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bigtree

(93,312 posts)
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 07:03 PM Oct 2024

Let's not forget why Trump was so confident in his efforts to overturn the election results

Last edited Wed Oct 2, 2024, 08:03 PM - Edit history (3)

_____________________

...even as so many of his advisers and lawyers were telling him he had no chance of succeeding.

Absent from Jack Smith's 'immunity' filing to Judge Chutkan is any naming reference to the 147 republican House members who voted to reject the results of the election, just on their partisan will and whim, without any evidence those results weren't valid.

We have no idea if Smith will make any connection in an eventual trial between those congressmen and Trump's efforts to provide them with 'alternate' false slates of electors which were in his favor.

There were a few references to the 'Representatives' and 'Congress' in the filing, but they were mostly in reference to Mike Pence's role in that certification as the Special Counsel argued that the vice-presidential role in those proceedings which might fall under the 'official acts' ruling by the Supreme Court shouldn't be used to exclude his conversations with Trump from evidence used in his prosecution.

...for example:

1) a conspiracy to interfere with the federal government function by which the nation collects and
counts election results, which is set forth in the Constitution and the Electoral Count Act (ECA);

2) a conspiracy to obstruct the official proceeding in which Congress certifies the legitimate results


...and:

"Only if the state-appointed electors have failed to make a choice, i.e., no candidate has such a majority, does the choice fall to the House of Representatives, who, voting by state delegation, “choose immediately, by ballot,” from the three presidential candidates receiving the most electoral votes."


...also, there's this ONE intriguing reference to his co-conspirators in the House:

"In addition, although countless federal, state, and local races also were on the same ballots as the defendant on election day—including those of every sitting member of the House of Representatives, even those on whom the defendant was counting to object at the congressional proceeding—the defendant focused only on his own race, the election for President, and only on allegations favoring him as a candidate in targeted states he had lost."


What we can conclude from the described way 'the defendant launched a series of increasingly desperate
plans to overturn the legitimate election results in seven states that he had lost," is that he was either disturbingly delusional, or extremely confident that his efforts would be rewarded by a Congress stacked with 147 cultist co-conspirators ready to capitalize on either the chaos or ballots deliberately presented to them as in dispute.

"When the defendant lost the 2020 presidential election, he resorted to crimes to try to stay in office. With private co-conspirators, the defendant launched a series of increasingly desperate plans to overturn the legitimate election results in seven states that he had lost—Arizona, Georgia, Michigan, Nevada, New Mexico, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin (the “targeted states”). His efforts included lying to state officials in order to induce them to ignore true vote counts; manufacturing fraudulent electoral votes in the targeted states; attempting to enlist Vice President Michael R. Pence, in his role as President of the Senate, to obstruct Congress’s certification of the election by using the defendant’s fraudulent electoral votes; and when all else had failed, on January 6, 2021, directing an angry crowd of supporters to the United States Capitol to obstruct the congressional certification. The throughline of these efforts was deceit: the defendant’s and co-conspirators’ knowingly false claims of election fraud."


I'm curious to see where that criminal, traitorous connection is revealed in the rest of the evidence Jack Smith is preserving for an actual trial. The threat (and the criminality) here isn't just one mentally-disturbed loser desperate to hold onto power. It's also the republicans who did their best to aid and abet that treasonous subversion of the will of the people.
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Let's not forget why Trump was so confident in his efforts to overturn the election results (Original Post) bigtree Oct 2024 OP
Which is precisely why B.See Oct 2024 #1
the lead Jan. 6 Committee Counsel just said that he thinks they could still face charges bigtree Oct 2024 #2
I sincerely hope so! Tumbulu Oct 2024 #15
It's because he lives in Lala Land Kaleva Oct 2024 #3
that too bigtree Oct 2024 #5
My thoughts? SOME Supreme court judges were involved. bluestarone Oct 2024 #4
through the conservative foundations like Heritage bigtree Oct 2024 #6
Maybe subpoena some phone calls or texts? bluestarone Oct 2024 #7
need solid evidence of criminality to get a warrant bigtree Oct 2024 #8
Gotta keep our eyes on Smith. bluestarone Oct 2024 #11
that's what I think bigtree Oct 2024 #12
Simple solution for the insurrectionists in the House...win a majority and expel them all. pecosbob Oct 2024 #9
I really like this idea bigtree Oct 2024 #10
THIS malaise Oct 2024 #13
I recall pre-emptive pardon requests n/t hibbing Oct 2024 #14
A key reason Trump was in the White House and is a candidate today Jarqui Oct 2024 #16

B.See

(7,629 posts)
1. Which is precisely why
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 07:06 PM
Oct 2024

I've always referred to that 147 as co-conspirators and insurectionists who should be sitting in jail alongside their fellow Capitol insurectionists.

bigtree

(93,312 posts)
2. the lead Jan. 6 Committee Counsel just said that he thinks they could still face charges
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 07:11 PM
Oct 2024

...and that he still believes this indictment was pared down to get it in before the election, leaving off prosecutable co-conspirators to keep it from bogging down.

I expect more indictments. Guiliani, for one. Bannon...

bluestarone

(21,057 posts)
4. My thoughts? SOME Supreme court judges were involved.
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 07:33 PM
Oct 2024

Just hope, IF they were then hope it's provable!

bigtree

(93,312 posts)
6. through the conservative foundations like Heritage
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 08:37 PM
Oct 2024

...that's going to need a whistleblower.

bigtree

(93,312 posts)
8. need solid evidence of criminality to get a warrant
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 08:45 PM
Oct 2024

...a talking witness.

Or, some documents.

The Supreme Court has zero legally enforcable rules of conduct regarding gifts and other favors. Moreover, they just legalized bribing politicians.

The most realistic means of accountability is through impeachment which would take a sufficent majority in the House and in the Senate to convict.

bluestarone

(21,057 posts)
11. Gotta keep our eyes on Smith.
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 08:47 PM
Oct 2024

Never know what he has now. Just to add, LOT'S of witness's will be coming forward.

bigtree

(93,312 posts)
12. that's what I think
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 08:53 PM
Oct 2024

...and after Judge Chutkan rules, there's nothing really standing in the way of bringing more charges related to the Trump crimes, but he's not going to before the election.

Nov. 6...

pecosbob

(8,297 posts)
9. Simple solution for the insurrectionists in the House...win a majority and expel them all.
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 08:46 PM
Oct 2024

A simple majority vote is all that is required to expel any member from the House...we've seen it done recently. Charges are not necessary, evidence is not necessary...it is a political action.

Jarqui

(10,804 posts)
16. A key reason Trump was in the White House and is a candidate today
Wed Oct 2, 2024, 10:01 PM
Oct 2024

is Republicans enabling him

He couldn't be there without them

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