Greg Sargent w/ Krugman: Trump Voters About to Be Shocked at How Badly He Scammed Them

[Dennis Donovan]

Greg Sargent
‪@gregsargent.bsky.social‬
Disturbing prediction from @pkrugman.bsky.social: If Trump's deportations really happen, inflation will spike, then MAGA loyalists will corrupt government info to mask it.

For autocrats, he says, "among their first targets are statistical agencies."

Our exchange:
https://newrepublic.com/article/188346/transcript-paul-krugman-badly-trump-voters-scammed (archived: https://archive.ph/zVtbq )


November 13, 2024 at 8:51 AM

Disturbing prediction from @pkrugman.bsky.social: If Trump's deportations really happen, inflation will spike, then MAGA loyalists will corrupt government info to mask it.

For autocrats, he says, "among their first targets are statistical agencies."

Our exchange:
newrepublic.com/article/1883...

— Greg Sargent (@gregsargent.bsky.social) 2024-11-13T13:51:10.494Z

Podcast: Krugman: Trump Voters About to Be Shocked at How Badly He Scammed Them

[Irish_Dem]

1. Trump voters will not believe Trump scammed them.

Will blame everything on Dems.

[Solly Mack]

2. Yep.

[GusBob]

4. I think the point here is they wont know

the numbers will be baked. To your point, any splashy bad news, yeah blame Biden

My favorite stories about the election

Opinion pollster asking: ' do you believe that DT will be an authoritarian?' #1 Reply: 'what's an authoritarian?'

Google enquiries for day after the election 'definition of tariff'

[Irish_Dem]

5. The American people do not appear smart enough to maintain a working democracy.

[lindysalsagal]

8. Sadly, we have reached that tipping point.

[Irish_Dem]

10. Basic intelligence, education, and morality are required to maintain a democracy.

We no longer have the basic requirements.

[Hope22]

15. Media that spreads lies and fear contributes as well.

Impossible to fight the magnitude of disinformation anymore.

[Irish_Dem]

17. We live in a post truth world.

Reality and facts are fluid concepts.

[Eyeball_Kid]

37. We are saturated with entertainment and marketing.

It's all pleasure and fantasy. Why study civics?

We are ripe for fascism. The clear message during this last election was the preservation of democracy. And what appears to be a majority voted for Trump. We can deduce a few possibilities, but not many, from this odd occurrence.

1. The (reportedly) 14 million fewer votes for the Democratic ticket than in 2020 seems fraught with doubts. Given the stakes and the saturation-messaging of the urgency of the matter, this odd statistic just isn't right. What really happened is that at least 14 million votes were "deleted." How and how many were deleted is a matter to be discovered. One of the objectives of any investigation is a determination of exactly WHO controls the data.

2. The far more cynical possibility is that the level of complacency and ignorance of our civic role is so extreme that the MAJORITY of voters are indeed ACTIVELY VOTING AGAINST THEIR OWN SELF-INTERESTS. They are voting for their own destruction.

[Irish_Dem]

38. Any way we slice it, not a good situation.

Whether people didn't vote or let the election get stolen, we are just as screwed.

It is the same problem. People don't care about our democracy.

The rest of the civilized world sees Americans as lazy, selfish, ignorant, immature bumpkins
who only care about entertainment and having fun. We are not a serious group of adults.

We don't care enough to make education, healthcare, sick leave, etc. basic rights.
Human rights don't matter here. And kids getting slaughtered in school with military grade
weapons doesn't bother us in the least.

And now we have let our democracy slip away. Without a whimper.

[Hope22]

40. Interesting story...

Fifteen years ago a friend of mine had young boys. She read to them, taught them kindness and that being a good person was important. Her husband a retired sheriff was teaching Law Enforcement classes at a local collage at this time. He heard the lessons she taught the boys, the reading and the tenderness she showed them. He came to her and told her to stop because the values she was teaching them were not those of ‘today’s world’ and that the boys would face hardship in the future if they tried to operate under her ideals! We thought he was crazy at the time but now I am really thinking. Was this societal hatred really programmed into us. Were the teachers of our protectors being programmed. Was the post 911, Homeland Security era really a program to turn us into hateful selfish people?

While this man’s comments made an impression on me at the time it is the shock of reading your comment that got me thinking about how we got here.

[Irish_Dem]

41. For a long time being a "real man" meant no empathy or kindness.

These were considered weak and female traits.
Men needed to be tough, strong, etc.

I think Americans tried to be more open to teaching women to be strong, and men to be more sensitive.

But all of that has changed with the GOP sexist hatred of women.
And males being terrified of losing their minority rule status.

[Hope22]

42. Unfortunately the men couldn't corner the market on toughness and strength.

Living through divorce as a child is amazing for cultivating that! Just wondering in your opinion did the sexist hatred of women come before or after T?

[Irish_Dem]

44. For most of human existence women have lived in a patriarchal society.

Where women had few rights and little power.

And live in a world which is dangerous for them.
98% of all rapes and violence against women are from male perpetrators.

It was/is legal for men to treat their wives in ways that would be illegal outside the home.

I think the abject hatred and public disdain for women has been in the making for the last
10 to 20 years.

Women now graduate from college at higher rates, get better grades, good jobs, more promotions, more fair divorces, etc.

Birth control, reproductive rights gave them freedom.

So we see this recent trend of women excelling while males lag behind.

And this is when I started seeing the real hatred coming out from men against women.

Men see the iron grip on women coming to an end, their power diminishing.
And Trump jumped on that fact and now the men all egg each other on about who can
be nastier and more cruel to women.

We see women lose rights, it is illegal now to save the lives of dying women in some states, etc.

So I think essentially the women's rights movement in the 60's and 70's has been so successful
in making a more fair and equal life for women that men hate it because they are threatened by it.

And Trump makes a lot of money and gets power on promoting this idea.

[whathehell]

18. Who is this "We"?

I have those 'basic requirements', and I'm sure you and the great bulk of DU has them as well, not to mention the very near half of the electorate who voted for our candidates.

[markodochartaigh]

20. Half of the electorate did not vote for

Kamala, nor for Biden. Only about one third did. And one third voted for Trump. About one third couldn't even be bothered to vote against an authoritarian Strong Leader.
Apathy is one of the Achilles' heels of democracy.

[whathehell]

24. Whatever..The point is that neither thirds

nor halves equate to "Americans" as a whole.

[markodochartaigh]

22. Requirements for democracy:

1) An engaged electorate.

2) An electorate educated on the issues.

3) At least two viable parties committed to democracy.

The US electorate is not engaged, one third could not even be bothered to vote when democracy was on the line, and against an authoritarian Strong Leader.

The US electorate is not educated on the issues. At least half of those who bothered to vote thought that the US is in a recession and that inflation is still high.

The US only has one viable party committed to democracy.

[Irish_Dem]

25. 4) Voters have a value system which precludes electing a vicious, ruthless psychopath

with a known criminal history, including high treason, to the WH.

[markodochartaigh]

27. Sure,

if a majority of the electorate which does actually vote are authoritarians, who actually do not want democracy if they can't be in control, democracy won't last.

[Irish_Dem]

29. Yes, people living in a democracy can vote out their democracy.

We currently live under white male minority rule.
White males are only 30% of the population but they hold most of the power in the US.

If the minority rulers see a threat to their power by women and non whites, they can shut down the democracy.

[whathehell]

26. "At the moment" is the necessary addition

to your last sentence. The elements of democracy you mention are all subject to change.

[markodochartaigh]

28. Perhaps.

Spain got its democracy back after 50 years. Chile got its democracy back after a decade.

[whathehell]

30. Uh huh

Point taken, but since we're neither Chile nor Spain, I'll continue to lean toward optimism...You, of course, are free to choose a more pessimistic path..

[Clouds Passing]

46. Thanks to reagan

[Dave says]

45. They will know when the price of eggs rise 400%, or that Nissan they were looking at for $45k now costs $90k

They won't be able to hide the costs at the cash registers. It just won't jibe with the CPI stats coming out of the BLS. Individuals will be scratching their heads, but that's just it. It will be wondering individuals, alone, no wide social group consciousness of the scams. The mass of Trump voters can't strongly or deeply reason. They feel their way through life - Trump makes me feel good, safe; I can have a beer with GWB, etc.

[Irish_Dem]

47. They will resolve their cognitive dissonance with some made up story, blaming the Dems.

And melt into the reassuring fantasy dear leader will take care of them.

[dalton99a]

13. +1

[Ray Bruns]

19. And illegal immigrants

Don’t forget the scary brown people

[Irish_Dem]

21. And all of us uppity women.

We just don't know our place.

[ancianita]

31. It's consistently true about them.

There are many trump voters along with so-called christians, who don't know evil, or refuse to see evil, when it stands before them, announces itself, and causes harm. They and all other trump voters will continue to have brought great harm and hardship to their fellow Americans by letting Mammon (pride, power and money) into the White House.

Jesus first declared the separation of church and state Matt 22:21; he continually condemned the rich. Jesus said, "No man can serve two masters...Ye cannot serve God and mammon." Matt 6:24

Blinded by mammon they will forget that benefits accrued to them by FDR and Biden will be stripped from them and millions of other Americans within 18 months, and that property assets will be stripped from America for at least 3.5 years ahead.

They will never look into a mirror or their hearts, and they will never be sorry.

[MustLoveBeagles]

32. Exactly

They're a cult.

[Raven123]

3. Keep copies of your local newspaper ads with prices

[johnnyfins]

23. Absolutely. As of 1/20/2025 we can no

Longer trust any stat coming from ANY part of the federal government.

[Blue_Tires]

6. They won't care...

All they ever wanted to do was "piss off the libs" 😒

[MustLoveBeagles]

33. There's that too

[JI7]

7. I don't think so. They will just find someone else to blame

[Vinca]

9. They will go to the grocery store and see that bacon is now $16 a package instead of the $8 and

declining during the former administration and they'll blame Biden. I don't know why, but Dear Leader can do no wrong in their eyes.

[dickthegrouch]

12. They're still wedded to the idea of integrity in politics

No-one can rely on anything spoken by politicians any longer. There’s so much spin on both sides that we’re all dizzy from trying to sort out which bits are true and which not. There is no reliable press, they even managed to get SCROTUM’s imprimatur to call their lies “truth” and “news”.
Add is so-called AI and all information is being corrupted. Snopes is the most reliable method but who has time to check literally everything there?

[Borogove]

11. As Winston Churchill once said,

the best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

[Prairie Gates]

14. Counterpoint: They are already suckers and masters of rationalization

Anything bad that happens will be blamed on Dems.

[krkaufman]

16. See DeSantis

Florida newspaper investigation finds state government misled public on Covid as cases rose

‘That decision cost lives’: Covid data case further deflates Ron DeSantis’s campaign

edit: Though we needn't look beyond the genius logic of the idiot the country chose to put back in the White House...

Trump says U.S. would have half the number of coronavirus cases if it did half the testing

[Jack Valentino]

34. Well, if they lose jobs, and the price of eggs, Doritos and video games go sky high-- no fake

government data will cover up their personal situation....


The whole reason Biden did not get much credit for what is classically a "good economy",
is that people weren't feeling it in their personal situations,
with food and housing prices having gone so high, and not coming down.

[oldmanlynn]

35. The only problem with this

Is that Trump and the maga GOP are going to lie to them and report completely different things than what’s actually happening and they’ll never know

[camartinwv]

36. We will certainly be aware of the cost of groceries, housing and other goods from personal experience.

[republianmushroom]

39. Believe it is going to hit home like a rocket.

[PedroXimenez]

43. he arragned for busses to get people to the Coachella rally

but they were on their own getting home after the rally.

[sakabatou]

48. "I can't believe the leopard ate my face!"