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Dennis Donovan

(31,059 posts)
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 12:21 PM Dec 2024

Raw Story: CEO shooting suspect may win with this 'very strong, public political defense': lawyer

Raw Story - CEO shooting suspect may win with this 'very strong, public political defense': lawyer

Carl Gibson, AlterNet
December 14, 2024 11:01AM ET



Luigi Mangione — who has been charged in the murder of UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson — could be banking on one particular defense strategy in order to prevail in court.

On Friday, Mangione hired attorney Karen Friedman Agnifilo — a former New York City prosecutor with decades of experience in criminal law — to represent him in court as he defends himself against five charges, including second-degree murder. While it remains unknown exactly how Mangione will argue his innocence, one attorney recently told the Guardian that he thinks the alleged killer could bank on claiming he was in "extreme emotional disturbance."

"He has one and only one viable defense and that is extreme emotional disturbance," veteran civil rights attorney Ron Kuby said. "One version of extreme emotional disturbance is he just snapped, but the defense is broader than that and certainly covers the slow, bitter, corrosive wearing away of normal sentiments of right and wrong until it all collapses in pain."

Another unnamed New York City-based criminal defense attorney anonymously told the outlet that Mangione will have a "limited number of defenses" available to him. Investigators have been rapidly accumulating evidence to use against Mangione in court, including a 262-word manifesto found on him when he was arrested in Pennsylvania that reportedly encouraged violence, a 3D-printed "ghost gun" and a silencer. The attorney said that for this strategy to work, the "extreme emotional disturbance" would have to be proven "reasonable from the point of view of the defendant at the time that it occurred." Though in New York, this would mean that Mangione's second-degree murder charge would be dropped to first-degree manslaughter, which still carries a hefty prison sentence.

"The good thing about the defense, from what I’m going to assume is Mr Mangione’s perspective, is that it’s a strong legal defense or at least it’s a viable legal defense, but it’s also a very strong public, political defense," Kuby told the Guardian. "All of his difficulties with the health insurance industry, all of his problems with them, everything that he knows and has read and has heard, the whole narrative comes in at the trial to show his state of mind."

/snip
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sop

(18,620 posts)
1. "Extreme emotional disturbance" pretty much describes most thinking Americans' state of mind today.
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 12:37 PM
Dec 2024

I hope Mangione's jury is made up of extremely emotionally disturbed people, really pissed off by America's Medical Industrial Complex.

Irish_Dem

(81,266 posts)
2. The PutinGOP has worked hard to make the American people distressed and off balance.
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 12:44 PM
Dec 2024

Creating chaos, hatred, division.

Divide and conquer.

Yes hard to tell what the jury will do.

Baitball Blogger

(52,345 posts)
3. Why should any of us be surprised? Trump won the presidency in the very same way.
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 12:46 PM
Dec 2024

Rittenhouse, Penny and Zimmerman also got off the hook.

All of them on the right-wing side. Maybe someone is thinking they owe the left a bone, when the truth is that appeal for Mangione goes far deeper than party lines. It goes down to the fact that we are indeed a country where the laws can be undermined through political pressure, which is why Trump will never look back, and always do his worse.

hlthe2b

(113,971 posts)
5. Hired attorney Karen Friedman Agnifilo (she does a Midas Touch/Legal AF podcast with Michael Popok
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 01:35 PM
Dec 2024

Last edited Sat Dec 14, 2024, 02:18 PM - Edit history (1)

She is likely an outstanding lawyer, but as I pointed out before, she's clueless about some basic issues related to politics, congress, and Trump-related events. When she took over the podcast one week she REPEATEDLY commented on the Senate's failure to IMPEACH Trump (said it 3x on my count), rather than CONVICT him. That really annoyed me and at least once she talked about Trump's "appointees," not as is correct now, "nominees." Popok would have corrected her had he been there, but boy was she glaringly clueless.

At this point, I would guess that the trial is very likely to end in a mistrial or conceivably even jury nullification, whether he has the very best attorney or not.

unblock

(56,198 posts)
6. Strictly speaking, I guess they're not even nominees yet. They're just names he's floating
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 02:04 PM
Dec 2024

He can't officially nominate anyone until January 20 after noon.

hlthe2b

(113,971 posts)
8. True. "Named picks" being floated. (albeit the media looks upon him as the current "President" )
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 02:16 PM
Dec 2024

and have all but ignored our ACTUAL President Biden the past months.

But my key issue with this lawyer is she doesn't even show that she knows Trump was (indeed) impeached TWICE and the issue was that the Senate failed to achieve 2/3 of Senate votes to convict. One might expect a former criminal prosecutor and now defense attorney to understand the concept. Just as a unanimous jury decision is required in state and federal criminal proceedings, it is not required in many state civil proceedings.

The political and "current event/media" aspects of this trial ARE going to matter. She needs to be more aware.

unblock

(56,198 posts)
11. Most people have their area of expertise, and it's usually pretty narrow.
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 03:32 PM
Dec 2024

Once in the media, they tend, sooner or later, to talk about things way beyond what they're actually expert in.

Of course, I do that too, but I try to occasionally point out that I'm not a lawyer, etc....

 

Silent Type

(12,412 posts)
7. I think George Zman's lawyer is in the running. If Luigi is going to use back pain as part of his defense, his lawyers
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 02:07 PM
Dec 2024

need to tell him to look in pain, don't ride bicycles, don't fight 10 policemen, hunch over, stop working out with weights, get a walker, etc.

 

Tickle

(4,131 posts)
9. WAIT! He only got charged with
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 02:33 PM
Dec 2024

second-degree murder? What, did they run out of first-degree stickers?

Penny, initially got charged with first degree and then I think it went to second. ???

Dennis Donovan

(31,059 posts)
10. 1st degree murder charge in NY only happens if you kill a certain kind of person...
Sat Dec 14, 2024, 02:56 PM
Dec 2024
First-degree murder
First-degree murder is the most serious homicide offense in New York State. It is defined as the intentional killing of a person without justification with one of the following aggravating factors:

The victim was a police officer, peace officer, correctional employee, judge, or a criminal case witness
The murder was committed while the perpetrator was serving a life sentence
The murder was committed with torture of the victim
The murder was committed as an act of terrorism
The murder was committed during the commission or attempted commission of one of the felonies under New York's felony murder laws.
Murder committed for hire (with the charge applying to both the murderer and the person who paid the murderer)


I'm guessing Penny got 1st degree because the chokehold was probably considered torture, but I don't know that for sure.
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