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Riftaxe

(2,693 posts)
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:41 AM Dec 2012

Liberals!

God help ya, i love you!

I have been a liberal over the years, something you will never hear me apologize for.

Sure, i could jump on the boat and be a progressive, but I despise the baggage attached, and liberal will do for me.

I was a liberal when carter was elected, I was liberal when i voted for dukakis (even after that little tank picture).


While it is all the rage to claim to be "progressive", I will remain a liberal.

if your proud to be a liberal, let us know why! Anecdotes are encouraged!


13 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited
Liberal
10 (77%)
Progressive
1 (8%)
other
2 (15%)
Show usernames
Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll
47 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Liberals! (Original Post) Riftaxe Dec 2012 OP
please tell me the difference former-republican Dec 2012 #1
As far as i can tell, Riftaxe Dec 2012 #2
I would have to call my self a liberal then former-republican Dec 2012 #7
Not to me! Progressives want change. Liberals want humanity. Both are compatible in society. CTyankee Dec 2012 #13
That is a hard definiton to argue Riftaxe Dec 2012 #14
And what crap might that be?? scratcho Dec 2012 #26
+1 leftstreet Dec 2012 #37
I believe in the social contract liberal_at_heart Dec 2012 #3
The reason we do not have most of those things Riftaxe Dec 2012 #4
I agree 100% liberal_at_heart Dec 2012 #5
It's all in the name. n/t Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #6
And only the difference will divide us Riftaxe Dec 2012 #8
PROUD LIBERAL Skittles Dec 2012 #9
Taunting in good fun' Riftaxe Dec 2012 #12
YEE HAW Skittles Dec 2012 #22
JFK: I'm proud to say that I'm a "Liberal" pinboy3niner Dec 2012 #10
+1 Riftaxe Dec 2012 #11
A wonderful definition of "liberal". Thanks for posting it. pampango Dec 2012 #47
You seem a tad obsessed with labels tkmorris Dec 2012 #15
This message was self-deleted by its author Scootaloo Dec 2012 #16
Liberal conveys a commitment to "free markets" BainsBane Dec 2012 #17
That is an astute explanation Riftaxe Dec 2012 #18
I have no problem with either term, Blue_In_AK Dec 2012 #19
Liberalism from the age of enlightenment has pretty Riftaxe Dec 2012 #20
You're entitled to your opinion, Blue_In_AK Dec 2012 #21
Would love to know what you're talking about here Proud Public Servant Dec 2012 #25
Labels make it easier to drive wedges between people. n/t FSogol Dec 2012 #23
No problem with either... The Time is Now Dec 2012 #24
Dyed in the wool liberal Aerows Dec 2012 #27
Liberals think we can tweak the existing system. Progressives disagree. KamaAina Dec 2012 #28
Yup!! scratcho Dec 2012 #29
Spot on! BlueCaliDem Dec 2012 #31
You should make this an OP leftstreet Dec 2012 #34
Done! KamaAina Dec 2012 #45
Technically, "liberal" means one who favors change. closeupready Dec 2012 #41
Thank you this definition. bunnies Dec 2012 #42
Thank you. Blue_In_AK Dec 2012 #43
A pragmatic progressive - I like to see this country move forward BlueCaliDem Dec 2012 #30
I think---- scratcho Dec 2012 #32
See two posters above me have completely differnt defintions. white_wolf Dec 2012 #33
The labels serve to avoid saying 'Working Class' leftstreet Dec 2012 #36
Liberal who grew up with a Red State Bircher...got out asap and moved to a wonderful Blue State libdem4life Dec 2012 #35
I am a liberal. Always have been, always will be. "Progressive" is a weak term to me. forestpath Dec 2012 #38
Unapologetic liberal, and proud of it. closeupready Dec 2012 #39
Can I be a Progressive Liberal, or a Liberal Progressive ... or ... JoePhilly Dec 2012 #40
I'm a LIBERAL RedCappedBandit Dec 2012 #44
I like liberal because it seems a lot of folks became progressive when liberal started TheKentuckian Dec 2012 #46

Riftaxe

(2,693 posts)
2. As far as i can tell,
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:47 AM
Dec 2012

progressives want to carry all the crap forward from the 1900's, liberals slap that crap down.

CTyankee

(64,175 posts)
13. Not to me! Progressives want change. Liberals want humanity. Both are compatible in society.
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:28 AM
Dec 2012

That's my opinion. So I voted "Other," meaning "Both."

Riftaxe

(2,693 posts)
14. That is a hard definiton to argue
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:29 AM
Dec 2012

so I will not argue it

on edit: never mind i said i would not argue

scratcho

(42 posts)
26. And what crap might that be??
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:46 PM
Dec 2012

Maybe when those trying to form unions were bloodied and/or killed? Women's right to vote? Civil rights act? OSHA for worker safety? Environmental laws? Women's right to control their own bodies? 40 hour work week with overtime over 40? Childrens labor laws? That's enough for now. Just checking. Awaiting your reply. Thank you.

liberal_at_heart

(12,081 posts)
3. I believe in the social contract
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:47 AM
Dec 2012

Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, food stamps, education, union jobs, living wages, universal health care, infrastructure, environment. The reason we don't have the money to fully fund all of these is because of corporate America and I say it is time to take the money back so we can finally fully fund these liberal social contracts.

Riftaxe

(2,693 posts)
4. The reason we do not have most of those things
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:49 AM
Dec 2012

Is because joe the average cannot buy his way into either party.


I am a bit skimped on $45k for a cheap dinner with the president, you?

Riftaxe

(2,693 posts)
8. And only the difference will divide us
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:55 AM
Dec 2012

(I am sure i stole that from somehwere, but cannot attribute it atm)

Riftaxe

(2,693 posts)
12. Taunting in good fun'
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:18 AM
Dec 2012

is always permissable..but only after who picks up the check is determined

I kid, but reminds me of many a dinner!

reminds me of a company outing where one person from texas came back and complained about all the graffiti on the men's room wall adverting for companionship of the same sex....my reply was, "I did not know there were that many texans about"

pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
10. JFK: I'm proud to say that I'm a "Liberal"
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:04 AM
Dec 2012
What do our opponents mean when they apply to us the label, "Liberal"? If by "Liberal" they mean, as they want people to believe, someone who is soft in his policies abroad, who is against local government, and who is unconcerned with the taxpayer's dollar, then the record of this party and its members demonstrate that we are not that kind of "Liberal." But, if by a "Liberal," they mean someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people - their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties - someone who believes that we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our policies abroad, if that is what they mean by a "Liberal," then I'm proud to say that I'm a "Liberal."

--Address of John F. Kennedy upon Accepting the Liberal Party Nomination for President, New York, New York, September 14, 1960

http://www.jfklibrary.org/Research/Ready-Reference/JFK-Speeches/Address-of-John-F-Kennedy-upon-Accepting-the-Liberal-Party-Nomination-for-President-New-York-New-Yor.aspx



tkmorris

(11,138 posts)
15. You seem a tad obsessed with labels
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:44 AM
Dec 2012

I honestly don't know what the difference is supposed to be between a "Liberal" and a "Progressive". Nor do I care.

Be what you are mate, and screw the labels.

Response to Riftaxe (Original post)

BainsBane

(53,394 posts)
17. Liberal conveys a commitment to "free markets"
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:00 AM
Dec 2012

That I don't share. Historically, liberalism emerged as the political corollary of capitalism. I'm now middle-aged and more moderate than I once was, so I'm reconciled to capitalism. But I'm not sufficiently enamored with it to identify myself as liberal if other options are available. I generally use the term leftist.

Riftaxe

(2,693 posts)
18. That is an astute explanation
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:10 AM
Dec 2012

and very true. Although i doubt any of us are enamored with it, it is what it is in the end.

Blue_In_AK

(46,436 posts)
19. I have no problem with either term,
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:32 AM
Dec 2012

but I feel more comfortable with progressive. I don't see why you can't be both. (And in my case, I'd throw in a little libertarian in some areas, as well.)

Riftaxe

(2,693 posts)
20. Liberalism from the age of enlightenment has pretty
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:47 AM
Dec 2012

much gotten us this far without the garbage of progressive movement, which has been in opposition to liberalism many times in the 20th century.

Proud Public Servant

(2,097 posts)
25. Would love to know what you're talking about here
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:45 PM
Dec 2012

Progressives -- capital "P" -- are the group responsible for everything from child labor laws to women's right to vote to food and drug regulation to checking corporate power though anti-monopoly legislation. I proudly call myself a liberal, but you'll never hear me dumping on the 20th Century progressive movement. What's your beef?

The Time is Now

(86 posts)
24. No problem with either...
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:42 PM
Dec 2012

but I started out as a liberal and feel no compulsion to change. (I'm rather conservative in that respect.) Also, I feel even more allegiance to the term once it became part of the right wing smear campaign.

 

KamaAina

(78,249 posts)
28. Liberals think we can tweak the existing system. Progressives disagree.
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:49 PM
Dec 2012

Liberals think everything will be OK if, for instance, we can only get rid of the Bush tax cuts. Or that the ACA is a panacea, so who needs single payer?

Progressives look at the millions of Americans living in poverty, uninsured, hungry "er, I mean "experiencing food insecurity&quot and come to the conclusion that the entire system is broken and must be rebuilt, placing people above profits.

leftstreet

(36,144 posts)
34. You should make this an OP
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:06 PM
Dec 2012

Since it looks like we're in for a few days of 'Liberal' vs 'Progressive' threads

 

closeupready

(29,503 posts)
41. Technically, "liberal" means one who favors change.
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:53 PM
Dec 2012

That term would include - in contrast to what we have today - progressives if being progressive means, as you put it, putting people above profits.

So, not disagreeing with you post as such, but rather just pointing out why there is sometimes heated discussion about the terms.

Cheers.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
30. A pragmatic progressive - I like to see this country move forward
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:52 PM
Dec 2012

even if it's done in baby steps.

Unfortunately, there are still just too many moderates and cons in this country for me to be a Liberal. It breaks my heart each and every time when my desire to see this country become more liberal is crushed when, after the dust settles, I find a Bush is in the WH because the rest of the country isn't "there" yet.

As a pragmatic progressive, I'll at least see the progress, keep things in perspective, and understand, however slowly, we're moving our country in the correct direction. There's that added benefit that I don't get my heart broken anymore, as well.

white_wolf

(6,238 posts)
33. See two posters above me have completely differnt defintions.
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:57 PM
Dec 2012

Karmaaid seems to be defining progressive as something closer to socialist and BlueCaliDem describes pragmatic progressiveism which seems to be to the right of liberalism. This debate comes up a lot, I really wish we could agree on a definition.

leftstreet

(36,144 posts)
36. The labels serve to avoid saying 'Working Class'
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:08 PM
Dec 2012

Although I agree with you, some definitions would be nice

 

libdem4life

(13,877 posts)
35. Liberal who grew up with a Red State Bircher...got out asap and moved to a wonderful Blue State
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:08 PM
Dec 2012

and my first legal Presidential vote was McGovern. Having gone AWOL in politics for a couple of decades in the meantime, I wondered about the Progressive Label, too. I guess there's a reason Liberal went out of fashion, maybe too lefty, maybe the Media needed a synonym for Liberal, but not for me.

I've also found that when it comes up in conversation and I say, "Hell yes, I'm Liberal." They are so shocked that they're nice, and usually listen.

I miss Molly Ivins...they broke that mold...RIP.

RedCappedBandit

(5,514 posts)
44. I'm a LIBERAL
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:15 PM
Dec 2012

I don't give a flying $%# how badly Fox Sn00ze wants to tarnish the word, I'll wear it proudly.


TheKentuckian

(25,328 posts)
46. I like liberal because it seems a lot of folks became progressive when liberal started
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:52 PM
Dec 2012

getting drug through the muck, though I don't like the much older baggage of liberal that is associate with Laissez Fare economics which I consider the worst and most cancerous part of Reich Wingery.

I like leftist more and more. Sounds more threatening to wingers as well.

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