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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsPastor: If we "publicly execute a few women," false rape allegations would end
Proving once again that patriarchal culture is alive and well in white evangelical churches, Christian pastor Joel Webbon said during a recent sermon that women who falsely accuse men of rape should be murdered by the government. Webbon, pastor of Covenant Bible Church in Georgetown, Texas (not far from Austin), argued that ancient Israeli law mandated this. If you accused someone of a crime, and your allegation was found to be false, you would face whatever punishment the accused would have suffered. If the alleged crime warranted the death penalty, then the lying accuser would be put to death. And it would be done in public. That, he continued, should apply to women who falsely accuse men of rape.
"In Israel, and this should be the law of the land in our country and every country still to this day, this is a timeless principle, a timeless, universal truth," Webbon preached. "If you perjure yourself by bearing false witness accusing somebody else, whatever the penalty would have been for that person had they been found guilty, then that penalty should fall on your head for falsely accusing them. If that were to occur and the just penalties were to be enforced, you, the false accuser, is now put to death," Webbon declared. "And that's a public death. It's a public sentence, publicly carried out, then the citizens of these United States of America, you know what they would do? #MeToo would end real fast. False accusing, playing the victim when you're actually not; you know how to end that real fast? All you have to do is publicly execute a few women who have lied."
Upon hearing the reaction from the congregation, Webbon added in the original sermon, There are nicer ways to say that
The reason I say things the way I do is because I'm convinced there's not a better way to say it. I think that's precisely the way to say it." Even though Webbon believes rapists should suffer the same fatestate-sponsored executionyou can tell that its the women who lie, not the men who actually commit those crimes, that get him more riled up. After Right Wing Watch shared that clip, Webbon responded by basically saying, Yeah, thats exactly what I meant: The biblical penalty for rape is death. Therefore, if a woman lies about being raped, the biblical penalty for her is also death.
There are obviously all kinds of problems with his Christian fantasy here, none of which garnered any bit of thought. The obvious one is that rapists today arent put to death. Even if that was the penalty in the Bible, its not our law. And conservative Christian pastors, no matter how much they whine about being persecuted, have never spent much time pushing for harsher sentences for men who commit sins. If they did, they might have to say goodbye to a bunch of their religious colleagues and preferred political candidates.
https://www.friendlyatheist.com/p/pastor-if-we-publicly-execute-a-few
Autumn
(48,962 posts)Is that applicable?
kairos12
(13,590 posts)It would make street corners much more quiet and pleasant.
ProfessorGAC
(76,706 posts)And a major tool for saying this.
Dave Bowman
(7,162 posts)Last edited Sat Oct 26, 2024, 01:05 AM - Edit history (1)
tavernier
(14,443 posts)Sorry, I can be a sanctimonious grammar cop at times until I misspell something and slink away in embarrassment.
Dave Bowman
(7,162 posts)sdfernando
(6,084 posts)Retrograde
(11,419 posts)I seem to recall the guy you claim to worship said that about a woman who transgresses,
Seinan Sensei
(1,546 posts)Why didnt they bring the Man?
Quiet Em
(2,937 posts)Trump did this
or at least made it worst and out into the mainstream, because it was always there, just not as much in your face, there.
msongs
(73,754 posts)tanyev
(49,297 posts)I assume he's supporting Trump in this election.....???
Then Natty Yahoo would support his boy Trump to have be stoned to death 3 times.
Easterncedar
(6,269 posts)It wasnt an angel. It was a real estate agent.
getagrip_already
(17,802 posts)I would be raising my hands and thanking god for sendimg my savior.
Because every raped man or woman would be petrified to report the crime. Especially if it was date rape, or family rape, or he/she knew the person socially or professionally.
It would be open season on the young, and the employed, and the dating, and the family.
Basically on any man or woman any sick fuck wanted to target. For any reason.
sakabatou
(46,149 posts)Good god these people are insane!
surfered
(13,465 posts)WhiteTara
(31,260 posts)as a predator.
MrsCheaplaugh
(275 posts)... are the definition of batshit daft.
bahboo
(16,953 posts)AZJonnie
(3,706 posts)Or perhaps likes to take a 'wide-stance' in airport bathrooms. Cause that's pretty much always the case with these hypocrites, isn't it?
ArkansasDemocrat1
(3,213 posts)Fuck all of them who didn't then. They've earned their non-forgiveness.
AZJonnie
(3,706 posts)Offhand, I'd probably make a wager that to the extent there is any such "death penalty for rape" mentioned in the Bible, it only applies to a man raping a married woman who is not his wife, and that the logic for this penalty is based on the affront visited by the rapist upon the victims husband, not upon the victim herself. But now I'm going to look it up and see if I'm recalling correctly on this. Also, what a fucking dick this guy is
Wednesdays
(22,603 posts)Is that how it works?
AZJonnie
(3,706 posts)by this freaking asshole.
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)Fuck stupid primitive superstitions/mythologies. Fuck male supremacist Christianity. Magic isnt real, and neither are god/s or Jesus.
AZJonnie
(3,706 posts)I imagine we'd get on well IRL. Are you an East Bay person by chance?
Sky Jewels
(9,148 posts)Ive lived in different parts of the country, but have been in the PNW for many years.
EarthFirst
(4,153 posts)Sick fuck.
TBF
(36,669 posts)The one where Trump accused people - and bought huge ads calling for their executions: Trump took out full-page ads that ran in several New York City newspapers that read in all-caps, BRING BACK THE DEATH PENALTY. BRING BACK OUR POLICE! The folks Trump accused were exonerated in 2002 when DNA evidence linked another person to the crime.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/21/politics/central-park-five-trump-defamation/index.html
B.See
(8,504 posts)we ('those people') have the (rummages thru sticky notes) "criminal gene" and therefore are all 'guilty.'
Traildogbob
(13,018 posts)Blood kin to Pastor Mark Robinson in NC?
pat_k
(13,376 posts)We need to distinguish Christian faith from Christian Nationalists and Christian Nationalism. We must condemn Christian Nationalism, while being clear that a condemnation of Christian Nationalism is not a condemnation of the Christian Faith.
. . .
Christian Nationalists are more committed to the love of power than the power of love.
And it exposes a lack of faith because the opposite of faith is not doubt. Doubt is a healthy part of any faith.
The opposite of faith is control. When we stop trusting God, when we stop trusting love, we start taking control for ourselves.
Christian Nationalists want to control what we read, who we marry, where we travel, when we have children. They want to control our minds and our bodies.
"O ye of little faith."
. . .
TX State Rep James Talarico is a riveting speaker on the subject
As far as I'm concerned, so-called 'Christian' Nationalists is just another name for the KLAN. They believe the same kind of sht and think the same way.
LearnedHand
(5,500 posts)As long as the "true" xtians are content to let assholes like this have the loudest microphones, the label fits all, as far as I'm concerned. Where are their loud, unending, PUBLIC denouncements of the xtian nationalists?
I admire Talarico, even though we are on different planets about magical sky beings, but he's a lone voice.
pat_k
(13,376 posts)And, as far as magical sky beings, I don't think Talarico is on that planet either:
God it not a noun at all.
God is a verb.
God is not a being.
God is being itself.
God is love.
And that's why Jesus is against anything that gets in the way of that love between neighbors, including religion.
. . .
That's why he says sinners will get to the kingdom of heaven before religious people do. Sorry to everyone here. I know you came all this way.
pat_k
(13,376 posts)Accurate labels are the start of any debate.
I know Christians of faith who have absolutely no interest in legislating their beliefs who believe liberals hate them. Our failure to be clear that we are condemning Christian Nationalism, not the Christian faith, has alienated people who are actually natural allies.
T_i_B
(14,888 posts).... leading to horrific politics.
It's actually quite a fringe ideology, heavily disputed even with groups such as Calvinists where it has it's roots. Even if it's adherents are very loud.
And that's before we get to how it's not quite as biblical as it likes to proclaim. See 1 Samuel 8 and the Epistle to the Galatians for examples of this.
And then there's the matter of where it's been tried in history. In Britain we had an experiment with this sort of thing under Oliver Cromwell. And that alone is a very easy rebuttal of what gets termed "Christian Nationalism".
pat_k
(13,376 posts)However, as State Rep. James Talarico sees it, Christian Nationalism and Christian faith are completely incompatible.
If this was truly a Christian nation, we would love all of our LGBTQ neighbors. If this was truly a Christian nation, we would make sure every child in this state and in this country was housed, fed, clothed, educated, and insured.
If this was truly a Christian nation, we would never make it a Christian nation because we know the table of fellowship is open to everybody, including our Buddhist, Hindu, Jewish, Muslim, Sikh, and atheist neighbors.
. . .
The closest thing we have to the kingdom of heaven is a multiracial, multicultural democracy where power is truly shared among all people. Something that's yet to exist in human history.
. . .
When someone asked Jesus to name his most important commandment, he cheats and gives two -- two that he says are related. The first is to love God. The second, he said, "Is like it: love they neighbor as thyself." It's like it because when I recognize the divine image in myself, I can't help but recognize it in my neighbor; whether they're Christian or not, whether they're religious or not. In the Parable of the Good Samaritan, Jesus specifically defines neighbor as someone different from us, racially, economically, politically, religiously. God loves diversity; God loves variety. Just look around this beautiful planet of ours.
. . .
God is so much bigger than our human categories. God is not a Presbyterian. God is not a Christian.
God it not a noun at all.
God is a verb.
God is not a being.
God is being itself.
God is love.
And that's why Jesus is against anything that gets in the way of that love between neighbors, including religion.
. . .
That's why he says sinners will get to the kingdom of heaven before religious people do. Sorry to everyone here. I know you came all this way.
. . .
The kingdom of God inverts the power dynamics of "all the kingdoms in the world."
True strength is vulnerability.
True status is equality.
True wealth is sharing.
And we as Christians are called to realize that kingdom "on earth as it is in heaven," not by force, but by faith.
Jesus asked us to have the faith of a mustard seed, trusting that by living and dying for love we give birth to a better world.
That's not easy to do.
. . .
Christian Nationalists are more committed to the love of power than the power of love.
And it exposes a lack of faith because the opposite of faith is not doubt. Doubt is a healthy part of any faith.
The opposite of faith is control. When we stop trusting God, when we stop trusting love, we start taking control for ourselves.
Christian Nationalists want to control what we read, who we marry, where we travel, when we have children. They want to control our minds and our bodies.
"O ye of little faith."
. . .
struggle4progress
(126,157 posts)Tweedy
(1,284 posts)King Davids response on the discovery his daughter, Tamar, was brutally raped by her half brother was to suggest their marriage. When Davids son said no, the Kings response was meh.
His son, Absolom, was so incensed by this brutal rape, he murdered the rapist, then rose up and temporarily overthrew his fathers reign. For this crime, Davids general, Joab, stabbed Absolom in the third rib.
There was not any expectation that King David would punish Ammon the rapist with anything, much less death.
Swede
(39,496 posts)mt
Hermit-The-Prog
(36,631 posts)Dem4life1234
(2,533 posts)Mysterian
(6,486 posts)to Antarctica instead?