mind that this belief that the US can just order Israel to do whatever we want is bullshit. And last but certainly not least never mind that their misplaced temper tantrum threatens to help elect a man that wants to herd all Muslims into camps and deport them. A man who wouldn't give two shits if Netanyahu nuked every other country in the region.

I will try to have patience and calmly explain my point of view to anyone willing to listen. But I'm sorry there is a level of stupid beyond which I have no ability to help. Hating Biden and Harris and possibly getting Trump elected is like trying to cure a wart on your face by taking a gun and blowing your own dick off. But according to you I shouldn't tell someone that's a stupid course of action. So what should I do? Encourage them to blow their own dick off? Applaud them for it?

[Eko]

81. What you should do is exactly the opposite of what your reply to me was.

I would not say it's perceived at all but a fact that no Palestinian American spoke at the Democratic convention. Think about that for a moment. Does that show that Palestinian Americans enjoy support from the Democratic party or the opposite? Lets address this statement from you. "Never mind that this belief that the US can just order Israel to do whatever we want". No one believes that, no one is calling for that. That statement just disregards all the political tools that the US has, and they are pretty much without peer, to a nonsense argument that no one is using except for people who are against the actual Palestinian American goals. Unless you think the US has very little political power. As for the rest maybe you can get up off your high horse and talk to them like a people that may have lost family members or friends in this conflict, or have ones that are homeless, starving, maimed, sick, dying, without acting like they are what? Stupid? Having a misplaced temper tantrum? Maybe instead of trying to calmly explain your point of view you could actually listen and try to understand theirs? I mean, I know that the possibility of dump becoming president is so much worse for you than them actually losing friends and family to this conflict but hey ya gotta start somewhere right?

[Willto]

82. And I Think.....

....you have a ridiculously overinflated opinion of the effects of people posts on an internet forum. Nothing I say here, or you say here is going to have any measurable impact on how Muslim Americans vote. Nothing I can say is going to have any effect on someone whose powers of perception (or lack thereof) has led them to the conclusion that hating Democrats and helping Republicans get elected will help the people of Gaza. Especially when one of those Republicans is Trump.

A friend who threatens to turn their back on you and help your enemies get elected every time they don't get 110% of what they want isn't really a friend and never really was. Sad, but true.

[Cha]

83. Mahalo 🕯️💙🇺🇸

[Eko]

86. Jeeze,

You asked me "And what.........exactly could I or any other random citizen do that would sway such people?"
I told you.
Now it doesn't matter.
Great conversation.

[Happy Hoosier]

96. Trump for them will make things worse for their cause.

That’s a fact.

And yeah, believe it or not, my country not turning in to a Christofascist hellscape IS more important to me than the Gaza war as it should be to any patriotic citizen.

[TheKentuckian]

100. They should invest their energy getting the other members of the family

to cease their attacks, release the hostages, and surrender instead of playing at political suicide bombers.

[Eko]

101. Because every Palestinian is either a terrorist or has family members that are?

Wow.

[TheKentuckian]

120. If everyone has a family member impacted, a considerable percentage killed are terrorists, and the number killed

is close to the pre war estimates on Hamas operatives alone that doesn't seem much of a stretch.

They are almost statistically likely to know someone killed as they are to know a Hamas operatives.

Add in all the other groups and the nature of how embedded these groups are in the societies they dominate and it is very probable.

So, yeah write back home.

[Eko]

122. There are over 2 million people in Gaza.

Of those maybe 40,000 are hamas. Of the over 2 million I would hazard to say that all are impacted. What is the percentage of 40,000 to 2 million? 2%? Your figures don't add up but the racism seems possible.

[Cha]

88. Fuck the voters for

Lying jill stein. They had a Big hand in getting TSF in our WH in 2016 and Spreading Fascism through out America.

[Eko]

89. I think we should reach out to them and get them to vote for Kamala Harris.

One way we could have done that was to give them a spot speaking at the DNC. Do the hard work to win this thing. But that is just me I guess.

[Cha]

90. Fuck The Suckers For TSF

Putin & Bibi

[Eko]

92. A majority of Muslims voted for Biden last time.

I guess we will see how disregarding their concerns effects this election.

[Willto]

93. Well

("One way we could have done that was to give them a spot speaking at the DNC.&quot

Holding rallies where you chant "From the River to the Sea" which is a call for the complete eradication of the Israeli people along with calling Biden "Genocide Joe" is not going earn you a spot at the convention. Sorry. Conventions are for unifying the party and motivating your supporters. It would have been a huge risk handing the stage over to people who have been saying such ugly and unfair things about this administration. Not to mention engaging in some pretty Anti-Semitic activities at times. What little good could have come from it is far outweighed by the potential shit storm meltdown that could have resulted if a speaker from this group got up there and just went off on the Democratic Party in a nasty way. And given some of their public comments that was not an unreasonable fear.

[Eko]

99. The people who were asking to speak said and did no such thing.

Here is the text of the speech they wanted to give.
My name is Ruwa Romman, and I’m honored to be the first Palestinian elected to public office in the great state of Georgia and the first Palestinian to ever speak at the Democratic National Convention. My story begins in a small village near Jerusalem, called Suba, where my dad’s family is from. My mom’s roots trace back to Al Khalil, or Hebron. My parents, born in Jordan, brought us to Georgia when I was eight, where I now live with my wonderful husband and our sweet pets.

Growing up, my grandfather and I shared a special bond. He was my partner in mischief—whether it was sneaking me sweets from the bodega or slipping a $20 into my pocket with that familiar wink and smile. He was my rock, but he passed away a few years ago, never seeing Suba or any part of Palestine again. Not a day goes by that I don’t miss him.

This past year has been especially hard. As we’ve been moral witnesses to the massacres in Gaza, I’ve thought of him, wondering if this was the pain he knew too well. When we watched Palestinians displaced from one end of the Gaza Strip to the other I wanted to ask him how he found the strength to walk all those miles decades ago and leave everything behind.

But in this pain, I’ve also witnessed something profound—a beautiful, multifaith, multiracial, and multigenerational coalition rising from despair within our Democratic Party. For 320 days, we’ve stood together, demanding to enforce our laws on friend and foe alike to reach a ceasefire, end the killing of Palestinians, free all the Israeli and Palestinian hostages, and to begin the difficult work of building a path to collective peace and safety. That’s why we are here—members of this Democratic Party committed to equal rights and dignity for all. What we do here echoes around the world.

They’ll say this is how it’s always been, that nothing can change. But remember Fannie Lou Hamer—shunned for her courage, yet she paved the way for an integrated Democratic Party. Her legacy lives on, and it’s her example we follow.

But we can’t do it alone. This historic moment is full of promise, but only if we stand together. Our party’s greatest strength has always been our ability to unite. Some see that as a weakness, but it’s time we flex that strength.

Let’s commit to each other, to electing Vice President Harris and defeating Donald Trump who uses my identity as a Palestinian as a slur. Let’s fight for the policies long overdue—from restoring access to abortions to ensuring a living wage, to demanding an end to reckless war and a ceasefire in Gaza. To those who doubt us, to the cynics and the naysayers, I say, yes we can—yes we can be a Democratic Party that prioritizes funding our schools and hospitals, not for endless wars. That fights for an America that belongs to all of us—Black, brown, and white, Jews and Palestinians, all of us, like my grandfather taught me, together.

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/08/dnc-speech-uncommitted-movement-harris-walz-ruwan-romman/

[TheKentuckian]

107. There was a ceasefire and Hamas stopped honoring it and resumed their attacks.

There are no hostages being held by Israel.

Whining about the tribulations of the Palestinians while hand waiving the impetus and direct cause from Palestinians is straight bullshit.

Hell no nobody peddling that crap should be trusted with that platform, if they went off script it would be a fucking mess.

[Eko]

113. What do you call it when

thousands of people are being held without charges or a trial for as long as years?
https://apnews.com/article/israel-detention-jails-palestinians-west-bank-793a3b2a1ce8439d08756da8c63e5435
How about when they are tortured?
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2024/07/israel-must-end-mass-incommunicado-detention-and-torture-of-palestinians-from-gaza/

CNN spoke to three Israeli whistleblowers who worked at the Sde Teiman desert camp, which holds Palestinians detained during Israel’s invasion of Gaza. All spoke out at risk of legal repercussions and reprisals from groups supportive of Israel’s hardline policies in Gaza.
They paint a picture of a facility where doctors sometimes amputated prisoners’ limbs due to injuries sustained from constant handcuffing; of medical procedures sometimes performed by underqualified medics earning it a reputation for being “a paradise for interns”; and where the air is filled with the smell of neglected wounds left to rot.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/10/middleeast/israel-sde-teiman-detention-whistleblowers-intl-cmd/index.html

“Allegations of gang-rape of a Palestinian detainee, now shockingly supported by voices in the Israeli political establishment and society, provide irrefutable evidence that the moral compass is lost,” the experts said. In February 2024, a number of experts also expressed grave concern regarding the reports of sexual and other forms of gender-based violence committed against Palestinian women and girls in Israeli detention.
https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2024/08/israels-escalating-use-torture-against-palestinians-custody-preventable

"Whining about the tribulations of the Palestinians"
40,000 are dead. something like 100,000 are wounded. The entirety of Gaza is destroyed. That is not whining at all. With people like you in the party I don't understand why they don't want to support us.

[TheKentuckian]

117. Prisoners of war. Possibly even unlawful detention but not hostages.

Probably even some political detainees in there.

No hostages.

[Eko]

121. Whats the difference then?

Are healthcare workers prisoners of war? Are they political detainees? Can they be tortured?
Israel: Palestinian Healthcare Workers Tortured
https://www.hrw.org/news/2024/08/26/israel-palestinian-healthcare-workers-tortured

[SharonClark]

111. Is Romman committed to the election of

Harris, as stated here, or part of the uncommitted movement? You can’t be both.

[Eko]

114. You did not read post 99.

Like I said before, read post 99.
Here, Ill make it easy. Here is the link to it, https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=19496527

[Willto]

119. And you....

....can assure us that they would have remained on script and only spoke those words when we are talking about people who are not supporting the Democratic candidate for president. When did you acquire this precognitive ability and how? Does it require a crystal ball or a Ouija board to work?

The issue is not what's written there. The issue is trust. And trust has to be earned.

[Eko]

123. She is a elected Georgia State rep of the Democratic party.

It would be extremely easy to vet her and she is a member of the Democratic party. Her trust has already been earned. Or are you saying that a member of the Democratic party is not trustworthy?

[SharonClark]

103. Why should a speaking spot be given to people

who oppose the election of the Democratic candidate for President and who accuse the candidate of genocide.? That makes no sense.

[Eko]

104. See post 99.

Thanks.

[SharonClark]

118. I have sympathy for what Palestinians in the US

who see their friends and families in this horrible situation in Gaza are experiencing.

I also have sympathy for the Israelis and the families of those who have been held hostage or killed.

But I have greater sympathy and interest for the many Americans who would suffer under a Trump administration and that includes women, African-Americans, Native Americans, immigrants, non-Christians, the middle-class, and seniors. It also includes issues like education, the environment, the climate, health and safety regulations, free speech, and the right to collective bargaining.

Many Palestinian Americans may be grieving now, but they need to ask themselves how electing Trump to the presidency would make their situation and the situation of their friends and families in Palestine better.

I would also hope that the Palestinian Americans would want to elect a president who is good for the people of the United States and that person is Kamala Harris and not Donald Trump.

[elocs]

87. Brilliant! Here in WI in 2016, Stein had more votes than Trump's margin of victory.

And Hillary was so confident that she had Wisconsin in the bag for her that she made zero campaign stops here in the general election.

[JCMach1]

91. So they are saying they are Arabs first, Americans second...

F' that nonsense...

[demosincebirth]

105. they are Muslins first , anything else comes after...

[TheKentuckian]

109. We don't need anymore theocrats or right rightwingers

[JCMach1]

112. Precisely

[Abolishinist]

116. Exactly. I often wonder why some on "our side" of the aisle

are so welcoming to those whose religious beliefs ALWAYS come first, and in a way that is quite contrary to so-called 'progressive' values.

By the way, I'm a HUGE fan of Christopher Hitchens.

[Demsrule86]

102. If they are that stupid then fuck them.